NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - #13

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Horsewash. You're not going to help any fluid leaking out the tailpipe by stuffing a rag into it.
You're not going to suck air into the engine through the E X H A U S T either.

I can buy the rag was there to somehow hide that the tailpipe is smoking, even though that seems kind of dumb in my mind. But at least that makes more sense than putting a rag in the tailpipe to signal the car is disabled, something I've seen mentioned now and then over the years.
 
You're not going to suck air into the engine through the E X H A U S T either.

I can buy the rag was there to somehow hide the tailpipe from smoking, even though that seems kind of dumb in my mind. But at least that makes more sense than putting a rag in the tailpipe to signal the car is disabled, something I've seen mentioned now and then over the years.
That's right, so the rag would serve no purpose whatsoever to help the engine's isues.

No, you wouldn't. I have ran numerous clunkers and raced numerous clunkers. If the engine is farting smoke, THERE IS A MAJOR PROBLEM THAT NEEDS MECHANICAL REPAIR, no ifs/buts about it. THIS PROBLEM COMES FROM AN INTERNAL ISSUE WITHIN THE ENGINE. A rag? You put a rag on the driver's side window to send a message that this car is disabled, (modsnip)
 
I know better than to post this but it's late and I'm feeling lucky (Maura's case brought me to WS in 2010 and my username came from the treatment of posters if one dared to disagree) so here goes nothing... I've always assumed Maura put the rag in there after the crash to prevent drawing attention to the car. I was told it would not emit smoke after the crash but if it's cold outside and the tailpipe is hot, I would think some steam would still be visible. And for the mechanics who disagree, I think it's a plausible scenario in the mind of a young girl disoriented from a crash. Wasn't there talk of movement around the trunk/rear of the vehicle? That is all; let the lynching begin. JMVHO, MOO, and all that jazz

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I know better than to post this but it's late and I'm feeling lucky (Maura's case brought me to WS in 2010 and my username came from the treatment of posters if one dared to disagree) so here goes nothing... I've always assumed Maura put the rag in there after the crash to prevent drawing attention to the car. I was told it would not emit smoke after the crash but if it's cold outside and the tailpipe is hot, I would think some steam would still be visible. And for the mechanics who disagree, I think it's a plausible scenario in the mind of a young girl disoriented from a crash. Wasn't there talk of movement around the trunk/rear of the vehicle? That is all; let the lynching begin. JMVHO, MOO, and all that jazz

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If Maura indented to defer the public away from by stuffing the tailpipe with the rag, in reality, she did the exact opposite, unknowingly or knowingly.
 
I know better than to post this but it's late and I'm feeling lucky (Maura's case brought me to WS in 2010 and my username came from the treatment of posters if one dared to disagree) so here goes nothing... I've always assumed Maura put the rag in there after the crash to prevent drawing attention to the car. I was told it would not emit smoke after the crash but if it's cold outside and the tailpipe is hot, I would think some steam would still be visible. And for the mechanics who disagree, I think it's a plausible scenario in the mind of a young girl disoriented from a crash. Wasn't there talk of movement around the trunk/rear of the vehicle? That is all; let the lynching begin. JMVHO, MOO, and all that jazz

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Nobody really KNOWS what happened, your input is just as valuable as anyone else's. You won't get any negative input from me! Happy to hear from ya :)


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........If Maura indented to defer the public ........

Alfie, would you be kind enough to explain what that means?

I'm having trouble understanding what Maura indented and how that would defer them?
 
P.S. I'm available for anyone who needs an automotive and/or automotive racing credential for the last 25 years - I'm the man to talk to!
 
Alfie, would you be kind enough to explain what that means?

I'm having trouble understanding what Maura indented and how that would defer them?
Like you, I personally do not know Maura's expertise on automobiles. Nor his father or any people in their family tree. However, stuffing a tailpipe tells *me* only TWO things - 1) person wanted to commit suicide, and there was a hose accompanied to a rag - i.e., a hose from the tailpipe to a window, as seen in Client List, 1994. Otherwise, simply stuffing a rag onto the tailpipe would only slow Maura down. Maura's car would be trying its best to exhaust its exhaust to the atmosphere. Second would to throw everyone off. I, myself, might be a bit biased, but I cannot think of a reason to walk up to my own car's own exhaust pipe plugged up for any other reason other my own." From this I'm only guessing someone with mechanical aptitude was waiting for someone like Maura.
 
I haven't followed this case, and certainly do not know all the details. So bare with me. Is it known if she stopped anywhere near where she crashed? Like to get gas, or go to the restroom? Because if she did, I wonder if someone didn't put that rag in the tailpipe then. I don't think it was in the actual muffler. You would have needed a broom stick or something similar to push a rag through the tail pipe into the muffler.

From what little I know about vehicles, a rag in the tail pipe would affect it's performance. It doesn't get air from the tail pipe, but from the air filter on the motor, but what goes in, must come out, so the air leaves through the exhaust. I can't imagine someone driving like that. And I can't see any reasonable reason to put it in the tailpipe after it's crashed. If the tail pipe was hot, and releasing 'smoke' or condensation, then you'd burn yourself trying to stuff something into it.


I recently saw this one some TV show, and it just doesn't make sense. Maura's disappearance. I would have thought suicide, but then, why no one has found her body? Of course now, unless someone saw a skull, they probably wouldn't even know it's a person. :(

Such a bizarre case!
 
Alfie, would you be kind enough to explain what that means?

I'm having trouble understanding what Maura indented and how that would defer them?

Intended, not indented.
 
I said same thing about a perp using this time while she's stopping for her last fill up to put the rag in the pipe...she then had car trouble and pulled off onto 112...






I haven't followed this case, and certainly do not know all the details. So bare with me. Is t thit known if she stopped anywhere near where she crashed? Like to get gas, or go to the restroom? Because if she did, I wonder if someone didn't put that rag in the tailpipe then. I don't think it was in the actual muffler. You would have needed a broom stick or something similar to push a rag through the tail pipe into the muffler.

From what little I know about vehicles, a rag in the tail pipe would affect it's performance. It doesn't get air from the tail pipe, but from the air filter on the motor, but what goes in, must come out, so the air leaves through the exhaust. I can't imagine someone driving like that. And I can't see any reasonable reason to put it in the tailpipe after it's crashed. If the tail pipe was hot, and releasing 'smoke' or condensation, then you'd burn yourself trying to stuff something into it.


I recently saw this one some TV show, and it just doesn't make sense. Maura's disappearance. I would have thought suicide, but then, why no one has found her body? Of course now, unless someone saw a skull, they probably wouldn't even know it's a person. :(

Such a bizarre case!
 
Yesterday's episode was alright. I am very conflicted about the show veering towards the Murrays. I feel bad for them. But I realize the drama in Maura's life pre-disappearance could be key to discovering what happened that night. On the other hand, I realize the drama could be 100% unconnected to what happened to Maura after the crash. If Kathleen doesn't reveal any juicy details about the phone call next week, it will be a let down.

Whether by accident or design, the show is making the case for Maura deciding to take off. But I keep thinking about is if Maura was driving in tandem with someone, why was that other car so far behind? That seems problematic, especially when driving out in the country and at night.
 
I said same thing about a perp using this time while she's stopping for her last fill up to put the rag in the pipe...she then had car trouble and pulled off onto 112...

What do you think about the common belief that the rag came from the emergency kit inside her trunk? How did the supposed perp get access to it.

Sgt. Smith also found a rag stuffed into the exterior tail pipe of Maura's Saturn. The rag came from the trunk of Maura's car, according to Fred Murray, who said he had stored the rag along with an emergency roadside kit in the Saturn.
http://whitmanhansonexpress.com/ind...sing-part-ii-the-accident&catid=912&Itemid=83

And just to address the suicide theory: From the link -

Stuffing a rag into a tail pipe would stall the vehicle and it would eventually kill the engine, according to Ferry's Automotive in Hanson. Plugging the tailpipe can also be a way to check for leaks in a vehicle's exhaust system. While carbon monoxide poisoning is a common method of attempting suicide, it would normally require a means of feeding the deadly gas back into the vehicle, such as by hose or in a confined space.
 
What do you think about the common belief that the rag came from the emergency kit inside her trunk? How did the supposed perp get access to it.


http://whitmanhansonexpress.com/ind...sing-part-ii-the-accident&catid=912&Itemid=83

And just to address the suicide theory: From the link -
Of all the ways to disable a car, this seems like a pretty futile method. A solid object in the exhaust is one thing, but a rag? Why not cut the brake lines? Sugar in the gas tank? Slash a tire or two? In that context this never really made sense to me.
 
I just saw the first two episodes of the show. I think it's great to see a fresh (or fresh-looking) perspective on the case.

Using Occam's razor (and bearing in mind my tendency to think the best of people), I find myself thinking that either she wandered off into the woods and her body was never found or she met with foul play. It may be that her reasons for making the trip are irrelevant.

But there are so many unusual possibilities.

Watching the program made me think of how vulnerable people are at around 20. Not just to the onset of schizophrenia, but to all kinds of other things. When I heard of the facts behind "She stole from Fort Knox!" (c'mon, Renner), the details seemed so understandable. You're a good kid, an overachiever, with a father with high expectations. Around that age, other influences come in, or for whatever reason you have a need to rebel. So there goes the lipstick into your pocket.

It also made me think about the secrets that families and other close groups keep (many of which are about alcohol use). After a while, there are many things that simply aren't said. You get a lot of "You know how that Bob is!" or other shorthand. You even start to lie to yourself, to forget the messier details that don't fit with the narrative you want.

From having read about the case before and from what I've seen so far, I don't feel suspicious of the Murrays. I do think they're covering up a lot of things--but not necessarily things that are directly related to the disappearance. It seems like Kathleen has many sorrows. I felt sorry that she was being compelled to talk about the case; even as I'm fascinated and want to help (which is true for most of us), the whole thing happening as part of a TV broadcast made me a bit squirmy. And the setting of that interview was horribly intimidating--was that on purpose? When someone listening in said something like "Look how tense her body is!" I yelled at the TV "She's fat and she's sitting on a lousy motel bed! We've all been there! Get the poor soul a frickin' chair!"
 
The thing that amazes me is all the programs I have pèrsonally seen on TV portray Maura as the all American girl, she obviously had problems as we all do, I think if the REAL Maura was put out there, it might be easier to figure out what happened to her.
Precisely. And this has been the source of so much of the frustration about the case. Now, all we have is the white noise of all the rumors and speculation that, over the years, have become the conventional wisdom. (There's been very little confirmation of any of these ideas that are being discussed today as if they were facts of the case.)
 
At least the last episode brought out Maura's legal issues....So many times before she has been portrayed as an All American Girl, no problems, no issues. No judgement here, we ALL have problems. I'm glad at least it was brought to light that she had several negative things in her life, that might make her want to get away.
I personally disagree with Renner, I don't believe she was pregnant. In this day and age it is not unacceptable to be pregnant out of wedlock. And if she had to she could have gotten an abortion. I DO agree with her sister Cathleen (she has more info in my opinion) that the car accident involving her Dad's car was the tipping point.
 
At least the last episode brought out Maura's legal issues....So many times before she has been portrayed as an All American Girl, no problems, no issues. No judgement here, we ALL have problems. I'm glad at least it was brought to light that she had several negative things in her life, that might make her want to get away.
I personally disagree with Renner, I don't believe she was pregnant. In this day and age it is not unacceptable to be pregnant out of wedlock. And if she had to she could have gotten an abortion. I DO agree with her sister Cathleen (she has more info in my opinion) that the car accident involving her Dad's car was the tipping point.
I have wondered, what if the purpose of the trip was to get an abortion? Maybe the death in the family excuse was just a cover for that. I haven't thought it through much beyond that though.
 
I have wondered, what if the purpose of the trip was to get an abortion? Maybe the death in the family excuse was just a cover for that. I haven't thought it through much beyond that though.

It would be a lot easier to get an abortion in the Northampton/Amherst area (or Springfield, if worried about privacy) than in New Hampshire.
 
It would be a lot easier to get an abortion in the Northampton/Amherst area (or Springfield, if worried about privacy) than in New Hampshire.

That was what I was just thnking and expecially in the populated U-MA area. But who knows what Maura was thinking.
I did not get to see the series at all and from the sounds of it nothing new has really come to light. It is such a mystery as many of these cases are.
The rag in the tailpipe makes no sense and never did.
 
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