AMBER ALERT NJ - Dulce Mariá Alavez, 5, abducted at Bridgeton City Park, Cumberland County, 16 Sept 2019 #4

[958pm]

I think the explanation would be the witness didn’t realize there was a family connection between the two kids.

It’s interesting Noema claimed they couldn’t see the kids anymore when it’s also been said they never could see the kids on the swings because a hill blocked their view.

Yes, but what would a healthy/normal individual do if they saw an unaccompanied 3 year old at a playground? It can be assumed he was in distress because his ice cream was on the ground and his sister was being led away. (Unbeknownst to the observer but very real to the toddler). Even if it didn’t register that his sister was being abducted to the observer ... would the witness not keep an eye on a three year old alone at a park?

It is interesting. Absolutely. Maybe they were first on the play structure and they could see them at the top of the slide? Every few moments?

 

[moonlessnight]

that is not the only video in which a smile is being suppressed. some people get nervous in front of cameras. but after that last video I just can't...

Things I’m thinking about.

A witness saw Dulce being placed into a vehicle and driven off. Did they notice then a three year old in distress on the playground ? Probably crying and alone? Moms narrative is that Manuel returned to the car. Most people would approach an upset three year old alone on the playground and attempt to offer assistance.

I know we are victim friendly and I am the first to advocate whole heartedly. I hate to go there...here....Saying this in the most non accusatory way. But we are missing something. The first few + seconds of moms latest interview she appears to be holding back a smile. Sooo many people do this when nervous or uncomfortable. So it is easily explainable if that the case . What is the likelihood/ statistical probability though, that Dulce was taken by someone she knows to be returned when award money meets desired amount? It would explain why mom is upset when thinking of Dulce going to bed .. she knows she’s probably sad, but not hysterical that her daughter is missing.

 

[Yvettea]

Yes, but what would a healthy/normal individual do if they saw an unaccompanied 3 year old at a playground? It can be assumed he was in distress because his ice cream was on the ground and his sister was being led away. (Unbeknownst to the observer but very real to the toddler). Even if it didn’t register that his sister was being abducted to the observer ... would the witness not keep an eye on a three year old alone at a park?

I wouldn’t hurry to help a crying 3-year old on the playground. Where I live people are very strict about stranger danger and do not want their child to accept help from a stranger even one with good intentions. The mother arrived fairly quickly.

A far as the move to get the reward money it would never occur to me that someone might try that. It seems adolescent and even feeble-minded but that’s just me.

 

[MsFacetious]

Why not just say I live with my grandparents? The renting a room in the neighborhood statement made me think she was staying with friends or in a boarding house.

Renting a room sounds a bit more “adult” than living with grandparents? Maybe that’s all it is.

I wouldn’t hurry to help a crying 3-year old on the playground. Where I live people are very strict about stranger danger and do not want their child to accept help from a stranger even one with good intentions. The mother arrived fairly quickly.

A far as the move to get the reward money it would never occur to me that someone might try that. It seems adolescent and even feeble-minded but that’s just me.

Yet we’ve seen it happen before.... adolescent behavior isn’t terribly uncommon unfortunately.

 

[Lewie]

Renting a room sounds a bit more “adult” than living with grandparents? Maybe that’s all it is.

That was my thought as well. Although “renting” usually implies money, which would be surprising to me because of her job situation and it just doesn’t seem to align with their culture. But she may be renting in exchange for services like cooking, cleaning, etc.

 

[JerzeyGirl]

Everything I read stated she rents a room with her boyfriend near her parents. Not with her parents. The kids live with the grandparents.

 

[MimosaMornings]

I haven’t seen him with Dulce’s mom in any of the videos, I thought I saw an article that he had been released.

 

[MissMalowe]

I haven’t seen him with Dulce’s mom in any of the videos, I thought I saw an article that he had been released.

I noticed this as well and have been wondering about that as well as this:

She said she did not know why he had been detained. ICE’s Philadelphia field office did not confirm anyone was being held but in response to an inquiry from NJ Advance Media, the agency wrote that “Edgar Martinez-Santiago, a 27-year-old Mexican citizen, is part of ongoing investigation by local, state and federal law enforcement partners and ICE cannot comment further."

Authorities offer $20K reward for information about missing 5-year-old Dulce Alavez, plead for more tips

 

[jjenny]

I think the explanation would be the witness didn’t realize there was a family connection between the two kids.

It’s interesting Noema claimed they couldn’t see the kids anymore when it’s also been said they never could see the kids on the swings because a hill blocked their view.

I noticed that too. If they couldn't see the kids on the swings because of the hill blocking view to begin with, then what alarmed them when they couldn't see them that they went to look?

 

[jjenny]

Why not just say I live with my grandparents? The renting a room in the neighborhood statement made me think she was staying with friends or in a boarding house.

Dulce's mother doesn't live with her parents. There was an article stating that she got kicked out of their house and lives in a room nearby. I never saw anything suggesting she lives with her grandparents. Are grandparents even in the US?

 

[jjenny]

Yes, but what would a healthy/normal individual do if they saw an unaccompanied 3 year old at a playground? It can be assumed he was in distress because his ice cream was on the ground and his sister was being led away. (Unbeknownst to the observer but very real to the toddler). Even if it didn’t register that his sister was being abducted to the observer ... would the witness not keep an eye on a three year old alone at a park?

It is interesting. Absolutely. Maybe they were first on the play structure and they could see them at the top of the slide? Every few moments?

We don't know who this witness is. Could have been another child I suppose. As far as I understand the situation, witness wasn't even found on the same day as Dulce went missing.

 

[Rosiebones]

Why was the ground and water search the first couple of days up at Lake Sunset and the drained waterway up that way too? Instead of the waterway and Jeddy's Pond which was right next to the playground site. This was all done before they had the description of a red van.
Has LE ever given a schematic of the areas of the high school and the park that have been searched?

 

[ProtectChildren]

Completely get what you’re saying, but wouldn’t it stand to reason that a would be abductor would deliberately seek out a place where he wouldn’t be known, rather than take a local child and risk recognition?

This is probably a good understanding of the mindset of someone who could commit a crime like that. It makes sense.

I would imagine such a crime would take a lot of research. I would wonder how a remote city like Bridgeton would even be on the radar of an abductor.

I thought Dulce and then little brother lived with Noema’s parents. Noema rents a room somewhere.

I've been curious who else may live in the home where Dulce lived. We know her ** year old brother and Grandmom and Grandfather.

** 3 year old brother, omit

 

[283]

We don't know who this witness is. Could have been another child I suppose. As far as I understand the situation, witness wasn't even found on the same day as Dulce went missing.

This is probably a good understanding of the mindset of someone who could commit a crime like that. It makes sense.

I would imagine such a crime would take a lot of research. I would wonder how a remote city like Bridgeton would even be on the radar of an abductor.

I've been curious who else may live in the home where Dulce lived. We know her year old brother and Grandmom and Grandfather.

I would imagine he 8 yr old daughter if the grandparents - possibly Noema brother since she called him to come with the family dog - and maybe even her older sister ?

 

[peppertheyorkiepoo]

This is probably a good understanding of the mindset of someone who could commit a crime like that. It makes sense.

I would imagine such a crime would take a lot of research. I would wonder how a remote city like Bridgeton would even be on the radar of an abductor.

I've been curious who else may live in the home where Dulce lived. We know her year old brother and Grandmom and Grandfather.

This is probably a good understanding of the mindset of someone who could commit a crime like that. It makes sense.

I would imagine such a crime would take a lot of research. I would wonder how a remote city like Bridgeton would even be on the radar of an abductor.

I've been curious who else may live in the home where Dulce lived. We know her year old brother and Grandmom and Grandfather.

This is probably a good understanding of the mindset of someone who could commit a crime like that. It makes sense.

I would imagine such a crime would take a lot of research. I would wonder how a remote city like Bridgeton would even be on the radar of an abductor.

I've been curious who else may live in the home where Dulce lived. We know her year old brother and Grandmom and Grandfather.

This is probably a good understanding of the mindset of someone who could commit a crime like that. It makes sense.

I would imagine such a crime would take a lot of research. I would wonder how a remote city like Bridgeton would even be on the radar of an abductor.

I've been curious who else may live in the home where Dulce lived. We know her year old brother and Grandmom and Grandfather.

I am more curious about who else lives in the home where mother rents a room. Are there other people that rent rooms?

 

[ProtectChildren]

But with the Millville case this makes two events this year reported to be abductions or missing persons. Have there been others?

I have not had any other unresolved child abductions or missing persons on my radar in this area.

Through the news of Dulce, I read about Mark Himebaugh, who was missing at age 11 in 1991 and has not been found or resolved. This is still much more South of the Bridgeton area.

Daniel Grinier, who was murdered by his mom this year, I have seen reported happened in Bridgeton. It was resolved in a manner of days.

There was another child murder case, that seems to involve the mom and was in Bellmawr, about 45 minutes away.

It's sad seeing these stories.

**edited out a typo

 

[ProtectChildren]

I wouldn’t hurry to help a crying 3-year old on the playground. Where I live people are very strict about stranger danger and do not want their child to accept help from a stranger even one with good intentions. The mother arrived fairly quickly.

A far as the move to get the reward money it would never occur to me that someone might try that. It seems adolescent and even feeble-minded but that’s just me.

There was a murder of a 20 year old in Camden in the news over the summer. About an hour from Bridgeton. The young man, aged 20 was murdered over a botched kidnapping ransom and request for large amounts of marijuana. It seems feeble minded, but men aged 30 and 22 years old were found involved.

 

[MimosaMornings]

http://www.city-data.com/city/Bridgeton-New-Jersey.html

Analysis: Vineland-Bridgeton job market among 10 worst in U.S.

Who are the major employers in Bridgeton?

What is the big draw for the Hispanic community to this small town?

 

[otto]

I noticed that too. If they couldn't see the kids on the swings because of the hill blocking view to begin with, then what alarmed them when they couldn't see them that they went to look?

I think the original version is more accurate - that the crying 3 year old returned to the car without his ice cream, so the mother or her sister went to the playground to help. That is when they realized that Dulce was missing, and then they asked the 3 year old where she went.

We would have a better idea if someone local went to the park, stood near the building in the parking lot, and took a photo in the direction of the swings. Based on the aerial view, it looks like trees and the basketball obscured a full view of the playground.

A photo along the lines of the orange arrow would tell us what the mother could see from her car if she looked in that direction.

 

[MimosaMornings]

And the basketball court is elevated.