VERDICT WATCH OH - Pike Co - 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered - 4 Wagner Family Members Arrested #85

[Willow Knight]

Wouldn’t the Judge saying: “reasonable minds could conclude that the defendant is guilty” be grounds for a mistrial (even if jurors are sequestered or instructed not to read or watch / listen to anything about the case)? We’re a week away from closing arguments and the judge is pronouncing the defendant guilty?

Jmo

Isn't that standard procedure for the defense to ask for a judgment of acquittal?


I found this, it explains it much better than I could.

A motion for a judgment of acquittal can be granted only if no reasonable jury could find beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant committed the crime charged. This essentially means that the prosecution’s evidence is too weak to support a conviction, viewing it as generously as possible.

Judgments of Acquittal in Criminal Trials

A judge may grant a judgment of acquittal if no reasonable jury could find beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant committed the crime charged.

www.justia.com

 

[Dudly]

Did GW let it slip on the stand that The Flying W is in his name? That makes him one of the owners of the largest land masses in Pike County, Ohio

He may have said that but I would bet RW is, or will be, in control of the farm. FW has a number of recent trusts set up I read about somewhere. No link, so, MOO…

 

[rsd1200]

In RE: He also changed his story about his whereabouts the night of the murders. First, he says he went to bed (after he and his entire family watched a movie) at 12:30 am. He testified that he went to bed at 10:00 night of the murders.

That was what was suppose to have been stated at the MT Border interview that no audio or transcript was put before the jury. He did not say this on the stand.

I'm baaack. lol

JW did testify that he claimed to have killed all eight. Lies then can't lie, lies, then can't lie? Lies when he can justify lying, jm2.

Law and Crime Link

Jake Wagner testified that he confessed to planning and carrying out the murders of eight members of the Rhoden and Gilley families after he felt he’d received “an answer from God” in December 2019 when his grandmother admitted lying to prosecutors about forging custody documents related to the case and agreed to cooperate.

several paragraphs down: Wagner said he took his grandmother’s words to heart and viewed them as “an answer from God.” He testified that he had been praying about what to do and had lied to his lawyers about committing the murders.
A short time later, he said that he confessed to his lawyers and detailed his mother, father and brother’s involvement in the conspiracy but did not plan to cooperate and wanted to go to trial. He didn’t plan to testify at his trial because he would have to lie.

By the Spring of 2021, Wagner said his feelings had changed and he decided to resolve his case. He sat down with Canepa, Pike Co. Prosecutor Rob Junk and special prosecutor Andy Wilson and told them “everything that had happened” over a period of two to three days. Wagner said his plea agreement required him to testify accurately and fully.

 

[Pru2U]

Wouldn’t the Judge saying: “reasonable minds could conclude that the defendant is guilty” be grounds for a mistrial (even if jurors are sequestered or instructed not to read or watch / listen to anything about the case)? We’re a week away from closing arguments and the judge is pronouncing the defendant guilty?

Jmo

No, I've heard it before. I believe it's standard language when denying acquittal, just as it's standard for the defense to request acquittal.

 

[Pru2U]

I'm almost certain 4 mentioned he was either the owner or one of the owners of Pedersen rd property. 3 did mention he was a trust fund brat, I believe during the Kroger chat with BCI. Jmo

Yes, GW said he & JW were on the title of Peterson Rd allegedly to avoid inheritance taxes in the event of the deaths of his parents. I thought JW or AW said it had something to do with AW & BW not being able to get the insurance on it. JMO

 

[Berrybell]

Yes, GW said he & JW were on the title of Peterson Rd allegedly to avoid inheritance taxes in the event of the deaths of his parents. I thought JW or AW said it had something to do with AW & BW not being able to get the insurance on it. JMO

I am sure after so many fires that BW & AW would have trouble getting insurance.

 

[Pru2U]

I am sure after so many fires that BW & AW would have trouble getting insurance.

Just knowing AW’s deceitful nature, I feel like both answers could be correct. It could have been the insurance but they (or AW) told the boys it was for inheritance. I don’t think anyone lied in court about it. MOO.

 

[arielilane]

Watch live: court is still being held for procedural hearings and evidential arguments, without jury present.

 

[arielilane]

Court is minus the presence of attorney Nash.

 

[dgfred]

So the moving of the bodies were never mentioned by JW as to why? I can’t recall that discussion. It’s called staging, killers trying to throw off the crime scene…confuse the investigation. IMO

Maybe he was still outside when that happened so he can't really say who/when except from BW or GW.

I 'think' GW did shoot from outside with the rifle and then went inside after BW shot both inside at close range. Then helped move bodies.

I don't think they were staging... likely didn't want someone easily peeking in the window and seeing the bodies. Maybe the windows in the bedroom were covered. Might still see the blood tho but still darkish when they were there. Locked door.

 

[arielilane]

https://twitter.com/jbakerohio

Pike County Massacre Trial: Jury instructions, more issues before judge Tuesday ahead of closing arguments next week





Judge Randy Deering says there's several things 'we need to work on today.’

Judge says he expects they will spend a great deal of time today finalizing jury instructions after they argue some related defense motions

Jury instructions from the judge are important. They focus the jury on specific issues and how laws apply to the case be tried. They are supposed to serve as a guide for jurors to understand these legal and factual issues as they work to reach a verdict

Reporters pore over proposed jury instructions from attorneys on both sides of a case because these records give us insight into closing arguments

 

[arielilane]

https://twitter.com/pattinewberry


The jury is out but the lawyers are in for Day 48 in #PikeCountyMassacre trial of #GeorgeWagnerIV.
@brook_lavalley
is in the courthouse for ⁦
@DispatchAlerts
⁩. Live feed and updates at ⁦
@Enquirer
⁩

Find today's coverage and link to the live feed here: Live: Lawyers to discuss death penalty in Pike County killings case

 

[Niner]

A little late, but what the hey! At least I will be able to shorten this up a bit.

Tuesday, November 22nd:
*Trial continues (Judge & attorneys only) (@ 9am ET) - OH - Pike County 8 people dead: Christopher Rhoden, Sr. (40), his ex-wife, Dana Manley Rhoden (37), their three children, Clarence "Frankie" Rhoden (20), Christopher Jr. (16), Hanna Mae (19); Frankie's fiancée, Hannah Hazel Gilley (20), Christopher Rhoden Sr.'s brother, Kenneth Rhoden (44), & a cousin, Gary Rhoden (37). Hanna Rhoden's baby girl (5 days old), another baby (6 mos.) & a young child (3) were unharmed. (April 21-22, 2016, Pebbles) – for *George Washington Wagner IV (27/now 31) (Jakes’ bro) indicted (11/12/18), arrested (11/13/18), charged (11/15/18) & arraigned (11/28/18) with 8 counts aggravated murder, (plus gun specifications on each), 1 count of 1st degree conspiracy, 4 counts of 1st degree aggravated burglary, 1 count of 5th degree unlawful possession of dangerous ordnance, 3 counts of 3rd degree evidence tampering, 1 count of 5th degree forgery, 1 count of 5th degree unauthorized use of computer or telecommunications, 1 count of 4th degree interception of wire, oral or electronic communication, 1 count of 5th degree obstructing justice, & 1 count of 1st degree engaging in a pattern of corrupt activity. Plead not guilty. Held without bond. DA will seek the DP. Per Jake’s plea agreement, DP is off the table only for Jake if his testimony is truthful. But George still faces the DP as he did not take a deal.
Trial began on 8/29/22 with final jury selection & the jury was seated on 8/30/22. 12 Jurors & 6 alternates. Jury: (9 women & 3 men) & 6 alternates: (5 women & 1 man). 9/30/22: Ill juror replaced with alternate. 12 jurors & 5 alternates. Jury: (9 women & 3 men) & 5 alternates (4 women & 1 man). A few are in their late 20s or 30s, but most are in their 40s or 50s.
Trial began with opening statements on Monday, 9/12/22 & ended on 11/18/22. State rested their case on 11/18/22. Defense rested their case 11/18/22. Closing arguments begin on 11/28/22.
Crime info & court hearings from 11/28/18 thru 9/6/22 & Trial Day 1-44 (9/12 to 11/17/22) no court on 10/27, 11/4 & 11/11 & 11/14/22 reference post #718 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-84.644269/page-36
11/18/22 Friday, Trial Day 45: They will work on entering exhibit/evidence in the morning. Judge tells jury we'll have schedule set tomorrow, Friday & it could be a short day. Judge & attorneys back up presenting evidence to be allowed.
For more info see posts #744 & 746 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-84.644269/page-38
For more info see posts #774 & 775 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-84.644269/page-39
For more info see posts #782, 788, 790 & 791 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-84.644269/page-40
The state rests their case no further witnesses. Defense is also rested their case, they have no more witnesses, but have some exhibits. No rebuttal witnesses for the State.
For more info see post #810, 811 & 818 thru 820 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-84.644269/page-41
Judge adjourned jurors until 11/28/22, when they will come back & hear closing arguments. There will still be hearings next week before Thanksgiving.
For more info see posts #822 & 831 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-84.644269/page-42
For more info see posts #847 & 849 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-84.644269/page-43
For more info see post #924 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-84.644269/page-47
Trial continues on Monday, 11/28/22 for closing arguments & jury instructions.
11/21/22 Monday, Attorneys & Judge only today going over procedural issues with remaining evidence admittance.
For more info see posts #403, 410 & 414 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-85.644991/page-21
For more info see posts #425, 429 & 438 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-85.644991/page-22
For more info see post #451 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-85.644991/page-23
The death specifications will be dropped from the case before closing arguments & before the jury deliberates.
Motions filed by John P. Parker: #113 Defendant's motion for proposed jury instruction on aiding & abetting. #114 Defendant's motion for proposed jury instruction regarding circumstantial evidence. #115 Defendant's motion for proposed jury instruction on modus operandi. #116 & 117 Defendant's motion for proposed jury instructions filed.
Judge Deering denied Rule 29 motion on all counts saying a reasonable jury or juror could find GW4 guilty. Rule 29: Judgement of acquittal.
For more info see posts #471, 472 & 474 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-85.644991/page-24
For more info see post #499 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-85.644991/page-25
Court will resume Tuesday, 11/22/22 morning at 9 a.m. where these items are expected to be the focus.
11/22/22 Tuesday: Attorneys & Judge only today. Judge says he expects they will spend a great deal of time today finalizing jury instructions after they argue some related defense motions.
For more info see posts #509, 512 & 513 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...ner-family-members-arrested-85.644991/page-22

 

[Betty P]

I listened to some of it. It sounds like they may have finished getting the evidence entered.

AC said due to Jake's testimony and the fact that all of it was officially submitted as evidence for the jury to use, the prosecution would drop the death specification charges in counts 1 thru 8 - the ones that apply to Aggravated Murder. All parties agreed. The decision isn't based on merit, but on the agreement with JW. They will do this formally in front of the jury, before closing arguments. See Niner's post above.

 

[JerseyGirl]

No death penalty for George Wagner IV if convicted of Pike County massacre

Closing arguments will begin Monday, Nov. 28

www.fox19.com

 

[justtrish]

Just knowing AW’s deceitful nature, I feel like both answers could be correct. It could have been the insurance but they (or AW) told the boys it was for inheritance. I don’t think anyone lied in court about it. MOO.

To me the why it was in their names isn't as important as the fact it was in their names

GW: I am not like them, I separate myself from them. They do this and they do that and I don't agree with it. My brother is x, I am y.

But actions say otherwise. He knew they burned that house because he removed his items. He can either be okay with that or not. If he was really opposed to that, then WHY would he agree to have a house put in his name where these arsonist are going to live? He could have went off on his own at that point with Tabby and his son. We know from Tabby's testimony she wanted them to leave that house and be on their own. She didn't want to live with his family. Instead, he buys a house with his brother and moves right in to once again live with his mom, brother, niece and his family. If that was because of taxes or insurance or whatever other excuse he thinks up, the fact still remains he knew about the arsons and he still chose to move to the new house with his family AND have the home put in his name. Doesn't seem like separating himself from his family to me.

Then, he when they move to Alaska he does it again. We have a recording of that conversation and mom is telling him about the house and it will be in his name and he doesn't bat an eye or protest one bit. He hasn't even seen the house.

 

[CIA Team Member]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1595118155231531008

https://twitter.com/x/status/1595120259186700288

 

[Betty P]

No death penalty for George Wagner IV if convicted of Pike County massacre

Closing arguments will begin Monday, Nov. 28

www.fox19.com

"Two of the Wagners, Jake and Angela, pleaded guilty last year to their roles in the slayings and testified for the state against George as part of their plea deal.

The state has the discretion to ask the judge to lift the death penalty specifications for the family members.

Jake Wagner and Angela Wagner’s testimonies did prove there is enough evidence to find George Wagner guilty, Canepa told the judge Tuesday."


"Canepa has repeatedly argued that George “certainly is complicit” in the execution-style killings, most at close range and some while the victims were sleeping even though he didn’t actually shoot anyone.

The state contends he is eligible for aggravated murder convictions because he actively participated in planning out and covering up the killings. George’s mother and brother’s testimony backed that up."

 

[RAISINISBACK]

What I find interesting is when I went back and watched the two days of George's testimony, many of those who previously said they believed George was guilty changed their minds to not guilty after his testimony, even one who claimed to be related to the R's. Many said they found him very sincere and believable. Some hosts of podcasts also are expressing doubt in his guilt as are some reporters saying they find him believable. I also found him very believable.

I wonder if his testimony had the same effect on members of the jury? If some of the jurors were sitting on the fence, his testimony could have decided them.

It is very possible these murders were planned while he was gone, working or other pursuits, and they never allowed him to know what they were planning. I really don't think, from his testimony, that he was trusted fully by Jake or Angie. There was so much they concealed from him.

I don't think the prosecution proved their case. I think they know it too. Too many holes in it to send a man to jail with LWOP. I think the prosecution should make a deal for obstruction of justice and give him timed served. That way he can't sue the state for keeping him locked up with no evidence. They should stop wasting money and time and proceed on to Billy.

JMO

 

[RAISINISBACK]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1595118155231531008

https://twitter.com/x/status/1595120259186700288

As far as Dana's i think the defense should leave that alone.

I am wondering if they throw out the murders at Dana's house because of jurisdiction if Adams county can come back and try him for those three in an Adams county court?

JMO