MI MI - Julia Niswender, 23, EMU student, Ypsilanti, 10 Dec 2012 - #4

[georgiasblu]

Wasn't it her sister who said that there was no evidence of sexual assault? Has Law enforcement commented on that at all?

Jennifer did say that and I'm sure LE stated that as well. Check out Bessie's post from last night.

 

[Mountaingazer]

Jennifer did say that and I'm sure LE stated that as well. Check out Bessie's post from last night.

Thanks, Georgia! It looks like Jennifer confirmed the police told the family there was no sexual assault, but at least from what I have read and what Bessie posted the police have never actually said it themselves in a public statement.

They did state she was found in an "unnatural position" but declined to elaborate because they wanted to keep some details private. Though we now know the position her body was found in.

I don't know why, but this case just gets to me more than others. It's not as fast moving, but I check it frequently. I hope Trojan and her family and friends get answers in the coming months.

 

[georgiasblu]

Thanks, Georgia! It looks like Jennifer confirmed the police told the family there was no sexual assault, but at least from what I have read and what Bessie posted the police have never actually said it themselves in a public statement.

They did state she was found in an "unnatural position" but declined to elaborate because they wanted to keep some details private. Though we now know the position her body was found in.

I don't know why, but this case just gets to me more than others. It's not as fast moving, but I check it frequently. I hope Trojan and her family and friends get answers in the coming months.

You're welcome, Mountaingazer. Looks like it did come from Jennifer. Perhaps they wanted JT to think otherwise? I feel the same about Julia's thread as well.

 

[monster12]

What if the perp took out the SIM card?

Perhaps it was the physical evidence on the phone that the perp was trying to get rid of. The last signs of life of Julia was a text message to Jennifer and to her roommate.

http://www.mlive.com/news/ann-arbor/index.ssf/2013/11/julia_niswender_family.html

http://www.mlive.com/news/ann-arbor/index.ssf/2015/09/documents_detail_allegations_a.html

Perhaps the perp used Julia's phone himself to send the text messages, thus giving himself a false alibi. Filling the bath with hot/warm water might also throw of investigators thinking that the murder was commited at a later time. Julia may already have been dead by the time "mean girls" was shown on TV.

I thought this same thing. They could have sent a message to whoever she was last talking to and have been general enough to make it seem like it was really her.

I'm having a hard time finding a good article to link except Wikipedia, but, there is something called positional asphixiation. If you search it, several articles come up dealing with cases about it but they seemed too detailed and long to reference here to get the details out I wanted.
"Positional asphyxia, also known as postural asphyxia, is a form of asphyxia which occurs when someone's position prevents the person from breathing adequately. A significant number of people die suddenly during restraint by police, prison (corrections) officers and health care staff."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positional_asphyxia

Tying it back to the post someone made about the possible "holds/moves" a certain perp would be familiar with. Also, I have read that it can cause biting of the tongue and the binding of arms/legs cause more anxiety and stress on the body to cause fainting... Which could tie back to her condition although it was said that wasn't a cause of death. Usually a person would use their arms to move their body to open their airway and help them gain their breath back.
Also, could the missing pillow case have been used to suffocate and they took it with them?
I know this seems jumbled but I just have so many random thoughts coming to mind as I read through the posts. I'm not so much sold on what's being released and said by family. At first they denied certain details from occurring which have now been released recently in these new documents. So I feel anything is possible at this point until more is released ...


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[Deleted member 132804]

Also, could the missing pillow case have been used to suffocate and they took it with them?
I know this seems jumbled but I just have so many random thoughts coming to mind as I read through the posts. I'm not so much sold on what's being released and said by family. At first they denied certain details from occurring which have now been released recently in these new documents. So I feel anything is possible at this point until more is released ...

I just hazard to think, the missing pillowcase leads me to believe a pillow was possibly used in suffocation. It would be a way to block an airway with minimal physical damage.

 

[black_squirrel]

Jennifer said police have told the family there were no signs that a "sexual assault or struggle" took place.

http://www.annarbor.com/news/ypsila...-confirms-julia-niswender-drowned-in-bathtub/

It is still unclear to me whether there was a sexual assault or not. Although semen was found, it may not necessarily be related to the murder. It could be that the perp put the semen there from another person, to mislead investigators. The FBI believes that the gloves were put there to mislead. There are also some signs that there may not have been a sexual assault. If such an assault had taken place, it probably would have taken place in the bedroom and not in the bathroom. In that case, the clothes probably would have been in the bedroom and not in the bathroom. Also, the clothes were cut with some cutting device, but the body had no injuries as far as we know (other than biting the tongue). So this suggests that she was unconscious or already deceased when the clothes were taken off.

I conjecture that the perp may have been trying to mislead investigators in many ways. From what the FBI profiler says, the perp took his time. (I am just writing he/him, but note that the perp could have been
a woman, although perhaps less likely.) Even if the the perp was looking for something, it seems unnecessary to throw all the drawer contents on the floor. Perhaps the perp just wanted to make it look like a burglary. Even if the police doesn't buy it, it will at least confuse investigators. Next, the perp also tried to make the scene look like a sexual assault had taken place, by taking off the clothes and stealing the panties. If this is the case, then it is unclear what the true motive is for the murder.

 

[FindHG]

[video=youtube;Jqz2X0IKrq0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jqz2X0IKrq0[/video]

Shawn Ley, Local 4 Detroit
9/3

and it runs into a second report by (will post below)


In the second segment you'll see a poignant quote from Turnquist about remorse eating up Julia's killer enough not to be able to handle it. It has always been my impression of Turnquist that he is a man willing to have his family torn apart into pieces to protect himself. His lawyer is heard objecting for facts linking him. Would it not be the facts stacked around him that prevents Turnquist from giving a full statement to LE about where he was around the time of Julia's death - not as defined by his advocates?


Documents make Turnquist target in death of stepdaughter
By Ray Kisonas, Monroe News
Thursday, September 3 '15, 11:00 am

“portraying the possibility that Julia was the victim of a home invasion,” according to the document. However, valuable items, including electronics, were left behind."

[...]

The documents showed that she had been bound and there were ligature marks on her wrists and ankles.

[...]

“The details of my sister’s death were very difficult to read because those were things we didn’t even know,” Jennifer said. “Ypsilanti (police) held it from us.”

[...]


Vasectomy is new clue in EMU student's bathtub drowning
By Katrease Stafford, Detroit Free Press
9:50 am edt, September 2 '15

Dresser drawers were left open with clothes thrown all over the floor, plastic drawers from an organizer were pulled out and the contents were dumped onto the floor.

[... looking for something other than valuables, perhaps?]


Documents detail suspicions of stepfather in Julia Niswender homicide
Darcie Moran, The Ann Arbor News/mlive
9/2

"I'm so delighted I gave my daughter a big hug that weekend," he told The Ann Arbor News in 2013 when discussing the family's last times saying goodbye to Niswender. "I told her I loved her and she said, 'I love you, too, Daddy," he said.

[... and we know Turnquist is a trophy hunter. Julia seems to have been treated like one by her killer, whether sexual assault can be proven or not]

Police did not find the cutting instrument used to remove the clothing, the ligatures used to bind her or underwear they suspected her of wearing.

[...]

"I'm not going to let him be repeatedly interrogated by officers that are hell bent on tripping him up — if that's what it is," Stablein previously said of intervening with police interviews.



bbm above & posted for reference

 

[FindHG]

[video=youtube;2DFf5ggolDA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DFf5ggolDA[/video]

Jonathan Carlson, ABC7 WZYX
9/2

 

[Deleted member 132804]

One thing I find very odd is Julia's friend recanting statements she made to LE about inappropriate behavior on JT's part towards Julia in the family household. IMO the statements she made were probably true, in that Julia confided this to her.

(the statements themselves sounded eerily familiar to me, of a friend I had in high school who said the same thing of her stepfather, she never wanted to stay home sick from school because the stepfather, who worked a midnight shift was at home while her mom worked. He would ask her to sleep in his bed, and cuddle with him, he would tell her not to be afraid etc..)

IMO...The statements Julia's friend made that were reported to her by Julia sound classic of someone who is trying to coerce a child/teen. Was she afraid people wouldn't believe her? Did she fear having to testify in court? Since Julia confided this to her friend 2 years before her death, I'm assuming this is a friend from Monroe where other family resides since Julia went to MCCC in Monroe before transferring to EMU in Ypsi. Maybe the friend is in the same social circles as other family members and has been convinced that JT would never do something like what happened to Julia and YPD was unfairly targeting him. And that those statements were said in anger by Julia, who wasn't getting along with the stepfather at the time. Or, those statements get in the way of LE finding the real killer.

IMO...Another thought about the statements being recanted is that the friend, being the only person she may know of that Julia confided in, may be feeling solely responsible if JT is charged with the said event. Maybe her own family told her after making the statements to recant, and not to get involved.

 

[georgiasblu]

One thing I find very odd is Julia's friend recanting statements she made to LE about inappropriate behavior on JT's part towards Julia in the family household. IMO the statements she made were probably true, in that Julia confided this to her.

(the statements themselves sounded eerily familiar to me, of a friend I had in high school who said to same thing of her stepfather, she never wanted to stay home sick from school because the stepfather, who worked a midnight shift was at home while her mom worked. He would ask her to sleep in his bed, and cuddle with him, he would tell her not to be afraid etc..)

IMO...The statements Julia's friend made that were reported to her by Julia sound classic of a someone who is trying to coerce a child/teen. Was she afraid people wouldn't believe her? Did she fear having to testify in court? Since Julia confided this to her friend 2 years before her death, I'm assuming this is a friend from Monroe where other family resides since Julia went to MCCC in Monroe before transferring to EMU in Ypsi. Maybe the friend is in the same social circles as other family members and has been convinced that JT would never do something like what happened to Julia and YPD was unfairly targeting him. And that those statements were said in anger by Julia, who wasn't getting along with the stepfather at the time. Or, those statements get in the way of LE finding the real killer.

IMO...Another thought about the statements being recanted is that the friend, being the only person she may know of that Julia confided in, may be feeling solely responsible if JT is charged with the said event. Maybe her own family told her after making the statements to recant, and not to get involved.

I think you're on the right track with those thoughts. It's not unusual for one child to be targeted in a family and others are left alone.

 

[black_squirrel]

One thing I find very odd is Julia's friend recanting statements she made to LE about inappropriate behavior on JT's part towards Julia in the family household. IMO the statements she made were probably true, in that Julia confided this to her.

That is odd, but I am not sure what to think of it. There are other possible explanations. Perhaps detective Koppock misunderstood, misrepresented or forgot exactly what was said in that initial interview. It seems that there were no other witnesses to that conversation. I also find the term "inappropiate things" very vague. Surely, Julia must have said something more specific when/if she brought it up.

I wonder, is this friend a cousin of Julia's?

 

[georgiasblu]

That is odd, but I am not sure what to think of it. There are other possible explanations. Perhaps detective Koppock misunderstood, misrepresented or forgot exactly what was said in that initial interview. It seems that there were no other witnesses to that conversation. I also find the term "inappropiate things" very vague. Surely, Julia must have said something more specific when/if she brought it up.

I wonder, is this friend a cousin of Julia's?

I 'm not sure she would have gone into the nitty gritty. The women I knew who were molested had a certain amount of shame about it. Julia was young and likely was just beginning to work through what happened. If there was an attempt to tell someone what happened as a much younger child, it probably didn't leave a good impression. MOO

 

[Spellbound]

I 'm not sure she would have gone into the nitty gritty. The women I knew who were molested had a certain amount of shame about it. Julia was young and likely was just beginning to work through what happened. If there was an attempt to tell someone what happened as a much younger child, it probably didn't leave a good impression. MOO

Right on, georgiasblu. I did not tell a single soul for at least 30 years after the way my mother reacted toward me, and I was very young at the time of the abuse. From speaking to others since, this is not at all unusual.

 

[FindHG]

Right on, georgiasblu. I did not tell a single soul for at least 30 years after the way my mother reacted toward me, and I was very young at the time of the abuse. From speaking to others since, this is not at all unusual.

I think it would be typical, considering the abuse in the Turnquist family seems to have been generational according to information from the search warrants. Knowing how to use social pressure and shame to shut down revelation of their truths may be a familiar coping skill in these circumstances, only those involved would know for sure. Maybe that's why Julia was murdered, truths were spilling out, from the way things seem, but who knows?

 

[georgiasblu]

Right on, georgiasblu. I did not tell a single soul for at least 30 years after the way my mother reacted toward me, and I was very young at the time of the abuse. From speaking to others since, this is not at all unusual.

I'm sorry Spellbound. Molestation, particularly when it occurs within the family unit is so destructive. The secrets, the shame and victim blaming is so sad. I think we can get hints of that within the T family with the angry denials that almost border on rabid. Jmho

 

[georgiasblu]

I think it would be typical, considering the abuse in the Turnquist family seems to have been generational according to information from the search warrants. Knowing how to use social pressure and shame to shut down revelation of their truths may be a familiar coping skill in these circumstances, only those involved would know for sure. Maybe that's why Julia was murdered, truths were spilling out, from the way things seem, but who knows?

I go back and forth. Sometimes I think the disarray in Julia's bedroom was staged. Other times, I think Julia's murderer was looking for something in particular. A journal, letter, something like that.

 

[FindHG]

I go back and forth. Sometimes I think the disarray in Julia's bedroom was staged. Other times, I think Julia's murderer was looking for something in particular. A journal, letter, something like that.

That sounds right to me, the plastic organizer being taken apart in the search, something on paper, a journal or pictures, possibly?

 

[black_squirrel]

That sounds right to me, the plastic organizer being taken apart in the search, something on paper, a journal or pictures, possibly?

Nowadays, a journal and picture probably would be on her laptop computer. But the laptop computer was not taken.
In any case, I think the disarray was either staged, or the perp was looking for something physical, not just incriminating photo's/information.

 

[Spellbound]

Perhaps the perp was looking for the key(s)? The organizer with drawers implies something small to me.

 

[georgiasblu]

Perhaps the perp was looking for the key(s)? The organizer with drawers implies something small to me.

I don't think it was they keys primarily as they were on a lanyard and I think they were likely laying out. Today, I'm thinking it was staged.