MN - Jacob Wetterling, 11, St. Joseph, 22 Oct 1989 - #13

[Sasquatch321]

Strange indeed....and why did they need to lie down? Doesn't LE typically require criminals to lie down? Why not stand them in line? Ask their ages and look them in their faces-the perp had the gun-the boys would not have run as they already surrendered. Either or it takes time. And this occurred next to the mailbox....what if a vehicle had come from the north and down the hill? This would have exposed the situation immediately. Could the perp have had a lookout up the hill?

Nice observation, because with Jareds case there is the portable police scanner. This guy is becoming a security guard, mall cop, or a straight up rogue cop.

 

[Dave K]

Look at the link you cited for the picture of investigator Steve mund stooping in the middle of the print field with the crime scene tape around him. Look at the position of his feet and the type of shoe he is wearing. Does this match up with anything in your print photos? Also, what is he spraying? Finally, maybe this picture will give you more area to blow up and get the position of the vehicle and the location of the correlated tire print.

http://s100.photobucket.com/user/shergal1/media/stevemundCasts.jpg.html?sort=4&o=8

Interesting!

As to "What is he spraying?" - here's from Tracker's post #782:

Trackergd

Mund is holding an aeresol can and appears to be spraying a track. This is an older method of using a "fixing agent" to hold loose soil together for the application of plaster where there is concern that the granular makeup of the soil could be affected/moved by the weight of the plaster. It was also sprayed on the plaster cast after it was removed from the track and the dirt cleaned off to preserve the cast. There were a lot of methods used over the years to take casts of tracks including spray wax, dental stone (like plaster of paris but harder), liquid rubber and even liquid sulphur for tracks in snow.

The rest of what you mention looks interesting; but, I'll have to come back to it at some point; I'm way tired, and can barely think right now, (head hurts), so, I gotta go cash in. Thanks for the notes; I'll see what I can make of it.

 

[Sasquatch321]

When the boys rented the Naked Gun movie from to thumb I have come to wonder, did Jacob have to say his full name and possibly address out loud? This is how I could make the theory of a perp at the store a more probable scenario imo.

 

[cGorg]

Look at the link you cited for the picture of investigator Steve mund stooping in the middle of the print field with the crime scene tape around him. Look at the position of his feet and the type of shoe he is wearing. Does this match up with anything in your print photos? Also, what is he spraying? Finally, maybe this picture will give you more area to blow up and get the position of the vehicle and the location of the correlated tire print.

http://s100.photobucket.com/user/shergal1/media/stevemundCasts.jpg.html?sort=4&o=8

This Steve Mund picture has been a craw in my side for a long time! He's right next to the print he's spraying! Tire tracks around him-curved tracks even...are these ATV's riding around the 'sprayed prints'?. Why is he so confidant that he can place his footprints so close to what I assume is Jacob's last footprint? And in subsequent videos the LE officers are walking right on the driveway! If you study other pictures(of what's available) you'll see all kinds of footprints....obviously LE walking to and fro...just a smattering of prints. It's exasperating! And I'm a layperson viewing this from a distance in time and space. If I look at that picture on a simplistic basis I conclude that Jacob's last footprints are within the semi-circle indicated by the LE tape and that anything outside of that circle is extraneous and then I wonder why is Steve Mund within that circle? My conclusion is that there is no conclusion...as especially as it relates to 'tire tracks'.

 

[cGorg]

When the boys rented the Naked Gun movie from to thumb I have come to wonder, did Jacob have to say his full name and possibly address out loud? This is how I could make the theory of a perp at the store a more probable scenario imo.

Joy's Blog says that the clerk Jennifer only had Jacob sign his name....nothing about a verbal confirmation. However, if the perp knew where Jacob lived then it wouldn't be hard to get ahead of the boys as they most likely didn't travel too quickly.

 

[cGorg]

Look at the link you cited for the picture of investigator Steve mund stooping in the middle of the print field with the crime scene tape around him. Look at the position of his feet and the type of shoe he is wearing. Does this match up with anything in your print photos? Also, what is he spraying? Finally, maybe this picture will give you more area to blow up and get the position of the vehicle and the location of the correlated tire print.

http://s100.photobucket.com/user/shergal1/media/stevemundCasts.jpg.html?sort=4&o=8

I looked at that picture again....it appears Steve Mund is wearing Nike shoes.....as was Jacob. Are you saying there was a mix of victim and investigator shoes? If so, then that is...I don't know what to say. And if this picture according to human was 'staged'(#749,Thread #13) then I really don't know what to think....that's disgusting. If that's the case, I don't trust anything I see of what has been released by LE.

 

[Trackergd]

One of the first things we do with a "print field" is to make sure we limit the number of people who have access. We photograph the bottoms of their shoes and note any patterns, cuts, nicks etc so that we can exclude any prints they make from the mix. I have a piece of plywood with blocks attached to the four corners that I put down near the tracks I want to investigate so that I can kneel on it without disturbing anything underneath....sort of a mini deck over any other prints.

We then map each of the unknown prints noting wear patterns, any marks in the pattern that are unique to that individual and any pressure releases, speed and weight indicators, aging indicators etc... I also ask for a pair of the missing individuals shoes so I can compare the wear patterns to those in the print field that LE thinks are the subjects.

A cardinal rule is to never wear the same make and model shoe as any of the prints in the print field.

In 90% of the cases, by the time someone with my skill set is called in, the Last Known Place is heavily contaminated with other prints. Most first responders never think to preserve the print field. This was true in the 80's and still is today.

Our pet name for this is "The Area Of Total Destruction" that has everything from ATV tracks to fire fighters bunker boot tracks. We are then forced to work in a circle to see if we can find the subjects prints leading out of the TAOTD. If there are no prints leading out and no scent picked up by SAR dogs, we entertain the possibility that the individual left by other means and start looking for indicators for those.

 

[Sasquatch321]

Military Recruiter Misconduct

http://www.bing.com/search?q=milita...s=n&sk=&cvid=3b54e88771a443b18e65a69d74b5dc3d



Raspy Voice- Been through a war? smoked and drank with comrades?
Cargo/Military pants, black combat boots
Gun- Not afraid to use it
Orders the boys to lie down in the ditch, military training?
Span of Assaults that suddenly stopped in the area- Military recruiters can be in MN from any state in the country for a period of time before they are assigned a new location.
Happens at night, weekends- Lonely time for a recruiter from out of state, temporarily living in MN with no family or friends.

 

[chaplain1]

Military Recruiter Misconduct

http://www.bing.com/search?q=milita...s=n&sk=&cvid=3b54e88771a443b18e65a69d74b5dc3d



Raspy Voice- Been through a war? smoked and drank with comrades?
Cargo/Military pants, black combat boots
Gun- Not afraid to use it
Orders the boys to lie down in the ditch, military training?
Span of Assaults that suddenly stopped in the area- Military recruiters can be in MN from any state in the country for a period of time before they are assigned a new location.
Happens at night, weekends- Lonely time for a recruiter from out of state, temporarily living in MN with no family or friends.

Randomly waiting for a boy to come down that road? Why kill if from out of state? Why ask Jared if he recognizes him?

 

[human]

As a teacher for 36 years, I can tell you that it's easy to approximate a child's age. Certainly, one can tell an elementary child from a young person in junior high or high school.

Ha ha. Remember the 12 year old who had sex with the female teacher that produced a child? She went to prison , came out and married him.

Just one example.

I would love to show you more and have you guess the ages of the children.

 

[human]

Plus the fact that he's still teaching!

The teacher that I knew molested the junior high boy taught right up to retirement. He was never accused of anything a he stopped his activities when sex abuse training came out after Jacob.

My friend and I wondered what he did. This teacher went to Minnneapolis often on weekends.

 

[Jbrown324320]

Per website "behind the pine curtain", many of the monks would go to Minneapolis on the weekends and come back with stories of going to gay bars and taking students there.

http://www.behindthepinecurtain.com/wordpress/victims-memories-of-fr-tom-andert/


http://www.behindthepinecurtain.com/wordpress/decades-of-abuse-and-secrecy-at-st-johns-abbey/

clipped from second link:
"Abbey monks who had taken vows of celibacy confided sexual fantasies to each other and talked of weekend partying at gay bars in Minneapolis.

It seemed, thought Brother Timothy Pembroke, that there was nobody in charge who was willing to confront the behavior.

Many nights, after evening prayers and dinner, Pembroke said he played bridge with other monks and wound up listening to conversations laced with sexual innuendo. "

 

[Dave K]

Look at the link you cited for the picture of investigator Steve mund stooping in the middle of the print field with the crime scene tape around him. Look at the position of his feet and the type of shoe he is wearing. Does this match up with anything in your print photos? Also, what is he spraying? Finally, maybe this picture will give you more area to blow up and get the position of the vehicle and the location of the correlated tire print.

http://s100.photobucket.com/user/shergal1/media/stevemundCasts.jpg.html?sort=4&o=8

It's hard to say. I can't personally make too much of what shoes he's wearing, especially the soles. The thing is, about the prints that are visible in the photos. It's my expectation that any number of them are from 'investigators' on the scene. To an extent it's bothersome, because, I would like to think that they should have documented the 'scene' with video and still photographs quite well, before there was much of any other foot traffic on it at all. And, actually, it may well have been, but, if so, those pictures, videos aren't the ones shared with the public. At the same time. As noted in previous posts, unless I'm wrong, what's known as Jacob's last footprint, the pic itself looks pretty pristine, and I'm presuming that it has to have been taken before any plaster was poured into the print; and, at the same time, we see several 'other' prints in the area, which I'm presuming are from investigators. So, unless I'm figuring wrong; there seems to have been a fair amount of traffic right in the area of the 'main' print, before it was even cast. That seems kind of awkward.

So, were there any photos/videos taken, before the scene was so contaminated? Among the things we'd like to know, but, don't, and pretty well can't, with lack of cooperation from LE. And, if there are such pics, we don't have access to them. So, it's really hard to say what we can do with what we have. But, I still feel like pursuing, just to see what we 'can' find.

Blowing that picture up is kind of interesting; but, as all the other pictures, also frustrating. As far as I've seen, this may be the only picture that gives the whole driveway, including both sides. So, you can see the little fence, which would make that the North side of the driveway (the left hand side, looking east, toward the Rassier farm), and basically, you can see the right hand (south) side of the driveway. For the most part, that's the most that I can get out of the enlarged picture.

The thing is, in that specific pic, I, at least, don't get a real good view of the 'corresponding track' which would be one of my main interests. What we do see, it looks as if the one track, I suppose the one we're most familiar with, (the main track) runs pretty much down what looks like the middle of the drive. Starting in the lower/left corner of the pic, and running toward the upper/right (I'm not saying necessarily moving that direction, I'm just trying to identify it). Then the detective seems to be spraying something, just to the 'north' side of that track. While it's hard to tell, and I just can't feel like I can see it definitively, I'm 'guessing' and I feel like I can kinda see what may be the corresponding track, toward the north, upper/left part of the picture. Given the average width of a vehicle, a few feet to the other side of the one track. If that's the case; then, presuming the last track was made by the vehicle, exiting the farm, going west, then, the main track, which appears to be in the middle of the picture, would be the driver's side of the car.

But at this point, I'm not certain, for sure, (redundant, I know) that I'm necessarily seeing correctly, what would be the corresponding tire tracks. That to me, is one of the main things that I'd like to know for sure. I'm curious if anyone else has an opinion on whether they can identify the two corresponding tracks in this, or any other picture? Or, can anyone identify a 'corresponding track' on the south/right-hand side of the main track?

The thing is, most of the pictures, we see 'one' track specifically, and no other, and we don't have a broad enough view of the driveway to see the corresponding track. Therefore, we don't see, as far as I can tell, whether we're looking at a driver side track or a passenger side track.

So, I'm kinda stuck, for a few reasons.

 

[Jbrown324320]

I wonder if there is a connection?

 

[human]

I have always wondered why someone abducting anyone would ask ages. That, in itself, seems strange, and it's even stranger, albeit a few moments, to take time to ask. One would think a fast getaway would be in order.

I do not want to talk about why pervs prefer certain ages of boys because it is revolting. Google is your friend.

 

[human]

Strange indeed....and why did they need to lie down? Doesn't LE typically require criminals to lie down? Why not stand them in line? Ask their ages and look them in their faces-the perp had the gun-the boys would not have run as they already surrendered. Either or it takes time. And this occurred next to the mailbox....what if a vehicle had come from the north and down the hill? This would have exposed the situation immediately. Could the perp have had a lookout up the hill?

Making them lie down is control. The perp needs control and he exerts his dominance by making them lie down.

If you have ever looked into hiring issues, you will see tricks used such as having the boss sitting in a chair that is higher than the employee to establish dominance, for instance.

 

[human]

When the boys rented the Naked Gun movie from to thumb I have come to wonder, did Jacob have to say his full name and possibly address out loud? This is how I could make the theory of a perp at the store a more probable scenario imo.

Possible, but in the little store where we rented vids, the clerks knew the kids and they simply wrote on the slip that was kept of our family . Children needed to have their parents sign off that the kids could rent. I imagine most places were like that.

 

[human]

Joy's Blog says that the clerk Jennifer only had Jacob sign his name....nothing about a verbal confirmation. However, if the perp knew where Jacob lived then it wouldn't be hard to get ahead of the boys as they most likely didn't travel too quickly.

Who was in the store though?

 

[chaplain1]

Per website "behind the pine curtain", many of the monks would go to Minneapolis on the weekends and come back with stories of going to gay bars and taking students there.

http://www.behindthepinecurtain.com/wordpress/victims-memories-of-fr-tom-andert/


http://www.behindthepinecurtain.com/wordpress/decades-of-abuse-and-secrecy-at-st-johns-abbey/

clipped from second link:
"Abbey monks who had taken vows of celibacy confided sexual fantasies to each other and talked of weekend partying at gay bars in Minneapolis.

It seemed, thought Brother Timothy Pembroke, that there was nobody in charge who was willing to confront the behavior.

Many nights, after evening prayers and dinner, Pembroke said he played bridge with other monks and wound up listening to conversations laced with sexual innuendo. "

Big difference between gay bars and violently abducting a child. I guess for people outside the culture, that is considered strange. Be a lot less problems right now in the Church if they were all allowed to go to gay bars instead of repressing their desires.

 

[ThePhantom]

Alas, so many of these monks and priests were in positions of authority and abused the privilege most grievously. They plied their prey with alcohol and intimidated them to no end. They lied, deceived and played mind games. And there was at least one and I dare say more who had no conscience at all -- once described to me by a respected colleague as being like a snake -- cold -- methodical -- meticulous -- deviant and devious in their pursuits.