GUILTY OH - Johnny Clarke, 21, & Lisa Straub, 20, murdered, Springfield Twp, 31 Jan 2011

[SmoothOperator]

bbm

Those two statements seem contradictory to me. In a random robbery, something of substantial value would be taken: computers, iPod, stereo components, silver, jewelry. And they're in/out in 5 minutes.

This sounds more more person: bags over the head, nothing of substantial value missing. Two $20 bills? Would someone really risk life in prison for murder over $40?

IMHO:
1) there is something hidden in that house that they couldn't find,
2) there was something hidden that they DID find but either the parents didn't know or don't want to say (drugs), OR
3) it was a personal vendetta

It doesn't appear like a random "robbery gone bad". MOO

I agree with you, beli. No way, no how this was a robbery gone bad. The bags placed on the victims heads and then duct taped around there necks was for no such purpose such as silencing loud victims. By the age of 4yrs old every human being is well taught that just a plastic bag alone over one's head=DEATH. ADD IN DUCT TAPE TO SECURE A PLASTIC BAG OVER A PERSON's head=100% intentional murder!

About the bags and the question of specifics of the bags such as were they a local store type of bag or garbage bag type. I think where we are getting the idea in our heads that they are a grocery store type of bag is from the visuals onsuch shows as NG. On her show they show a blue grocery type plastic bag along with a roll of duct tape when speaking of this case. IMO that's most likely what has put this idea in our heads. I've not had a chance myself to see the video of the mom and dad where dad goes into detail about when he found the bodies and ripping the bags off of both victims. Does he mention any type of specifics regarding the type bags that he ripped off?

TIA to anyone who may know.

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[Wondergirl]

Can someone remind me where this business about the DUCT TAPE comes from anyway?

This video interview with both of John's parents, says that they were bound with black tape.

Duct tape is not usually black. Could they have been bound with black electrical tape?


His parents also state clearly that bags and tape were brought with the perp(s). I don't know how they woud know that, the fact that the tape and bags were not already there. There must be more that is unreported.

http://www.wtol.com/Global/story.asp?S=13960338

 

[alsmom]

Can someone remind me where this business about the DUCK TAPE comes from anyway?

This video interview with both of John's parents, says that they were bound with black tape.

Duck tape is not usually black. Could they have been bound with black electrical tape?

His parents also state clearly that bags and tape were brought with the perp(s). I don't know how they woud know that, the fact that the tape and bags were not alread there. There must be more that is unreported.

http://www.wtol.com/Global/story.asp?S=13960338

The duct tape was reported early on. Post #4 of this thread has the link that mentions duct tape.

 

[Wondergirl]

In the videos of the Straub home, the camera focuses on the window with the long curtains as if that is the window that looks upon where the bodies were recovered.

There had been reference for the kitchen being directly off the garage, and that is how the home was usually entered.

Does anyone know if that window with the long curtains is actually the one where the kitchen/dining room was? It seems very unlikely if that is the window the cousin and father peered in, that so much detail of the scene could be viewed, kwim?

Hi wondergirl! Would u post me a link to where you saw the curtains that u are speaking about above. I have not been able to spend as much time as I'd like to getting to sleuth arounD on this specific case. But would love to see what u r talking about.
TIA


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Sure SmoothOperator.

The videos of the Longacre home show an extended focus on one window with long curtains (the one with the brown flashing).

The window is the left window on the front of the home (facing it), and does not appear to be close to the garage.

So, I don't know if the info about the kitchen/dining room being just off the garage is correct, and the news crews filming footage just assumed that the long curtain window was the one in question, or what? It seems to me as if it was Lisa Uncle discussing the location, so I would take that over a visual cue, but, ???

http://www.foxtoledo.com/dpp/news/local/dead-in-a-holland-ohio-home

 

[future criminologist]

I just started following this case and it definitely kept me up late last night. I was thinking about what we KNOW so far according to what the police have released, and the specific wording used in their press conferences. I was also thinking about what I learned from watching the show The Shift - that LE tightly controls what information gets released: 1. so that they have the upper hand in any interrogations; 2. to generate leads or tips from the public; 3. as part of the investigative strategy. There is a lot of information we are not privy to- they need to satisfy public need for information and reassurance but at the same time use the media for their own purposes. And I think "robbery gone bad" could mean two things: 1. nothing of value was taken from the PARENTS - but that doesn't mean nothing of value was taken from the victims - I'm thinking someone knew he had a large stash of drugs or money in the house or he had just made a big deal - perhaps a member of his crew? 2. It's meant to get the perp's partner, the person who didn't do the killing, to roll on his partner and to come forward - almost to reassure them that "hey, we know you didn't mean to kill these two - you just went in there to get the stash but things went south and you didn't INTEND to kill them". Perhaps if the accomplice - and there is no way that this was done by solely one person - thinks he won't get first degree murder but a lesser charge he will come forward.

What do you guys think of that as possible LE strategy?

 

[pspence]

I'm not accusing Tiffany of anything ...however the story she shares doesn't hold up in many ways...if you were thugs who are getting ready to go in this house...you see Johnny on the phone (allegedly with Tiffany) and know he starts screaming "Who are you? Why are you here? etc etc. and then Johnny drops the phone...don't you think the thugs would think "ummmm, whoever he was on the phone heard him screaming ...we had better get the drugs or whatever and get the #%&* out of here fast...what they did took time...

As far as critism of Lisa's parents for letting him into the home...as a mother of 3 now grown children but once teens...often you don't know what their past is and you just pray that by giving the child a home and love that your child will figure things out...I don't blame them at all...she was 20 years old...we can't accept the credit or the blame for our adult children...just love and guide and do the best we can...

A lot of us did dumb things when we were late teens early 20s that most of us regret and just lucked out and grew up and survived...

 

[Wondergirl]

The duct tape was reported early on. Post #4 of this thread has the link that mentions duct tape.

Thanks for that.

I was very suprised to watch that video and hear black tape. Maybe it's a regional thing, but, I didn't think black duct tape was very common.

Maybe someone local to Ohio could shed some light on that? If that colour isn't as common in Ohio, that might help narrow things.

 

[LadyL]

listening to NG at the moment. One man on the show (unidentified) said when police first arrived they looked for fresh prints in the snow and none were found. This led police to determine whoever came to the house entered through the garage.

Thinking here because I'm wondering if the driveway and walks were cleared. Just thought I'd bring this up. Second point being that it's believed more than one person was in on this crime.

Currently no suspect or person/s of interest.

that's weird to me ...

wouldn't the friend, the parents, and the cousin have made fresh prints when they were circling the house?

 

[LadyL]

I wanna know if he needed to pick her up how did she get a car later to drive over there

I wondered the same thing.

I guess it's possible that after the dropped phonecall and unreturned texts etc. that she got worried and borrowed a car from someone.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Thanks for that.

I was very surprised to watch that video and hear black tape. Maybe it's a regional thing, but, I didn't think black duct tape was very common.

Maybe someone local to Ohio could shed some light on that? If that colour isn't as common in Ohio, that might help narrow things.

It is becoming more and more common.

It is actually stickier than the silver duct tape and easier to tear without it ruffling up.

Most of the time it is used to wrap outside pipes.

http://www.google.com/products/cata...og_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CGsQ8wIwAA#

Since it is sticker that gives LE a better chance of retrieving fingerprints on it if they weren't wearing gloves, but they have also been able to go back, and match gloves if they find the suspect and a pair of gloves due to the unique pattern that will be left on the sticky side of the tape.

IMO

 

[LadyL]

Wondergirl
Lisa's car was in the garage, I think JC's mother was referring to Tiffany when she said and "her" car is in the driveway. But yeah when Tiffany said she was talking to Lisa and then He hung up..That makes no sense unless for some reason Lisa was talking on Johnny's phone and then handed it back to him, and when she called back again he answered. And another thing that is strange, in this day and age, noone calls someone back to say hey come a little later, I'm running to the store. They would most certainly send that message via text.

*RUMOUR ALERT* very early on it was said that Tiff, Lisa & Johnny were on a three-way call ...

ETA: can't find a source so am marking it as rumour

 

[Wondergirl]

very early on it was said that Tiff, Lisa & Johnny were on a three-way call ...

Really?

A three way call where two of the three are in the same house? That adds another layer then, if that is the case. ???

 

[SmoothOperator]

very early on it was said that Tiff, Lisa & Johnny were on a three-way call ...

Wow!! I never have heard that. That would be ridiculous. As you have Johnny and Lisa together at Lisa's home, both preparing to leave and go pick up Tiff(supposedly)...3way call? When 2 of the 3 ppl involved In the call are together??

Sounds more than strange and unneccesary when whomevers phone the call was taking place on(johnny or Lisa's)would simply have to hit the speakerphone button to achieve this same effect with a 1000 times less the trouble. But if infact turns out to be true, it can easily be accessed thru phone records to verify this.

Just wondering where this info was reported early on?

TIA


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[bdawk20]

I'm not accusing Tiffany of anything ...however the story she shares doesn't hold up in many ways...if you were thugs who are getting ready to go in this house...you see Johnny on the phone (allegedly with Tiffany) and know he starts screaming "Who are you? Why are you here? etc etc. and then Johnny drops the phone...don't you think the thugs would think "ummmm, whoever he was on the phone heard him screaming ...we had better get the drugs or whatever and get the #%&* out of here fast...what they did took time...

As far as critism of Lisa's parents for letting him into the home...as a mother of 3 now grown children but once teens...often you don't know what their past is and you just pray that by giving the child a home and love that your child will figure things out...I don't blame them at all...she was 20 years old...we can't accept the credit or the blame for our adult children...just love and guide and do the best we can...

A lot of us did dumb things when we were late teens early 20s that most of us regret and just lucked out and grew up and survived...

Something else that I was thinking about Tiffany....if I were on the phone with him, he dropped it and after I heard what went on, the phone went dead I would assume the perps got the phone, and could see who he had been talking to. Personally, I would be scared to death. I haven't seen anything where she said she was worried about that. Or maybe I'm just more paranoid than she is! lol

jmo

 

[LadyL]

I'm not accusing Tiffany of anything ...however the story she shares doesn't hold up in many ways...if you were thugs who are getting ready to go in this house...you see Johnny on the phone (allegedly with Tiffany) and know he starts screaming "Who are you? Why are you here? etc etc. and then Johnny drops the phone...don't you think the thugs would think "ummmm, whoever he was on the phone heard him screaming ...we had better get the drugs or whatever and get the #%&* out of here fast...what they did took time...

As far as critism of Lisa's parents for letting him into the home...as a mother of 3 now grown children but once teens...often you don't know what their past is and you just pray that by giving the child a home and love that your child will figure things out...I don't blame them at all...she was 20 years old...we can't accept the credit or the blame for our adult children...just love and guide and do the best we can...

A lot of us did dumb things when we were late teens early 20s that most of us regret and just lucked out and grew up and survived...

[bbm]

good point

 

[LadyL]

duct tape is available in a wide array of colours here, with black, silver, white, blue & red being the most common (I don't know specifically about Ohio though)

 

[LadyL]

Wow!! I never have heard that. That would be ridiculous. As you have Johnny and Lisa together at Lisa's home, both preparing to leave and go pick up Tiff(supposedly)...3way call? When 2 of the 3 ppl involved In the call are together??

Sounds more than strange and unneccesary when whomevers phone the call was taking place on(johnny or Lisa's)would simply have to hit the speakerphone button to achieve this same effect with a 1000 times less the trouble. But if infact turns out to be true, it can easily be accessed thru phone records to verify this.

Just wondering where this info was reported early on?

TIA


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I'm gonna have to go search but it's really not that unreasonable. People do 3-ways all the time on cell phones ... just like picking up another extension on a land-line KWIM?

ALSO ETA:


please disregard what I said since I can't find a source

I'm slapping myself on the forehead now

 

[LadyL]

Something else that I was thinking about Tiffany....if I were on the phone with him, he dropped it and after I heard what went on, the phone went dead I would assume the perps got the phone, and could see who he had been talking to. Personally, I would be scared to death. I haven't seen anything where she said she was worried about that. Or maybe I'm just more paranoid than she is! lol

jmo

holy carp

another good point I hadn't considered

yeah, I'd be scared too

 

[realist1972]

Actually you can get black duct tape at our local Walmart, Menards, Lowes, Home Depot, Meijer.... all of which are fairly close the the residence. I really hope that the announcement that LE made stating that they have concluded that it was a robery gone bad is just a cover up, that maybe they can't release any of the real information.

 

[angela]

I think this case will be solved fairly quickly. I dont think we are dealing with experienced robbers here. One thing about the bags over the heads is that would be no guarantee that they wouldn't survive. I just watched a true story not too long ago where a woman was attacked and a plastic bag placed over her head. She was able to bite through the bag and free herself. It is possible. Of course, the killers could have stuck around long enough to make sure that didn't happen but that brings us back to them spending a lot of time in a house when they knew that Johnny was on the phone with someone who could have reported that something was going on there.