NH NH - Allenstown, Adult Female & 3 Children, found Nov'85 & May'00

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Bear with me on this scenario because it's a little different. Let's say RE WAS on the older end of his estimated age range. And, let's say he was dating an older woman (35-50) who had a twenty-something daughter and a 7-11 year old daughter. So, at least two children of her own. And, let's say the twenty-something daughter had a daughter of her own, like a 1 or 2 year old or was just pregnant with one. Let's say RE dates this older lady and then, like his assumed pattern, she catches on to something and he kills her. But she maybe was kind of flaky. So, one day she doesn't come home and the 20-something daughter is told "she got mad at me and took off" and the 20-something daughter knows she's flaky and believes him. Then shortly later or that same day, he says "I'm done with this. I have a line on a job out of State but I feel awful leaving you here without your mother. Why don't you guys come with me and I'll take care of you or help you out and you can probably get a job at this place too and I'll help you out with the kids cuz I'm a nice guy. ". 20-something really doesn't see any other options and decides to pack up her sister and her baby (if it's already born) and go with him. And maybe he even says, you know I have a daughter of my own and you can help me out, or maybe he even had his daughter with him at that time. So, maybe 20-something is named Elizabeth or maybe her mother had that name. And maybe you and your mom and little family lived in northern Michigan (in the known isotope region for the 3 of you) when your mom met BE and he had moved you originally to the east coast,to like Delaware and you were there only a short time before all this happened and maybe he met your mom in northern Michigan on his way through from the upper Midwest like Minnesota or the Dakotas where he Came from with his daughter.

Unfortunately, when you've been in New Hampshire for awhile you discover what your mom had; that he was doing something bad to the younger girls. So he got rid of you and the other girls too, including his own.

So with this imaginary scenario in mind, what do you all think of the following Jane Doe? She had at least two children. They thought she was from Michigan, so I don't know if they had isotopes on her, but part of the Allentown family had northern Michigan in the range. She also had poor teeth. There was no one to report her missing if her family went with RE. If there was family in Michigan maybe she and her little family weren't reported missing because just like Denise B. she and her daughters went out of State voluntarily with RE.
I'd like to know more about this Jane Doe if anyone has any information on her. What do you all think?


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unidentified_murder_victims_in_the_United_States

New Castle County Jane Doe
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3D reconstruction
<img alt="" src="//upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/61/Searchtool.svg/16px-Searchtool.svg.png" width="16" height="16" data-file-width="512" data-file-height="512">

Profile
A possible victim of Henry Lee Lucas was found in a field in Townsend, New Castle County, Delaware on June 27, 1977. Examination of the bones concluded that she was a middle aged woman, the mother of approximately two children and had various dental problems, as well as a spinal condition, at the age of thirty-five to fifty. Her dental problems may have been due to smoking, as a large amount of tar was found in her mouth, which also had a removable plate and many fillings. Despite the various types of dental work, the quality of the procedures was of fairly low quality. One of the bones of one of her right fingers was broken, possibly from defending herself from the killer. She may have been native to Michigan, which has led investigators to believe that Lucas had been involved, as he had given statements in prison describing a similar crime scene as well as claiming he had murdered a Michigan woman in the same area.[65]
 
I'm not sure about your specific Jane, but I find that scenario quite plausible. Also fits both the isotope and genetic information.

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The do compare DNA of unidentified remains to each other, even if they're not found together. If there were a match to any of the related female victims among the Jane Does, there would have been a hit.

Investigators don't really know what the maternal relationship is between the three related victims; they stated that in the 2015 press conference. Everyone is just assuming it's mother and daughters, which is the most probable one. However, it could also be two sisters with the oldest sister's baby (as you've suggested Owut). Or, it could be three maternally related cousins. Or it could an aunt with two nieces.
 
The do compare DNA of unidentified remains to each other, even if they're not found together. If there were a match to any of the related female victims among the Jane Does, there would have been a hit.

Investigators don't really know what the maternal relationship is between the three related victims; they stated that in the 2015 press conference. Everyone is just assuming it's mother and daughters, which is the most probable one. However, it could also be two sisters with the oldest sister's baby (as you've suggested Owut). Or, it could be three maternally related cousins. Or it could an aunt with two nieces.
Or three sisters, or half sisters of the same father. There are probably dozens of permutations.



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The do compare DNA of unidentified remains to each other, even if they're not found together. If there were a match to any of the related female victims among the Jane Does, there would have been a hit.

Investigators don't really know what the maternal relationship is between the three related victims; they stated that in the 2015 press conference. Everyone is just assuming it's mother and daughters, which is the most probable one. However, it could also be two sisters with the oldest sister's baby (as you've suggested Owut). Or, it could be three maternally related cousins. Or it could an aunt with two nieces.

I'm not overly confident that they DO compare unidentified remains to each other.
 
I'm not overly confident that they DO compare unidentified remains to each other.

I wasn't sure but was curious about the process, so I asked Lori Bruski from NamUs. Here is what she replied:
[FONT=&quot]Yes, unidentified cases are automatically compared to other unidentified cases found.[/FONT]
 
I am very confused because there are only three children. ?????

Sorry again... I've started to refer to them with numbers in my notes, so I added the word child to clear things up and ended up creating confusion. I was referring to the youngest child (my system being Adult #1, and children #2,#3 and #4). I'll try to be clearer in the future.
 
I guess this means it is useless to look at unidentified remains unless ther profile indicates the DNA is not complete.
 
I guess this means it is useless to look at unidentified remains unless ther profile indicates the DNA is not complete.
Yeah, unless there's something else really compelling to justify a double check.

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I was thinking about who Elizabeth Evans could be and had an idea-- what if she was a fugitive along with RE? Her real name might not have even been Elizabeth but what if she was using that name to hide from the law just like RE?

I started looking for cases of women or couples who ran away in the 70's and found the complex case of Stephanie and Edward Hunsberger.
WS thread: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...g-of-Prussia-25-Feb-1978&highlight=Hunsberger
Charlie Project pages:
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/h/hunsberger_edward.html
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/h/hunsberger_stephanie.html

Namus:
https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/34827/
https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/34828/

I haven't read too deeply to see if this is even possible timeline wise and age wise but Ed's nose reminded me a little of RE.

66458
AR-170129351.jpg&q=82&stamp=&maxw=729


Stephanie's DNA on Namus says "samples submitted --tests not complete". I'm not sure who the children would be but Stephanie had a sister that is not named anywhere (no idea if she is missing or just wants to remain unaffiliated with the case and I don't know how old she was) and if Stephanie was really working as a prostitute in Philly for a while she might have had a child by another man that ED/RE might claim as his own since they were married.

65250
66459
1328

It's not a very strong resemblance, IMO, but thought I would put them side by side for comparison. Thoughts?
 
Edward could possibly be RE, but there's no way Stephanie is the adult female because there is no missing 5-11 year old maternal female relative known to be missing with her. There's a possibility she could be the middle child's mother, though, if her family didn't know she'd had a child. Since they were on the run a lot, that's possible and it would explain why no one is looking for her on her mother's side..
Hopefully, once Stephanie's DNA profile completes, it will match to someone.

ETA: Excellent insight, Gardener1850!
 
Are the two pictures of the same woman? It seems like her eyes are bulgy in the second one which would indicate a thyroid problem (or a couple of other medical issues). Thyroid problems would cause significant risk to a baby.
 
Are the two pictures of the same woman? It seems like her eyes are bulgy in the second one which would indicate a thyroid problem (or a couple of other medical issues). Thyroid problems would cause significant risk to a baby.

Yes, they are the same woman. The first is a High School age picture. I think the one with the bulgy eyes is when she was older (early 20's?) right before she went missing. She had a drug problem with heroin. She supposedly got clean or was getting clean when she disappeared. Does anyone know if heroin use causes bulgy eyes? Also do we know if RE ever had drug issues? I know it was suggested he may be an alcoholic but I'm not sure if that is speculation or a known fact.
 
Edward could possibly be RE, but there's no way Stephanie is the adult female because there is no missing 5-11 year old maternal female relative known to be missing with her. There's a possibility she could be the middle child's mother, though, if her family didn't know she'd had a child. Since they were on the run a lot, that's possible and it would explain why no one is looking for her on her mother's side..
Hopefully, once Stephanie's DNA profile completes, it will match to someone.

ETA: Excellent insight, Gardener1850!

Ooh good thought. Maybe the middle child's mother who also pretended to be Elizabeth Evans? I've been thinking Elizabeth Evans as the woman in the barrel but she may not be. RE might have killed the woman in the barrel and the older child and kept the two younger ones alive for a few months and pretended to raise them with EE. Or EE could be unrelated to any of the NH victims.
 
Anyone explore the idea of Mary Elizabeth Stuart from Honeydew, Ca and her 2 missing girls being these related females? It could explain who was listed as a spouse for Robert Evans as Elizabeth in 1980.
 
With BE's recent lead to Oregon, could this be his child's mother?
Found Jun 1976 (Time of death:1966-1976) http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/762ufor.html

Consistencies:
*Bob Evans surfaces in NH in 1976, could he have fled there after the murder?
*She has Native American items found with her and the daughter is possibly native
*The daughter's isotopes (the whole yellow map, not the just the red boxed areas) show that area of Oregon where she was found.

Did they submit the daughter's DNA into CODIS? ? Maybe it will get a hit if her mother is a murder victim.
 
With BE's recent lead to Oregon, could this be his child's mother?
Found Jun 1976 (Time of death:1966-1976) http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/762ufor.html

Consistencies:
*Bob Evans surfaces in NH in 1976, could he have fled there after the murder?
*She has Native American items found with her and the daughter is possibly native
*The daughter's isotopes (the whole yellow map, not the just the red boxed areas) show that area of Oregon where she was found.

Did they submit the daughter's DNA into CODIS? ? Maybe it will get a hit if her mother is a murder victim.
Since the deceased woman's mtDNA is in the system, it ought to have been picked up automatically.

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