MO - Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #10

[HatesSociopaths]

The question remains....why cover up an accidental death? Children unfortunately have accidents and die sometimes, and the parents are seldom jailed. It's obvious that Lisa was well cared for, so chronic abuse is not a factor.

It's the ones who claim that an accident caused injuries to a child when it's obvious abuse that get into trouble.

Good question. Exploring the possibility of him being in an on-going (or recently ended) custody battle may help reveal why it may have been thought necessary to do this. Overdosing a baby with Tylenol appears to be not rare (see http://www.ehow.com/about_5218511_tylenol-overdoses-babies.html)
but perhaps they thought it was their fault? In a custody battle, having had a baby die under one's care would not look good, IMO.

MOO. Just exploring possible motives.

 

[Sassygerl]

Just to clarify-I am posting my good friend's story...what she wrote to me to share in the 1st person (her words)....

What's additionally scary is that IF the intruder had picked the "correct" window, and gotten into the baby's room, walked out the front door with her, and down the street where they had left the parked car.....YOU KNOW my friend and husband would be the PRIME suspects.

I don't get why they didn't get more info from the tracking dogs in Lisa's case.

That story was soooo scary! When you mentioned the guy "hugging houses" it made me think of an incident we had at our house recently. Totally off topic but we have security cameras all over outside. Recently my son was on our balcony at 1 am and said a guy was walking through our yard. I went back to view the footage and it was soooo creepy. You could see the guy "hugging" our house walking along. He glanced in my sons car and went on. My son said next door he stood at the bottom of their stairs looking like he was going to go up to the house. Very unsettling...but for what it's worth the cameras are great!!!!!!! And not all that expensive for peace of mind!

 

[In da Middle]

Thank you for the pics especially for the backyard photo as it show there IS a garage under the house. I guess that would be classified as attached in "some" form or another.

There is both at this house. The detached one was a machine shop type setting a former owner built.

 

[Jacie Estes]

Kitchen

Something I keep meaning to post and so I've finally remembered it.

This is a nice house; when you see the pics of inside it is cute, clean and well maintained. Lisa is always clean and dressed so cute in the pictures and Debbie is clearly a good housekeeper. :twocents:

It's not like this place is a dump and Lisa is abused. IMHO

 

[jjenny]

BBM

A simple DNA test would fix that problem. I think Jeremy knows that.
...

I don't believe that to be always the case. The husband is assumed to be a legal father, and in some cases a husband is required to pay child support even if he is not a biological father.

 

[Shelby1]

I am watching Judge Jeanne's show and writing what is being stated by the parents.

Jeramy hadn't taken his phone with him so his phone and her phone were on the kitchen counter. The third phone was a broken phone.

She was telling Jeramy to call 911, call 911 and they were panicking. She said were are the phones? Jeramy had his work phone on him however, he didn't know that he had his work phone on him until he put his hand in his pocket.

I did not upload the show and I can't find a transcript to the show. Just my mini transcript from watching the show.

BLESS YOU!!!

I am getting ready to get put in time out by directway--my sat. internet provider. They only let me down load so much per day (sigh)



updated timeline here

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7208063&posted=1#post7208063

 

[TobyWong*]

LE climbing in front window this morning (enlarged).

Is the person stepping on a meter? Like the energy or water meter? It does look easier to get in w/ that little step(meter). imo

 

[In da Middle]

Maybe LE is playing games with the family, making it look like they are considering something regarding that window, when they really could care less.

Maybe they just want to appear "busy" to the public.

I am more concerned over the fact that no one has seen or talked to the parents of baby Lisa today. Where are they? Why aren't they looking for their baby girl?

Or maybe somebody within view?

 

[SyraKelly]

MOO-I think LE should have re-created this the exact same way they think it happened.Late at night with the dog in the back yard and then try climbing in the window to see if anyone could get in there without noise and the dog barking!!

 

[mrye4709]

I'm in the process of getting a divorce and The Guy and I live separately. I contacted my insurance company about this specifically and no one told me this.

Sometimes it is court ordered for the person to provide health ins for the divorced spouse (health reasons) and the dependent children. To have someone on your car ins they have to live with you, not sure why.

 

[IAM]

If you look at that picture where the deputy is climbing in window you will see another window just around the corner in the DARK, excluded from view, further from the ears of any occupants. That window would be the better choice to try to enter you would think.

 

[jjenny]

Something I keep meaning to post and so I've finally remembered it.

This is a nice house; when you see the pics of inside it is cute, clean and well maintained. Lisa is always clean and dressed so cute in the pictures and Debbie is clearly a good housekeeper. :twocents:

It's not like this place is a dump and Lisa is abused. IMHO

This is a purely theoretical argument, and I don't want to imply anything, but cute pictures of child that appears to be well cared for mean nothing, as we all saw in a recent case where the child's body ended up in a swampy area, despite there being plenty of cute pictures and videos of that child.

 

[wfgodot]

NBCActionNews NBC Action News
Police at Lisa Irwin's home, recreating alleged abduction #LisaIrwin pub.vitrue.com/Dv0
1 minute ago

http://twitter.com/#!/search/realtime/#lisairwin

Here's the attached article:

http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/ne...ives-back-at-irwin-home,-recreating-abduction

 

[mrye4709]

I am watching Judge Jeanne's show and writing what is being stated by the parents.

Jeramy hadn't taken his phone with him so his phone and her phone were on the kitchen counter. The third phone was a broken phone.

She was telling Jeramy to call 911, call 911 and they were panicking. She said were are the phones? Jeramy had his work phone on him however, he didn't know that he had his work phone on him until he put his hand in his pocket.

I did not upload the show and I can't find a transcript to the show. Just my mini transcript from watching the show.

How was the screen described? I know they talked about it, just can't remember. TIA

 

[kai]

Disclaimer:

Like many of you, I have read through countless cases at WS prior to this one. I have been drawn into some more than others. I usually am what I consider to be fair and open minded when considering all possible scenerios. I don't know what it is about this case but for whatever reason my entire heart, soul, and mind has 99.9 % firmly made a decision on who is responsible for baby Lisa missing. This boggles me because I can't point to one piece of evidence nor do I have even a smidgen of the true facts. I read Lisa's threads and I get angry that we are all even sitting here having to theorize and go over every tiny morsel of information we are getting fed by several sources. This is a new feeling for me and I don't like it. I don't like not being able to be rational and calm headed. And I don't like not knowing WHY I feel so strongly about this. /Disclaimer

I think I keep going back to trying to place myself in Deborah and Jeremy's shoes. I know logically that I am not them and that I do not know of their normal demeanor and what their "natural" reaction to their child being missing would be. But I cannot get it out of my head that there (in my opinion) does not seem to be any genuine words and effort coming out that are tied directly to the immediate and ongoing care of whoever has Lisa right now.

If I truly were innocent and I truly had been asleep in the protection of our own HOME and someone had violated our HOME and our safety and done the absolutely unthinkable with my child and taken her- you better believe that I would be begging, pleading, talking, and attempting to communicate with every possible resource available to me WITH AND TO THAT PERSON. I would be concerned every single second with thoughts of "Is my baby being fed? Is my baby warm? Does she have a toy that is making her laugh? Is she OK?" I would be using any resource and access I had to top notch FBI profilers and authorities who deal with "kidnappers" as their JOB. I would want to work with and be in CONSTANT contact with people who were getting leads on the possible location of my baby. MY BABY who was STOLEN from OUR HOME in the MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT while I SLEPT. HOW DARE THEY TAKE OUR BABY!!! WHERE is our baby Lisa? PLEASE bring her home!!!

I know I am irrationally livid about this case. I know it makes no sense as I don't have any more information than any of you. I just truly 100% CAN'T get over the appearance of the lack of concern for the CURRENT CARE that Lisa is getting right now.

 

[EllaMae]

But that is a long time to work things out, considering she was living with another guy and had a child.

I have a good friend whose parents lived separate lives for over 20 years before finally getting a divorce. Her dad had even started another family. They had decided to each go their own way, and didn't finalize anything until the Mom wanted to remarry.
They were very amicable, and still are to this day.

 

[Patty G]

If that screen had a crease in the frame then it could have very well been the point of entry. It would not have had to have been removed all the way because if you push one corner of screen in there is plenty of room to crawl through if you are not real big.

Well, not so sure about just the corner being creased allowing a small person to crawl through. By the looks of the picture with LE trying to get in, any size person would have great difficulty trying to get through the corner of the screen. IMO

 

[Cher352]

LE climbing in front window this morning (enlarged).

Looks like he is both standing on something with one foot and getting a boot up with the other. Window appears to be shoulder height when compared to the women in black standing on the right side. So maybe when JI said the window was too small he really meant it was too high off the ground.

 

[Shelby1]

That story was soooo scary! When you mentioned the guy "hugging houses" it made me think of an incident we had at our house recently. Totally off topic but we have security cameras all over outside. Recently my son was on our balcony at 1 am and said a guy was walking through our yard. I went back to view the footage and it was soooo creepy. You could see the guy "hugging" our house walking along. He glanced in my sons car and went on. My son said next door he stood at the bottom of their stairs looking like he was going to go up to the house. Very unsettling...but for what it's worth the cameras are great!!!!!!! And not all that expensive for peace of mind!

I live far out in the country. I am the only only house on a long, dead-end road. You would only come down this road if you wanted to get to me.

Around 1 in the morning a couple years ago, I awoke to a noise and looked out the window of our 2nd floor bedroom. Car in driveway. Two people. One person against car, one person hugging the house right under my window, making his way to my back porch. I shook and kicked my husband (sleeps like a log) he grabs gun and goes to back porch. I am watching the guy hugging house and he's almost to the corner where he would meet up with my husband. I was scared to death that the guy would have a gun or something, so I opened the window and shouted "hey what the hell-o are you doing?!" Scared the bejezus out of both of them. He said that he had just left the airport and had grabbed the wrong luggage and was looking to return it. As he's running to get in their car and screeetch away.

I'll never forget it.

 

[saba]

BBM

A simple DNA test would fix that problem. I think Jeremy knows that.

He followed legal procedures to get his son,and was successful, so why would he stage a kidnapping to get Baby Lisa and risk losing everything?

That makes no sense to me.

According to the MO lawyers, the fact that he is the biodad and gets a dna test is nice but not the end of the story (i know- it is weird) Sean Bradley is the presumed father because he and Debbie were married when Lisa was born.
If Debbie and Sean get a divorce, there is a way for Jeremy to be a third party to the action and get it all legally established. I hope the lawyers start chiming in and explain this again.