MI - 4 students killed, 6 injured, shooting at Oxford High School, 30 Nov 2021 *Arrest incl parents*

[x_files]

His eyes...

He changed a lot in just a few years, and I wonder what happened to him? Years of abuse? mental illness?

 

[x_files]

I know now that the girl who spent YEARS threatening to have her brothers gang-rape me so I would get pregnant and have to leave school probably got that idea from some kind of personal experience. Saying any more would probably get this post deleted.

terrifying.

 

[x_files]

I am not in any way saying that bullying is an excuse for this guy's behavior AT ALL.

Nor do we have confirmation that he was bullied, but I tend to believe the students who say he was over the reports that the school had no record of him being bullied. Reporting a bully will just get you more bullying if the bully is confronted by school authorities.

As someone who was bullied at the age of 7, I can tell you right now that I am still affected by it 50 decades later. My bullies did things to me that I have never been able to reveal to another human being, not even the multiple therapists I've had over the those decades.

In my case the bullying lasted only that one year, but I can understand how someone who had been bullied long-term could snap. There have been documented cases of kids who were being bullied killing themselves. It's not a reach to me to think that other kids being bullied might lash out at others instead of themselves.

Again, I am not making excuses for his behavior on account of the alleged bullying. I'm saying that being bullied can really mess a person up for the long term. Feeling resentment over that damage isn't grievance collecting, IMO, it's recognizing that damage has been done.

Plenty of people, including myself, have been bullied and not inflicted violence on other people. But it seems to me that so many of these school shooters have been bullied that if society wants to prevent them, it might start to think of being bullied as a contributing factor (NOT AN EXCUSE) and examine what might be done to mitigate that factor.

Agreed. Many teachers, principles turn a blind eye to the bullies and allow it to continue.

 

[x_files]

Has there been any concrete proof reported that he was bullied?

It was quoted by classmates in several articles.
Is there any child spared from bullying? Some kids can handle it better than others, others do not have support from parents or teachers and are battling other issues.
I never met anyone who has not been bullied at one time or another in their life.

 

[x_files]

A student said yes, LE and school say no.

The students would have witnessed it, schools are often too busy and oblivious to what goes on in bathrooms, lockerrooms, hallways, and on the buses. Bullies wait until teachers are out of the room or out of earshot.

 

[Skigh]

Brother of Ethan Crumbley says he never exhibited violent tendencies | Daily Mail Online


The older half-brother of Oxford High School mass shooting suspect Ethan Crumbley has described the teen as a quiet but happy boy who stayed out of trouble and never exhibited violent tendencies.

Speaking exclusively with DailyMail.com, Eli Crumbley, 18, said he can't understand how his own sibling could suddenly snap, open fire, and kill his classmates, following the deadly rampage in Oxford, Michigan on Tuesday.

'The Ethan I knew was just a smart boy who just seemed like an average kid,' he said in an interview on Wednesday. 'There was nothing that ever stood out to me. He'd never get suspended from school, or detention.

'He didn't suffer depression or anything like that. He woke up happy, went to school, came home and played games.'

Eli and Ethan, 15, have the same father, but different mothers. Originally from Florida, the two boys later moved to Michigan with their dad James Crumbley and his second wife, Ethan's mom, Jennifer.

The older brother hinted at some family turmoil that prompted him to abruptly move out last March, to live with his biological mother in Florida where he grew up.

 

[Lilibet]

This tragic thread moved me to look for information about Kip Kinkel, the 15 year old Springfield, Oregon school shooter who killed both of his parents and two classmate, injuring 25 in 1999, pre-dating Columbine. It was such a shock! He appeared to be absolutely evil. In his case, undiagnosed and untreated paranoid schizophrenia was the driving force. Easy access to guns made it possible. He is serving what amounts to a life sentence, which has become controversial. This is a long read, but it raises important issues and nuance that may or may not relate to Crumley’s case. In any case, I was pleased to see that Kinkel has received treatment and has made the best of his time in prison, advocating on behalf of other youthful offenders serving life terms. He makes no excuses and is filled with remorse. May Ethan Crumbley walk a similar path.
JMO

Kip Kinkel Is Ready To Speak

 

[Facinatingtimes]

I made a narrowly minded comment up thread about bullying that I wish to amend. I don’t want to minimize anyone’s experience. What I have witnessed in my own life and with my own kids is that often what is labeled as bullying is teasing, which also stinks, but is something most will encounter in life and we need to lift those people up to overcome the feelings. However, serious bullying mentally or physically does happen and can be devastating. My flaw is when I hear teens talk about bullying, I assume my life experience with it and tend to generalize.

 

[Kristin Esq.]

I tried to find the case on the Court's website, but I was unable to. Has anyone else had success?

 

[Betty P]

The Washington Post noted that Michigan state law does not require gun owners to lock up their weapons or keep them away from children. Such measures are rarely enforced in states that have child access laws.''

Well, that's an easy problem to resolve. Hopefully Michigan will follow up on that oversight.

 

[x_files]

I made a narrowly minded comment up thread about bullying that I wish to amend. I don’t want to minimize anyone’s experience. What I have witnessed in my own life and with my own kids is that often what is labeled as bullying is teasing, which also stinks, but is something most will encounter in life and we need to lift those people up to overcome the feelings. However, serious bullying mentally or physically does happen and can be devastating. My flaw is when I hear teens talk about bullying, I assume my life experience with it and tend to generalize.

Some bullying exceeds normal ribbing, or friendly teasing and crosses the line into assaults, physical, and sexual, to outright non-stop harassment and into terrorism.
Honestly, not sure how some kids can handle it. It seems to have gotten worse with social media because the bullying is 24/7 even after you go home.
If you have an emotionally unstable child/teen with no support it can lead to horrible outcomes. No, I'm not condoning violence, but some kids may feel they have no other options left. Kids need supportive parents, teachers, role models in their life that offer options. Too bad his parents didn't enroll him in martial arts vs buying a gun.
I'll wait to see what motivated him.

 

[x_files]

"Two Michigan sisters said there were threats about a shooting posted on social media for weeks before a teen opened fire at a high school Tuesday, killing three other students and wounding eight other people."

So they reported the threats and NOTHING was done about it.

Sisters report social media threats before school shooting

 

[Kristin Esq.]

In Case anyone was interested:

Michigan law defines an act of terrorism as a "willful and deliberate act that is all of the following:"
"An act that would be a violent felony under the laws of this state, whether or not committed in this state.
"An act that the person knows or has reason to know is dangerous to human life.
"An act that is intended to intimidate or coerce a civilian population or influence or affect the conduct of government or a unit of government through intimidation or coercion."

The criminal complaint refers to the third condition.

Ethan Crumbley: Here's why the suspected Michigan school shooter has been charged with terrorism - CNN

 

[AC's Grandma]

In my opinion the school is likely downplaying what they really know about him being bullied. Likely they chose to overlook and downplay it. CYA
As someone who was brutally bullied from the time I was 7 to well into adulthood it's taken me decades of therapy to work through it and I can't say that it doesn't still effect me to this day and I'm 58. Also note, no matter how bullied I was I never chose to pick up a gun or other weapon and harm another.
I know, I'm not this kid but bullying isn't a reason to shoot up a school and shouldn't be used as an excuse for his behavior.

I wonder what occurred in March in their home when his half brother decided to move back to mom's, could it be something that played a role in EC's behavior and violence now?
JMO MOO IMO

 

[Kristin Esq.]

"Two Michigan sisters said there were threats about a shooting posted on social media for weeks before a teen opened fire at a high school Tuesday, killing three other students and wounding eight other people."

So they reported the threats and NOTHING was done about it.

Sisters report social media threats before school shooting

Some students stayed home because of the threat:

Rumors of impending danger, terror-filled moments in Oxford school shooting | Bridge Michigan

 

[AC's Grandma]

Some bullying exceeds normal ribbing, or friendly teasing and crosses the line into assaults, physical, and sexual, to outright non-stop harassment and into terrorism.
Honestly, not sure how some kids can handle it. It seems to have gotten worse with social media because the bullying is 24/7 even after you go home.
If you have an emotionally unstable child/teen with no support it can lead to horrible outcomes. No, I'm not condoning violence, but some kids may feel they have no other options left. Kids need supportive parents, teachers, role models in their life that offer options. Too bad his parents didn't enroll him in martial arts vs buying a gun.
I'll wait to see what motivated him.

I posted above about being bullied but there is one difference between what I dealt with and what is a significant problem in behaviors of others today...social media.
Kids are cheered on to do things and the non-stop push to participate and to handle things that has made things considerably worse in my opinion, just look at the kid who committed suicide because a girl kept telling him to.
JMO MOO IMO

 

[x_files]

In my opinion the school is likely downplaying what they really know about him being bullied. Likely they chose to overlook and downplay it. CYA
As someone who was brutally bullied from the time I was 7 to well into adulthood it's taken me decades of therapy to work through it and I can't say that it doesn't still effect me to this day and I'm 58. Also note, no matter how bullied I was I never chose to pick up a gun or other weapon and harm another.
I know, I'm not this kid but bullying isn't a reason to shoot up a school and shouldn't be used as an excuse for his behavior.

I wonder what occurred in March in their home when his half brother decided to move back to mom's, could it be something that played a role in EC's behavior and violence now?
JMO MOO IMO

Agreed.
I do think society as a whole needs better options for kids/teens.
As a kid when I was bullied luckily I had supportive parents and a few teachers, but many kids do not. If I didn't have a loving supportive family and friends I'm not sure what would have happened.
Healthy outlets for anger/rage...better healthcare for mental illness.
Keeping guns out of kids' hands helps too.

 

[x_files]

In my opinion the school is likely downplaying what they really know about him being bullied. Likely they chose to overlook and downplay it. CYA
As someone who was brutally bullied from the time I was 7 to well into adulthood it's taken me decades of therapy to work through it and I can't say that it doesn't still effect me to this day and I'm 58. Also note, no matter how bullied I was I never chose to pick up a gun or other weapon and harm another.
I know, I'm not this kid but bullying isn't a reason to shoot up a school and shouldn't be used as an excuse for his behavior.

I wonder what occurred in March in their home when his half brother decided to move back to mom's, could it be something that played a role in EC's behavior and violence now?
JMO MOO IMO

Agreed.
I do think society as a whole needs better options for kids/teens.
As a kid when I was bullied luckily I had supportive parents and a few teachers, but many kids do not. If I didn't have a loving supportive family and friends I'm not sure what would have happened.
Healthy outlets for anger/rage...better healthcare for mental illness.
Keeping guns out of kids' hands helps too.

 

[x_files]

I posted above about being bullied but there is one difference between what I dealt with and what is a significant problem in behaviors of others today...social media.
Kids are cheered on to do things and the non-stop push to participate and to handle things that has made things considerably worse in my opinion, just look at the kid who committed suicide because a girl kept telling him to.
JMO MOO IMO

Yes. Thank you!
Online most busy parents have NO CLUE what is going on.
Kids/teens have anon/secret accounts and cyberbullying is non-stop. No one is safe or immune.
Even a mentally balanced child can start to suffer depression after constant bullying.
Social Media often won't ban the offenders either.
On social media there are no parents, no mentors, no one to moderate, it's like Lord of the Flies.
Honestly, I don't think I could handle what we expect kids to handle today.

 

[Kristin Esq.]

Yes. Thank you!
Online most busy parents have NO CLUE what is going on.
Kids/teens have anon/secret accounts and cyberbullying is non-stop. No one is safe or immune.
Even a mentally balanced child can start to suffer depression after constant bullying.
Social Media often won't ban the offenders either.
On social media there are no parents, no mentors, no one to moderate, it's like Lord of the Flies.
Honestly, I don't think I could handle what we expect kids to handle today.

Agreed. And with social media, sometimes the bully is faceless. They make fake accounts so they can't be found out! (Unless someone has special skills)