MO - Grief & protests follow shooting of teen Michael Brown #11

[jjenny]

HVAC is considered technical training. It is an excellent field to get certified in.

http://hvactrainingexperts.com/

It is technical training and I presume the students are drug tested. There was reportedly pot found in MB's system, so how would he even become a student?

 

[SStarr33]

MBs little sister is cute as a button She is sacked out on her dad despite the noise all around her.

 

[jjenny]

The family had every right to know the autopsy results ESPECIALLY if their loved one was killed ! If I was MB's family and the ME refused to share the autopsy results of my child with me, I would sue.

I don't think family gets all the information in what is potentially a criminal case.

 

[jmcgladr]

It is technical training and I presume the students are drug tested. There was reportedly pot found in MB's system, so how would he even become a student?

Why would HVAC students be drug tested? I have been to both 4 year and technical college and was never drug tested. At admission, or ever.


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[jjenny]

Why would HVAC students be drug tested? I have been to both 4 year and technical college and was never drug tested. At admission, or ever.


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Well, they would have to go into someone's home so I presume when they are hired they are tested.

 

[K_Z]

The term is "sanitation". Before the embalming process begins the body is thoroughly washed with a disinfectant.

The fact that the body was embalmed (as confirmed by Dr. Baden in his interview with Greta Van Susteren) suggests to me that the family did not anticipate having to do a second autopsy when the body was released by the ME and turned over to the funeral home. I suspect that when the family lawyers saw the results of the first autopsy they realized that the conclusions of the ME did not fit their narrative and so they arranged for a second autopsy (IMO).

If in fact OW's firearm discharged during a struggle with MB - there can be little doubt that evidence of GSR would have been on MB's body and clothing. It would not however - be present after embalming (IMO).

An interesting question for Dr. Baden (and Shawn Parcells) would be ; did the first autopsy indicate signs of GSR on the body and clothing? Without doubt both Baden and Parcells have seen a copy of the autopsy performed by the ME so they would be able to answer this question.

Just reading thru the discussion from overnight about the gunshot residue, washing the body, timing of the first and second autopsies, etc. I wanted to share my recollections about this.

- MB died Aug 9. Body went directly to county ME from scene.

- First autopsy by county ME Dr. Mary Case, Sunday, Aug 10, or possibly Aug 11- Monday (I think-- will have to check for citation)

- Shawn Parcells says he was contacted Aug 13. (previously cited)

- Daryl Parks said in an interview Aug 15 (Friday) that the second autopsy was completed (preciously cited), which means the funeral home had the body AT LEAST as early as Aug 15, and possibly sooner.

- Parks, Parcells, and Dr. Baden ALL confirm that the funeral home DID NOT have a refrigerator to preserve the body, and that embalming was necessary. I'd sure think so, after 6 days and one autopsy, with the body not embalmed, with no refrigeration immediately available at funeral home site, means something HAD to be done right away after the funeral home received the body. I'm sure the body was refrigerated after autopsy #1 at the morgue, and up until the funeral home took possession.

- Shawn Parcells says he took photographs, and other "preliminary work" (lol--I'd love to see how "preliminary work" is defined"), because the body had to be embalmed (due to no refrigeration), and embalming can alter the appearance of gunshot wounds

- Dr. Baden himself says he did not arrive from NY to MO until Sunday, Aug 17.

- I think it would be preposterous to think a funeral home without a refrigerator for bodies would leave a body, already over a week old, with one previous autopsy, to sit at "room temperature".

- There is no question in my mind that MB's body HAD to be embalmed within a few very short hours of arrival at the funeral home, and in advance of Dr. Baden's arrival on Sunday. Whatever was done to the body at the funeral home before Dr. Baden's arrival was done by Parcells and the funeral home staff. IMO.

**ETA:
Which also begs the question that has been bugging me, WHY didn't the family, with the guidance of their experienced attorneys, and the guidance of the eminent Dr. Baden, choose a funeral home WITH refrigeration capabilities??? Especially since the "second autopsy" was being talked about almost immediately after MB's death! I"m just kind of incredulous about that-- choosing a funeral home without a refrigerator, when a second, and a third autopsy were actively being talked about. Poor decisions, IMO. Or poor communication. Or something.

 

[Lovejac]

What's wrong with a career in HVAC?

Nothing. We paid them a pretty penny the other day for a new unit.

 

[jmcgladr]

The article I posted earlier, which discusses the role of an ME had some very good info. The ME does not work "for the police"



http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/20/opinion/melinek-michael-brown-autopsy/index.html

My gut tells me the results were discussed with the family, despite it being a murder investigation. it's not as if anyone in MBs family is a suspect in his death.

It's a great article, revealing how an ME works, and offers insight into many of the questions that people may have.

Thanks. I think so too.


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[UdbCrzy2]

The family had every right to know the autopsy results ESPECIALLY if their loved one was killed ! If I was MB's family and the ME refused to share the autopsy results of my child with me, I would sue.

Sometimes the Prosecutor may withhold an autopsy report to ensure that the defendant receives a fair trial. It's the law that a defendant has the right to a fair trial and if those ME results would jeopardize that, they won't be released.

The family had their own autopsy and made that public. So, no reason for them to sue...

 

[jmcgladr]

Well, they would have to go into someone's home so I presume when they are hired they are tested.

Doubt it. I work with kids and was criminal background checked but never drug tested.


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[bettybaby00]

Why would HVAC students be drug tested? I have been to both 4 year and technical college and was never drug tested. At admission, or ever.


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I think the original comment yesterday was making the point about if one were to get hired in the field, as electrical work and drugs use is likely a bad combo.

:dunno: also, you are likely right re: being a student, yet depending how long ago you went to school for that it might have changed?

 

[bettybaby00]

Doubt it. I work with kids and was criminal background checked but never drug tested.


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Most jobs do drug testing now, at least where I live (suburb of NYC)

 

[jmcgladr]

Sometimes the Prosecutor may withhold an autopsy report to ensure that the defendant receives a fair trial. It's the law that a defendant has the right to a fair trial and if those ME results would jeopardize that, they won't be released.

The family had their own autopsy and made that public. So, no reason for them to sue...

Releasing the results to the public would jeopardize the case. Releasing the results to the family would not, IMO. The family is not on the jury. And a number of posters here are (I think rightly) saying that the 2nd autopsy would have been compromised b/c of the cleaning and embalming and organ removal that happened before the 2nd autopsy was conducted. So having the 2nd autopsy results is not the same thing.


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[Sonya610]

What's wrong with a career in HVAC?

Nothing is wrong with a career in HVAC, but if you have a felony criminal record that includes robbery/theft NO reputable HVAC company will hire you so the "career aspirations" were likely fantasy.

 

[jmcgladr]

I think the original comment yesterday was making the point about if one were to get hired in the field, as electrical work and drugs use is likely a bad combo.

:dunno: also, you are likely right re: being a student, yet depending how long ago you went to school for that it might have changed?

I completed my AAS degree in 2002 and my Bachelor's degree in the spring of 2014.


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[LambChop]

Please keep your personal views on political figures in this case out of your discussions unless it pertains to what is happening or what is being reported.

 

[jmcgladr]

http://www.vatterott.edu/documents/catalogs/springfield.pdf

Admissions Information

Be drug free and consent to random drug testing.

MB would have been kicked out before he started.

Per the link provided, that was only an "additional requirement" for the Commercial Driver's License program.


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[UdbCrzy2]

Releasing the results to the public would jeopardize the case. Releasing the results to the family would not, IMO. The family is not on the jury. And a number of posters here are (I think rightly) saying that the 2nd autopsy would have been compromised b/c of the cleaning and embalming and organ removal that happened before the 2nd autopsy was conducted. So having the 2nd autopsy results is not the same thing.


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Isn't this the same family that I've been seeing on TV giving press conferences about the incident?

 

[Ladylub]

I said I had no theory specifically about the interaction in the police vehicle. I do have an opinion that the shooting of MB was tragic and unjustified.

If you have no theory of what happened at the car how can you determine its an unjustified shooting.

I have theories so far I can not find one where I feel it is unjustified.

All MOO
My thinking is there are some truths to DJ story. One way it may have happened....
OW ask them off the street and keeps moving. Realizes they either ignored him or heard info about the robbery over radio realizing it was the 2 in the middle of the street turns around and heads back.
I can not see OW grabbing at MB or opening the car door into them. MB was like a wall, why would anyone try to open a door with him right there. Back up a bit get out.
Cop tries to open door but MB pushes it back. This causes OW to realize there is a threat he goes for his gun to point it at MB for an arrest. MB sees OW going to gun and starts to fight him. Punches OW in the face, OW pulls trigger as a last effort not to be beaten anymore ( this is when maybe the hand wound happened). MB starts to run away thinking OW was knocked out or injured enough to not follow. OW gets out of car yells freeze MB turns around with a oh you want more attitude and goes back thinking just as he intimated the store owner he could do the same to OW. OW not playing those games anymore pulls the trigger before MB could get any closer. The rounds are quick and MB goes down before OW's brain catches up to the fact that the threat has been taken down.

 

[SStarr33]

Per the link provided, that was only an "additional requirement" for the Commercial Driver's License program.


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Thanks, I will check it out and delete my post if wrong.