MN - Jacob Wetterling, 11, St. Joseph, 22 Oct 1989 - #4

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I have an answer on part of this, the girl working at Tom Thumb that night had the same last name as the babysitter/family next door/ guy who called 911, and I think it was an older sister. (This is way out there, but it did cross my mind when I heard Trevor say on the 911 tape "The man looked just like Merle here"... that maybe... but I'm sure A) he was thoroughly checked out and home with family, and b) he could have never been back at the scene grabbing Jacob and then also home when the boys ran home and somehow beat them there.) But it is an odd coincidence that one sister was babysitting and one was at the store. (I'll find a link for the sister at the store - I think it was on the Charley project site.)

Also, in a snippet I read in comments on a blog in the St. Cloud Times, there are two posters discussing the Bahner brothers and according to this "on the run joe" person, the Bahner brothers (or MB and Lou) were seen in the ditch at the Tom Thumb that night. So they were on the scene at the store. (snippet below with link)

This is a really long link, if it doesn't work, I can try tiny url. This is from our local paper by a blogger named joe on the run.

http://www.sctimes.com/apps/pbcs.dl...mmentKey:8f4cc63e-9fdc-4f44-8c1b-a002827f6b9b


Joe on the Run Commentary
This is what I think
Wetterling abduction
Posted 10/20/2009 8:33 PM CDT
go to youtube and search stearntruth. some interesting videos about the abduction.

Myrts1 wrote:
ok....so this Ben is saying the Bahner brothers are the one that took him, but this Mike Bahner is saying someone named Lou took him? am I understanding this?
10/21/2009 8:17 AM CDT

ontherunjoe wrote:
Ben is saying he saw the Bahners in the ditch when he went to the TomThumb that night. Michael is saying he was there with Lou. Understand, this was late at night and Ben could of assumed it was the both Bahner's, since they seem to be together a lot, when in fact it was Michael and Lou.
10/21/2009 7:38 PM CDT
I listened to that tape quite a few times, and I was never clear on where exactly they saw them in the ditch. If it was close to the Rassier farm, my question is, where were they coming from- who were they visiting. I think they were from St Cloud at the time, not St Joseph.
It is very interesting that the clerk had the last name as Merle. Was he the parent of the babysitter? I wasn't sure from the 911 tape. If you can find the full name of the clerk, that would be great. I do think that in light of looking locally, it would be interesting to know who else was there around the same time.
 
Still wondering who in specific and what restaurant delivered the pizza, as questioned by several of you earlier on in the threads.

Probably has no relevance whatsoever, Devlin was a pizza parlor manager when he abducted Shawn Hornbeck, as we all know.

(well I take that back, perhaps relevant to the extent that maybe Devlin learned something about potential kidnapping victims from his pizza delivery routes.) http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,243661,00.html

Perhaps the pizza delivery is another piece of the puzzle.

Says in the above article that Devlin got a job in the pizza parlor as a teenager.

Makes me question if a teenager (who perhaps was himself a victim) was part of whatever logistics it took to kidnap Jacob.

Forgive me if this has already been stated somewhere around here... But... wasn't Devil questioned in regards to Jacob's abduction? I think I vaguely recall hearing / reading this somewhere (might even have been around here on WS somewhere... ??).
 
http://www.startribune.com/local/64675297.html?page=3&c=y
This is from a story in the Star Tribune.
This part is in the words of Aaron:

About halfway through their mile-long trip, Aaron heard a rustle in the tall grass by the road.

"A little shiver went through me," he said. "I didn't know if it was a person or an animal, but I kind of sped up. I don't know if Trevor or Jacob even heard it. ... It was just a strange noise that shouldn't be there."

Not wanting the others to know he was scared, he said nothing.
They arrived at the store near 9 p.m. For 10 or 15 minutes, they studied the videos, renting "Naked Gun'' because their first choice, "Major League," was checked out.

After buying some candy, the boys headed home.

Halfway back, near the same spot where Larson heard the rustle, a man wearing a mask stepped from the dark.

"The first thing I remember was the flash of the gun, and a guy saying, 'Stop, I have a gun,'" Larson recalled. "I caught my breath. I thought it was a high school kid pulling a joke on us. ... Then it hits you: this is happening, it's no joke."

The man ordered them to lie face-down in the roadside ditch.

Larson remembers his heart "going 1,000 beats a minute," but having no clue what was happening. "You didn't hear about people being kidnapped or abducted. It didn't cross my mind."

The man asked Trevor to look at him, then asked his age. He did the same with Aaron, then Jacob.

"Then he told Trevor to run as fast as he can to the woods. Trevor was not gone that long, maybe 10 seconds, and he said the same to me or he'd shoot," Larson said. "I ran as fast as I could to catch up to Trevor."

After running 100 yards, Larson looked back -- and saw nothing but darkness.

Frantic, the boys ran to the Wetterling house. The baby sitter called her father, who called 911. Within minutes, the cul-de-sac lit up with squad cars.

Petrified, Larson looked out a living room window and kept telling himself he would see Jacob again. "Sooner or later, he's going to come and he's going to get out of the car and this will all be over."

Twenty years later, there's a part of him still looking out the window, waiting for his friend.

1. He heard a noise that shouldn't have been there halfway to the store.
2. They got to the store about 9pm and were there for 10 or 15 minutes.
3. Halfway back near the same spot, a man came out of the dark.
4. The babysitter called her Dad, who called 911.

I couldn't find the name of the clerk at the store. But again, it sounds like someone was in the woods when they were on the way to the store.
 
Even if the whole town knew the R's were in Europe, they would also know that the strong son was still in the home.
There were a lot of out buildings, and I heard that they stored things for the church fair or something like that. Who knows what kind of interesting things might be on that farm, that could be of value. And a big enough place to be able to stay hidden pretty easily.
 
I am waaaaay to lazy to do this, but somewhere on here is the link to the student newspapers at St. John's. The girl who was the clerk gave a talk at St. John's about her night at the store.

I cannot remember the last name of the girl. But it is in the article.
 
There were a lot of out buildings, and I heard that they stored things for the church fair or something like that. Who knows what kind of interesting things might be on that farm, that could be of value. And a big enough place to be able to stay hidden pretty easily.

I suppose that is possible for sure. There was a dog at the DR home, but no barking?

People of that age steal-guns, money and booze. Nowadays electronics, but there wasn't much of that back then. I don't think they are looking for things that would be good for a church fete.
 
I suppose that is possible for sure. There was a dog at the DR home, but no barking?

People of that age steal-guns, money and booze. Nowadays electronics, but there wasn't much of that back then. I don't think they are looking for things that would be good for a church fete.

Or maybe they weren't there to steal anything. Maybe they wanted to give a scare to DR who they knew was home alone? Or maybe they were friends of DR's who had been visiting him and they all decided to grab that good looking jock kid from down the road who they were all jealous of? Just thinking out loud.

Thanks, human, those newspaper archives - that's where I saw her name. I think I have that link somewhere here, or I can search my own old posts. ;-)

Found it!
Here's the main link to the St. John's newsletter archives: (this is a direct link, which was really long so I shortened it with tiny url, if it doesn't work, try the one below it.)
http://tinyurl.com/2438n37

Alternate - go here: http://www.hmml.org/vivarium/
Then go to this heading (2nd one down on right) for archives of St. John's newsletters. "CSB/SJU Newspaper Archives" and type in "Jacob Wetterling" in the blank and click go. A bunch of archived newsletters "The Record" come up.

You have to read through individual papers, but the name of the girl from Tom Thumb is in there somewhere.
 
Or maybe they weren't there to steal anything. Maybe they wanted to give a scare to DR who they knew was home alone? Or maybe they were friends of DR's who had been visiting him and they all decided to grab that good looking jock kid from down the road who they were all jealous of? Just thinking out loud.

Thanks, human, those newspaper archives - that's where I saw her name. I think I have that link somewhere here, or I can search my own old posts. ;-)

Found it!
Here's the main link to the St. John's newsletter archives: (this is a direct link, which was really long so I shortened it with tiny url, if it doesn't work, try the one below it.)
http://tinyurl.com/2438n37

Alternate - go here: http://www.hmml.org/vivarium/
Then go to this heading (2nd one down on right) for archives of St. John's newsletters. "CSB/SJU Newspaper Archives" and type in "Jacob Wetterling" in the blank and click go. A bunch of archived newsletters "The Record" come up.

You have to read through individual papers, but the name of the girl from Tom Thumb is in there somewhere.

Thank you Shergal. I will have to go through them tonight.
There are a lot of them that come up, so it might take awhile.
It is really kind of curious that they would all have the same last name.
 
And let's not forget that we still haven't heard any results on the trunk that had blood on it or DR's journals, as we get sidetracked on the Bahner brothers, etc.

This is a 14 minute interview with DR in which he talks about the evidence taken from his home and the journals he kept on Jacob's case. (It'd be nice if we had the sunshine law here so we could see some of those notes eventually.) I get the impression from what DR says, that he still feels a car was involved - because he keeps saying he knows what he saw. Although he mentions what he saw earlier that day also. Sure would like to know what he thinks he saw.
http://kstp.com/news/stories/s1767412.shtml?cat=1
 
And let's not forget that we still haven't heard any results on the trunk that had blood on it or DR's journals, as we get sidetracked on the Bahner brothers, etc.

This is a 14 minute interview with DR in which he talks about the evidence taken from his home and the journals he kept on Jacob's case. (It'd be nice if we had the sunshine law here so we could see some of those notes eventually.) I get the impression from what DR says, that he still feels a car was involved - because he keeps saying he knows what he saw. Although he mentions what he saw earlier that day also. Sure would like to know what he thinks he saw.
http://kstp.com/news/stories/s1767412.shtml?cat=1

I remember the trunk from the house that had blood on it. They haven't released the tests on that yet?
 
I remember the trunk from the house that had blood on it. They haven't released the tests on that yet?

Nope. Nothing has been said on that, the journals or the umbrella stand.

I'm currently watching Nancy Grace's missing program and she's featuring Scott Kleeschulte who disappeared at 9 years old in June of 1988 from St. Charles, MO. They mentioned suspecting Michael Devlin, but supposedly he passed a polygraph saying he didn't take Scott. The case seems very similar to Jacob, a 9 year old only one block from his home, totally disappeared and hasn't been seen for 21 years. (There's a thread on him here under 1980 missing.)
 
Nope. Nothing has been said on that, the journals or the umbrella stand.

I'm currently watching Nancy Grace's missing program and she's featuring Scott Kleeschulte who disappeared at 9 years old in June of 1988 from St. Charles, MO. They mentioned suspecting Michael Devlin, but supposedly he passed a polygraph saying he didn't take Scott. The case seems very similar to Jacob, a 9 year old only one block from his home, totally disappeared and hasn't been seen for 21 years. (There's a thread on him here under 1980 missing.)
I heard she was doing a series on missing children. I wonder if she will cover Jacob. I really hope so.
 
I heard she was doing a series on missing children. I wonder if she will cover Jacob. I really hope so.

Jacob's photo is in with the many other missing children photos in the background during the show. I'm hoping that means that she will be covering Jacob's case...
 
there is a woman in Sheboygan Wisconsin who killed her child 50 some years ago. Her son went to authorities and she has been arrested. For 50 some years the family kept the secret.

So people do have info and then they crack.. Let's hope that this is the case here as well.
 
I completely forgot about the tests regarding the blood on the trunk, the umbrella stand, etc. They seem to be taken their time with those tests. I don't know if thats a good thing or a bad thing. Either way I hope we get the results soon.
 
I did read a comment or an article about the experience of the clerk in the Tom Thumb.
I'll have to go back over the articles you all posted. I've read some of these before. Sometimes it's difficult to remember to save these things because you're scanning so quickly through the material trying to find any little shred of circumstantial evidence.

Here's what I remember from reading articles/comments (and we realize that sometimes comments are a) telling or b) rumors, or both with a nugget of truth):

The clerk (?), or was it a customer in the store (maybe not on the same night), saying something to the effect that a man would come into the store repeatedly after the abduction and talk about the case. Also, I believe the same person said that this man told him or her that he frequently just drove around the area.

Once again, this could be heresay, just to reiterate.
 
I completely forgot about the tests regarding the blood on the trunk, the umbrella stand, etc. They seem to be taken their time with those tests. I don't know if thats a good thing or a bad thing. Either way I hope we get the results soon.

I haven't forgotten that Shergal and others have circled back around to the tests on the trunk and umbrella stand numerous times.

If: there is Jacob's DNA on the umbrella stand:

Then: Was he hit in the head with it? Was he tied to it or somehow secured onto it?

If: the blood droplet or spatter on the trunk is Jacob's blood, then:

Was he placed on or in the trunk? Was it blood spatter from being hit with the umbrella stand?

What are some of your speculations regarding the above, because I'm certain that this has run through your minds often, as it has mine.
 
there is a woman in Sheboygan Wisconsin who killed her child 50 some years ago. Her son went to authorities and she has been arrested. For 50 some years the family kept the secret.

So people do have info and then they crack.. Let's hope that this is the case here as well.
--------------------------
Yes, I agree that this keeping secrets thing, IMO, has and is hampering the case from moving forward.

Another example in my mind is that just now, in the last couple of years, we are hearing about the sexual abuse of children that hasn't been reported or was covered up. The more you research it, the more aware you get that a huge number of cases were covered up, or the victims were too traumatized, fearful, ashamed to divulge that this happened to them.

In addition, moreso in the past, the names of victims, and sometimes even the fact there were crimes committed against children/adolescents, is withheld.

So, since citizens can't know the information, we sometimes are left clueless.
 
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