Netflix to stream new documentary on Steven Avery - #4

[MysticJynx]

Ok I read all this. :gaah: So here's some take aways-
Regarding Colburn- claims the only LE dealings he had with SA was tangential in relation to the phone call about having GA in custody and is admitting to an assault in MC that SA was in prison for. He denies any hard feeling or anything that might give him cause to plant evidence. Yet interestingly was he was running for Sheriff in the upcoming election against Robert Hermann who was under sheriff at the time (the owner of the other salvage yard) and it was implied the taint of the SA civil suit was enough to hurt his chances in the election. SA's defense was going down the path that Colburn and Lenk had a quid pro quo relationship in regards to SA's planting of evidence.
Regarding Lenk- he claims that he only had a deposition in the SA civil suit because of that phone call transferred from Colburn regarding the GA incident. That he had no other dealings with SA.
So truthfully what's their motive??? At the time they weren't named in the civil suit. And did they have a real opportunity to plant the evidence? Neither claims to have ever been in her SUV at any point in time. Neither of their dna or fingerprints should be inside the car. Could possibly SA been caught up in a web of personal politics within the MCSO?

I would like to know who was the investigator that would have been in charge of rapes in 1995/96? KP admitted on Dr Phil that he even knew in 1995 about the call that AC took. Seems there was more to that call then anyone there wanted to admit. As for Sgt AC and Lt. JL. the information of their involvement also did not come to light until he had already filed the Law suit against the COUNTY and retired Sheriff and DA. Another thing I don't understand about Sgt. AC, he went to JL to report this call the day after SA was released. How come he went to JL and not his superior officer?

 

[atthelake]

I am freshly new following this case .

That said ... was the car found on his property behind gates?

That Folks are thinking that she was burned by someone else and somewhere else and the bones were put on his property afterwards? ( or that the bones weren't even found at the property and they were burned by somebody else and then sent to the sheriff's office who then sent it to someone to investigate)

Newcomer here on this case ...



I'm seeing more of the outrage that is perhaps due to not following proper procedures in the court of law and law enforcement vs. .....did he do it? please note my only exposure to this case is Dateline two nights ago and ID channel special last night.

I did not view the Netflix series which I think from reading MSM is the new Joze Baez type journalism at first blush ....as it (netflix) was very *defense oriented * perhaps. From what I have read it is very defense oriented. Tainting at it's best ?

 

[TheDuchess]

Actually, the law says he will walk free if his rights were violated, whether he's guilty or not.

Just to maybe help you clarify? (If not, I apologize.) When many of us say "walk free" we do mean a new trial with LEGAL evidence.

 

[Madeleine74]

So, we should let guilty killers walk free to kill again?

If their convictions were wrongfully obtained then they should either be freed or re-tried. Our constitution is founded on a set of principles that must be upheld (yes, even if a guilty person ends up going free, as awful as that might be).

 

[MysticJynx]

I am on the fence again! hahahaha. I do believe he deserves a fair and just trial, I will say that. The fact that MCSD didnt back off was a huge problem for me. However I was starting to lean towards framed and completely innocent, However I don't know again. The more I read and find out the more I back up onto the fence again. For instance the blood vial and packaging may have been handled in 2002. Still looking into this.

Of course if it had been it was still handled wrong in my opinion. With no paperwork stating why they'd open it. If opened they should have followed the protocol of making sure the evidence was sealed properly. Scotch tape was not proper and that alone should be looked at, if for nothing else to fix the way the evidence is stored and handled. In an open box that someone could simply go through in the middle of an office does not seem right.

And on this note I do believe LE did plant some evidence, the Key. I just dont know about the blood. Maybe they did frame a guilty man. Still dont make it right.




JMO's thoughts and theories

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Avery wrote and filed his appeal January 11, 2016 before noted defense attorney Kathleen Zellner took on his case. It appears the State of Wisconsin is part of this conspiracy to continue to violate his rights. (Strong language on page 4 of the appeal showing that one of the jurors related to law enforcement involved in the case intimidated the other jurors) That's a no-no.

https://localtvwiti.files.wordpress.com/2016/01/avery-motions-filed-1-11-16.pdf

Ok, if I hadn't saw that I might have some reservations---but---come on---really? The whole world is out to get poor old Steven Avery? Give me a break---It is almost laughable! As I understand, he prepared that himself--who is next---Hitler was conspiring against him before he was born....ha...ha...ha...ha...ha

 

[BigCityAccountant]

I am on the fence again! hahahaha. I do believe he deserves a fair and just trial, I will say that. The fact that MCSD didnt back off was a huge problem for me. However I was starting to lean towards framed and completely innocent, However I don't know again. The more I read and find out the more I back up onto the fence again. For instance the blood vial and packaging may have been handled in 2002. Still looking into this.

Of course if it had been it was still handled wrong in my opinion. With no paperwork stating why they'd open it. If opened they should have followed the protocol of making sure the evidence was sealed properly. Scotch tape was not proper and that alone should be looked at, if for nothing else to fix the way the evidence is stored and handled. In an open box that someone could simply go through in the middle of an office does not seem right.

Yes, I believe it was the Wisconsin Innocent Project that did the testing...I think I might have saw that on their website, but not sure.

 

[missy1974]

I am on the fence again! hahahaha. I do believe he deserves a fair and just trial, I will say that. The fact that MCSD didnt back off was a huge problem for me. However I was starting to lean towards framed and completely innocent, However I don't know again. The more I read and find out the more I back up onto the fence again. For instance the blood vial and packaging may have been handled in 2002. Still looking into this.

Of course if it had been it was still handled wrong in my opinion. With no paperwork stating why they'd open it. If opened they should have followed the protocol of making sure the evidence was sealed properly. Scotch tape was not proper and that alone should be looked at, if for nothing else to fix the way the evidence is stored and handled. In an open box that someone could simply go through in the middle of an office does not seem right.

My fence is very wobbly LOL one day it leans one way... the next it sways over to the other side ;-)

The only question I have about the box/scotch tape is, if it was opened in 2002 or whenever, and it was legit.... why didn't the prosecution bring in whoever it was to clear up the whole issue?

 

[BigCityAccountant]

Just to maybe help you clarify? (If not, I apologize.) When many of us say "walk free" we do mean a new trial with LEGAL evidence.

Thanks for clarifying---yes--if the evidence was tainted--yes--he deserves a new trail--but--he only gets to walk free IF it proven he did not commit the murder!

 

[MysticJynx]

My fence is very wobbly LOL one day it leans one way... the next it sways over to the other side ;-)

The only question I have about the box/scotch tape is, if it was opened in 2002 or whenever, and it was legit.... why didn't the prosecution bring in whoever it was to clear up the whole issue?

Maybe cause it don't look good either way. Either they deviated from another procedure when it came to Avery leaving the blood able to be tampered with or they tampered with it. Either way makes them look bad.

 

[missy1974]

Maybe cause it don't look good either way. Either they deviated from another procedure when it came to Avery leaving the blood able to be tampered with or they tampered with it. Either way makes them look bad.

But even now... with all the media attention.... even Kratz hasn't said that it was opened and taped up for any reason. If there was a reasonable explanation for it, wouldn't he say it now (even if it made them look bad lol)?

 

[missy1974]

I'm listening to the SA tapes.....

One thing that I'm curious about is.... where is her receipt book? And did she leave a receipt for other customers that day? and did she have other copies of the AutoTrader magazines that she gave to customers, where are they? I guess those could be easily burned and no evidence left behind.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

I'm listening to the SA tapes.....

One thing that I'm curious about is.... where is her receipt book? And did she leave a receipt for other customers that day? and did she have other copies of the AutoTrader magazines that she gave to customers, where are they? I guess those could be easily burned and no evidence left behind.

The receipt book was probably burned---regarding the Auto Trader magazines--she may have only taken the ones she needed for her appointments that day.

 

[MysticJynx]

But even now... with all the media attention.... even Kratz hasn't said that it was opened and taped up for any reason. If there was a reasonable explanation for it, wouldn't he say it now (even if it made them look bad lol)?

I'd say the Netflix series did a good job at making them look bad. why admit anymore while your trying to do your best to make it seem like MaM got it all wrong. Tell you this much. The few hour shows I have seen on this case including one released in the summer of 2015, Did He Do It (ID channel), touches on pretty much the same evidence in MaM. However MaM goes into more depth, way more.

 

[pleasestandby]

Thanks for clarifying---yes--if the evidence was tainted--yes--he deserves a new trail--but--he only gets to walk free IF it proven he did not commit the murder!

If the evidence was tainted because of police, prosecutor and/or judge conspiracy criminal misconduct then he's a free man without having a new trial (in my understanding of the law)

Also, if any of the above are proven guilty, I believe all their past criminal cases that they were ever involved in also stand a chance of being overturned and those criminals set free.

For all we know, there are many more wrongful convictions in criminal cases where the suspect was railroaded.

In Wisconsin, if you are wrongfully convicted, the state has to shell out $5,000.00 per year for each year the person was in prison. That's $50,000.00 they owe SA if he was wrongfully convicted, so far. If the state wants to drag these appeals on for years and years and SA eventually still gets out because of a wrongful conviction, he's going to have a tidy sum of money from the state when he does get out. If they're smart, they'll let him out pending appeal. That doesn't even include what the people involved will be sued for. So these people better get their heads out of their sand piles.

http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2014/06/16/320356084/when-innocent-people-go-to-prison-states-pay

Wisconsin pays the lowest amount and Texas pays the highest at $50,000.00 for each year so it's pretty easy to see how highly Wisconsin law makers value their own citizen' rights. It appears we are nothing but trash to them without value.

This case is going to scar the judicial system in Wisconsin for years to come. NO ONE will want to come forward to be a juror, testify or be a witness in a criminal trial because of all the corruption and bad publicity knowing that law enforcement or the criminal justice system is going to retaliate against you or even frame you at their whim.

In Wisconsin, you can go to the DMV and get a new drivers license for $14.00 with an address on it of where you tell them you will be moving to in the event you don't want to do or are afraid to do jury duty. Take it to the clerk of courts and tell them you're moving, here's my new address and you're off jury duty. Problem solved. Once you're off jury duty, "move" back a few months later. If they don't have to play by the rules, neither do you.

And remember, whenever a law enforcement officer talks to you, you tell them only five words: "I have nothing to say." No matter what it is. Followed by, "I'm not saying anything without an attorney present." Followed by, "Am I under arrest?" Followed by, "Am I free to go?" Better train your children well as to what to say or they, too, may one day become a BD.

 

[Oakland CA]

And remember, whenever a law enforcement officer talks to you, you tell them only five words: "I have nothing to say." No matter what it is. Followed by, "I'm not saying anything without an attorney present." Followed by, "Am I under arrest?" Followed by, "Am I free to go?" Better train your children well as to what to say or they, too, may one day become a BD.

This, this, this and this.

 

[pleasestandby]

Ok, if I hadn't saw that I might have some reservations---but---come on---really? The whole world is out to get poor old Steven Avery? Give me a break---It is almost laughable! As I understand, he prepared that himself--who is next---Hitler was conspiring against him before he was born....ha...ha...ha...ha...ha

He did prepare it himself. He had to. He didn't have nor could he afford an attorney. In Wisconsin, we have the right to defend ourselves and represent ourselves. The justice system is so corrupt in Illinois, I'll never cross the state line to go there. Of Illinois' last seven governors, four went to prison. That's over 50%.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

If the state wants to drag these appeals on for years and years and SA eventually still gets out because of a wrongful conviction, he's going to have a tidy sum of money from the state when he does get out. That doesn't even include what the people involved will be sued for. So these people better get their heads out of their sand piles.

...and those people would include:
Manitowoc County
Manitowoc County Sheriff’s Department
Andrew Colborn, Sergeant
Daniel Kucharski, Deputy
Dave Remiker, Detective
Eugene Kusche, Deputy Sheriff
James Lenk, Sheriff
Jason Orth, Sergeant
Kenneth Petersen, Sheriff 79-07
Robert Hermann, Under Sheriff
Thomas Bergner, Detective
Juror C.W.
Judge Jerome Fox, Manitowoc Circuit Court
Mark Rohrer, District Attorney

Calumet County
Calumet County Sheriff’s Department
Jerry Pagel, Sheriff
William Tyson, Sergeant

Calumet County District Attorney Ken Kratz
Calumet County Judge Patrick L. Willis
Sheboygan County
Judge Angela Sutkiewicz of Sheboygan County Circuit Court
Milwaukee County
Norm Gahn – Assistant District Attorney
Marinette County
Marinette County Sheriff Department
Anthony O’Neill, Detective
Wisconsin Department of Justice
Tom Fallon, Assistant Attorney General
Amy Lehmann, Special Agent
Debra Strauss, Special Agent
Kevin Heimerl, Special Agent
Tom Fassbender, Special Agent
Tom Sturdivant, Special Agent
FBI
Dr. Marc LeBeau, Chemistry Unit Chief
Wisconsin State Crime Lab
Nick Stahlke, Bloodstain Pattern Analyst
Sherry Culhane, DNA Technical Unit Leader

6 Ineffective Trial and Appellate Counsels
Jodi Stachowski

WOW...what a conspiracy!!! He's going to be richer than Bill Gates!

 

[pleasestandby]

This, this, this and this.

Exactly. Not necessarily in that order.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

He did prepare it himself. He had to. He didn't have nor could he afford an attorney. In Wisconsin, we have the right to defend ourselves and represent ourselves. The justice system is so corrupt in Illinois, I'll never cross the state line to go there. Of Illinois' last seven governors, four went to prison. That's over 50%.

Very familiar with the IL thing---yes--probably the most corrupt state in the union...LOL

Sorry, but in my opinion--he looks like a very desperate man grasping at straws.