NC NC - Faith Hedgepeth, 19, UNC student, Chapel Hill, 7 Sept 2012 #1

[Webthrush]

... Rosario told investigators that a friend, Jordan McCrary, gave her a ride to the Longview Street home, where she stayed until midmorning."Read more here: http://www.newsobserver.com/2014/09/05/4124003/court-documents-unsealed-in-search.html#storylink=cpy

Thanks for that Boodles; somehow I totally missed the "Jordan McCrary" name along the way, and that's good (sort of) since it frees up BE (one of the prime POIs) at that time of morning.
As far as the DNA samples, my understanding (but DEFINITELY not guaranteed) is that TJ gave a sample (and passed), but neither BE nor DB ever gave samples -- would be great if someone could confirm (or correct) that; also great if someone could explain the legalities involved to compel someone to give a sample???

 

[Ven]

Cliffs and questions...

1. Roommate KR and her boyfriend ETJ were living together in the apartment as recently as 2 months before Faith's murder. ETJ was violent and KR filed a restraining order against him in July 2012 forcing him to move out. ETJ believed Faith was influencing KR against him and threatened to kill Faith if he and KR did not get back together.

2. Faith moved in with KR. I'm unclear whether this was KR doing Faith a favor, or if Faith moved in with her for support. Perhaps both? Some articles seemed to indicate that Faith was waiting for financial aid to clear and didn't have a place to live, so she moved in with KR. Faith and KR were roommates at the time of the murder in September 2012.

3. ETJ posted things on social media in the days around Faith's murder that indicated he felt guilty of something, circumstantially incriminated him, etc. And drew extra scrutiny to him.

4. Another young man, BE, had dated KR previously. An article states "they" were just friends at the time, but had a previous physical relationship. I assume that means KR and BE, although the article is ambiguous enough that it could mean FH and BE. It's just not clear to my eyes, although I'm sure the people close to the case know which is which. Anyway, considering KR's relationship with ex-b/f ETJ, it seems like either KR and BE dated before she was with ETJ, or possibly he was a rebound guy / fwb type situation.

5. BE spent the night with KR and Faith on September 5th, 2012 and slept on the couch. He left around 11 a.m. September 6th. Later that night, in the early morning hours of September 7th, BE also had contact with Faith and KR at The Thrill nightclub. Faith and KR left and returned to their residence at 2:38 a.m. Faith sent text messages to BE in the middle of the night. The last two...

Faith 3:40 a.m: "“Hey b. Can you come over here please. Karena needs you more aha. You know. Please let her know you care.”

Faith 3:43 a.m: "Than"

Someone else in this thread pointed out she could have been correcting an auto-correct on spelling. Maybe she meant to type "needs you more than you know". That certainly seems possible now that I think about it. I guess the first time I read it I thought maybe BE was flirting with Faith and she was deflecting and slyly telling him to hit up KR instead, then maybe typing "thanks" after he replied.

I believe those were the final texts sent by Faith's phone, but there's nothing about what BE might have texted to her, if anything. Either some late night hookup was being solicited by one of the parties or more likely there was some kind of major drama going on that evening.

6. The roommate's male friend and I believe a soccer player at UNC, initials JM, stopped by the apartment and picked up KR at approximately 4:27 a.m. They left the apartment and that was allegedly the last time Faith was seen alive. I'm not sure what the situation was like in the apartment in the time between 2:38 and 4:27 ... were Faith and KR together and aware of what each other were doing? Were they in separate rooms? Is it possible they were interacting some of the time but also doing their own thing at other times?

7. Apparently another male, DB, was seen dancing with Faith at the nightclub that evening and left with her. It didn't say explicitly in any articles, but I'm assuming that means he returned to the apartment with Faith and KR. A year or two ago law enforcement suggested they had male DNA at the scene but that it was not necessarily the killer's, so it's possible that FH and DB might have had sex, either consensual or not. Could Faith have been killed while KR was still home? What is the floor layout for the apartment? Did Faith have her own room? Or did she usually sleep on the couch or a pullout? Maybe if she were looking for more privacy she used KR's room? Hard to believe a brutal murder could take place without KR hearing it if she were there, but just throwing it out there. More than likely KR left and the murder took place after. Was DB still there when KR left then? Etc.

8. JM gave KR a ride to the residence at Longview Street. If Faith were left alone, JM might have known. That's a possible avenue to explore, could he have known this young woman was left alone by herself and possibly returned to take advantage of her?

9. Where did JM go or stay after dropping off KR? Why was KR leaving to go somewhere else at 4:30 a.m.? Was there some kind of drama? Was she afraid to stay in her apartment? Or was she loaning her space to Faith and a male friend (such as DB) for the evening?

10. Investigators also sought a swab from JB, the Longview Street resident that KR went to stay with at 4:30 a.m. Not sure what this means ... was he not home? Perhaps after not solving the case initially, law enforcement was just trying to cover all bases, also look into the conspiracy angle with a small group. I believe the search warrant was filed months later, so it doesn't appear as though they looked at him initially, and seems hard to fathom he could have a strong connection to this crime, but who knows.

11. Faith was also frequently texting RLJ in the days/weeks leading up to her murder. This is the person I believe is connected to the high profile NBA player from the area. It's not said whether he was a friend or possible romantic interest. It's not surprising that investigators would look into him for obvious reasons since he had frequent contact with Faith right before her murder.

12. Law enforcement has other information from social media accounts, phones and texts, email, laptops, etc. that have been redacted and not made public.

13. It's unclear which POIs have provided DNA samples and which ones have not.

Sorry if I missed anything or if any of this information is incorrect. Please feel free to add corrections if you know more.

Praying for Faith. I missed September 1st but I do hope this is the month that her killer(s) will be brought to justice.

 

[Webthrush]

Thanks for the synopsis Ven; I think a couple of minor details are inaccurate, but I won't take time to back-check right now… my main interest still focuses on that 3:30- 4:30am time period: FH sends a text message to BE encouraging him to come over (for KR) then shortly thereafter KR makes 4 short phone calls (each under 40 secs.) in less than 30 mins. (I'm presuming to BE but don't know) -- why so many and so terse? -- terse because of anger/upset or something else? and then she promptly leaves 15 mins. after last call -- does she know BE is on the way over, and she doesn't want to be there, or she deliberately wants him to find FH alone or something else entirely??? (BE is obviously someone FH would willingly let in the door.) (I don't know how JM fits in other than offering KR a lift -- police didn't seem very interested in him.)

Again, my understanding is that TJ (ETJ), despite a lot of circumstantially incriminating evidence, has basically been cleared of the murder and been DNA-tested (though he might still know more than he is telling), but neither BE or DB (and perhaps others) have yet been DNA-tested -- just my understanding -- if someone has direct sources that contradict that please post the links.

Hoping there will be many more documents released soon, including autopsy report perhaps with approximate time-of-death and further timeline details.

 

[Webthrush]

I don't mess around much with Facebook myself but if someone out there likes doing that sort of thing, here are pages for several of the principals (not all) in this case (including Faith's page, still up). I assume these pages have already been long-scoured and modified by now, but maybe there's still something to find, or a connection to make:

https://www.facebook.com/ebrandon915?fref=pb&hc_location=friends_tab
https://www.facebook.com/karena.rosario?fref=pb&hc_location=friends_tab
https://www.facebook.com/david.bell.507?fref=browse_search
https://www.facebook.com/TakoyJones?fref=pb&hc_location=friends_tab
https://www.facebook.com/jake.beatley?fref=ts
https://www.facebook.com/JordanMcCrary09
https://www.facebook.com/faith.hedgepeth

 

[Boodles]

Thanks for the synopsis Ven; I think a couple of minor details are inaccurate, but I won't take time to back-check right now… my main interest still focuses on that 3:30- 4:30am time period: FH sends a text message to BE encouraging him to come over (for KR) then shortly thereafter KR makes 4 short phone calls (each under 40 secs.) in less than 30 mins. (I'm presuming to BE but don't know) -- why so many and so terse? -- terse because of anger/upset or something else? and then she promptly leaves 15 mins. after last call -- does she know BE is on the way over, and she doesn't want to be there, or she deliberately wants him to find FH alone or something else entirely??? (BE is obviously someone FH would willingly let in the door.) (I don't know how JM fits in other than offering KR a lift -- police didn't seem very interested in him.)

Again, my understanding is that TJ (ETJ), despite a lot of circumstantially incriminating evidence, has basically been cleared of the murder and been DNA-tested (though he might still know more than he is telling), but neither BE or DB (and perhaps others) have yet been DNA-tested -- just my understanding -- if someone has direct sources that contradict that please post the links.

Hoping there will be many more documents released soon, including autopsy report perhaps with approximate time-of-death and further timeline details.

Webthrush, on what do you base your understanding that TJ has been cleared? Why do you think that? I'm not getting that vibe. Why do you believe he gave DNA? It would seem if he did, LE would clear him, since they have stated that they think the unknown DNA is that of the killer.

 

[Webthrush]

Webthrush, on what do you base your understanding that TJ has been cleared? Why do you think that? I'm not getting that vibe. Why do you believe he gave DNA? It would seem if he did, LE would clear him, since they have stated that they think the unknown DNA is that of the killer.

I'm going largely on my two-year old memory of press coverage at the time… TJ was the first POI focused on… they searched his car and as best I recall got DNA (though I could be mistaken), and then quickly turned to gathering info on others. At some point I even recall TJ bragging somewhere on the Web (Facebook, Twitter???) that he had been cleared, not that that would necessarily mean anything… but the fact that officers seemed to turn their attention elsewhere indicated to me the likelihood that he was no longer a prime focus (they wouldn't totally clear him, because he might still be withholding info he knows or otherwise be accessory).
At least one of the press articles says "...investigators collected hundreds of DNA samples, but did not name any suspects. Chapel Hill Police did report that at least one person refused to have a DNA sample submitted." Going back through the recently released docs I can't find anything confirming receipt of DNA from TJ although it does seem clear to me that 2 others likely didn't give DNA. I suspect the press quote is either a misprint -- I can't imagine LE actually collected 100s of DNA samples from individuals -- or else it is including all the swabs taken from vehicles and the crime scene as "DNA samples."
Anyway, I understand your skepticism (the circumstantial incriminating evidence against TJ is strong), but it seems to me LE have been looking in a different direction for awhile now.
On a side-note, I wonder what DNA samples collected from the various vehicles show???
Finally, I'll throw out a separate scenario that's troubling me, though unlikely: what if FH had consensual sex that night with someone (perhaps from The Thrill, perhaps not) and then was walked in on by some other suitor or ex-boyfriend who went into a jealous rage -- i.e. the semen evidence is not from the killer, but from someone scared-to-death to say anything or come forward???

 

[Skigirl]

I wonder why the news outlets have been so restrained in the case. As far as I can tell, they have the recording of the 911 call and copies of the autopsy, and although one could say that releasing them would be in poor taste, that hasn't stopped any of the local outlets from releasing the same documents in other high profile case (e.g., Eve Carson). The one place I've seen a transcript online was a 'regular citizen' who went to the police station to listen and transcribed it himself. I wonder why the quiet, especially after they fought so hard to get access to the search warrants and other documents.

In answer to one of the questions above, it does seem that Hedgepeth was only living with KR temporarily until her financial aid came through and she could afford to move into her own apartment: http://www.newsobserver.com/2013/09/07/3174021_on-the-anniversary-of-faith-hedgepeths.html?rh=1

The article is a little puzzling, though, because it says she was last known alive at 3:00 AM. it was not known at the time the article ws written that KR hadn't left the apartment until 4:30 AM, so perhaps the police told them about something that happened at 3:00 and let the press draw their own conclusions.

I've been thinking about the bag that was found on the bed with FH -- "I'm not stupid b*tch" "Jealous". I wonder if the writing on the bag reflects a response to something FH said to her killer right before he attacked her. She could have said something like, "You're just jealous." After the attack, the killer gets the last word by saying, "I'm not, stupid b*tch*" Then, after thinking a moment, wants to clarify what he is not -- "Jealous".

I strongly suspect that the bag was left by a man, not a woman, based on the fact that she seems to have been raped.

 

[Boodles]

You can get the 911 audio by contacting the PIO at the CHPD. It's public record. And the clerk of courts will release the entire set of "released" docs and reports, including the autopsy. My guess it the media is refraining from publishing the autopsy because it's so much graphic info.

 

[borndem]

I'm going largely on my two-year old memory of press coverage at the time… TJ was the first POI focused on… they searched his car and as best I recall got DNA (though I could be mistaken), and then quickly turned to gathering info on others. At some point I even recall TJ bragging somewhere on the Web (Facebook, Twitter???) that he had been cleared, not that that would necessarily mean anything… but the fact that officers seemed to turn their attention elsewhere indicated to me the likelihood that he was no longer a prime focus (they wouldn't totally clear him, because he might still be withholding info he knows or otherwise be accessory).
At least one of the press articles says "...investigators collected hundreds of DNA samples, but did not name any suspects. Chapel Hill Police did report that at least one person refused to have a DNA sample submitted." Going back through the recently released docs I can't find anything confirming receipt of DNA from TJ although it does seem clear to me that 2 others likely didn't give DNA. I suspect the press quote is either a misprint -- I can't imagine LE actually collected 100s of DNA samples from individuals -- or else it is including all the swabs taken from vehicles and the crime scene as "DNA samples."
Anyway, I understand your skepticism (the circumstantial incriminating evidence against TJ is strong), but it seems to me LE have been looking in a different direction for awhile now.
On a side-note, I wonder what DNA samples collected from the various vehicles show???
Finally, I'll throw out a separate that's troubling me, though unlikely: what if FH had consensual sex that night with someone (perhaps from The Thrill, perhaps not) and then was walked in on by some other suitor or ex-boyfriend who went into a jealous rage -- i.e. the semen evidence is not from the killer, but from someone scared-to-death to say anything or come forward???

bbm

My thoughts as well, thrush. That's how I had to look at what was said re the semen. Someone-not-her-bf but known to her, was there, and someone else -- bf/ex-bf, secret admirer, or friend or bf -- came in on them and went postal from jealousy. We need more DNA info....

 

[Zinn]

bbm

My thoughts as well, thrush. That's how I had to look at what was said re the semen. Someone-not-her-bf but known to her, was there, and someone else -- bf/ex-bf, secret admirer, or friend or bf -- came in on them and went postal from jealousy. We need more DNA info....

I find this scenario unlikely because her used tampon was found in the room, outside of her body, not properly discarded. To me, that sounds more consistent with non-consensual sex.

My opinion only.

 

[borndem]

I find this scenario unlikely because her used tampon was found in the room, outside of her body, not properly discarded. To me, that sounds more consistent with non-consensual sex.

My opinion only.

Oops, Zinn -- forgot about that. You are right -- prolly not consensual sex at all.

 

[Skigirl]

Some observations/questions answered based on the search warrants, in no particular order...

Cliffs and questions...

10. Investigators also sought a swab from JB, the Longview Street resident that KR went to stay with at 4:30 a.m. Not sure what this means ... was he not home? Perhaps after not solving the case initially, law enforcement was just trying to cover all bases, also look into the conspiracy angle with a small group. I believe the search warrant was filed months later, so it doesn't appear as though they looked at him initially, and seems hard to fathom he could have a strong connection to this crime, but who knows.

The search warrants and case notes (http://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/1283962/hedgepeth-case-files.pdf) shed a little light on this. What led investigators to JB is definitely very interesting and starts on p. 109. First of all, when they downloaded cell tower activity from the one near KR & FH's apartment, they found a call from his phone at 4:15 AM. They note that KR was picked up by his roommate just fourteen minutes later and that he might have known that FH was alone. Second, a couple years before FH's murder, in 2010, police from his home state called Chapel Hill police to say that he had made threatening comments and his parents were concerned that he was heading for Chapel Hill with a gun. Just prior to that, he had reportedly had some mental health issues and had sent a text to his mother that he was going to shoot her boyfriend in the head. If I'm reading the notes correctly (the names are blanked out, but it lists his home town), he was also at The Thrill that night. When asked, he refused to give a DNA sample.

Cliffs and questions...

4. Another young man, BE, had dated KR previously. An article states "they" were just friends at the time, but had a previous physical relationship. I assume that means KR and BE, although the article is ambiguous enough that it could mean FH and BE. It's just not clear to my eyes, although I'm sure the people close to the case know which is which. Anyway, considering KR's relationship with ex-b/f ETJ, it seems like either KR and BE dated before she was with ETJ, or possibly he was a rebound guy / fwb type situation.

According to the search warrants, a friend of KR and FH's told investigators that BE and KR (not FH) had had a physical relationship.

Webthrush said upthread

5) the text messages from Faith to BE at 3:40 and 3:43 were released, and then there is mention of short calls from KR to someone (I'm not quite clear if it's BE or JB, though I think BE) at 3:44, 3:52, 3:55, and 4:14 -- I assume those were actual calls, and not text messages? She then leaves around 4:30 -- again I'm not clear if she left with JB, BE or someone else?"

According to the search warrants (p. 48), the short calls from KR's phone were actual calls (33, 38, 37 and 36 seconds). The search warrant blanks out the name of the person she was calling, but the warrant that that information appears in is a warrant to search the car of the guy who spent the previous night on their couch (who I think is also the one KR had had a physical relationship with).

It seems from the search warrant that FH's phone was found and seized by police (p. 60), unless the purple HTC (?) phone was KR's.

One thing that's interesting about the 911 call, is that KR refers to the bedroom as "my bedroom", which implies to me that she considered the apartment hers and Faith's presence there temporary.

Another thing that's interesting is that the information about KR's ex's threats against FH came from another friend (not KR) (p. 87).

 

[Webthrush]

....One thing that's interesting about the 911 call, is that KR refers to the bedroom as "my bedroom",...

Two things I'm still trying to unravel are the 7 rapid-fire phone calls/messages within 30 mins. that precede KR leaving the apt. at 4:30am (they could mean nothing or they could mean everything!), and of course the meaning/timing of the paper bag note [ http://chapelboro.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Note-image.jpg ] But I'll come back to those some other time, because I'm imagining so many completely different possible scenarios that need to be eliminated.

"Skigirl" raising the notion that FH was murdered in KR's room raises a whole 'nother one -- is there any possibility (seems farfetched) that the killer entered a dark apt. with KR as the intended victim, and didn't realize 'til after-the-fact, that he'd raped/murdered Faith, IF she was in KR's room? (I don't even know, were the two women very similar in size, height, build etc?).

 

[Skigirl]

I have a really stupid question,Can you tell from a fluid sample if the person is a non secretor?Do they just not have any DNA or Do some DNA profiles not match up because of not enough protein in the sample but still have partial DNA?
I am thankful to all of you on Faith's Case,I new Borndem and Boodles would be here.

You can tell from a fluid sample if a person is a non-secretor, that is, if someone secretes antigens indicating blood type. They definitely have DNA because every cell everywhere has DNA. There can be a DNA fragment in a sample, and sometimes DNA tests don't match up because the certain segments are missing, but that wouldn't be directly related to the amount of protein in the sample. DNA generates RNA which makes the amino acids that come together to form proteins.

 

[chinacat67]

Some observations/questions answered based on the search warrants, in no particular order...



The search warrants and case notes (http://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/1283962/hedgepeth-case-files.pdf) shed a little light on this. What led investigators to JB is definitely very interesting and starts on p. 109. First of all, when they downloaded cell tower activity from the one near KR & FH's apartment, they found a call from his phone at 4:15 AM. They note that KR was picked up by his roommate just fourteen minutes later and that he might have known that FH was alone. Second, a couple years before FH's murder, in 2010, police from his home state called Chapel Hill police to say that he had made threatening comments and his parents were concerned that he was heading for Chapel Hill with a gun. Just prior to that, he had reportedly had some mental health issues and had sent a text to his mother that he was going to shoot her boyfriend in the head. If I'm reading the notes correctly (the names are blanked out, but it lists his home town), he was also at The Thrill that night. When asked, he refused to give a DNA sample.



According to the search warrants, a friend of KR and FH's told investigators that BE and KR (not FH) had had a physical relationship.

Webthrush said upthread



According to the search warrants (p. 48), the short calls from KR's phone were actual calls (33, 38, 37 and 36 seconds). The search warrant blanks out the name of the person she was calling, but the warrant that that information appears in is a warrant to search the car of the guy who spent the previous night on their couch (who I think is also the one KR had had a physical relationship with).

It seems from the search warrant that FH's phone was found and seized by police (p. 60), unless the purple HTC (?) phone was KR's.

One thing that's interesting about the 911 call, is that KR refers to the bedroom as "my bedroom", which implies to me that she considered the apartment hers and Faith's presence there temporary.

Another thing that's interesting is that the information about KR's ex's threats against FH came from another friend (not KR) (p. 87).

I haven't read the documents yet (headed there now)but this seems at first look like Faith got mixed up in her roommates drama and this had little to do with her to a huge degree. I can't imagine her roommate doesn't know/sense/feel this and that is a huge burden that the police are working at.

I don't know if anyone else posting/reading here has college age kids, but a lot of it seems fairly obvious to this mother of two college age girls, who tries to be fairly realistic about their lives at school.

Roommate had a thing (probably rebound, after my main suspect) with BE and liked him more than he liked her. He liked the booty call. She is a little clingy and needy, he takes advantage of it until it bugs him. Roommate,sad and probably a little tanked after couple hours at bar where BE probably ignored her too much (and I bet he was the reason they went out that late to that bar that night),is sad and down and Faith tries to help (texting BE) from 3 to 430 while roomie gets needier and drunk dials BE leaving increasingly desperate messages that she is up for another booty call. He doesnt answer, I have no doubt. So she gets angry, decides to "show him" she can get another guy and gets a ride to another guy who is a "sure thing"..thinking this will make her feel better about herself (never does) and make BE mad. I hope this isn't offensive to anyone but it is honestly fairly standard operating procedure at any college these days.

I haven't seen a pic of roomie but I also bet the perp knew she was insecure and felt Faith was prettier (another common girl issue). The perp also felt that Faith thought she was too good for him and that pissed him off. Think of how angry this crime is. I think he was angry at both of them, mostly the roomie, though. I think he was watching/stalking ,saw roomie leave, knew exactly where she was going (since was booty call's roommate who drove roomie there), got furious and took it out on Faith. He left the note on the bag for roomie. "I'm not stupid **" refers to knowing where she was going (booty call)and "jealous" was referring (in demented thinking) to his "doing" her prettier friend,Faith. As said, I think it was former boyfriend who I think has not been cleared by DNA even if his alibi seems solid (buds cover for buds--another kid the police are trying to sweat? I sure hope so!)

Absolutely just my gut opinion and as I said, I haven't read the released docs yet, but the college drama evident here is really scarily standard stuff up until the rape/murder of this lovely girl. [emoji20]

 

[tarheelslim]

He left the note on the bag for roomie.

That's what I keep coming back to - what was the purpose of the note? If we assume that it was written after the murder, then IMO there were only 2 people it could have been intended for: 1) the roommate (most likely) or 2) Faith (if he didn't think she was dead - unlikely - or if he was in such a bonkers state he wasn't even thinking along those lines).

I suppose there are also those who think the note was meant to mislead investigators, but I tend to think it was for the roommate (wasn't Faith killed on her bed? and the note left on her bed?) which should be a huge clue as to would've done this.

 

[Ven]

I would bet anything the note was intended for KR and written after the murder.

 

[chinacat67]

After reading through the documents released so far, I still maintain the ex of KR with the RO has got to be the main suspect. The other guys seem like regular college aged guys---don't like interacting with police and don't tell the truth, the whole truth to anyone, let alone the cops, even if they don't have any reason to lie. Kids do, even when they don't have to--and with cops? Definitely. Plus you're looking at a bunch of young law school students---when I was a young law school student I was very much against giving anything to the cops without a lawyer present, just on the principle of the matter. The age and the little of bit of legal knowledge makes most law students pretty stupid. Of course, that was way back, well before standard DNA swabs, but I most certainly would not have given (and still wouldn't necessarily) my DNA "just because"---even if I didn't have anything to do with anything, it still puts me in a system somewhere and I don't like that and would have hated it at that age.

So I think the soccer/basketball/law school bros are more likely red herrings.

Especially after reading the KR's ex actually lived in the same complex? And his behavior right after the crime? If he isn't their number one suspect I must be missing something huge or we don't have all the documents/information still (which I think is the case?)

As always, MOO!

 

[all4justice]

After reading through the documents released so far, I still maintain the ex of KR with the RO has got to be the main suspect. The other guys seem like regular college aged guys---don't like interacting with police and don't tell the truth, the whole truth to anyone, let alone the cops, even if they don't have any reason to lie. Kids do, even when they don't have to--and with cops? Definitely. Plus you're looking at a bunch of young law school students---when I was a young law school student I was very much against giving anything to the cops without a lawyer present, just on the principle of the matter. The age and the little of bit of legal knowledge makes most law students pretty stupid. Of course, that was way back, well before standard DNA swabs, but I most certainly would not have given (and still wouldn't necessarily) my DNA "just because"---even if I didn't have anything to do with anything, it still puts me in a system somewhere and I don't like that and would have hated it at that age.

So I think the soccer/basketball/law school bros are more likely red herrings.

Especially after reading the KR's ex actually lived in the same complex? And his behavior right after the crime? If he isn't their number one suspect I must be missing something huge or we don't have all the documents/information still (which I think is the case?)

As always, MOO!

BBM

LOL. I probably would have done the same thing when I was in law school. Plus, the persons of interest probably weren't fathers yet. I think having children, especially if they had daughters, could have caused innocent persons of interest to be more compassionate towards Faith's parents, and made them more willing to cooperate with LE so they could be eliminated as potential suspects sooner. Of course, if they have even the slightest culpability, then they may not cooperate under any circumstances.

IMO, JMO

 

[Skigirl]

After reading through the documents released so far, I still maintain the ex of KR with the RO has got to be the main suspect. The other guys seem like regular college aged guys---don't like interacting with police and don't tell the truth, the whole truth to anyone, let alone the cops, even if they don't have any reason to lie. Kids do, even when they don't have to--and with cops? Definitely. Plus you're looking at a bunch of young law school students---when I was a young law school student I was very much against giving anything to the cops without a lawyer present, just on the principle of the matter. The age and the little of bit of legal knowledge makes most law students pretty stupid. Of course, that was way back, well before standard DNA swabs, but I most certainly would not have given (and still wouldn't necessarily) my DNA "just because"---even if I didn't have anything to do with anything, it still puts me in a system somewhere and I don't like that and would have hated it at that age.

So I think the soccer/basketball/law school bros are more likely red herrings.

Especially after reading the KR's ex actually lived in the same complex? And his behavior right after the crime? If he isn't their number one suspect I must be missing something huge or we don't have all the documents/information still (which I think is the case?)

As always, MOO!

I would totally agree, and I was absolutely convinced but: WHY has getting a DNA match been so difficult? They have a rape kit, they say that the DNA from the rape kit matched DNA found in the apartment. They also mentioned "tissue" and "DNA" on one of the bottles found in the bedroom (I presume either the riesling bottle or the Bacardi bottle). It seems like there is DNA, and I thought they did get a DNA sample from KR's ex. So why no match?