Nancy Cooper, 34, of Cary, N.C. #14

[Deduction]

The thing about the Ex Parte hearing is that is a one-sided hearing. And by law the other party's time to respond is within a proscribed time period. That gives him time to prepare his side, also. So it's not as though he did not have a chance - and the protection of the children was of the prime importance.

An ex parte judicial proceeding is conducted for the benefit of only one party.

I don't think the other party does have a time to respond that is the purpose of Ex Parte---it is for the benefit of one party. Brad was not allowed to respond otherwise it would not have been Ex Parte.

 

[The Saint]

I found it. I quess the green card became an essential item since Brad could not find a position in Toronto so Nancy decided to stay in the US. From this it seems immigration issues would not be of a concern prior to this time and as long as she was married to Brad. The separation would require her to obtain a green card to remain. So we can probably date this to about the same time or shortly after the preparation of the separation agreement. If Brad was indeed getting the green card through Cisco, which Cisco can verify or deny either way, Nancy didn't have any immigration issues really.

yes, nancy did have immigration issues. she was unable to work without a greencard. if getting her greencard was tied to brad and cisco, then she would have been stuck staying w/ him if she was unable to get one on her own.

it was about her being able to work here not just live here.

 

[carolinalady]

An ex parte judicial proceeding is conducted for the benefit of only one party.

I don't think the other party does have a time to respond that is the purpose of Ex Parte---it is for the benefit of one party. Brad was not allowed to respond otherwise it would not have been Ex Parte.

Exactly. And it might have ended w/ the same agreement reached at the hearing on 7/25 if he had been notified and attended the original hearing. It's not like they didn't know where he was to notify him of the hearing. The police were watching his every move and he'd been making plans w/ her family during the day.

 

[Star12]

His time to respond to the Ex Parte Order was on July 25th - the Custody hearing.

 

[The Saint]

An ex parte judicial proceeding is conducted for the benefit of only one party.

I don't think the other party does have a time to respond that is the purpose of Ex Parte---it is for the benefit of one party. Brad was not allowed to respond otherwise it would not have been Ex Parte.

ex parte is just about filing a motion that requires a judge's intervention for expediency, isn't it? it not about getting around due process or not allowing brad to respond.

you submit your motion to ex parte and you serve a copy to the defendant
(or plaintiff, depending on the case) after the judge signs.


you wait until the judge signs it and then you attach
a xerox copy of the judge's writing that tells you when and where to appear. you attach the judge's order to your moving papers.

you usually have to serve the other party within 48 hours of the judge signing.

if you are requesting a judge's order (Order to Show Cause, imminent danger to a child, etc) it is done for expediency. a judge can compel
the other party to act.

i don't know how NC works, but in most states, OTSCs are filed w/ Ex Parte and other motions are filed in the Motion Support office of the court house.

it is not about trying to pull a fast one on the other party or the law being one-sided. it is procedural.

Brad was allowed to respond at the time and date the judge set. his affidavits are that response. he could have attended the hearing but he sent his lawyer on his behalf.

 

[SleuthyGal]

This ex-parte emergency hearing was not, IMHO, just a power play. I think NC's parents honestly believed right from the get-go that BC committed the murder and that their grandkids might be in danger. That's the impression I got. The handoff was not so smooth, no. But I think the grandparents were scared out of their gourds that he might do something to harm himself and the kids.

 

[Deduction]

Exactly. And it might have ended w/ the same agreement reached at the hearing on 7/25 if he had been notified and attended the original hearing. It's not like they didn't know where he was to notify him of the hearing. The police were watching his every move and he'd been making plans w/ her family during the day.

I agree and he was even on his way to take the children to visit the grandparents when the 7 police stepped in and pulled the child from his arms crying. I can not see this in any way but very poorly managed. Why not let him give the children to the grandparents then serve the papers on him quietly. Perhaps, that wasn't enough action for the cameras.

 

[SusieClue]

This ex-parte emergency hearing was not, IMHO, just a power play. I think NC's parents honestly believed right from the get-go that BC committed the murder and that their grandkids might be in danger. That's the impression I got. The handoff was not so smooth, no. But I think the grandparents were scared out of their gourds that he might do something to harm himself and the kids.

I agree. They felt they needed to surprise him (catch him off guard) so the kids wouldn't be in danger of him feeling threatened. I'm only sorry if the kids were confused/scared, but I know the GPs truly felt it to be in their best interest, and I think I agree!

 

[Star12]

I agree and he was even on his way to take the children to visit the grandparents when the 7 police stepped in and pulled the child from his arms crying. I can not see this in any way but very poorly managed. Why not let him give the children to the grandparents then serve the papers on him quietly. Perhaps, that wasn't enough action for the cameras.

Cameras?

 

[Deduction]

His time to respond to the Ex Parte Order was on July 25th - the Custody hearing.

If his time to respond was July 25 why did 7 police take his children and send them to Canada, sorry but his time to respond was over when the Judge said send his children to Canada---end of story. He got a second chance on the 25th.

 

[dyrewolfe]

I agree and he was even on his way to take the children to visit the grandparents when the 7 police stepped in and pulled the child from his arms crying. I can not see this in any way but very poorly managed. Why not let him give the children to the grandparents then serve the papers on him quietly. Perhaps, that wasn't enough action for the cameras.

Ooooh! You have video? Can I see? Can I have a link?

 

[carolinalady]

Are there NEVER emergency custody hearings where both sides are present?

Does anyone know the answer to this?

 

[carolinalady]

This ex-parte emergency hearing was not, IMHO, just a power play. I think NC's parents honestly believed right from the get-go that BC committed the murder and that their grandkids might be in danger. That's the impression I got. The handoff was not so smooth, no. But I think the grandparents were scared out of their gourds that he might do something to harm himself and the kids.

I don't know. I think it partially might have been a power play. The Rentz/Lister attorney is a former family court judge after all.

Again, they knew where he was and could've served him. And, the kids weren't w/ him at ALL times (they were w/ friends during some of his questioning, atty visits, etc.) and he was being watched by police the entire time. The timing of the serving could've easily be done while the children were not in his presence and therefore they would've been out of harms way (if they were worried that he'd harm the kids after being served).

 

[The Saint]

i think nancy's inability to work legally (due to the lack of the greencard) was one of the major contributing factors to her murder. i think she felt trapped, brad controlled the money and seemed to act like nancy was wasting or spending all of HIS money.

some men resent their wives staying home with the children.

i have a friend who supported her husband with the agreement that when they had a child, she would stay at home until the child was in kindergarten.even though that was what they had agreed, he was resentful and pouty because she wasn't working and they ended up divorced.

 

[carolinalady]

i think nancy's inability to work legally (due to the lack of the greencard) was one of the major contributing factors to her murder. i think she felt trapped, brad controlled the money and seemed to act like nancy was wasting or spending all of HIS money.

i think that some men resent their wives staying home with the children.

i have a friend who supported her husband with the agreement that when they had a child, she would stay at home until the child was in kindergarten.even though that was what they had agreed, he was resentful and pouty because she wasn't working and they ended up divorced.

It would be interesting to hear how it was prior to the children. They moved here 8 years ago (that house shows they bought it in Jan 01) and she's been unable to legally work in the US the entire time. Of course, having two children greatly increases the amount you spend.

I don't have it in me to go back through the affidavits tonight, but I would be interested in which of her friends knew them prior to kids since a lot indicate when they met Nancy (& Brad for that matter).

 

[The Saint]

It would be interesting to hear how it was prior to the children. They moved here 8 years ago (that house shows they bought it in Jan 01) and she's been unable to legally work in the US the entire time. Of course, having two children greatly increases the amount you spend.

I don't have it in me to go back through the affidavits tonight, but I would be interested in which of her friends knew them prior to kids since a lot indicate when they met Nancy (& Brad for that matter).

i am sure that it is hard work having 2 small children but did nancy prefer not to work, whether she was legally able to not?

were there places in Cary where should could have worked off the books?

wasn't she IT in canada? was there a job that she could have done for Cisco from home?

selling on ebay or etsy?

 

[The Saint]

i am in no way saying that she is responsible for her own murder by working at home as a mother. i am just interested in knowing what options she had that would have enabled her to get away from brad.

 

[carolinalady]

i am sure that it is hard work having 2 small children but did nancy prefer not to work, whether she was legally able to not?

were there places in Cary where should could have worked off the books?

wasn't she IT in canada? was there a job that she could have done for Cisco from home?

selling on ebay or etsy?

For some reason I thought someone said she ran a shop in Canada. I could be completely wrong.

 

[carolinalady]

RC, what year BMW did you figure out the Nancy's car was? Or did you?

I know that in BC's affidavit or the rebuttal he says that he is now driving Nancy's old car. I was looking as county records and if I've got the right one, it shows he had a Z3 before (last tax bills in 2003). Of course, I could have the wrong BC as it doesn't show billing address but w/ the preference for BMWs made me think I have the right one. There is also one year w/ a bill for a something listed as YAMA (maybe a Yamaha motorcycle/sportbike?).

I was just trying to look at preferences prior to the kiddos being born.

 

[fran]

To those curious about Nancy working, not working etc. I invite you to read the Erased thread. There's some links with interesting information that may help you understand where Nancy was coming from before she was Erased.

fran