OH OH - Brian Shaffer, 27, Columbus, 1 April 2006 - #2

[PrinceofPop]

Yes, there was no employee exit. Employees of the Ugly Tuna have confirmed supplies were brought up the escalator.

 

[PrinceofPop]

They're are not, that's why this is a mystery.

 

[PrinceofPop]

Maybe if the drug angle holds any weight but there is no evidence of it at all. Police have said they do not. A college guy talking to a couple of girls at a bar is pretty common

 

[PrinceofPop]

I tend to think so as well. There are reports of them possibly using the freight elevator for their equipment but who knows we can't even get a basic layout of the place down

 

[PrinceofPop]

That is an excellent question. I have been planning on going to Columbus just to check this out. I have heard there is an elevator to the right of leaving the bar but others just say the freight lift for construction.

 

[PrinceofPop]

It was on the floor below. There was only a rusty ladder to get there or a freight lift

 

[PrinceofPop]

That's excellent work. I have been wondering if there was a path to a car from the construction exit

 

[PrinceofPop]

Yes, one of the detectives believe he left to start another life

 

[Satch]

They're are not, that's why this is a mystery.

Hi Prince,

To what are you referring here? I agree this is one of the most mysterious missing persons cases EVER!

Satch

 

[Satch]

t

more to add to what I mentioned earlier:

If Clint went to Brian's apartment right after the disappearance without Brian's family/gf being aware of it.... that's even more suspicious. If you're truly worried and are frantically worried about your friend, wouldn't you attempt to look for him anywhere that he could possibly be? I know that Brian's loved ones weren't immediately aware of Brian's disappearance. This also creates a time gap in all of this, giving Clint/whoever is involved to cover up evidence.

Also, think about how Clint always persisted on his story, almost getting mad that he's not being heard. After a while, he was tired of repeating the same thing, his verbiage becoming even more and more uncaring and casual. There are just too many things about this guy that don't seem right, on an instinctive level.

Why? Why was he so fast to distance himself not only from the investigation but also from Brian's loved ones? They were surely desperate for answers, compassion and understanding. Would a friend just leave like this? It just doesn't add up in any way thinkable.

Exactly!

I could be wrong, but I don't think that Clint, not even once, offered to help in the search, or provide any support to Randy, Derrick, or Alexis in any way.

Satch

 

[neesaki]

It was on the floor below. There was only a rusty ladder to get there or a freight lift

I really appreciate your input, PrinceofPop. Just wondering if there's any way you could use the "reply with quote" feature so it would be easier to know what you're referring to. Specifically here, what are you referring to that was on the floor below? Thanks so much!

 

[neesaki]

Yes, one of the detectives believe he left to start another life

This is a very interesting point, IMO. Something that I've wondered myself as well. I do wonder what led the detective to believe this. Any ideas here? TIA

 

[dotr]

Refresher..
Rbbm, wondering if "Brain" was a nickname for Brian, or a slip of the tongue?
http://thelantern.com/2009/04/is-brian-shaffer-alive/

[h=1]Is Brian Shaffer alive?[/h] By Drew Sullivan: Drew Sullivan April 12, 2009

An attorney believes that an Ohio State medical student who has been missing for more than three years is alive, he told a private investigator in an e-mail.

In the e-mail he sent to Corbett on Sept. 22, 2008, Rosenberg said: “If Brian is alive, which is what I’m led to believe after speaking with the detective involved, then it is Brian, and not Clint who is causing his family pain and hardship. Brian should come forward and end this.”

In an e-mail last week, Florence said: “While I appreciate any effort in trying to determine what happened to Brain [sic] that night, I must decline your request. ANY and ALL questions you have for me should be directed to my attorney, Neil Rosenberg.”

Corbett said he doesn’t know which detective Rosenberg was referring to in the e-mail. However, he believes it is one of three men at Columbus Police: detective Andre Edwards of the Physical Child Abuse Section, Sgt. John Hurst of the Physical Abuse Section and Deputy Chief Antone Lanata of the Investigative Subdivision.

All three did not respond to repeated requests last week for an interview about whether they told Rosenberg they believe Shaffer is still alive.

“If Brian did take off somewhere, if that is the case, we just always had a strong feeling that Clint would possibly know that.”

Shaffer’s girlfriend at the time, Alexis Waggoner, also thinks Florence knows something he doesn’t want to tell.

 

[Satch]

Refresher..
Rbbm, wondering if "Brain" was a nickname for Brian, or a slip of the tongue?
http://thelantern.com/2009/04/is-brian-shaffer-alive/

Quote in the above article from Alexis' father Tom:

“The gist of my perspective on Clint Florence is that I think that basically all roads to making any progress on the case on Brian Shaffer lead through Clint Florence,” Tom Waggoner said.

I couldn't agree more.

Satch

 

[neesaki]

Refresher..
Rbbm, wondering if "Brain" was a nickname for Brian, or a slip of the tongue?
http://thelantern.com/2009/04/is-brian-shaffer-alive/

That article is a good refresher.

Regarding the detective that believes Brian is alive, I wonder if it's Detective Andre Edwards.

[FONT=&amp]Edwards spent hours upon hours scrutinizing the surveillance video that captured the image of Brian just before he vanished. He watched him enter the bar, step outside to talk with friends and re-enter a few minutes later. He rewound the tape over and over again, pausing as each patron exited, waiting for a glimpse of Brian.[/FONT]

[FONT=&amp]Edwards saw it all on the video as Brian’s friends said it happened. He watched it so many times he could confirm that every person who left the bar had also entered-he’d rewind the tape just to make sure. He wanted to rule out the possibility Brian had changed clothes or disguised himself in some way.
[/FONT][FONT=&amp]"I can say with 100-percent certainty that Brian Shaffer did not go back down that escalator,” says Edwards, who now works on the division’s physical abuse unit. Aside from leaping over the second-story balcony and landing on an awning below, there was only one other way Brian could have left the bar undetected by security cameras. Part of the building was still under construction, and a construction elevator outside surveillance range could have been taken down to the first floor. Several theories of what happened to Brian that night exist, including the possibility he left the bar with the intention of never being found.[/FONT]

[FONT=&amp]Even today, Edwards finds himself doing double-takes in crowds or while watching TV.[/FONT]

[FONT=&amp]“I’m constantly looking for Brian,” he says. “When I go on vacation now, when I see commercials, if there’s anybody that resembles Brian, it catches my eye.” [/FONT]

http://www.columbusmonthly.com/content/stories/2014/09/when-missing-persons-cases-go-cold.html

I'm wondering even more now regarding this theory... realizing of course that my theory has changed a few times, and may again, LOL. Still, it makes sense to me that Brian could very likely have left on his own, under the radar, quietly and discreetly. Thus the phone being immediately turned off. It also seems that any kind of confrontation, incident, or scuffle would have more than likely attracted someones attention, and there's been no evidence of anything like this happening.

Just think, when he was outside talking to the two girls, maybe his intended purpose was to get a look at the construction elevator door and to surveil the area in preparation for his exit. From what I could tell in the video, wasn't the construction elevator door just to the left of the door to the bar ? (if one is facing the bar from the escalator). Wouldn't that door have been very near to where Brian was standing when he was last seen on the video? If that was the case, one would assume that door was left unlocked and he knew this. JMO

 

[Brainy]

That article is a good refresher.

Regarding the detective that believes Brian is alive, I wonder if it's Detective Andre Edwards.




http://www.columbusmonthly.com/content/stories/2014/09/when-missing-persons-cases-go-cold.html

I'm wondering even more now regarding this theory... realizing of course that my theory has changed a few times, and may again, LOL. Still, it makes sense to me that Brian could very likely have left on his own, under the radar, quietly and discreetly. Thus the phone being immediately turned off. It also seems that any kind of confrontation, incident, or scuffle would have more than likely attracted someones attention, and there's been no evidence of anything like this happening.

Just think, when he was outside talking to the two girls, maybe his intended purpose was to get a look at the construction elevator door and to surveil the area in preparation for his exit. From what I could tell in the video, wasn't the construction elevator door just to the left of the door to the bar ? (if one is facing the bar from the escalator). Wouldn't that door have been very near to where Brian was standing when he was last seen on the video? If that was the case, one would assume that door was left unlocked and he knew this. JMO

I have had thoughts of Brian possibly leaving on his own many times. When thinking of this theory, there are many thoughts and considerations that instantly pop out.
Think of…

1) Why to leave bar at 2am? Unless you are going somewhere on foot or getting a taxi to take you to another location, public transportation is not available at that time of the day? But then again, whoever happened to see, I am sure would come forward as a witness.

2) If he left the country, how could he have flown without being detected? Forging documents is not easy unless you’re an expert or have connections somewhere?


3) According to the investigators, all of his belongings were in place – money untouched, apartment neat, car locked and parked where he left it. If he left, what resources could he have to start life elsewhere? I am sure his bank account(s) were monitored to watch for any weird/large transactions or withdrawals.

4) Also, we don’t know of any reasons why someone would do this, or exit this way. I have heard the theories and thoughts that he was deeply saddened by his mom’s death, but I really don’t buy that. Just because you feel saddened or depressed is not going to make you wake up one day and want to leave it all behind. This is just my impression, but he seemed kind of a guy who wouldn’t do this. Not to sound cliché here.


5) If he wanted to go away, why go away this way and cause so much pain? He could have just said that he was leaving and they shouldn’t be looking for him – they would at least know it was his decision to leave.

Finally, the circumstances of his disappearance are just too random and out of sort for such a predetermined action.

 

[Satch]

That article is a good refresher.

Regarding the detective that believes Brian is alive, I wonder if it's Detective Andre Edwards.




http://www.columbusmonthly.com/content/stories/2014/09/when-missing-persons-cases-go-cold.html

I'm wondering even more now regarding this theory... realizing of course that my theory has changed a few times, and may again, LOL. Still, it makes sense to me that Brian could very likely have left on his own, under the radar, quietly and discreetly. Thus the phone being immediately turned off. It also seems that any kind of confrontation, incident, or scuffle would have more than likely attracted someones attention, and there's been no evidence of anything like this happening.

Just think, when he was outside talking to the two girls, maybe his intended purpose was to get a look at the construction elevator door and to surveil the area in preparation for his exit. From what I could tell in the video, wasn't the construction elevator door just to the left of the door to the bar ? (if one is facing the bar from the escalator). Wouldn't that door have been very near to where Brian was standing when he was last seen on the video? If that was the case, one would assume that door was left unlocked and he knew this. JMO

The only problem with that theory is that I don't think it explains Clint's "Off-putting" behavior. A question I have.Is that 1:55am time with Brian on the video and than Clint supposedly calling him at 2:10am. Is that Clint establishing this time-frame, or has this time-frame been established by other sources whom in my view are more trustworthy? How do we go from a 15-minute time interval to never, ever being seen again?

And if Clint is innocent, hiding nothing, and knows nothing about what happened to Brian. why does he need a layer for this case?

Satch

 

[Satch]

I have had thoughts of Brian possibly leaving on his own many times. When thinking of this theory, there are many thoughts and considerations that instantly pop out.
Think of…

1) Why to leave bar at 2am? Unless you are going somewhere on foot or getting a taxi to take you to another location, public transportation is not available at that time of the day? But then again, whoever happened to see, I am sure would come forward as a witness.

2) If he left the country, how could he have flown without being detected? Forging documents is not easy unless you’re an expert or have connections somewhere?


3) According to the investigators, all of his belongings were in place – money untouched, apartment neat, car locked and parked where he left it. If he left, what resources could he have to start life elsewhere? I am sure his bank account(s) were monitored to watch for any weird/large transactions or withdrawals.

4) Also, we don’t know of any reasons why someone would do this, or exit this way. I have heard the theories and thoughts that he was deeply saddened by his mom’s death, but I really don’t buy that. Just because you feel saddened or depressed is not going to make you wake up one day and want to leave it all behind. This is just my impression, but he seemed kind of a guy who wouldn’t do this. Not to sound cliché here.


5) If he wanted to go away, why go away this way and cause so much pain? He could have just said that he was leaving and they shouldn’t be looking for him – they would at least know it was his decision to leave.

Finally, the circumstances of his disappearance are just too random and out of sort for such a predetermined action.

Add to the list:

6.) Why leave drunk? Unless you're so drunk you don't think your drunk. Booze can make you do stupid and dangerous things. I do think that regardless of what happened to Brian, his high alcohol consumption influenced his thinking and judgement that night.

Everything else in that list is exactly the kind of thoughts and questions that I have to this day. IF Brian wanted to leave on his own. Briainy, do you think he could have gone away to commit suicide?

Satch

 

[Brainy]

Add to the list:

6.) Why leave drunk? Unless you're so drunk you don't think your drunk. Booze can make you do stupid and dangerous things. I do think that regardless of what happened to Brian, his high alcohol consumption influenced his thinking and judgement that night.

Everything else in that list is exactly the kind of thoughts and questions that I have to this day. IF Brian wanted to leave on his own. Briainy, do you think he could have gone away to commit suicide?

Satch

Yes, givn that alcohol was involved in that all, I don't think the theory of his willing disappearance is likely (also taking into consideration all the points we presented above).

Satch, well... I don't think so. If he left on foot, he really couldn't have gone that far. Oftentimes the drowning scenario is discussed. I think it's unlikely he went to the river, there is actually a large research organization (can't recall the name right now, have to look it up to remember) between Ugly Tuna and the river that as pretty high security surveillance, all indications are he would be spotted. I don't believe he was missed on camera x2. That's just so against the odds.

There really aren't many places where we could have gone on foot. If he left drunk and passed out somewhere he would be found, dead or alive. If he took a cab in the middle of the night, I am sure the driver could identify him and remember him. Drunk guy at 2am possibly going nowhere/ no destination in mind would be a memorable customer.

So... I don't know. The odd thing is that if Brian is dead, his body has never been found, and it been over 11 yrs now. I really don't know what else to think but consider that someone deliberately hid his body after killing him, but again, we go in circles as all these theories lose connection dots and lead to dead end.

I do stick to the theory that Clint is involved somehow. I don't know how but he either did something or knows something.


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[Brainy]

This is a very interesting point, IMO. Something that I've wondered myself as well. I do wonder what led the detective to believe this. Any ideas here? TIA

Yes, that is interesting. Someone who was involved in the investigation believed that. I would love to hear why that was his impression and what made him think that.


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