NY - Captured, escaped convicted killers, David Sweat & Richard Matt, Dannemora #9

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These thoughts of you fellow WSleuthers: UTTERLY BRILLIANT !! I picture Sweat woozy, awakening from drugs that had him knocked out initially. That D.A. (???) Wylie is right next to him: 'Hi Dave, Can we chat? Do you feel up to it? I brought you a carton of Pepsi, your fav', and 3 packs of your fav' cigarettes'.... So Sweat closes his eyes and buys some time..................hmmmmmmmmmm.. REVENGE ON TILLIE !!! It would sure make sense that to Sweat & Matt, EVERYTHING is Tillie's fault.
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I kinda wonder why Tillie backed out at the very last moment like she did --------- I bet she thought if she had her 2 BF's murder Mr. Tillie, life on the road with her two lovers, and their ultimate life, all happily settling down in Tijuana, well, I bet her thoughts were of greediness: 'Maybe we won't get to live in a very nice place. Maybe my 2 Lovers will have trouble making big money'. Yup, I bet in Tillie's soul, her backing out was all about her fretting that her 'new life' might not have enough money for her likings....
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And I JUST LOVE the comment (above) about how Sweat would deny to the po po that he'd had s@x with Tillie - LOL hahahah:happydance:
 
In my opinion I think Tillie was getting off on the attention and the power, she knew once out - the power was in their hands. She probably would have loved to keep the "escape" plan going on forever. Once it got real, she freaked. She most likely went to work on Friday and they told her about the "dry run" the night before and it was on for that night. She knew that the gig was up! Cue the panic attack. And now she's in deep doo, thrown to the curb and her only hope is Lyle.
 
CNN:

Tillie became an important person in the prison?? She was getting off on it?


Give me a break, female guest on AC360!!

Worst offenders pushing this salacious crap: often other females MOO
 
Did Tillie have sex with Matt? Yea, I would say she did.

Did Tillie bury hacksaw blades etc in frozen burger meat to help Matt escape? Yea, I would say she did.

Did Tillie have sex with Sweat? I don't think so: she and Matt (via Sweat) played the Admins who, frankly, were not that interested anyway in what was going on between employees & inmates, or they would have swiftly transferred LE-murdering Sweat out of the facility etc

Did Tillie concoct the "plan" to murder Lyle? I don't believe so: When she realized this wasn't some crappy erotic romance novel & she had to actually show up with a vehicle, she freaked out. One thing to have sex with the well-endowed con in the tailor shop; quite another to set up shack in Tijuana with Matt and his BFF in a menage a trois cooking and cleaning and sexing with the boys during the last half of her life LOL Fun Times!

Then, Matt pretty much set her straight: You bring the car OR we will off Lyle on our way out of town, or better yet, I'll set it up so someone inside offs your hubby while he's on the job

And Lyle...for all I know, Tillie used to read that erotic romance crap to him in their early years. She' not certifiable, but as another poster suggested, she's def "nuts"

She'll do her time. I have no doubt. But will the naive, underpaid, duped, baked goods & art loving 28 years on the job experienced veteran CO do his time as well?
 
johunt said:
Did he turn and try to run or did they come up behind him and tell him to put the gun down and hands up and he didn't comply? I don't know I haven't read much except he didn't comply.
Click to expand...

Who cares. He was a convicted killer. He had a gun. If they shot him dead...good.


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I just thought of a new angle on Tillie. See, here in Minnesota, a case was just released today. Lady lawyer wants to jet off to Paris for a week or so. Little problem is that she's supposed to be defending her client in his criminal trial, witnesses, exhibits, the whole bit. Also, judge has already called this lady lawyer on other 'stunts' and tricks she's been pulling on him in the case. And, oh, by the way, just a couple years prior, she'd been publicly disciplined and suspended for other unseemly conduct, so for sure the judge would have a little red flag up in his mind about this lady lawyer. So, what she does: She buys her round trip tickets for Paris, to leave just after the day that the criminal trial was to end. To 'stick it' to the judge, she goes to an emergency room right when the trial is to begin, then faxes over some hospital documentation that she actually went in to the emergency room, but she 'redacts' (that means, blacks-out) all the parts that would tell the judge WHAT she told the E.R. doc' her symptoms were. Judge is again very ticked off -- boiling (he does NOT know about Paris). Judge reschedules trial for the next week. Lady lawyer jets off for her 2 weeks in Gay Paris', probably did some power shopping while she was there. Lady lawyer faxes judge a letter saying 'No can do about the trial, judge - I MAY have a follow up appt. as to my emergency room visit!' Can ya' believe it !?! I don't recall every detail, but it may have been that lady lawyers fax gave away that lady lawyer was actually in Paris, not laying in some sickbed.

So, what I'm thinking now is that Tillie entirely faked her E.R. visit, and her purpose was for her to have a solid alibi (cuz' Mr. Tillie was with her at all times) that she had NO part in the prison break. Makes sense to me. Here is a link to that case that just came out today ---- I will point out to you that the lawyer this lady lawyer hired to represent her himself had recently been publicly disciplined & lost his license for a while TWICE for conduct similar to lady lawyer's - that's prob' why lady lawyer chose that guy to handle her case LOL - - Lady lawyer had the nerve to APPEAL, so the court really slams her: http://www.mncourts.gov/mncourtsgov... Court/Standard Opinions/OPA140995-070115.pdf
 
Only4Justice said:
Who cares. He was a convicted killer. He had a gun. If they shot him dead...good.


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Click to expand...

I tend to agree. Just because the prison wasn't "up to par" so to speak and they found a way out, doesn't make what they did excusable because of the prison. So if I go and steal a car that someone left unlocked/running, it's not my fault/not as much of a crime because the person left it unlocked/with the keys in it? I know that is not the point some of you are trying to get across but they were in prison and murderers, they knew/know it was wrong no matter what.:notgood::silenced:

Another thought....MAYBE Sweat shot Matt himself from the tree he was hiding in and continued running. LE come across the body and want to say they did it, so they make a scene of coming across him and shooting him. And who took that picture of Matt and why is it okay to send around? Good grief. You think it would be part of evidence/part of the investigation and they would be accountable for that in some way. It would seem obvious it was someone that was at the scene immediately. :waitasec:
 
Only4Justice said:
Who cares. He was a convicted killer. He had a gun. If they shot him dead...good.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I was commenting on someone's else comment that he was shot in the back of the head while running away. Because we don't know. That's all.

I think a few folks on this thread care and would like to know why he was shot in the back of the head. Doesn't mean we disagree/agree - just care to know the facts, which may never fully come out.
 
I believe the Federal Tort Claims Act ("FTCA") allows certain kinds of lawsuits against federal employees who are acting within the scope of their employment. I could be reading this wrong....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Tort_Claims_Act

Having said that I just want to reiterate that I don't really have a dog in this fight. They were stopped from killing anyone else and that's that. Whether there is negligence somewhere down the line (for sure within the prison itself it seems or there wouldn't be 2 CO's being charged) I'm sure will be decided by a judge and jury IF anyone tries to bring a lawsuit.
 
Instead of killing Tillie, I wonder if the two convicts would have kept her alive to use her as a bargaining chip if they were caught while still in the states.
 
johunt said:
I was commenting on someone's else comment that he was shot in the back of the head while running away. Because we don't know. That's all.

I think a few folks on this thread care and would like to know why he was shot in the back of the head. Doesn't mean we disagree/agree - just care to know the facts, which may never fully come out.
Click to expand...

Cops are para-military. They are taught to shoot to kill.

Haven't you noticed how many cops SHOOT and the person is KILLED?
Just look at all the cop killings over time.
Cops are not taught to FEEL, they are taught to shoot to kill and that's that!

A lawyer told me that! Wow - I never thought about it before, but it makes sense.

Someone posted a few posts back that Sweat has denied having sex with Tillie?
Really?
that's hysterical - he's denying it. bwahhhhhhhhh ha ha ha
that is very funny. Didn't about a dozen people report that they had sex at least
about a hundred times?
 
epiphany said:
Did Tillie have sex with Matt? Yea, I would say she did.

Did Tillie bury hacksaw blades etc in frozen burger meat to help Matt escape? Yea, I would say she did.

Did Tillie have sex with Sweat? I don't think so: she and Matt (via Sweat) played the Admins who, frankly, were not that interested anyway in what was going on between employees & inmates, or they would have swiftly transferred LE-murdering Sweat out of the facility etc

Did Tillie concoct the "plan" to murder Lyle? I don't believe so: When she realized this wasn't some crappy erotic romance novel & she had to actually show up with a vehicle, she freaked out. One thing to have sex with the well-endowed con in the tailor shop; quite another to set up shack in Tijuana with Matt and his BFF in a menage a trois cooking and cleaning and sexing with the boys during the last half of her life LOL Fun Times!

Then, Matt pretty much set her straight: You bring the car OR we will off Lyle on our way out of town, or better yet, I'll set it up so someone inside offs your hubby while he's on the job

And Lyle...for all I know, Tillie used to read that erotic romance crap to him in their early years. She' not certifiable, but as another poster suggested, she's def "nuts"

She'll do her time. I have no doubt. But will the naive, underpaid, duped, baked goods & art loving 28 years on the job experienced veteran CO do his time as well?
Click to expand...



Have to say I have zero sympathy for Ms. Tillie, and I hope she ends up serving every minute of the maximum sentence permissible for her crimes. Crappy romantic novels don't have plots that include being attracted to men that have run over and dismembered a real person, or having sex with a convicted cop-killer, or helping such killers escape from prison.

Only her clueless husband and her own self-serving self have said she had a "panic attack" that night. Who really knows why she didn't go through with it. Maybe she wanted to but Lyle persisted in taking her to a hospital and she couldn't refuse without explaining too much.

That said, yes, it's offensive that NY officals and the media persist in trying to make Tillie the lone villian. Palmer doesn't deserve any kind of pass, and if he didn't know as much as Tillie did about the escape plans it was because he didn't want to, which is no excuse. The determination to lay the whole thing at Tillie's feet is as cynical as it is transparently false. But, yep, my guess is Palmer ends up paying far less a price than does Tillie, if any at all.
 
human said:
Can't forget this:

DISMEMBERED HIS BOSS WITH HIS BARE HANDS, THE OTHER PUMPED 22 BULLETS INTO A SHERIFF'S DEPUTY THEN RAN HIM OVER: THE GRISLY STORIES BEHIND RICHARD MATT AND DAVID SWEAT
Click to expand...

Right. They were both bad apples. No doubt. But as far as I know, Matt was spared the death penalty.

And I do not believe they were out to kill anyone. The reason no one was hurt physically was NOT because LE did such a great job. No one was hurt physically BECAUSE M&S DID NOT CHOOSE TO KILL ANYONE. I would feel much better if both were back in prison for rest of their lives. That's punishment enough. Killing Matt just serves the blood lust that so many fine people have.
 
st. crispian said:
Right. They were both bad apples. No doubt. But as far as I know, Matt was spared the death penalty.

And I do not believe they were out to kill anyone. The reason no one was hurt physically was NOT because LE did such a great job. No one was hurt physically BECAUSE M&S DID NOT CHOOSE TO KILL ANYONE. I would feel much better if both were back in prison for rest of their lives. That's punishment enough. Killing Matt just serves the blood lust that so many fine people have.
Click to expand...

Allegedly Matt tried to kill the man driving the camper that had the bullet hole in it.

If S&M killed anyone - they'd have been busted immediately. Then they would have been caught
and sent right back to prison. Breathing in the night air, even with mosquitoes, black flies, ticks
and red ants crawling all over you was a million times better than being in prison.

They weren't going to do anything to blow that freedom

But - if they did make it out of that dragnet and escaped....it was only a matter of time
until each one of them killed again - especially that Matt convict. You can put all your
IRA money on that one.
 
epiphany said:
Better than focusing on the male COs and the Admins. And why not? It's fun to focus on Tillie. She's 51 (O My, she's menopausal)! She's married! She cheated on her first husband when she had sex on the railroad tracks! EWWW! Look at her:

“The way I can describe it is in high school, when one of the good-looking jocks looks at the ugly girl or asks her to the prom — that look on her face. She was ecstatic,” Jensen said.

http://nypost.com/2015/06/24/shawskank-had-closet-sex-with-killer-4-times-a-week-ex-inmate/


I'm waiting for the conspiracy to murder (Lyle) charges from the non-stop talkative (while an investigation was and is ongoing) DA:

It's Bull & trumped up salacious nonsense spouted by DA to distract from the DOC's shortcomings, Cough (No pun intended) IMO

Amazing he was able to get away with it during ongoing investigation
Click to expand...



Tillie is a criminal AND Palmer is a criminal AND inmates were running at least the "Honor" Block at Clinton, AND there was a culture of corruption at Clinton, AND Co's plural were negligent, at the very least AND Clinton's management, from the Super all the way down were negligent at the very least. All of that is true, including Tillie being guilty as all get out.

The ntl media pack as a whole is brainless, clueless, and lazy as all get out. They loved the chase as reality show because it made for "good" TV, and they love Tillie for the same reason folks here for weeks mocked the crap out of her and her escapades, even while the chase was still going on. Tillie is an easy target.

The FBI at least seems serious about getting Clinton back under control, thank goodness for that.
 
To Kill a Mockingbird said:

Allegedly Matt tried to kill the man driving the camper that had the bullet hole in it.

If S&M killed anyone - they'd have been busted immediately. Then they would have been caught
and sent right back to prison. Breathing in the night air, even with mosquitoes, black flies, ticks
and red ants crawling all over you was a million times better than being in prison.

They weren't going to do anything to blow that freedom

But - if they did make it out of that dragnet and escaped....it was only a matter of time
until each one of them killed again - especially that Matt convict. You can put all your
IRA money on that one.
Click to expand...

Absolutely true. They did not want to call attention to themselves
 
Hope4More said:
Tillie is a criminal AND Palmer is a criminal AND inmates were running at least the "Honor" Block at Clinton, AND there was a culture of corruption at Clinton, AND Co's plural were negligent, at the very least AND Clinton's management, from the Super all the way down were negligent at the very least. All of that is true, including Tillie being guilty as all get out.

The ntl media pack as a whole is brainless, clueless, and lazy as all get out. They loved the chase as reality show because it made for "good" TV, and they love Tillie for the same reason folks here for weeks mocked the crap out of her and her escapades, even while the chase was still going on. Tillie is an easy target.

The FBI at least seems serious about getting Clinton back under control, thank goodness for that.
Click to expand...

Well said! A voice of reason.....
 
johunt said:
I was commenting on someone's else comment that he was shot in the back of the head while running away. Because we don't know. That's all.

I think a few folks on this thread care and would like to know why he was shot in the back of the head. Doesn't mean we disagree/agree - just care to know the facts, which may never fully come out.
Click to expand...

Thanks to MinnesotaMary for this from thread #8 post #157

The Border Patrol agent who shot and killed a fugitive convicted of murder in upstate New York is stationed in El Paso and is a member of an elite squad headquartered at Fort Bliss, officials said Saturday.

http://www.elpasotimes.com/news/ci_28395986/border-patrol-agent-who-shot-and-killed-new


It is my opinion that it didn't matter what matt was doing this fellow was brought in to shot to kill, (jmo) not for a leg shot. jmo idk
 
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