<modsnip> DR claims the vehicle responsible was driving recklessly that afternoon and turned around up by the farm house and Kevin drove all the way up also so I'm not sure what you are getting at???
MN - Jacob Wetterling, 11, St. Joseph, 22 Oct 1989 - #9
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<modsnip> DR claims the vehicle responsible was driving recklessly that afternoon and turned around up by the farm house and Kevin drove all the way up also so I'm not sure what you are getting at???
You're trusting LE to accurately account for all the cars that drove on the driveway yet the actual person who came forward disputes where they say his tracks stopped.
If LE can't even get that right how on Earth can they determine that all tracks are accounted for!?!?
If LE can't even get that right how on Earth can they determine that all tracks are accounted for!?!?
ELOCsoul
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Again, where are you getting that information? I've never heard or seen anything from LE regarding where Kevin's tracks were.
I got them from you! Here's your quote from 11-12-2012
"That's correct - I was referring to Kevin's tire tracks. My point was that Kevin most likely turned around at the end of the driveway."
Based on your assumption, you noted that Kevin didn't proceed up to the telephone pole, hence, his tracks were the ones that ended abruptly.
"That's correct - I was referring to Kevin's tire tracks. My point was that Kevin most likely turned around at the end of the driveway."
Based on your assumption, you noted that Kevin didn't proceed up to the telephone pole, hence, his tracks were the ones that ended abruptly.
CrimeSolver
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Apologies if this has been posted already. I haven't had occasion to read recent weeks' of this ongoing discussion. I've just started on Thread #9.
John Walsh, late of America's Most Wanted, has a new show coming on CNN, The Hunt, which sounds like it's quite similar in content (but hopefully not style) to A.M.W. According to a recent entry in Joy Baker's blog, the show, which premieres July 13th, will be doing a segment or episode about the Wetterling case.
John Walsh, late of America's Most Wanted, has a new show coming on CNN, The Hunt, which sounds like it's quite similar in content (but hopefully not style) to A.M.W. According to a recent entry in Joy Baker's blog, the show, which premieres July 13th, will be doing a segment or episode about the Wetterling case.
bessie
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To keep things in context, here is the exact quote from 11/12/12 that FindTim has referenced.
Post No. 829, Thread #6
Post No. 819, Thread #6
Post No. 829, Thread #6
Post No. 819, Thread #6
Info on footprint and tire tracks:
"The police arrived six minutes later and went to the place where the boys had seen the man. Jacob’s footprints were on the driveway by where the man had been standing. But then they ended and his toe sort of dug into the gravel. There appeared to be some resistance at that point. There were tire tracks on the driveway. You can see the tire tracks right next to Jacob's footprint in this photo."
Jacob could have been picked up at this point, or moved over to the grass on the north side of the driveway. If another car was there before Kevin's red car, they would have had to drive in the same exact tracks, and stop and back out in the same way, because there was just that one set of tire tracks in the photos.
More photos and details at link.
http://saintautumn.wordpress.com/2012/07/01/the-jacob-wetterling-abduction/
(I'm not sure whose blog this is, it could be someone from here at WS, because many of these pics have been posted here previously.) Also all details in this blog may not be correct. For instance, when Nancy Grace aired a show on Jacob, Sheriff Sanner said the mask was a ski type mask and NOT a nylon stocking.
Do you know if this picture is of the spot where Jacob's footprints ended? If so, I believe that point was about 40 yards up the DR driveway. Kevin has been quoted as saying he just pulled into the driveway far enough to just turn around. If that's the case, then the tracks by the footprints in the photo would not have been Kevin's. All speculation and assumption here, of course.
That post was from back in 2012 when we were still going by Kevin's original statements, before Joy interviewed him and he added new details, such as;
1. he did drive all the way up to the house and turn around, and
2. he no longer told a cop at the scene about the bikes, he drove to Tom Thumb, went in there, saw a medical cop, left there went across the street where a cop car was parked by Dr. Cotton's office, and told the cop in the car there.
I'm not so sure Kevin "changed his story" in 2014 as much as he just left out really a lot of details the first time he told it back in 2003/4. But it has definitely added confusion to the case.
As far as I know, NO tire tracks stopped in the driveway at all. Kevin's went all the way up and back according to him. The only tire print pictures we have seen are continuous tracks, not stopping. That is why it's hard to believe Jacob was taken in a moving car.
ELOCsoul
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OK, hang on a sec' here .I was asking you to defend your statement below (in red), which I interpreted to mean that you are suggesting that LE has disputed Kevin's story.
My post from 2012, which you subsequently quoted from, was back when pretty much everyone was operating under the assumption that Kevin pulled into DR's driveway and backed out. It wasn't until last year, when Joy revealed Kevin's full story, that the backing out of the driveway was really down at Dr. Cotton's office. So, all this time, it was the media that got the story wrong and inadvertently misled the public for 9 years
Can you explain a conclusion that LE has disagreed with Kevin? Or, maybe you just misinterpreted??
TIA
Originally Posted by FindTim View Post
You're trusting LE to accurately account for all the cars that drove on the driveway yet the actual person who came forward disputes where they say his tracks stopped.
If LE can't even get that right how on Earth can they determine that all tracks are accounted for!?!?
ELOCsoul
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Please share with us where it is on record that DR talked about both cars immediately after the abduction. Yeah, he claims now that he told LE back then about two cars, but to my knowledge there is only one account from 1989, and that references a single car.
I have posted my "It's All About The Cars" position statement on here several times. If it can be documented that DR told LE about two cars, from the very beginning - that would go a long way toward establishing his innocence.
bingo!!!!!!
"When Dan returned home that evening (sometime around 5pm he figures), he had to park in a neighbors yard because a police dog was searching the road and ditch areas. He was stopped by a reporter from the St. Cloud Times, who questioned him about what he had witnessed. He told her about the two cars, but she only reported on one of them
the small dark car. "
http://www.joybaker.com/2013/05/15/dans-story-covered-on-wcco-news/
LE has not disclosed ANY information in regards to the interviews conducted immediately after with Rassier.
Now, can you site your sources where it says that LE had checked by the house for tire tracks?
http://www.joybaker.com/2013/05/15/dans-story-covered-on-wcco-news/
LE has not disclosed ANY information in regards to the interviews conducted immediately after with Rassier.
Now, can you site your sources where it says that LE had checked by the house for tire tracks?
I do not understand how this proves anything as it is DR's words.
I also do not understand why you keep implying LE did not check tire tracks.
They got a hold of people at the Del Win including a guy from Japan.
They would not look at tire tracks on the whole driveway because..........?
Seriously, that is not believable .
Your quote above is not from a media source. This is just what DR told JoyB in their interview this year. So, IMO, it can't be taken as fact. I believe WS has stated comments from blogs are to be considered as just opinions or rumor, and not fact.
<modsnip>
DR may be a POI, but he's also a key witness, and the police did a horrendous job of documenting his accounts of that evening. First, the 911 tape isn't even on file. Second, they didn't even knock on his door the night Jacob was abducted. Third, they let him drive his car over the crime scene in the morning. Remember, DR was only told the night before that a kid was taken at the end of his driveway. He had no idea and wasn't told that the kid is still missing until he reached the end of his own driveway.
The police had and have done a horrible job on this case. Patty Wetterling wasn't even aware of the kidnapping attempts in Paynesville, and the intercommunication between police forces was deplorable. It seems shoddy and bad police work is pretty consistent in Stearns county (see C.S. police murder).
DR is, IMO a victim. The police conducted such poor investigative work that they allowed the scene to be contaminated and failed to even knock on his door. These are facts.
Everything else everyone talks about in regards to DR being some kind of mastermind is speculation. It constantly amazes me how people throw speculation around and act as if they are going to arrive at the conclusion. The facts are the facts, and if Jared and Patty feel these cases are all interconnected, than I have no doubts that they are.
DR may be a POI, but he's also a key witness, and the police did a horrendous job of documenting his accounts of that evening. First, the 911 tape isn't even on file. Second, they didn't even knock on his door the night Jacob was abducted. Third, they let him drive his car over the crime scene in the morning. Remember, DR was only told the night before that a kid was taken at the end of his driveway. He had no idea and wasn't told that the kid is still missing until he reached the end of his own driveway.
The police had and have done a horrible job on this case. Patty Wetterling wasn't even aware of the kidnapping attempts in Paynesville, and the intercommunication between police forces was deplorable. It seems shoddy and bad police work is pretty consistent in Stearns county (see C.S. police murder).
DR is, IMO a victim. The police conducted such poor investigative work that they allowed the scene to be contaminated and failed to even knock on his door. These are facts.
Everything else everyone talks about in regards to DR being some kind of mastermind is speculation. It constantly amazes me how people throw speculation around and act as if they are going to arrive at the conclusion. The facts are the facts, and if Jared and Patty feel these cases are all interconnected, than I have no doubts that they are.
ELOCsoul
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I like your passion FindTim. We need more constructive debate around here, regardless of what our positions are - they all inspire creative thinking.
Had I ever made a claim that LE checked by the house, I would gladly cite my source.
ELOCsoul
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The news media itself is quite unreliable and biased at times. WCCO's recent coverage is full of inaccuracies. I guess they're particularly irritating to me because I've done so much media research on the subject. The most glaring example is the claim that the 86-87 cases were never investigated with regards to Jacob's case. Articles from 1989 clearly state that they were being looked into by the Wetterling task force.
Additionally, recent news stories have said that the possible connection between Jared's and Jacob's cases were not made until 6 months after Jacob was abducted. Not true - investigators first disclosed the possible connection on Wednesday October 25, 1989 - just 3 days after Jacob's abduction.
Joy's blog is a big factor in these inaccuracies
Sasquatch321
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Not on that beautiful night they didnt. Remember that day was described as being pleasant and perfect for running. The only way tracks erode on gravel in a couple hours is by the act of a strong force of mother nature, like a tornado. Tracks on gravel can even survive rain.
I agree with you on the gravel but please explain Jacob's last footprint as it relates to DR as lone perp on foot.
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