GUILTY OH - Pike Co - 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered - 4 Wagner Family Members Arrested #86

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rsd1200 said:
I quit scrolling after seeing FR. I thought it was quite tacky. I think everyone has seen enough of that in the jury and the families. They have the pics if they want to look at the deceased again in the jury room. Showboating the dead... AC in her stride.
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Lol You know, in real life I'm usually the one who stirs the pot but on here I bow to you and Raize. lol I see what you see and I see it differently too. After 65 years of experience with crazy though I would have to find GW guilty on all counts available. Covert sociopaths are not new to me. :)
 
almond said:
Lol You know, in real life I'm usually the one who stirs the pot but on here I bow to you and Raize. lol I see what you see and I see it differently too. After 65 years of experience with crazy though I would have to find GW guilty on all counts available. Covert sociopaths are not new to me. :)
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I truly don't think that GW4 is a blameless angel re; the murders. My thing is that the prosecution must prove their case. The defendant does not have to prove themselves innocent. Based on what I have seen, and heard, I didn't feel they proved their case, against G4, but, we didn't see a lot of testimony and evidence that was important to the case. I bow to the jury. I feel they will get it right as they have it ALL. Just a lot of holes I could not patch up, but Clark is doing a pretty good job. He's summing it up well. Had they used AC, I feel it could have been a total disaster. (AFA covert sociopaths, I may have been married to one at one time... many years ago. Not a murderer, but, man oh man. I've known my share of other unsavory characters too).
 
arielilane said:

"The law requires you to consider Jake and Angela's testimony with grave suspicion ... there's no proof here beyond a reasonable doubt." "His mother wouldn't even look at him.”

Parker asks jury if they believe George was there, that they remember he had no intent to kill and that he only went along to protect Jake from his father.

"I ask you to return a verdict of not guilty all charges, George wasn’t even up there, there’s nothing even credible here to say otherwise ... George didn’t do this, he is different than Jake he is different than Angela." Parker finishes by pounding on the podium.

Wilson on the rebuttal: Says Parker destroyed his case. You can't have it both ways - either George was there or he wasn't. If you have two defenses, means you have no credible defense.

Wilson: He is guilty of aggravated murder ... lists all the victims' names. Then says "you better believe that he is up to his eyeballs in this with his family”

Says Jake had his chance to throw his brother under the bus by saying he pulled trigger on SKS. But he didn't. Wilson says that doesn't matter - he can still be guilty of aggravated murder in Ohio.

If you aid assist or abet - you are guilty. Wilson brings up buying the phone jammer from China - fraud detection called George and he authorized it.

Wilson: That alone shows you he aided and abetted. Walking through all the other things he allegedly did to prepare including false bed.

Calls the impromptu plan to use Chris Sr's truck and have two vehicles was "brilliant" and makes perfect sense.

After Montana interview if you are innocent "You better believe when you get out to the car, you would say 'what the hell was that?' Mom how in the world are shell casings from the murder weapon on our property?"

Run though list of 20 things that you can't do if you're really innocent that they think George did. "And that's not a cumuluative list." "It shows you have accepted that group intent.”

Wilson suggests they pull out complicity instructions and apply to each charge and each count even though it's written as if he's principal offender. If they find he's complicit by aiding and abetting, he's guilty.

Shows picture of Wagner family after the murders - Wilson says those kids were "going to be raised Wagners" referring to Jake and George's daughter and son. They stole George's son wiped out an entire family to get Jake's daughter

Says the allegations of sexual abuse of Jake's daughter "wasn't true ... it was their playbook" - common planner's theme under the law. Accused previous people of abuse "to push them out”

But Hanna was stronger than the other women - had a strong support system and family - gestures to the Rhoden family in the gallery.

Wilson: Make no mistake, their desire to raise (*advertiser censored*) 100 percent as Wagners was the motive in this case.

Says if you peel back the case another layer - this is about control and power. The playbook is the same all the time. "The Wagners need to control these children, these grandchildren, need to be raised. That's a group think.”

Wilson: "Who's running the show? It's him" pointing to George. Also says he manipulated his son at Montana border. "No way he's sitting on the sidelines"

Wilson says they waited to put Jake on stand to show you depth and complexity of the investigation before Jake pleaded guilty.
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"Parker asks jury if they believe George was there, that they remember he had no intent to kill and that he only went along to protect Jake from his father."

IMO, quick deliberations
 
rsd1200 said:
I truly don't think that GW4 is a blameless angel re; the murders. My thing is that the prosecution must prove their case. The defendant does not have to prove themselves innocent. Based on what I have seen, and heard, I didn't feel they proved their case, against G4, but, we didn't see a lot of testimony and evidence that was important to the case. I bow to the jury. I feel they will get it right as they have it ALL. Just a lot of holes I could not patch up, but Clark is doing a pretty good job. He's summing it up well. Had they used AC, I feel it could have been a total disaster. (AFA covert sociopaths, I may have been married to one at one time... many years ago. Not a murderer, but, man oh man. I've known my share of other unsavory characters too).
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I get it. As for AC vs Clark...I think AC was used for the "human" side and Clark finished with "just the facts". He is a fine orator, for sure. The jury will decide with more insight than we've gotten, yes. I hope they toss him in a cage and those children can have better lives than they would've had. Now we wait?
 
RAISINISBACK said:
Well then Jake and Angie started planning alone, since George said he never saw the message and Billy was still out running drugs to get money for an attorney to take Hannah to court and money for a motel room for him and Angie and BW to have some fun in.

I have never seen a more incompetent and boring closing. I was wondering if she was going to finish before Deering kicked off of old age.
LMAO
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One, she's too invested. Rob Junk asked for her as "special prosecutor". She quit her job in a one-line letter of resignation with Yost, and went to Pike County for $65. an hour. Two, It is past her time. She needs to give it up or stick with women's abuse cases.
 
Betty P said:
GW4 is very much the Alpha male in those wiretap recordings. He's bossing everyone around, making decisions, accusations and demands of others. Not for a moment was he unaware of what was going on, he was into everyone's business.
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I can actually see him being the one to tell everyone else how their plan wouldn't work and why and inserting his opinion on how it should be done. I can see him criticizing Jake for the failed silencers, even having input on that murder truck like maybe not to title it in their name just acquire it and the get rid of it. I recall he was the one saying it wasn't a good idea to get it from family because it could be traced back to them. That's JMO for now since I don't have the tweet about it, but I'll look. Maybe it as Jake or Angela that said that.

He sure allowed Jake to wreck his truck. He seems to not to like to get his hands messy so to speak. Now isn't that convenient that he can say he didn't know things, didn't know about purchases, didn't see anything, didn't hear anything..
 
almond said:
I get it. As for AC vs Clark...I think AC was used for the "human" side and Clark finished with "just the facts". He is a fine orator, for sure. The jury will decide with more insight than we've gotten, yes. I hope they toss him in a cage and those children can have better lives than they would've had. Now we wait?
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You know, if only for the W children, if they all go to prison, and they are out of their lives, it will be justice. G4 has his parents' upbringing drilled into him, he was basically a child reared in abuse, as was JW, but their raising is so ingrained, I don't feel they should ever be in their children's lives, unless the children decide to see THEM, at some point, years in the future. I feel G4 aligns more with his father and JW with his mother. G4 is taking it to trial and JW is a big rat, just like G4 said he was. AW, and JW, the ones who I feel started this, turned tail facing death, G3 and G4, will not rat. G4 never even ratted out JW on the stand. Just said if anyone is convicted of such a crime, they should get the DP. AC lifts DP making it easier on jury.
 
IMO...I like seeing Prosecutor Andrew Wilson at work, so watched his rebuttal argument twice. His skill before a jury is impressive. Disappointed we didn't see more of his talent during this long trial. Angela Canepa, as Lead Prosecutor, is Wilson's boss in State vs. George Wagner IV, so she likely made all the decisions re assignment of duties. I think if Prosecutor Wilson played a larger role in this trial, the State would have had GW4 convicted of all charges weeks ago. opinion only of course.
 
almond said:
I get it. As for AC vs Clark...I think AC was used for the "human" side and Clark finished with "just the facts". He is a fine orator, for sure. The jury will decide with more insight than we've gotten, yes. I hope they toss him in a cage and those children can have better lives than they would've had. Now we wait?
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Agree. AC spent a very long time in the Pike County community. She was there early in the investigation and was an active part throughout. She ended up working for the Pike Co Prosecutor's office when the new Ohio AG inexplicably decided to ditch the case. Both special prosecutors had skills that complemented each other.
 
rsd1200 said:
One, she's too invested. Rob Junk asked for her as "special prosecutor". She quit her job in a one-line letter of resignation with Yost, and went to Pike County for $65. an hour. Two, It is past her time. She needs to give it up or stick with women's abuse cases.
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She only left Yost's office after he announced he wanted to move prosecution of the murder case to Pike County. IOW he wanted to dump it because he thought it cost too much money. He also inferred it wasn't a winnable case.

Not long after that Jake and AW confessed. Boy, did Yost look like a fool. I'm surprised he was re-elected, but most Ohioans outside southern Ohio didn't hear much about these murders after the first month or so.

DeWine engineered the transfer, some funds and assigned Andy Wilson from DeWine's office to help out.
 
arielilane said:

All of Evan's tweets before am break:



CLOSING ARGUMENTS: Parker questions the route Jake testified they used ("coming and going and backtracking and circling back") - and the truck swap that happened at Chris Sr's. "If this was a pre-planned murder - which it was - what sense does that make?”

CLOSING ARGUMENTS: Parker calls the custody battle a "theory." "It doesn’t make sense for one family to kill another over custody - have you ever heard of such a thing? No ... Quite frankly I don’t think anybody will ever believe this is about custody."

CLOSING ARGUMENTS: Parker calls the Facebook message from Hanna May ("I'll never sign papers ... they'll have to kill me first") - 'alarming.'
But says "People don’t kill over custody.”
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ETA - sorry for going back to the beginning, I'm just getting home and catching up

He is so strange, why is he trying to get the jury to make sense of of this crazy family? How do you say Angela is crazy and Jake is crazy and they're both liars - does he really think that the jury won't take another step and say so is George?!?!

Also - people kill over custody ALL THE TIME! Maybe not 8 people but they certainly do
 
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