MO - Grief & protests follow shooting of teen Michael Brown #11

[Minette]

And... It begins. Clearly this case is falling apart. I also heard that OW is talking now after his silence
I didn't realize he never filled a report!




"Investigators are grappling with witness statements that include shifting and contradictory stories, and some who appear to be reciting accounts of what they've seen in the media, two law enforcement sources told CNN."
http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/25/us/ferguson-michael-brown-funeral/?c=&page=4

All posts are MOO

"If we had more of this," one family member said, referring to the audience and then motioning to Brown's casket, "we could have less of this. It shouldn't have took this to get us together like this."

It's something I find hard to come to terms with, that there is apparently SO much family involvement, especially with the church, and yet somehow MB did the actions that he did. Forgive me for not going into details, because this day is NOT about me, but I had an upbringing much more like DW's with all the chaos & hurting than MB's with all these family members in his court, preachers of the word, etc., and still he did things (stealing & threatening from that tiny store clerk) and scuffling with a LEO that I would have never have thought to do. I don't know, is it because my skin is a different color??? It's so freaking sad and confusing. But he had TWO apparently loving & involved parents AND a grandmother and a great uncle who is a pastor, so what happened? And this whole community who evidently knew and loved him and yet....he did what he did. Why??? I don't get it. How the hell do you have all that love and support and yet go on to menace this poor little shopkeeper and then have a 'serious altercation' with a cop in his own car? Those are questions I am asking today.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Can someone PLEASE help me out. I'm looking for a link of any kind that says MB was embalmed before Michael Baden did his autopsy. I know it's true but I can't find a link to back it up. And yes---I've looked through the Media thread but still no luck. Any help will be greatly appreciated. Holding my breath---please don't make me turn blue. Tia and more thanks to come.

I linked it earlier...the transcript from Greta Van Sustern


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[tlcya]

Can someone PLEASE help me out. I'm looking for a link of any kind that says MB was embalmed before Michael Baden did his autopsy. I know it's true but I can't find a link to back it up. And yes---I've looked through the Media thread but still no luck. Any help will be greatly appreciated. Holding my breath---please don't make me turn blue. Tia and more thanks to come.

Just arriving so apologies if this has been responded to already.

here is what I could find

“Sometimes in between the first and second autopsy, the body may be embalmed,” Fowler said, adding that embalming “can sometimes alter some of the features externally to a minor degree.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2014/08/18/multiple-autopsies-like-those-in-michael-browns-death-are-unusual-but-not-unprecedented/

Another complicating factor is embalming. Brown's body was embalmed after the first autopsy, which may limit the information discernable from the gunshot wounds, as the colour and texture of the body is altered.

http://www.newscientist.com/article...y-unlikely-to-solve-mystery.html#.U_vC-PmwKy8

In Brown's case, the initial autopsies found that he was healthy at the time of the shooting. Second autopsies can be slightly more challenging to conduct than initial autopsies, because of changes to the body during the initial examination orembalming, according to the Autopsy Center of Chicago. However, features such as the entry and exit wounds from gunshots would remain on the body. Baden told reporters in a news conference that observations in multiple autopsies rarely disagree. Autopsy is a science, Brown said, so in most cases the basic observations are clear and reproducible. In some tough cases, he said, interpretations of the wounds can vary. At that point, he said, it's up to the pathologist to explain his or her reasoning to the jury.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/michael-browns-autopsy-what-it-can-and-cant-tell-us/

 

[hambirg]

I asked how to surrender. Are you saying if he stops running & freezes, OW must stop shooting?

He stops running, lays on the ground, spread eagle with his hands behind his head and yells that he is surrendering.

 

[Starry Night]

I don't think you know whether anyone has or hasn't done so. :rose: Prayer is a personal thing. And i don't think it is disrespectful to continue posting here. We are not out protesting which is what the father asked others not to do tonight.

No I don't know if anyone here online posted a prayer for him on this thread. today. I stand corrected. I hope they have.
I didn't mean people were disrespectful for posting about him today but I am sad that people are reporting on the funeral logistics and criticizing such in a negative manner. I am too sensitive for my own good I think. Sorry.

 

[SnoopyDawgDawg]

Has it occurred to anyone posting today to post a prayer for the deceased Michael Brown? Have some respect please. His family laid a 17 year old son to rest.
I ask for a moment of silence for the repose of his soul.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wC6RXAJpPjo

Respectfully
Starry

my humble opinion

No, it has not occurred to me personally to post a prayer, as I pray in private. However, if it's really anyone's business, I've been praying for his family all along. I've also prayed that everyone involved have wisdom and to find peace. And I have stayed away from any and all media regarding the funeral, as I feel this should have been a private affair...not a public spectacle.

But these are my feelings and my ways of dealing with what I consider private matters; I do not try to force my personal ways on others, and I do not chastise others for the way they deal with these things.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Has it occurred to anyone posting today to post a prayer for the deceased Michael Brown? Have some respect please. His family laid a 17 year old son to rest.
I ask for a moment of silence for the repose of his soul.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wC6RXAJpPjo

Respectfully
Starry

my humble opinion

Nope. Not everyone prays


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[Apollo]

Just arriving so apologies if this has been responded to already.

here is what I could find

“Sometimes in between the first and second autopsy, the body may be embalmed,” Fowler said, adding that embalming “can sometimes alter some of the features externally to a minor degree.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2014/08/18/multiple-autopsies-like-those-in-michael-browns-death-are-unusual-but-not-unprecedented/

Another complicating factor is embalming. Brown's body was embalmed after the first autopsy, which may limit the information discernable from the gunshot wounds, as the colour and texture of the body is altered.

http://www.newscientist.com/article...y-unlikely-to-solve-mystery.html#.U_vC-PmwKy8

In Brown's case, the initial autopsies found that he was healthy at the time of the shooting. Second autopsies can be slightly more challenging to conduct than initial autopsies, because of changes to the body during the initial examination orembalming, according to the Autopsy Center of Chicago. However, features such as the entry and exit wounds from gunshots would remain on the body. Baden told reporters in a news conference that observations in multiple autopsies rarely disagree. Autopsy is a science, Brown said, so in most cases the basic observations are clear and reproducible. In some tough cases, he said, interpretations of the wounds can vary. At that point, he said, it's up to the pathologist to explain his or her reasoning to the jury.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/michael-browns-autopsy-what-it-can-and-cant-tell-us/

Thank you very very much much!!! The more links I have, the better!

 

[Yoda]

I just saw him on Wolf blitzer tonight. Wolf asked him about the robbery and he said that had nothing to do with his murder. Wolf should have asked about the struggle in the car, but didn't of course.

Then Parks talked about how this officer put no value upon MB's life. Well, how much value did MB put on the officers life?

BBM jmo So the rationale is that OW allegedly did not know of the robbery so it shouldn't be used as a factor in determining why MB was shot. If we go by the assumption that OW might not have known or initially known, MB still knew. He knew he had just robbed a store and assaulted the store owner- with witnesses.
If we start from when the parties first meet, OW tells two men to move to the sidewalk. He could have immediately arrested them or ticketed them for obstructing traffic. He advises them to move out of the street and begins to drive away.
He stops and reverses, because they were not complying, or, he becomes aware of the bolo. OW speaks to the men through his window for a second time. At this point, a serious altercation happens between MB and OW through the window.
The minimum OW knew was that this man had just ignored a police order to get out of the street and now had assaulted him while he was still in his vehicle. So OW can infer that this man does not obey laws, still does not obey laws when given a warning/direction by a LO, does not have consideration for other citizens of his community (the drivers that have to drive around him), and will physically assault an officer of the law.
OW has seconds to determine MB's threat to his safety and the community's safety, and he has to come to this conclusion while being physically assaulted. Jmo

 

[Starry Night]

I have said prayers for all involved, I just don't think today was particularly about Michael Brown, at least in terms of the pageantry and sensationalism of his funeral.

Nevertheless, yes, I will say a prayer for him, and for his bereaved family.

I thanked your post for the prayer

the 'pageantry and sensationalism of his funeral' part I don't agree . Let his family have the funeral they want.

 

[katydid23]

It's something I find hard to come to terms with, that there is apparently SO much family involvement, especially with the church, and yet somehow MB did the actions that he did. Forgive me for not going into details, because this day is NOT about me, but I had an upbringing much more like DW's with all the chaos & hurting than MB's with all these family members in his court, preachers of the word, etc., and still he did things (stealing & threatening from that tiny store clerk) and scuffling with a LEO that I would have never have thought to do. I don't know, is it because my skin is a different color??? It's so freaking sad and confusing. But he had TWO apparently loving & involved parents AND a grandmother and a great uncle who is a pastor, so what happened? And this whole community who evidently knew and loved him and yet....he did what he did. Why??? I don't get it. How the hell do you have all that love and support and yet go on to menace this poor little shopkeeper and then have a 'serious altercation' with a cop in his own car? Those are questions I am asking today.

In My opinion, the HUGE monolithic entertainment complex, which provides teens 24/7 images of violence and lust and greed, and low morals, and puts the -life up on a pedastal, is partly to blame. If you listen to the rap lyrics, play violent video games, watch some of the -life music videos, then you will see what inspired MB, imo.

 

[SStarr33]

But he was out of school, and I can't find anything on MSM that has him registered at any technical college. Cigar wrappings are often used for blunts (MJ). You can fill a cigar with a lot more MJ than you can a wrapper. Must be a thing I guess - I never heard of it:

Source: http://www.hightimes.com/read/7-best-cigars-use-blunts

MOO

Mel

The place he was going said it is their policy not to disclose enrollment status of students

 

[Minette]

No I don't know if anyone here online posted a prayer for him on this thread. today. I stand corrected. I hope they have.
I didn't mean people were disrespectful for posting about him today but I am sad that people are reporting on the funeral logistics and criticizing such in a negative manner. I am too sensitive for my own good I think. Sorry.

But no, it's OK, it's OK to ask people to pray (though not everyone does) I've prayed over this, and have again in response to your post, I pray for peace, for understanding, for truth, for solace, not necessarily the kind of prayers everyone suggested for today, but that's what I have asked this day. Just be aware that seeking the truth is a certain kind of prayer on its own (IMO) and that there are lots of people who don't follow and organized religion or any at all and so won't pray but will still be respectful in their own ways. :rose:

 

[Minette]

I thanked your post for the prayer

the 'pageantry and sensationalism of his funeral' part I don't agree . Let his family have the funeral they want.

Starry Night, I am always OK to be thanked for prayers or intentions, my opinions are all on me.

 

[Lovejac]

And... It begins. Clearly this case is falling apart. I also heard that OW is talking now after his silence
I didn't realize he never filled a report!

"Investigators are grappling with witness statements that include shifting and contradictory stories, and some who appear to be reciting accounts of what they've seen in the media, two law enforcement sources told CNN."
http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/25/us/ferguson-michael-brown-funeral/?c=&page=4

All posts are MOO

Spike Lee was there? I wonder if he's going to do a movie.

And did I miss some info? It doesn't say who said it but I read something about MB spreading the word of Jesus Christ the day he was killed

 

[Linda7NJ]

Maybe we need a dedicated prayer thread??



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[Lovejac]

Retweeted by STLtoday
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Robert Cohen ‏@kodacohen 10m
The casket of #MikeBrown was brought graveside by a horse and carriage. #Ferguson
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bv62sXOCMAAcnbF.jpg

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So you were serious about that. Thank you.

I don't think I've ever seen that. Didn't even know it was an option.

 

[Minette]

Oh, Linda, I would say, "shut up, you! Smooch!" but then I would get a time out. (PLEASE don't give me one, it wasn't Linda who I joked with like this before, and also I think she's cool with being teased, well ITO me if I'm wrong.) I don't know, I'm OK with praying for peace or whatever for everyone involved, and I'm not even particularly religious. I'm just---today, IMO wasn't really about the real MB, it was all about this Cause, the Narrative, and he was a very minor player. It makes me sad, but what can you do???

 

[reedus23]

BBM jmo So the rationale is that OW allegedly did not know of the robbery so it shouldn't be used as a factor in determining why MB was shot. If we go by the assumption that OW might not have known or initially known, MB still knew. He knew he had just robbed a store and assaulted the store owner- with witnesses.
If we start from when the parties first meet, OW tells two men to move to the sidewalk. He could have immediately arrested them or ticketed them for obstructing traffic. He advises them to move out of the street and begins to drive away. He stops and reverses, because they were not complying, or, he becomes aware of the bolo. OW speaks to the men through his window for a second time. At this point, a serious altercation happens between MB and OW through the window. The littlest OW knew was that this man had just ignored a police order to get out of the street and now had assaulted him while he was still in his vehicle. So OW can infer that this man does not obey laws, still does not obey laws when given a warning/direction by a LO, does not have consideration for others citizens of his community (the drivers that have to drive around him) and will physically assault an officer of the law. OW has seconds to determine MB's threat to his safety and the community's safety, and he has to come to this conclusion while being physically assaulted. Jmo

We just don't have enough information to say either way. MB may have posed a threat at the time of the confrontation but did he pose a threat at the time he was shot dead? Maybe, maybe not. We just don't know. The only thing I think we can say for certain is that MB got to at least a point 35 feet away from the vehicle and that he was shot multiple times from the front. We can surmise or speculate as to whether or not he continued to pose a threat once he was 35 feet away, but I don't think there is any way possible for us to say one way or the other definitively based on the information we know. Personally, I'll wait for more information to be released.

 

[SStarr33]

There's UG (unknown guy) who came into the store several seconds before MB/DJ and sauntered out as the robbery was going on. Only he didn't leave the scene, but only stepped outside and held the door open for the entering female customer and child, and held the door open while MB was at the counter gathering cigars, and held the door open as DJ slithered out of the store, and only let the door go when the clerk walked up to try and lock it and keep MB from leaving [jmo]. UG clearly was "with" MB/DJ imo, knew what was planned, and served as lookout outside perhaps. My guess is they entered with a plan to steal the cigarillos and after UG got his cut he went on his separate way.

Do you think he was a driver? I looked at the distances on a map a while ago and it seemed like the market was pretty far away from the shooting.