NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - #16

[carbuff]

I am most inclined to think he met with some mischance -- falling down and banging his head where nobody could find him, stumbled into criminal violence, some weird combination of circumstances that couldn't be guessed -- and his body just hasn't been found. Part of me still thinks suicide; there's just something about the way he's behaving that last week that sounds like he's saying goodbye to everything.

 

[laytonian]

I am most inclined to think he met with some mischance -- falling down and banging his head where nobody could find him, stumbled into criminal violence, some weird combination of circumstances that couldn't be guessed -- and his body just hasn't been found. Part of me still thinks suicide; there's just something about the way he's behaving that last week that sounds like he's saying goodbye to everything.

(BBM)

I agree. That's why I can't eliminate the possibility.

The thing that sticks in my mind, is Dec 9th.

He went to his temple, he had a fairly upsetting talk with his father, he found out that the landlord had tattled on him for not paying the rent, and then starts driving to Ruby Valley sometime thereafter.

He rejects the money deposited in his behalf, to help catch up on the rent.
(We don't know if he'd been bailed out before, nor do we know how much the check grandma wrote, was for.)

The phone records are the catch here. If he went there to harm himself, why did his phone hit clustered cell towers on the opposite side of town, for the next 19 or so hours? His other tower hits are in logical areas: Pecos Tower while driving into town, and then near SCA, where the car was found.

To leave SCA and travel to the Whitney Ranch area, he needed a ride. I see only three possibilities:
-- He met someone there, who drove him away.
-- He had arranged a cab ride.
-- He was given another vehicle to drive away in, to Whitney Ranch (and maybe further).

Is travelling to the other side of town, something a suicidal person would do?

Maybe we're still caught in the "trying to make logic out of illogic" trap?

 

[dreamweaver]

Maybe we're still caught in the "trying to make logic out of illogic" trap?
Respectfully snipped from post:

That is my thinking. It is easy for any of us to go far afield trying to make sense of the known happenings of Steven K.

I still feel Steven had some kind of job, that job led to where he parked his car and that job/employer was not an upstanding person.
I think that Steven, once he found out more details of the job, could not in good conscience continue with the work.
And that decision caused his disappearance.
IMO: His disappearance equals murder.

 

[laytonian]

Maybe we're still caught in the "trying to make logic out of illogic" trap?
Respectfully snipped from post:

That is my thinking. It is easy for any of us to go far afield trying to make sense of the known happenings of Steven K.

I still feel Steven had some kind of job, that job led to where he parked his car and that job/employer was not an upstanding person.
I think that Steven, once he found out more details of the job, could not in good conscience continue with the work.
And that decision caused his disappearance.
IMO: His disappearance equals murder.

You're saying he had the job first, and THEN parked where he did -- right?
If this is a crime, that's my thought, too.

(We kicked around why there weren't other people going there "for jobs" - and there's been no mention of anyone else parking in that spot, either.)

This not-upstanding person had to be a one-off, then?
How many "white bread" blond-haired ex-Missionaries are recruited into crime and then disposed of?

I can't think of any.

 

[carbuff]

Trying to make logic out of illogic is what makes me lean toward mischance -- something strange and random that can't have been foreseen. Unlikely coincidence. This is a far-fetched example, but something like he's trying to make a phone call, he slips and falls into a ditch, his phone falls into the back of somebody's truck and gets carried around town until the battery goes dead.

The phone records do make me think that if Steven killed himself, it wasn't until the morning after he parked the car.

 

[laytonian]

Trying to make logic out of illogic is what makes me lean toward mischance -- something strange and random that can't have been foreseen. Unlikely coincidence. This is a far-fetched example, but something like he's trying to make a phone call, he slips and falls into a ditch, his phone falls into the back of somebody's truck and gets carried around town until the battery goes dead.

The phone records do make me think that if Steven killed himself, it wasn't until the morning after he parked the car.

Unless someone found it, and played with it until it died. Odd that nothing went only, only came in. To me, it's like he was hoping THAT CERTAIN SOMEONE would call.

The phone's movement, and its staying in a (pretty much) fixed location afterwards while still active, makes the suicide theory unlikely.

But yes, misadventure is always an option.

Here's another "misadventure" example:
You're hired to drive a car full of drugs out of state, and you wreck the car on some mountain road - and the wreck is yet to be discovered. Obviously, the car/drug owner isn't going to report that.

That would be similar to our Christopher Coan case (although he wasn't a drug dealer). He disappeared from Southern Utah, and his wrecked car was found about a year later, crashed down a mountain road.

 

[CONCRNED CTZN]

When did they say that? I've never heard *anything* from the family, stating it might not be him.

I'm sorry if you got the impression I said the family suggested it might not be him. I meant we changed the discussion in the forum bc we didn't want to step on the toes, and discussion went to days and days of it not being him.

I have questioned it, because there's been no evidence that the video has been worked on or other sharpened to reveal more than we see. If someone has manipulated the video enough to firmly ID Steven Koecher walking down that street, I'd sure like to see it.

Do you honestly believe that this hasn't been done???? There's alot I'd like to see....like video
from the 24 hours before and after Steven went missing.

I question everything, until it's completely ruled out.
Rightly, or wrongly.

The only outgoing activity on Steven's cellphone, after noon on Dec 12th, were voicemail checks. All other calls were incoming.

That's been stated here before.

News reports said that the last calls were from the men, and then a call to voicemail on Monday. I thought it was weird we didn't hear about the other voicemail checks until months later. The calls before AND after we see him on video could be suspect? Maybe the point was to leave instructions on the voicemail bc SK knew he wouldn't be able to answer for some reason. If there are voicemail messages missing...that would be telling. When they are deleted they are deleted. I had that question answered personally from ATT. There is no "audio file" saving them...only during the same call can they sometimes be recovered if accidentally deleted.[/QUOTE]

Where do you think the investigation should go?

To the people who were calling him after he disappeared, or those who called him before?

See above.

As far as forward...i think you know my answer to that, I've remained steadfast in my beliefs from the beginning.

 

[laytonian]

I'm sorry if you got the impression I said the family suggested it might not be him. I meant we changed the discussion in the forum bc we didn't want to step on the toes, and discussion went to days and days of it not being him.

We talked about other stuff, too. These discussions have always been like octopi There was never any intentional change of direction.

There's just been roads that we've tried to go down, and we have to be very careful when we sleuth out people who've not been named as POIs/suspects in a case (TOS).

Do you honestly believe that this hasn't been done???? There's alot I'd like to see....like video from the 24 hours before and after Steven went missing.

I don't know if it's been done; if the family is so sure it's him, why would they pay to have the video enhanced?

I've LOVE to be able to go through all of those videos...including who walked up and down Savannah Springs while that car was parked there.

Frankly, I have a hard time believing there weren't other security cameras on Mr Security's house. Like I've said ad nauseum, why would someone have CAM-3 and CAM-7, and not 1, 2, 4, 5, 6....? I've even looked at pictures of that house, and I'm sure I see a security camera.

Take a look at pictures 4 and 5 that Fairy1 took (click here): the home on the left edge is where the videos came from. There's a door on the side of the house; what is that white spot facing west, directly above the door? Security light, camera, or what?

News reports said that the last calls were from the men, and then a call to voicemail on Monday. I thought it was weird we didn't hear about the other voicemail checks until months later. The calls before AND after we see him on video could be suspect? Maybe the point was to leave instructions on the voicemail bc SK knew he wouldn't be able to answer for some reason. If there are voicemail messages missing...that would be telling. When they are deleted they are deleted. I had that question answered personally from ATT. There is no "audio file" saving them...only during the same call can they sometimes be recovered if accidentally deleted.

Remember, we didn't hear officially.

According to Naegle, AT&T made it possible for the family to listen to the voicemails. Q&A page. NOW, those would obviously be the UNdeleted ones, but there's quite a few after the last voicemail check on the morning of Dec 13th.

As far as forward...i think you know my answer to that, I've remained steadfast in my beliefs from the beginning.

You don't have to see the phone records, to guess who *never* called Steven after noon on Dec 13th, although there'd been about 14 calls/texts between them, in the previous week.

That detail lead me back to my original thought: an "unapproved of" relationship that broke up, then a suicide/disappearance.

I wonder if the family has ever thought about it, talked to him about it, and gained info. Could that be the reason for the perceived "protection" of him?

 

[carbuff]

Your last suggestion would explain an awful lot about what happened.

 

[laytonian]

Your last suggestion would explain an awful lot about what happened.

...and maybe explain how this has played out. I've never suspected anything sinister about the calls that morning; just three almost-middle-aged men covering up for the absence of two of them.

If this is the case, there's absolutely NO reason for the family to reveal the details; after all, it affects another person's privacy and religious issues.

If this is the case, the important thing is the return/recovery, not the "why".

 

[JennaLee]

I don't post often in this thread, but you can be darn sure I read it!

I just have to say, what I've read here today with the business cards has really blown me away. We have several members coming together in different ways, pitching in with skills, finances and time to do whatever they can to find a man none of them have ever met.

After seeing so many sad cases here on WS, you kind of start to wonder what's wrong with the world. You can get a little down and start to lose faith in the human spirit. However after seeing so many come together in such an unselfish way, it makes you realize that the world really isn't such a bad place after all.

Thanks to all of you going out of your way to find Steven! I hope and pray that one day Steven himself will have the pleasure of being blown away by your generosity and kindness.

 

[seekingsusan]

You don't have to see the phone records, to guess who *never* called Steven after noon on Dec 13th, although there'd been about 14 calls/texts between them, in the previous week.

That detail lead me back to my original thought: an "unapproved of" relationship that broke up, then a suicide/disappearance.

I wonder if the family has ever thought about it, talked to him about it, and gained info. Could that be the reason for the perceived "protection" of him?

BBM, respectfully snipped. I got attacked by bees :bee: yesterday and I'm under the influence of Benedryl - why can't I figure out who you're talking about? Who stopped calling after December 13th? GW, SA, LL?

 

[laytonian]

BBM, respectfully snipped. I got attacked by bees :bee: yesterday and I'm under the influence of Benedryl - why can't I figure out who you're talking about? Who stopped calling after December 13th? GW, SA, LL?

The first one on your list of initials. The second didn't call again, but hadn't in the prior week. The third continued to call, as did TH.

Yikes! :bee: :bee: :bee:

 

[RubyRed]

BBM, respectfully snipped. I got attacked by bees :bee: yesterday and I'm under the influence of Benedryl - why can't I figure out who you're talking about? Who stopped calling after December 13th? GW, SA, LL?

How horrible. Take care of yourself.

 

[RubyRed]

The first one on your list of initials. The second didn't call again, but hadn't in the prior week. The third continued to call, as did TH.

I think that is extremely important. Somehow I think he is the key to what happened. Not necessarily that he did something, but I think he has more knowledge of why SK was there and what was going on in SK life. Why else would he not call after that date and time? Only someone that knows SK is not going to be around for whatever reason, would suddenly go from approximately 14 text/calls down to none. I find it strange. Maybe SK went to Vegas in search of him.

 

[Helix11]

Do we know anything about the life of the individual we're talking about? Single, married, children etc.?

 

[laytonian]

Do we know anything about the life of the individual we're talking about? Single, married, children etc.?

Singles ward member (unless married since the events took place).

 

[laytonian]

I think that is extremely important. Somehow I think he is the key to what happened. Not necessarily that he did something, but I think he has more knowledge of why SK was there and what was going on in SK life. Why else would he not call after that date and time? Only someone that knows SK is not going to be around for whatever reason, would suddenly go from approximately 14 text/calls down to none. I find it strange. Maybe SK went to Vegas in search of him.

Yeah, you'd think there'd have been some church-related calls made later in the week. UNLESS there were, after the date that the phone records stop. I think SK's family knows the answers to those questions, which is why I believe it may be deeply personal.

 

[hollyblue]

I think that is extremely important. Somehow I think he is the key to what happened. Not necessarily that he did something, but I think he has more knowledge of why SK was there and what was going on in SK life. Why else would he not call after that date and time? Only someone that knows SK is not going to be around for whatever reason, would suddenly go from approximately 14 text/calls down to none. I find it strange. Maybe SK went to Vegas in search of him.

I think GW knew much more than we have heard. I don't know how the phone conversation (as given) may have played out or into this, but wasn't it SA who ask if he would be there Wednesday night for basketball and got a negative from Steven? They knew (apparently) that SK would not be around until after the 15th anyway or may have been covering up to that point?? So there may be the reason GW didn't call/text SK.

ETA: I think the cameras were/are a crucial part of this.

 

[sbakker]

Do we know anything about the life of the individual we're talking about? Single, married, children etc.?

I have said it from the beginning, I feel this individual knows something also.

When people are supposedly "friends", work together closely in "church" positions, live in the same town, and then you do NOT go out and make a BIG effort to help find this person? I have a daughter that lives in the area(shares the church house sk was in) and said she did not see anything going on looking for sk after he went missing.

When Susan Powell went missing, and her husband never did anything to help find her. It just looks somewhat suspicious.

We do not know what was said in the phone conversation with sk and the other individual. Just heard what he TOLD PEOPLE was said.