OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #55

[TheRevWells]

what I am hoping is that no deals are made to remove the death penalty. the viciousness in the killing, the planning, trying to cover up evidence, leaving the babies in pools of their parents blood etc....all of it is pure evil and hatred and the death penalty is something that is created for murders such as these

 

[Loomis124]

This is what I think - no way. Do we also know, for a fact, that JW put together the baby crib? Or is that just coming from him? Unfortunately, I think anyone who could verify if this was true was murdered. JMO.

I have never seen proof about the crib. I don't recall JW ever mentioning it. If anyone has something other than rumor, can you please share?

 

[Loomis124]

This is what I think - no way. Do we also know, for a fact, that JW put together the baby crib? Or is that just coming from him? Unfortunately, I think anyone who could verify if this was true was murdered. JMO.

I have never seen proof about the crib. I don't recall JW ever mentioning it. If anyone has something other than rumor, can you please share?

Jake looks a lot better now he has gain some weight and his complexion is better??? JMO

What? I was replying to your post about the 404 evidence they had on Jake.

 

[TheRevWells]

I have never seen proof about the crib. I don't recall JW ever mentioning it. If anyone has something other than rumor, can you please share?

i think that was people speculating in regards to JW putting together the crib etc. I know I saw it too but not sure if it was in an article I read - the one where Jake is talked to by the reporter way before he was a suspect and before they left for Alaska

 

[Loomis124]

This is what I think - no way. Do we also know, for a fact, that JW put together the baby crib? Or is that just coming from him? Unfortunately, I think anyone who could verify if this was true was murdered. JMO.

I have never seen proof about the crib. I don't recall JW ever mentioning it. If anyone has something other than rumor, can you please share?

Jake looks a lot better now he has gain some weight and his complexion is better??? JMO

What? I was replying to your post about the 404 evidence they had on Jake.

Humm..Interesting motion filed by Billy's attorneys:

06/25/2020 MOTION NO. 59 DEFENDANT'S MOTION FOR AN ORDER REQUIRING THE PROSECUTION TO PROVIDE A TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO RECORDINGS IT INTENDS TO INTRODUCE AT TRIAL FILED

So there are 2 types of audio recordings we know of now. Recordings from the confidential reliable source and now we find out there are 1000's of hours of recorded phone calls. All for the jury to listen to while reading the transcripts.

Usually tapes are played in court with juries reading transcripts at the same time.

I can only assume this motion covers both phone recordings and wiretap recordings. Wiretaps planted by BCI or worn by an informer - when the revenge conversations occurred at Fred's house. There were multiple conversations.

USING TRANSCRIPTS OF AUDIO RECORDINGS DURING TRIAL – The “Olkon” Cautionary Jury Instruction & Protecting Your Court Reporter (15-11)

GENERAL RULE: Transcripts of audio recordings to be played during trial may be provided to the jury to help the jury or judge understand what is being said in the recording.

CC, with all due respect, I don't recall Canepa ever saying the confidential information source/resource was a recording of any kind. I believe that was pure speculation here on WS.

Also, there were audio recordings of some of the Wagners' interviews in 2017.

JMO

 

[Loomis124]

what I am hoping is that no deals are made to remove the death penalty. the viciousness in the killing, the planning, trying to cover up evidence, leaving the babies in pools of their parents blood etc....all of it is pure evil and hatred and the death penalty is something that is created for murders such as these

I totally agree. If anyone deserves it, they do! JMO

 

[Loomis124]

i think that was people speculating in regards to JW putting together the crib etc. I know I saw it too but not sure if it was in an article I read - the one where Jake is talked to by the reporter way before he was a suspect and before they left for Alaska

No proof that I can recall.

 

[Loomis124]

BTW, why would Hanna allow Jake to come and put up a crib? It wasn't even his baby.

 

[TheRevWells]

No proof that I can recall.

i think you are correct. i think it was speculation regarding how the murders could of went down etc and how he could of got access to the trailer via putting together a baby crib etc and when i searched for Jake Wagner Rhoden Baby Crib etc, there was actually a search result for this site in one of the previous threads where people were discussing that option etc

 

[Cool Cats]

I have never seen proof about the crib. I don't recall JW ever mentioning it. If anyone has something other than rumor, can you please share?


What? I was replying to your post about the 404 evidence they had on Jake.


CC, with all due respect, I don't recall Canepa ever saying the confidential information source/resource was a recording of any kind. I believe that was pure speculation here on WS.

Also, there were audio recordings of some of the Wagners' interviews in 2017.

JMO

WAGNER, IV, GEORGE WASHINGTON
02/06/2020 JOURNAL ENTRY

"Counsel for each of the parties confirmed to the Court that counsel for the State of Ohio intends to inform counsel for the Defendant concerning certain parts of the recordings of conversations delivered as part of the discovery that the Defendant's attorneys may wish to focus upon..."

I always assumed this is referring to the confidential reliable source. Which is separate from the recorded phone calls. There is no indication that the revenge conversations were over a phone. They were all talking together at Freds.

So it's either wiretaps hidden in the house or hidden on a person. Which means there are audio recordings from inside Fred's house as well as phone recordings from the Wagner's own phones.. My take on it.

 

[Loomis124]

WAGNER, IV, GEORGE WASHINGTON
02/06/2020 JOURNAL ENTRY

"Counsel for each of the parties confirmed to the Court that counsel for the State of Ohio intends to inform counsel for the Defendant concerning certain parts of the recordings of conversations delivered as part of the discovery that the Defendant's attorneys may wish to focus upon..."

I always assumed this is referring to the confidential reliable source. Which is separate from the recorded phone calls. There is no indication that the revenge conversations were over a phone. They were all talking together at Freds.

So it's either wiretaps hidden in the house or hidden on a person. Which means there are audio recordings from inside Fred's house as well as phone recordings from the Wagner's own phones.. My take on it.

Fredericka Wagner arraignment

Here's FW's arraignment in live. The best one is in YouTube. No recordings mentioned. AC says they have "information." Period. From. "A confidential...." There is NO proof as to in what form this information came from. These assumptions have always irked me because the vehicle of the information is simply just not stated. JMO

We cannot assume "meanings" of what AC said. She said what she said, no more, no less.

 

[Loomis124]

WAGNER, IV, GEORGE WASHINGTON
02/06/2020 JOURNAL ENTRY

"Counsel for each of the parties confirmed to the Court that counsel for the State of Ohio intends to inform counsel for the Defendant concerning certain parts of the recordings of conversations delivered as part of the discovery that the Defendant's attorneys may wish to focus upon..."

I always assumed this is referring to the confidential reliable source. Which is separate from the recorded phone calls. There is no indication that the revenge conversations were over a phone. They were all talking together at Freds.

So it's either wiretaps hidden in the house or hidden on a person. Which means there are audio recordings from inside Fred's house as well as phone recordings from the Wagner's own phones.. My take on it.

I disagree. What if the CFI was there in person.

 

[Loomis124]

WAGNER, IV, GEORGE WASHINGTON
02/06/2020 JOURNAL ENTRY

"Counsel for each of the parties confirmed to the Court that counsel for the State of Ohio intends to inform counsel for the Defendant concerning certain parts of the recordings of conversations delivered as part of the discovery that the Defendant's attorneys may wish to focus upon..."

I always assumed this is referring to the confidential reliable source. Which is separate from the recorded phone calls. There is no indication that the revenge conversations were over a phone. They were all talking together at Freds.

So it's either wiretaps hidden in the house or hidden on a person. Which means there are audio recordings from inside Fred's house as well as phone recordings from the Wagner's own phones.. My take on it.

"...recordings of the conversations DELIVERED as part of the DISCOVERY...
"
Do you recall the date of this Discovery? Thanks

 

[Loomis124]

Does everyone agree that we have no clear, accurate list of Discovery documents in this case on WS? And this is in no way meant to be critical to anyone here. It would just be so helpful if we had a list of and copies of Discovery documents. I have hard copies, but they aren't any use to anyone else. Also as far as I know, there is no post of the March 13, 2020, Discovery submitted at the meeting held at BCI. Without this, a chunk of information is missing. JMO. Also, I don't have a membership to Scribd or contacts with Channel 12 to get continuing Discovery documents to provide here. Can we please get some help from WS staff to provide this info? Much appreciated.

 

[Loomis124]

"...recordings of the conversations DELIVERED as part of the DISCOVERY...
"
Do you recall the date of this Discovery? Thanks

Well, CC?

 

[Cool Cats]

I disagree. What if the CFI was there in person.

Yes, I concede the CRS (confidential reliable source) could be a person who heard conversations or who was told about conversations from Fred herself. Fred discussed her GJ testimony with people and could have said something incriminating.

"...recordings of the conversations DELIVERED as part of the DISCOVERY...
"
Do you recall the date of this Discovery? Thanks

Good call. If we can find the discovery that specifically mentions these recordings then maybe we can get a clearer picture if these are phone recordings or wiretaps from revenge conversations and multiple conversations at Freds.

Fredericka Wagner arraignment

Here's FW's arraignment in live. The best one is in YouTube. No recordings mentioned. AC says they have "information." Period. From. "A confidential...." There is NO proof as to in what form this information came from. These assumptions have always irked me because the vehicle of the information is simply just not stated. JMO

We cannot assume "meanings" of what AC said. She said what she said, no more, no less.

Right, Canepa did not state the exact source of the CRS information which is likely either recordings or from witness statements.

Even though Canepa does not specifically state this I can give my opinion that I still think there are recordings of multiple conversations from Fred's house.

I do not think that witness statements are enough proof. I think the 6 attorneys would get it all thrown out as hearsay. You have to have more in a Capital Case then just someone saying they overheard George saying he was going to go after LE for revenge. I mean anyone could say anything.

Now if I'm wrong and the CRS is just witness testimony, then there will have to be some compelling reasons why this testimony is so believable, such as the witness told someone else and that person can back them up or maybe there are multiple witnesses. They need something compelling or the defense will get it tossed as hearsay and say that the witness is getting revenge on the Wagner's and is a liar.

When the family says to the media that Jake was violent with Hanna it is not hearsay because they can back it up. There are actual Facebook posts by Hanna herself saying Jake was violent. You have to back up what you say because anyone can say anything...and these are Capital Cases that will spend years getting appealed if guilty verdicts are rendered.

....My take on it only....

 

[Loomis124]

Learning the Identity of a Confidential Informant

A confidential information source/resource's identification is protected by law.

 

[Loomis124]

Before further comment, I need to research in detail the differences among audio, phone and wiretap recordings. TY

 

[Loomis124]

Yes, I concede the CRS (confidential reliable source) could be a person who heard conversations or who was told about conversations from Fred herself. Fred discussed her GJ testimony with people and could have said something incriminating.


Good call. If we can find the discovery that specifically mentions these recordings then maybe we can get a clearer picture if these are phone recordings or wiretaps from revenge conversations and multiple conversations at Freds.


Right, Canepa did not state the exact source of the CRS information which is likely either recordings or from witness statements.

Even though Canepa does not specifically state this I can give my opinion that I still think there are recordings of multiple conversations from Fred's house.

I do not think that witness statements are enough proof. I think the 6 attorneys would get it all thrown out as hearsay. You have to have more in a Capital Case then just someone saying they overheard George saying he was going to go after LE for revenge. I mean anyone could say anything.

Now if I'm wrong and the CRS is just witness testimony, then there will have to be some compelling reasons why this testimony is so believable, such as the witness told someone else and that person can back them up or maybe there are multiple witnesses. They need something compelling or the defense will get it tossed as hearsay and say that the witness is getting revenge on the Wagner's and is a liar.

When the family says to the media that Jake was violent with Hanna it is not hearsay because they can back it up. There are actual Facebook posts by Hanna herself saying Jake was violent. You have to back up what you say because anyone can say anything...and these are Capital Cases that will spend years getting appealed if guilty verdicts are rendered.

....My take on it only....

Sigh

 

[NoNameNoSlogan]

I have never seen proof about the crib. I don't recall JW ever mentioning it. If anyone has something other than rumor, can you please share?

I remember the conversation about the crib. I watched it play out on one of the Justice for the Rhoden's Facebook groups. One of Hannah's cousin's was on there replying one night. He stated Jake had been abisive to her in the past, and also how he had been there outing the crib together, very close to the murders. I always thought if this is true, maybe he tried pretending to be nice, right before everything. So he could pick Sofia up before she had the baby? Idk. But I do recall reading a guy cousin stating that on Facebook. Without linking consider this moo, jmo, and delete if necessary. Thanks!