NY-LI 10 bodies found on Beach-Poss. SrlKlr-12/10-4 id'd; more found 3/11 #12

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If the doctor said he knew her was it because during that drive she was given a drug by him.
Then after he tries to cover his butt with a phone call knowing something went wrong with the drug he gave her and/or the situation in the home that made her freak.
He then got the number from Pak to call the family as a cover up?
 
Whoever is running the FindingShannanGilbert website updated their interactive search map by shading in the area immediately behind CPH's house and labeling it as the exact section of the swamp where they found her purse, cell phone, jeans and shoes.

Here is the link to the map;

http://www.findshannangilbert.com/maps/

If you zoom all the way in to the swamp and click on the shaded area, it looks like this;

interactivesearchmap.png

The light greenish-blue bullet is CPH's house. The pink/purple bullet is the place where she was last seen (based upon the last 911 caller who we do not know their name or address).

My question is, how do they know that this is actually the area where her belongings were found?

If it turns out that SG's remains are not within the swamp, does this suggest that someone tossed her belongings there in an attempt to frame CPH?
 
Also from that website is the below entry. I know we posted it before but it's worth posting again. When reading the last line, please keep in mind this was written almost a year ago.

Shannan’s Phone Records

DATE TIME PHONE # DESTINATION MINUTES USED OWNER

05/01/10 4:51 AM 911-000-0000 Emergency, 23

05/01/10 4:09 AM NEW YORK,NY 1 Michael Pak

05/01/10 3:15 AM NEW YORK,NY 2 Michael Pak

05/01/10 3:13 AM Incoming, 1 Michael Pak

05/01/10 3:04 AM NEW YORK,NY 6 Michael Pak

05/01/10 3:00 AM Incoming, 3 Michael Pak

05/01/10 2:57 AM NEW YORK,NY 3 Michael Pak

05/01/10 2:55 AM BABYLON,NY 1 Oak Beach CVS

(460 MONTAUK HIGHWAY WEST ISLIP, NY11795)

05/01/10 12:25 AM NEW YORK,NY 1 Michael Pak

05/01/10 12:23 AM NEW YORK,NY 2 Michael Pak

05/01/10 12:20 AM NEW YORK,NY 3 Michael Pak

04/30/10 10:02 PM NEW YORK,NY 2 Michael Pak

Key unanswered questions:

Shannan’s earring was found in front of J. Brewer’s house by her sisters (PD missed this)
Detectives recovered Shannan’s jacket in the brush where she had run early in their initial search, but now tell the family “it’s lost.” They also say they don’t have her purse, ID, cell phone.
http://www.findshannangilbert.com/inside-the-investigation-part-1/

In what brush did they find her jacket?

Why have we never heard about a single interview with the police officer who was the first one on the scene that morning?

Would not he hold the key to this entire investigation (from what he says he found, what JB said, whether he questioned to see the videotape, etc...)???????
 
One thing is obvious even if SCPD does not want to admit it;

If this week's searches are indeed the result of a tip by someone who cut a deal after an arrest, the authorities probably would not tell us (to protect the safety of the rat). Instead, they would tell us something like this week's searches were a result of more areas identified by the FBI helicopter photos as being "points of interest".

Anyone still buy that reason for the new searches?

What bothers me about the theory about the "Mob Tip" due to the bust, is the taunting phone calls to MB's sister. Why would a mafia hit man call a prostitutes sister on multiple occasions to taunt her? That is asking for trouble, and hit men don't like unnecessary trouble. Especially trouble that is self inflicted. What screams SERIAL KILLER in this case is the area the 10 bodies were found, MO and the taunting phone calls. And none of these three aspects seem to be in place with SG. Are there similarities? Sure. If CPH or JB were the SK, then that would be a slip up far worse than Denis Radar (BTK) asking the police if they can trace a floppy disk back to him. Busted. If that were the case then an arrest is soon. If not and SG's official COD is drowning, then we could be in for a long ride. Just my thoughts.
 
I read an article (scanned it briefly) where they said they thought they had found her lipgloss? Is this true?
 
Couldn't the calls be explained by MP and AD asking CH to call Shannon's mom?

Look at it this way, you have an Escort Driver and a Boyfriend who broke her jaw that are Shannon's contacts in NYC. I could see Shannon's mom not exactly trusting them due to their history. I could also see AD and MP feeling like they aren't exactly reputable because of this and thinking it might get the heat from SG's mom off of their backs if they have someone more reputable call. Even if it doesn't make complete sense, I don't think MP or AD are the sharpest tools in the shed (not that I think they're dumb) I just think they would be content doing a half-assed job.

Then you have the first call MG supposedly heard from a Doctor that took Shannon in. Does anyone know when she first made this statement? Did it happen before the other victims were found?

If it was my daughter and I felt like she was being ignored due to her profession I might stretch the truth and try to link her vanishing to the serial killings. I think this could also explain why she doesn't think she drowned. It could be a gut feeling. I could also see a parent thinking their kid drowned in this case due to confirmation bias and preferring that outcome to being murdered.

If that call was made from some "Unknown Doctor" could it have been Pak? Maybe he felt guilty about leaving her in Oak Beach and didn't know what to do?


Like someone said earlier, there is a lot of similarities to the 4 SK victims, but there is also a lot of differences.

I also remember reading that she carries multiple phones. Something to keep in mind. Also, whats up with CPH saying he saw her running? that part still doesn't fit for me.

I posted a link a couple times to an extensive radio interview from early last year with Sherre, Shannan's sister, in which she talked about the doctor and his calls. She said that she was there WITH her mother when he called, and I found her entirely credible. She may not have had her ear to the phone, but her being there during the phone call surely corroborates the content, since one would imagine her mother immediately relayed what was said after hanging up (and she would also have heard her mother's end of the conversation.)

She said she thought the call came the day after they filed the missing person's report. She and her sister subsequently went to Oak Beach and talked to the doctor, and that was when he denied saying what they claimed he said. (So what, they just invented that?!) Of course as we all know, he later admitted in writing to making two phone calls (after the tv. special.) so he definitely called - the issue is why and what was said.

It's interesting what you wrote about Alex and MP possibly passing the buck. I agree - to me that's the ONLY explanation I can see for the doctor calling Mari (benign explanation that is - one which fits in with his claims) - that they met and were talking to CPH and were nervous about calling Mari themselves and got him to make a call on their behalf (or perhaps he offered and they took him up on it) - doctors have a certain status & command a certain respect or can be looked at as authority figures, so that might have encouraged them.) If he was the "do-gooder" sort, MAYBE he would agree, or in fact make the offer himself. That, to me, is the only possible scenario that might explain the doctor's claim that he called at the request of Alex and MP, and which might make placing the phone call weird, but plausible & in fact benign.

I don't believe that for a second, of course, it's just an attempt to try to figure out a situation under which something that seems so weird could in fact be plausible, and that's the best I can do! Since CPH has never explained why the hell they would ask him to do that and why the hell he would agree (or what they specifically asked him to say) and in fact seems to have pointedly avoided explaining any of that (e.g.in those letters he wrote) it is, to me, very suspicious. And I don't think we've ever heard anything on the subject from Alex & MP's end either. I wish a reporter would ask Alex & MP if it was true that they asked him to call Mari - that would tell us alot!
 
I recall that the remains were sent to the NYC medical examiner's office. Do you think they are sophisticated enough to tell from skeletal remains the difference between being enclosed within burlap exposed to rain and deep snow vs. being submerged in brackish water?

i would think they'd have equipment and knowledge to be able to tell just that. not all the bodies were skeletal remains from what i recall, just badly decomposed. and if they were wrapped in the burlap sacks, i'm sure the sacks would contain evidence such as dirt, mud, plant, soil, to suggest that the bodies had been placed in marsh land prior to being found in ocean parkway. also, if cph is the serial killer and had placed the bodies in the marsh before moving them to ocean parkway, how was he not detected before? and why would he have been dumb enough to place the bodies directly behind his house when there were also other houses that overlooked the area? if he was doing this for 10 years, he would have likely attracted suspicion. plus, if cph is the serial killer, his prosthetic leg would have made it nearly impossible for him to move deftly and efficiently in the marsh that he was able to avoid detection for such a long time.
 
found this interesting in relation to ""SAL""

http://www.findshannangilbert.com/here-and-there-the-killer-on-the-internet/

O’Toole also gave a warning to the members of the media who report on the killer. She said it is not uncommon for a killer to contact a reporter who writes articles about the murders. “We have had cases when the killer contacts the journalists,” she said.


Kinda goes to towards to previous charges he faced...
Maybe he learned /evolved media wasnt the right choice,
Couldnt resist and called the family/sister instead?
 
What bothers me about the theory about the "Mob Tip" due to the bust, is the taunting phone calls to MB's sister. Why would a mafia hit man call a prostitutes sister on multiple occasions to taunt her? That is asking for trouble, and hit men don't like unnecessary trouble. Especially trouble that is self inflicted. What screams SERIAL KILLER in this case is the area the 10 bodies were found, MO and the taunting phone calls. And none of these three aspects seem to be in place with SG. Are there similarities? Sure. If CPH or JB were the SK, then that would be a slip up far worse than Denis Radar (BTK) asking the police if they can trace a floppy disk back to him. Busted. If that were the case then an arrest is soon. If not and SG's official COD is drowning, then we could be in for a long ride. Just my thoughts.

I honestly don't think that an actual hit man is involved because I agree with you that a hit man would want less publicity. If a professional hit man was responsible then the victims would most likely had been gunned down walking out of a hotel or somewhere.

On the other hand, if there are a handful of people who are part of a crime organization who have the responsibility of disposing the bodies of girls who are killed by VIP clients or who are killed as a result of turf wars or simply overdosed on drugs then one would imagine that the people whose job it is to dispose of dead bodies certainly are a little crazy in the head to agree to perform that role in the organization. It's not a far stretch to imagine one of them being so crazy as to play that game with tormenting the family with phone calls.

Now that I think about it, I just got a strong feeling that whoever made those tormenting calls to the little sister is not a complete stranger to that family.
 
I posted a link a couple times to an extensive radio interview from early last year with Sherre, Shannan's sister, in which she talked about the doctor and his calls. She said that she was there WITH her mother when he called, and I found her entirely credible. She may not have had her ear to the phone, but her being there during the phone call surely corroborates the content, since one would imagine her mother immediately relayed what was said after hanging up (and she would also have heard her mother's end of the conversation.)

She said she thought the call came the day after they filed the missing person's report. She and her sister subsequently went to Oak Beach and talked to the doctor, and that was when he denied saying what they claimed he said. (So what, they just invented that?!) Of course as we all know, he later admitted in writing to making two phone calls (after the tv. special.) so he definitely called - the issue is why and what was said.

It's interesting what you wrote about Alex and MP possibly passing the buck. I agree - to me that's the ONLY explanation I can see for the doctor calling Mari - that they met and were talking to CPH and were nervous about calling Mari and got him to make a call on their behalf (or perhaps he offered and they took him up on it) - doctors have a certain status & can command a certain respect or can be looked at as authority figures after all. If he was the "do-gooder" sort, MAYBE he would agree, or make the offer. That, to me, is the only possible scenario that might explain the doctor's claim that he called at the request of Alex and MP, and which might make making the phone call weird, but plausible & in fact benign.

I don't believe it, of course, it's just an attempt to try to figure out a situation under which something that seems so weird could in fact be plausible, and that's the best I can do! Since CPH has never explained why the hell they would ask him to do that and why the hell he would agree (or in fact what they specifically asked him to say) and if fact seems to have pointedly avoided providing that info. (e.g.in those letters he wrote) it's not easy! And I don't think we've ever heard anything on the subject from Alex & MP's end either. I wish a reporter would ask Alex & MP if it was true that they asked him to call Mari - that would tell us alot!

I have a theory on the CPH to SG's mom call. This has happen to all of us at some point, either we were the one "calling" or the one "answering". I will use an exapmle. A worker here at the job called me about a problem at work. I asked him, "is this the problem with the "blue light" that is out?" He said, "I don't know?". So after we discussed the issue for a while we hung up. 5 minutes later I get an e-mail from my boss asking why this guy is going on about the "blue Light" being out regarding his issue. His problem was not the "blue light", it was something else. But just because I mentioned "blue light" in our conversation, he ASSUMED it was the blue light. He swore up and down that is what I told him and stands by it to this day, if he were asked about it. I have accidentally injected things into a situation and thought I was dead right until I was proved wrong. It is human nature.
 
Now that I think about it, I just got a strong feeling that whoever made those tormenting calls to the little sister is not a complete stranger to that family.

That is interesting how he knew so much info about the sister. I was always under the assumption that he held her for a while, talked to her at some length before he killed her. Your thought makes good sense. But wouldn't the sister recognize the voice?
 
I honestly don't think that an actual hit man is involved because I agree with you that a hit man would want less publicity. If a professional hit man was responsible then the victims would most likely had been gunned down walking out of a hotel or somewhere.

On the other hand, if there are a handful of people who are part of a crime organization who have the responsibility of disposing the bodies of girls who are killed by VIP clients or who are killed as a result of turf wars or simply overdosed on drugs then one would imagine that the people whose job it is to dispose of dead bodies certainly are a little crazy in the head to agree to perform that role in the organization. It's not a far stretch to imagine one of them being so crazy as to play that game with tormenting the family with phone calls.

Now that I think about it, I just got a strong feeling that whoever made those tormenting calls to the little sister is not a complete stranger to that family.

but a crazy hit man would be a liability for a gang or mob, especially since there is always a risk that they can be tracked down. and if the profilers are to be believed, the person who killed all these women and the asian man and toddler was acting on his own. besides, if it was a hitman, wouldn't he have warned her family not to call the cops or else they'd be in trouble? in the mexican drug cartels, they usually kill the victims and contact their families to threaten them to shut up or they would be next. there's always a motive to their crazy killings, like sending out a warning or making an example of what can happen if anyone dares to go against them. in this case, i don't see anything that could be perceived as something similar to that.
 
Can someone look into whether or not Neptune uses burlap to package their feed? Maybe give them a call? Do they use it to package hay, straw or shavings?

Okay here's the deal...

They sell horse grain and grain for other animals in horse grain sacks (also known as "feed bags" or "feed sacks"). Some of the bags are paper (like the Purina Horse Chow) but some of them are indeed burlap. I just could not confirm whether it is actual burlap or if it is that new plastic burlap material that is on the market (then again, we don't have much info from the police about what kind of burlap was used to wrap the GB4). Also since that company has been around for decades, it is more than likely that they could be waist-deep in giant empty burlap bags like this one;
burlap%20bag.jpg
 
I have a theory on the CPH to SG's mom call. This has happen to all of us at some point, either we were the one "calling" or the one "answering". I will use an exapmle. A worker here at the job called me about a problem at work. I asked him, "is this the problem with the "blue light" that is out?" He said, "I don't know?". So after we discussed the issue for a while we hung up. 5 minutes later I get an e-mail from my boss asking why this guy is going on about the "blue Light" being out regarding his issue. His problem was not the "blue light", it was something else. But just because I mentioned "blue light" in our conversation, he ASSUMED it was the blue light. He swore up and down that is what I told him and stands by it to this day, if he were asked about it. I have accidentally injected things into a situation and thought I was dead right until I was proved wrong. It is human nature.

Extremely valid point. My impression of CPH is that he reminds me of this extremely annoying person in my neighborhood who always has to inject himself uninvited into every event that takes place within the neighborhood. I think every neighborhood has at least one of these weird people who thinks of themselves as the unofficial mayor/guardian/referee in the community.

-When someone's house was robbed... my neighbor went out of his way to show up and speak to the police.

-When someone starts-up a chainsaw in the neighborhood... my neighbor is there uninvited supervising to make sure nobody gets hurt and that no trees are cut down without the proper permits.

-Whenever there is a car accident, my neighbor is there setting up road flares and directing traffic around the detour.

-The moment someone's dog gets loose, my neighbor goes out of his way to catch it and turn it in to the dog pound.

-When someone's kid gets suspended from school, my neighbor goes out of his way to call that family (even when he never met them before) to ask if they want his help speaking with the school principal to "fix" their problem.

-If someone from outside of the neighborhood drives slowly or is walking around, he goes out and confronts them.

-If anyone steps foot on my property or on the other properties on my street that he does not recognize, he's dialing 911 before that person could get to the front door.

My neighbor has been like this ever since he retired and has too much time on his hands.

CPH reminds me of this type of person. If he is Oak Beach's annoying self-proclaimed "protector" then it would not be out of character for him (given the opportunity if he was handed MG's phone number as he describes in his letters to 48 Hours) to call up MG as an unofficial representative of Oak Beach. Then at the next association meeting he had bragging rights to announce to all of his neighbors that he "fixed" their problem with the "outsiders" and their missing child.

Now that I put this thought in my head, I wonder if someone can get their hands on the minutes of the May 2010 Oak Beach Civic Association meeting?


As far as what he said in that first phone call to MG, it is very possible that CPH is not a suspect in this case because he came forward to the police and admitted to them that he lied to MG about the drug rehab home simply to make her leave their neighborhood alone (not knowing that he was digging a grave for himself that he did not deserve because he had no clue that she was in any real danger or that she would go missing as she did). If that is the case, then that would explain all of his strange mannerism and guilty & unusual behavior that followed the months after the original GB4 bodies were found. He really put his foot in his mouth this time by sticking his nose into the wrong mess if that is the case.

This makes the most sense to me since even those who live in the neighborhood cannot link CPH with JB (according to everyone there, not many people who live there ever met JB). We can speculate all we want about JB buying drugs from CPH or CPH treating SG for an overdose. However, the simple fact remains that nobody has any proof that CPH and JB ever met each other ever. As a matter of fact, there isn't a single person who lives at that end of the community who will come forward and say that they ever heard of the name JB prior to this investigation.
 
but a crazy hit man would be a liability for a gang or mob, especially since there is always a risk that they can be tracked down. and if the profilers are to be believed, the person who killed all these women and the asian man and toddler was acting on his own. besides, if it was a hitman, wouldn't he have warned her family not to call the cops or else they'd be in trouble? in the mexican drug cartels, they usually kill the victims and contact their families to threaten them to shut up or they would be next. there's always a motive to their crazy killings, like sending out a warning or making an example of what can happen if anyone dares to go against them. in this case, i don't see anything that could be perceived as something similar to that.

Once again, there are no hit men in my theories. Imagine for a second a VIP client or a member of the crime organization who enjoys exotic asphyxiation (choking while having sex). And every so often he loses control and does not release his grip on the ligature in time to avoid death. In this scenario, the people dumping the bodies are not hit men. They aren't even the murderer. Yet they still must possess some level of mental sickness to agree to be a part of the disposing of the bodies. Some are so sick that it could be like a ritual or even a form of art to them when they place the bodies in their resting places. In the scheme of things, it would not have taken much for that person to make it look like some of the bodies were the work of a serial killer to throw the authorities off track. The powers above who order the victims be disposed are on a don't ask/don't tell basis when it comes to the where/when/how their subordinates made the bodies disappear. All they know is that their orders were carried out and their VIP client or family member is out of yet another jam.

On television and in the movies we are sold this idealism that the mob whacks people and then pulls a Jimmy Hoffa disappearing act on their remains so that there is no proof that a murder ever existed (or that the mob does an all-out public massacre to send a message to the rest of the underworld). That may have been the case back in the 1900's. Nowadays, organized crime has evolved. The only thing set about what they do is that there are no set ways anymore. The Meadowlands in New Jersey, Pelham Park in the Bronx, and now the pine barrens in Manorville along with the scrub brush of Gilgo Beach... these remote places very well may have replaced the cement shoes and holes in the desert that Hollywood has glorified in the minds of viewers.
 
I have a theory on the CPH to SG's mom call. This has happen to all of us at some point, either we were the one "calling" or the one "answering". I will use an exapmle. A worker here at the job called me about a problem at work. I asked him, "is this the problem with the "blue light" that is out?" He said, "I don't know?". So after we discussed the issue for a while we hung up. 5 minutes later I get an e-mail from my boss asking why this guy is going on about the "blue Light" being out regarding his issue. His problem was not the "blue light", it was something else. But just because I mentioned "blue light" in our conversation, he ASSUMED it was the blue light. He swore up and down that is what I told him and stands by it to this day, if he were asked about it. I have accidentally injected things into a situation and thought I was dead right until I was proved wrong. It is human nature.

I know what you're saying - the old telephone game - but I don't think your example is parallel to this in kind. The things that she said he said were pretty specific. I don't think they were things that could be misconstrued (and in fact, if that were the case, you'd think he subsequently would have explained that, and he didn't. He out and out denied he said anything of the sort when he spoke to Sherre - which would mean her mother would have had to literally invent what he said - and he's never provided any details or explanation about the phones calls, period, that I know of anyway. If you read the letters he wrote to 48 Hours, he ignores the elephant in the corner: "I returned a call as requested...it was supportive and that was all." ("as requested"?! What does that mean? He's ignoring the blatant fact that it would be weird for them to request that he, a total stranger who apparently had nothing to do with the case, call the mother of a missing woman, and for him to agree to do so. He acts like it's normal and it's not!) In the second letter he writes: "During my conversations with them they asked that I call the family." Oh yeah? Why? That's weird! Again, he throws it out there so nonchalantly, as though it makes perfect sense. (Actually, he doesn't do that. It comes across more as though he's purposely avoiding it.) There's more that's weird in the letters. He acts as though he had to dig out his phone bills to remember making the calls. He admits to a second call as well but doesn't explain either one. If there truly was a reasonable explanation for why he called and what he said, he would just say so. Something smells.


http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/48_hours_gilbert.pdf
 
There was a period of time when I became fascinated with the Mafia and read every book I could find about them. Believe it or not, there was a member who everyone else considered to be totally dangerously insane and they did let them do some hits and clean up and cut up victims. I wish I could remember his name and what happened to him.. Surely he got so crazy he was killed. A lot of those guys were portrayed as being psychotic and extremely sadistic with low IQ's (when they were tested in prison). They operate on sheer brute force and violence rather than intelligence. I still lean toward CPH but I thought I would explore the idea of organized crime since there seems to be such a coincidence that there was a big mob bust and they they start looking for Shannan again. And concoct what I consider to be a ridiculous story.
 
If there truly was a reasonable explanation for why he called and what he said, he would just say so. Something smells.


http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/48_hours_gilbert.pdf

He may not have explained it to the media, but to LE I bet he had to. I bet he knows that he has been "convicted" by some in the public opinion. By the time of the interview he must have been aware that Flukeyou and others were gunning for him. If he read it himself or was told by a third party. He was doing damage control for the public opinion aspect, and very badly at that. If I were in his shoes, I would be pooping bricks just knowing if one person thought I was capable of being a serial killer. I'm not Pro CHP or anti CHP, but his actions are not that of a calculated taker of human lives, and by that I mean a Serial Killer. All he needs is one strong alibi, not just for SG, but for any of the 10 victims. Saying this does not mean he had nothing to do with SG's disappearance. But being responsible for the SK murders? LE must know he is in the clear. They would have put so much pressure on him. Hours upon hours of interrogations. Countless searches of his property. General harassment to let him know they are watching. Force him to make a mistake. Heck, the guy can't even do a good interview with local news reporters. LE would tear him a new one if he was a true suspect.
 
<modsnip> there is a MASSIVE AND ACTIVE SERIAL KILLER INVESTIGATION going on in Oak Beach and that it is now centered behind CPH's house. I want to be a volunteer soldier in this rebel force of internet detectives and work with a team so that we can accomplish more than conversation.

I believe in the power of cyber neighborhood watch, I just don't know what everyone else on here is watching. We could be sleuthing/querying/searching the internet, making phone calls etc. to find the peice of the puzzle that LE most likely doesn't have yet and needs, but instead I see alot of people conjecturing back and forth with their own speculative theories.

The DEC and Parks Department aren't letting LE bring cranes into their holy "wetlands" to dig up the earth because they think SG drowned. And the FBI wouldn't be there if they thought they were looking for anything other than the victim of a serial killer. <modsnip>We all know they aren't going to find SG in the wetlands, the only reason she would be in there is if killer put her in there which he may have initially, but if he is smart enough to evade arrest for this long, we should assume he did a really good job disconnecting himself from SG geographically. Hopefully they can find traces of her or the other victims.

As this case is becoming more clear, most are still failig to recognize what they are watching unfold.

Thanks you SeaSlug for the very helpful images of the island, they are invaluable and data like that certainly doesn't lack merit. We need more credible data like those images you brought to the table.
 
All he needs is one strong alibi, not just for SG, but for any of the 10 victims. Saying this does not mean he had nothing to do with SG's disappearance. But being responsible for the SK murders?

Question, if CPH's alibi of him sleeping next to his wife the night of May 1st was true, then why was she so distraught when she found out about him being connected to the missing girl, and why did they then proceed to have, "a tough couple of days" ?

If she was in bed with him that night, she would know he wasn't involved that night, and she never would have been distraught.
 
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