MO - Grief & protests follow shooting of teen Michael Brown #7

[Dogface]

Totally agree with that..........but you didn't go towards the danger, you ran to safety and help.

If I would have had a gun in my house at the time, I would have ran to it and tried to shoot the as he was calmly leaving.

Eta: I didn't have a way to defend myself against my attacker. If I would have I guarantee I wouldn't live with the thought he will one day try this again.

Eta #2: it is also not my job to stop violent offenders.

 

[TexanMom]

Thanks for posting this. It sounds as if Office Wilson has 2 separate injuries. The reporter said 'swelling to his face and head'.

I'm wonder if the injury to his head came from when MB slammed the vehicle door on him.

Also, not fair that the Wilson supporter was escorted away by police for her 'own safety'. She did appear to be a little antagonistic, though :giggle: But not NEAR as bad as what we've seen of the other protesters.

Sigh. The inmates are running the asylum in regards to the protests.

 

[Elley Mae]

Edward Magee, spokesman for St. Louis County Prosecutor Robert McCullough, said the office will not disclose the nature of the evidence it will reveal to a grand jury.

"We'll present every piece of evidence we have, witness statements, et cetera, to the grand jury, and we do not release any evidence or talk about evidence on the case."

Nabil Khattar, CEO of 7Star Industries – which specializes in firearms training for law enforcement and special operations personnel – confirmed that police are typically instructed to use deadly force if in imminent danger of being killed or suffering great bodily injury.

“You may engage a threat with enough force that is reasonably necessary to defend against that danger,” he said.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/08/2...en-before-shooting-michael-brown-says-source/

 

[Bernina]

If I would have had a gun in my house at the time, I would have ran to it and tried to shoot the as he was calmly leaving.

Works for me.

 

[Boytwnmom]

But I wonder if the pressure is already so visible and great that the GJ's are not feeling free to do their job. Protesting a GJ is pretty bad in my view. No one should be trying to influence or intimidate Grand Jurors.

We also have to remember that "probable cause" is a lower standard which is why so many get indicted. But is still a "more likely than not" standard which, in a case like this, means the jurors would have to decide it is more likely than not that the officer was not justified in using deadly force. Much will depend on what the DA presents. A DA can present what they want. The other side doesn't get to present. Thus, the quote about "indicting a ham sandwich" as the prosecutor can introduce only pro-prosecution evidence. And since proceedings are secret we're not going to know if the DA is presenting a one sided or a balanced presentation. Ideally you'd want the DA to present the whole story as indictments issuing for a weak case don't serve any real purpose. In this case, I'm not sure how much normal rules apply.

It was said in the last thread that the prosecutor shouldn't be seeking a grand jury indictment if he feels no crime was committed. IMO even if he feels that way, he doesn't want to be the one to make that call. The officials are so concerned about the ramifications if "justice" isn't served. I truly hope the GJ chooses not to indict.

 

[Bernina]

It's not hard at all. An ex-boyfriend of mine, 6'3", about 285 lbs beat a guy bloody through an open car window. He made it look easy; I had to talk him out of doing more damage.

My current BF had a similar situation, having a neighbor grab him by the shirt and try to pull him through the window of bf's compact truck........

Wish someone would do re-creations of both Wilson's and Dorian's account.

 

[oh_gal]

While I do not believe aggression toward an officer is ever wise, I am not ok with totalitarianism. If an officer does happen to be completely abusing his or her position of authority, he/she should absolutely be challenged in the most respectful and calm way possible. I have seen a ton of video of situations in which a citizen is respectfully exercising his or her rights, and an officer becomes abusive and belligerent.

Obviously, it is a minority of officers who behave this way, however if the answer regardless of situation is "Do what I tell you and I won't hurt you", then that's also unacceptable. We have rights and if an officer is violating them, we shouldn't have to worry that we'll get injured or killed simply because we didn't shut up and do what we're told.

That said, I don't feel it's applicable in this case any longer, and it is a side-bar conversation. I just wanted to comment on that. JMO!

There are people in every profession who abuse their power and have the potential to hurt someone -- Doctors, clergy, teachers, coaches. The difference between them and LEO is that in any given situation, a police officer could be putting his/her life on the line. For that reason alone, his/her orders should be obeyed. But if a police officer is telling you to strip and climb into the back of his cruiser, then your good sense should probably override respect for the badge.

 

[katydid23]

I've had several from horse and bike wrecks........it took a while to get my bearings. And the pain was BAD. Ruptured veins in my eye that massed over my iris and pupil. Swelling and discoloration that went from one side of my head to the other. Surgery.

So maybe Wilson had the "minor" end of the spectrum?:thinking:

But if someone was trying to kill you at the time you were injured, would that help you get your bearings faster, and move through the pain?

 

[Lovejac]

Shimon Prokupecz ‏@ShimonPro 5m
pool: Jason Moore, died of cardiac arrest after officers allegedly used stun gun during disturbance call, his sister told Holder. #Ferguson

That happened in 2011... interesting, I read an article today, she just filed suit against Ferguson police.

This just goes to show that even if LE uses other measures to 'subdue' perps, they're still blamed. If really is damned if you do/ damned if you don't if you're Ferguson LE.

And transparent much? Filing a lawsuit 3 years after it happened. Really?

 

[Dogface]

I think real forensic evidence will be the only thing that settles this case, not eyewitnesses or anything else. I mean literally in the realm of possibilities, there are hundreds of possibilities as to what could have occurred. Could Wilson have lost his mind and just decided to shoot someone without cause yes? Could it just so happened by coincidence it was a massive man who just physically assaulted and robbed someone else? Sure. Not likely, but of course possible.

I like to stick with the fact what seems most likely is usually what happens. However I know that is not always the case. It just most likely is.

Back on topic though....someone said that the grand jury only meets a couple times a week? I guess I'm confused to the process bc it seemed like with the Holly Bobo case and with Rick Perry it all happened so quickly once it went to grand jury.

 

[KEVINinTO]

What I do not understand is why haven't we heard from a lawyer representing Officer Wilson by now? I would hope that the police association would have retained a top notch lawyer to defend Wilson in the media by now. All of the witnesses that have come forward are "lawyered up" but not Wilson?

In a case such as this where it appears that Wilson is being railroaded he should, IMO, have a lawyer presenting his version of events to the media as well as challenging all of the inconsistencies in the witness statements. A lawyer representing Wilson could come forward with proof of the severe facial injury sustained by Wilson. It would be very powerful if the public could see pictures of the bruising and x-rays depicting fractures to the orbital area.

 

[Bernina]

But if someone was trying to kill you at the time you were injured, would that help you get your bearings faster, and move through the pain?

All I would be thinking is get the h3!! out of there.

 

[popsicle]

Shimon Prokupecz ‏@ShimonPro 3m
Pool: AG Holder meeting with FBI officials in #ferguson promised thorough investigation into civil rights violations.

 

[katydid23]

All I would be thinking is get the h3!! out of there.

But you're not a cop. They are trained to put their lives on the line to protect the community. After he was attacked in his patrol car, he could have just stayed in there and waited for an ambulance. But he didn't. He wanted to stop the attacker from doing it again somewhere else.

 

[mikkismom]

BBM-Caveat

This is Dr. Erik Mitchell:






http://www.healthgrades.com/physician/dr-erik-mitchell-w5lwc/background-check

http://www.parcellsandcompany.com/contact.html

He is also a minister, procures 'tissue', does taxes, web design, sports management and business consulting. Busy guy.

jmo

 

[branwynbreeze]

So many emotions. IMO MB was a bully. He used his size to get what he wanted preying on smaller folks. It can take years or extreme circumstance to learn meaning of mortality. The moment he challenged LE he opened a can of worms that only he could bring to different conclusion.

I am not a huge fan of LE, we've had our ups and downs and don't even get me started on judicial system, but was taught to respect authority, perhaps yield to it may be a better term. Those demanding justice are fine and dandy, but I want to hear more about healing community. These dog and pony night protests are a waste of time, effort and funding accomplishing not a thing.

I'm of Hispanic ancestry and there is a lot prejudice between different Hispanic nationalities.

Again, JMO.

Thanks.

just pointing that the article isn't putting a name on the source.

I definitely believe Wilson was assaulted. Why? 'Cause when the lawyers on the other side admit there was "strong interaction" and that "there will be more coming out about it," then the event in question not only happened, but could also be worse than what they are admitting on TV while they demand "justice" for MB.

JMO

 

[popsicle]

What I do not understand is why haven't we heard from a lawyer representing Officer Wilson by now? I would hope that the police association would have retained a top notch lawyer to defend Wilson in the media by now. All of the witnesses that have come forward are "lawyered up" but not Wilson?

In a case such as this where it appears that Wilson is being railroaded he should, IMO, have a lawyer presenting his version of events to the media as well as challenging all of the inconsistencies in the witness statements. A lawyer representing Wilson could come forward with proof of the severe facial injury sustained by Wilson. It would be very powerful if the public could see pictures of the bruising and x-rays depicting fractures to the orbital area.

Why? Many comments made in the media have made it clear they will not be appeased until he is arrested, arrested and charged or arrested, charged and convicted...given the DP per MB's mom. jmo

I would just save it all for the GJ. jmo

 

[MyBelle]

There are people in every profession who abuse their power and have the potential to hurt someone -- Doctors, clergy, teachers, coaches. The difference between them and LEO is that in any given situation, a police officer could be putting his/her life on the line. For that reason alone, his/her orders should be obeyed. But if a police officer is telling you to strip and climb into the back of his cruiser, then your good sense should probably override respect for the badge.

I agree. Children learn at a very young age the difference between the exercise of authority and the abuse of authority. Teachers, parents, police are all in positions of authority at any age. If someone disobeys a legitimate directive from someone in a position of authority, there are consequences. A cop telling someone to get out of the street and on to a sidewalk is a pretty simple, legitimate directive Brown chose to disobey.

JMO

 

[JLSChook]

"Severe injuries" and "orbital fracture of the eye socket" or "orbital blow out"........and the officer didn't call for back up and was physically ok to get out of his vehicle to pursue MB?

Seriously.........have any of you ever witnessed or had the combination of the above? The pain is excruciating. Your nerve endings and mind are totally scrambled. It's an explosion in your head. Why didn't Wilson stay in his vehicle and call in a "officer down"?

I played baseball for the province I live in during my late teens. I got a line-drive hard ball to my eye (pitching) and ended up with an orbital blow-out.

1) My eye socket and upper cheekbone sustained 4 separate fractures

2) This happened in the 7 inning and I stayed to watch the remainder of the game (we won!)

3) I felt pain, dizziness, light-headedness and had some disorientation. After about 10 minutes, the injury sight was numb. (You'd be surprised what adrenalin can do for a person re: pain)

4) I needed NO surgery.

5) The swelling and pretty black, blue and purple colors took a few hours (if not more) to take hold

6) The bruising took about 4-5 months to disappear.

7) The fractures healed on their own after about 16 months. (Totally)

 

[PAJS]

Many years ago I suffered an orbital fracture. The pain was severe and the entire side of my face was swollen for weeks. /the blow that caused this injury also caused a concussion, which caused symptoms that lasted for several months.

Pat