OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) - #29

[rsd1200]

Makes me wonder if they towed BJM's vehicle? Probably not or LM would have mentioned it was towed too. JM may have been exhibiting some unusual behavior that caused LE to think this guy was acting fishy.

I think the killers left the babies in the death beds and did not remove them. Putting the children back would ensure that more DNA could be left and also more blood on the killers' hands and clothing. Just my opinion.

Someone mentioned balaclavas and I agree the killers probably wore them and were dressed in all black. Two people enter the trailers, and they go straight to the bedrooms, position themselves at the foot of the bed, one killer flips on the ceiling light and they both fire away. Alternatively they could have been wearing headlamps so as not to have to use or touch the light switch.

If 4 people were involved, 2 people killed at one trailer and the other 2 take out another trailer. Get the majority of the murders done and lessen the chance of someone calling 911. There may have even been 6 killers for the first 3 trailers - probably my least likely choice.

It may not have mattered if some of their dna got left there. They may not be in CODIS, probably wore gloves if they went to all of the trouble to wear headgear, and blackout clothing, or their dna was common to the homes. My guess is that all three are likely. Hearsay has it that they "beat the ******" out of CR1 & GR (BJM from 9111 call), and hearsay has it that DR was seen by her brother as he started to go inside, so he backed out (AM). DR's trailer wasn't your standard trailer either. It had at least one addition built onto it, and a basement, iirc, so the floor plan would be different. She'd only been in there four weeks. For DR's place, it seems they would have to at least had some heads up to the layout of her home, and her work schedule change. I'd guess more-so than at any of the others. Two teens, two babies, an erratic work schedule, and a new home.

 

[rsd1200]

I don't think they are going to release what caliber of weapon or weapons were used. That is something only the killer(s) would know. I think LE is trying to find out what caliber of weapons the W's owned to match with whatever shell casings they recovered, or bullets in case of a revolver. Sure could be wrong though! Wouldn't be the first time nor the last.

So far they've named no one as a suspect or poi. If they'd just put out a call, early on, in search of a particular firearm(s), that might have been used in a recent crime, w/o stating specifically that they were looking for them relative to the Rhoden/Gilley investigation, (There were other murders to be solved in the region), who knows, some pawn shop may have had them, or some one may reel one in off the banks of the Scioto River. Stranger things have happened. I found a safe in a clear, deep pool, of a stream one time, while out roaming around on back roads. Just stopped to enjoy the day, and decided to wade a bit, caught site of something that didn't look like it belonged there, and checked it out. I was dumbstruck! Called LE when I got home (this was back in the day, well before cell phones) and told them what I'd found, and where it was. It was way too heavy to even budge for one or two people. Found out it had been stolen from a Kroger store in another county. I digress, but, I do believe they could have put that call out, in such a way, that folks wouldn't know which murders they were seeking the firearms. They could have even put out a call for firearm information on another case into the mix for good measure. The level of secrecy on this case is what keeps my the theory that there's a dirty LEO mixed in somewhere, in my top three-five, depending on my mood (and they're trying to get their ducks in a row before it goes public).

 

[pearl]

Every time I watch a crime show that involves a family style murder/murders I listen and observe why they did it, hoping to gain insight into this crime. I watched one a couple of weeks ago about a mother and son and his ex-wife. There was a child involved in the situation also. The mother was very controlling of the son and had been since he was a child. The mother gets the idea to kill the daughter in-law because she feels the ex is inferior to her family and not good enough to be raising her granddaughter. And the son obey's his mother just like he always has (program indicated that mother and son were very close). Only this woman was truly devious! She took out an insurance policy on her daughter-in-law right after the son had divorced her. So they not only ended the ex's life, but tried to financially profit from her death! Some people are true evil![/QUOTE]


Snipped for brevity and bbm

Do you remember if this crime was in southeast Georgia?

 

[Bootsctr]

It may not have mattered if some of their dna got left there. They may not be in CODIS, probably wore gloves if they went to all of the trouble to wear headgear, and blackout clothing, or their dna was common to the homes. My guess is that all three are likely. Hearsay has it that they "beat the ******" out of CR1 & GR (BJM from 9111 call), and hearsay has it that DR was seen by her brother as he started to go inside, so he backed out (AM). DR's trailer wasn't your standard trailer either. It had at least one addition built onto it, and a basement, iirc, so the floor plan would be different. She'd only been in there four weeks. For DR's place, it seems they would have to at least had some heads up to the layout of her home, and her work schedule change. I'd guess more-so than at any of the others. Two teens, two babies, an erratic work schedule, and a new home.

Excellent point. Also I think y'all convinced me that the babies probably were taken out of the bed before people were killed. No one could be 100% sure that the toddler would not have popped straight up in bed after the first shot. It's hard to think about.

 

[amauet1]

Every time I watch a crime show that involves a family style murder/murders I listen and observe why they did it, hoping to gain insight into this crime. I watched one a couple of weeks ago about a mother and son and his ex-wife. There was a child involved in the situation also. The mother was very controlling of the son and had been since he was a child. The mother gets the idea to kill the daughter in-law because she feels the ex is inferior to her family and not good enough to be raising her granddaughter. And the son obey's his mother just like he always has (program indicated that mother and son were very close). Only this woman was truly devious! She took out an insurance policy on her daughter-in-law right after the son had divorced her. So they not only ended the ex's life, but tried to financially profit from her death! Some people are true evil![/QUOTE]


Snipped for brevity and bbm

Do you remember if this crime was in southeast Georgia?

Sometimes the "quote button doesn't work. And I don't remember where the case was from, but I think it was a cold case. Again sorry.

 

[Renee110]

UPDATE: Attorney: Family investigated in 8 killings has cooperated

http://www.wsaz.com/content/news/Oh...in-Rhoden-murder-investigation-429462583.html

But... they cooperated BEFORE they left... they are not cooperating NOW...

 

[evelezrn]

To jump off your post RSD...

I'm sure many Websleuthers remember one of our finest sleuthers who went by the name "Foxfire". He unexpectedly passed on several months ago.

I remember him well. He was a mentor to many and taught us much in solving missing persons cases.

One of Foxfire's most passionate subjects was how helpful private citizens can be in assisting LE in many situations. I realize this is not a "missing persons" case, but it applies in crimes like this too. An informed public is more aware of what to look for and will call LE with tips about things they might not have otherwise known was helpful or important.

I realize there are many things LE must withhold from the general public, but to remain secretive about every single detail is not helping solve this crime.

 

[Betty P]

To jump off your post RSD...

I'm sure many Websleuthers remember one of our finest sleuthers who went by the name "Foxfire". He unexpectedly passed on several months ago.

I remember him well. He was a mentor to many and taught us much in solving missing persons cases.

One of Foxfire's most passionate subjects was how helpful private citizens can be in assisting LE in many situations. I realize this is not a "missing persons" case, but it applies in crimes like this too. An informed public is more aware of what to look for and will call LE with tips about things they might not have otherwise known was helpful or important.

I realize there are many things LE must withhold from the general public, but to remain secretive about every single detail is not helping solve this crime.

Thanks for the wonderful comment and the kind words about Foxfire. I didn't realize he had passed and am sorry to hear it.

You are so right. It's difficult for the public to help when they have so little information about the crime.

 

[pearl]

I thought I would share some of my ideas and opinions. I do not know any of the victims, their families or friends, or anyone in LE in the state of Ohio. Pike County reminds me so much of the county in which I live. I get all my info from MSM, WS, and other websites. I read this forum daily but rarely post.
I think I am beyond being surprised about the twists and turns in this case. So many theories that have been discussed could have merit as some have been quite plausible.
My take on Sheriff Reader, AG DeWine, and the BCI. I think local LE had a good idea of the killers on the first day, maybe not the trigger pullers then but which way the investigation would go. I have more faith and trust in Sheriff Reader than AG DeWine because I think the AG is using the case for political gain. I mean, I have never before heard of a state’s attorney general being actively involved in an investigation. Reader comes across to me as a man who is frustrated and uncomfortable with the investigation. BCI and the legal eagles in the AG’s office are calling the plays aren’t they? I think Reader might have already made an arrest(s) if it was his decision to make. Reader seems to be personally horrified by these murders in his jurisdiction. The investigation itself seems confusing. I think this is because, yes, the killer(s) opened a pandora’s box into crime organization in Pike County and surrounding area. I think LE is using this time to take down as many criminals as possible. I base this on the number of busts, etc since the murders. Every action and communicationby LE is calculated to the nth degree for a specific reason. LE is not dumb. They know who they are dealing with. Think of the SWAT teams that accompany them.
Pike County is very similar to the county in which I live which is in another part of the USA. I’ll call my county by its nickname, Bloody. Here, we have many of the same problems that occur in Pike County. Demographics very similar:
square miles—Pike 444, Bloody 371
2010 Census population—Pike 28,256,Bloody 26,067
Dec 2016 unemployment rate—Pike 7.4%,Bloody 7.5%
poverty rate—Pike 23.1%, Bloody 24.8%
crime rateindex—Pike 161, Bloody 169
There was a mass murder in a small community in my county on Dec 4, 1997. A 20 year old man entered a home and killed the 43 year old father, the 33 year old mother, a 16 year old daughter, and an 8 year old son. He kidnapped and molested 3 girls aged 8, 9, and 10 years old. He left alive in the house a 10 month old boy and a 5 year old boy. Thankfully, he was arrested within 12 hours. The killer was up close and personal to the family, the 16 year old girl’s former admirer.
Some families here have over the years and still supplement their incomes by selling a little reefer. The ones I have known are indeed doing something illegal, but, they are also good people.
Whomever did these murders in Pike County, IMO, was someone(s) up close and personal. I can recall only reading about two groups of people who have been identified as being of interest to LE who are up close and personal. But then, I really don’t know a whole lot of things and can be way off base at times.

 

[Betty P]

But... they cooperated BEFORE they left... they are not cooperating NOW...

And LE seems to be bending over backward to avoid saying so. If DeWine, BCI and Rob Junk applied even half the pressure to the W family that they have to the Manleys and surviving Rhoden's this case would be much farther along, probably resolved.

But for some reason, LE is holding back. For some odd reason they're afraid to pursue major suspects in this case. I have my theories, but won't say why.

 

[Betty P]

After this gang announcement b.s. I'm starting to lean your way a bit. If they were coming it was poorly handled. Andy and Barney could have done better.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Not just Reader. Likely Junk feels the same way. DeWine wants nothing to do with it. He probably wishes he'd never heard of this case, would like it to all just go away.

ETA: I've always wondered about this case for this reason. Do they hammer the public and threaten their safety as a front to make it look like they want people to send in tips, but they don't really want them to?

Is that why they refused to even talk about a reward fund, why they seldom discuss the paltry one they now have?

They want to talk trash about people in the community, but don't want them to talk about the crime going on there? They just want them to turn themselves in for smoking a joint or taking heroin, but not talk about who the dealers or big bosses are? Is that the drift I'm picking up here?

"Tell us who killed the Rhoden's, but don't tell who was behind it?" Is that the message from LE? Cause it might interfere with the next election or something?

 

[rsd1200]

BBM

IDK. All I know this correction was placed at the top of that article.

If they keep retracting and scrubbing everything from the news articles, maybe eventually they will retract the murders themselves. We will all wake up one day questioning whether we dreamed the last year and a half on here. I think I will go join the R's on whatever beach they are laid up on.

Seriously, I say this tongue in cheek but....we have seen no photos of any bodies being removed, roads sealed off and no media within a mile of the crime scenes, no autopsy reports, children tucked out of sight in CPS custody, court records involving children sealed, no photos of MJ plants being removed, crime scenes sealed up tight in a warehouse out of the view of the public, search warrants sealed, court orders ordering the sealing of the search warrants sealed, no POI, no suspects, no press releases and Mike Brady er excuse me Dewine talking in circles leading us through a non ending maze of confusion, Reader warning anyone who talks they will be killed by gang members....this is beginning to look like the Twilight Zone.

I really am questioning whether the R's were ever killed, or just made to disappear into a witness protection program with RR and baby K.

I am shaking my head so much hubby is beginning to question if I have something medically wrong.

I'm not really a conspiracy theorist (well except maybe for the moon landing. :thinking: j.k.), but I'm pickin' up what you're layin' down. It is strange. We know that little B exists, we've seen photos of S, but don't know the dates the photos were taken, but she does seem older in the most recent one. I know that you are speaking "tongue in cheek", as am I, but I was re-reading, again, last night and, again, nothing adds up.

HHG's Momma:
But sheriff's squad cars blocked Union Hill Road by the time she and her husband, who worked with Frankie at a local sawmill, got there. She pleaded with them to tell her what was going on. She begged for any information. She was hollering at them and, as the minutes wore on, screaming. Frantic, she called a friend who made it up the road before it was blocked. Please, please, please tell me if HHG is OK, she asked. "I just kept asking: 'What about HHG ?' " AC said in an exclusive interview with the Enquirer. "But she didn't want to tell me. She didn't want to.

AC spends most days believing HHG is still alive. Sometimes, she calls her older daughter, MG, to confirm that HHGis dead. MG saw her sister after death; AC did not.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2016/10/25/ohio-family-massacre-rhoden/92757182/

From what I've understood, from following this, throughout the past year, HHG's mother lived less than 10 miles away from UHR, and the sawmill is barely over 12 miles, where AC's husband worked w/FR.

Little B's Momma:
She doesn’t have to look at her phone to recall that it was 8:14 a.m. on April 22 when she got the news. She left her job at a doctor’s office in Portsmouth, stopped to pick up her mom and made the normally 45-minute trip to Union Hill Road in Pike County in 20 minutes. They arrived before all the roads were blocked off ...

http://www.dispatch.com/content/sto...d-pike-county-shootings-learns-to-adjust.html

Again, from articles and what I've gathered from following this throughout the year, it's right at a 50 mile drive.

I'm not saying anything negative about either of the above, but, how could one get there, from Portsmouth, pick up their Mom, and arrive before the roads closed? Yet a mother, and step-father, living and working within fifteen minutes or less, did not make it before the roads closed? Who are all of these people who made it within the perimeter? Who called who, and told them their kin was dead? It doesn't sound like it was LE that spread the word, but what I find odd, is since that day not one of them has leaked nary a word for an entire year. Were those at the scene sworn to silence? The two people with BJM have flown way under the radar. Not one single interview (not that I blame them) or soundbite.

I'd think there'd be sirens since there were children, reported alive, within the homes. Helicopters overhead. I'd have been online, and on the phone, purely out of wondering what was going on, and b/c I had family in the area that all of the commotion was rolling toward. I've had my family call if a slew of LE, Ambulances, etc... come rolling down the road, just to make sure it's not one of us. How did some of these folks get in but others did not, who lived so close?

I'm like you Raisin, this is just too weird.

 

[Dudly]

Not just Reader. Likely Junk feels the same way. DeWine wants nothing to do with it. He probably wishes he'd never heard of this case, would like it to all just go away.

ETA: I've always wondered about this case for this reason. Do they hammer the public and threaten their safety as a front to make it look like they want people to send in tips, but they don't really want them to?

Is that why they refused to even talk about a reward fund, why they seldom discuss the paltry one they now have?

They want to talk trash about people in the community, but don't want them to talk about the crime going on there? They just want them to turn themselves in for smoking a joint or taking heroin, but not talk about who the dealers or big bosses are? Is that the drift I'm picking up here?

"Tell us who killed the Rhoden's, but don't tell who was behind it?" Is that the message from LE? Cause it might interfere with the next election or something?

I don't know that there is any rhyme or reason to what LE is doing in this case. Any more I'm not sure I'll believe them when they do name POIs or file charges...
I

 

[Dudly]

I'm not really a conspiracy theorist (well except maybe for the moon landing. :thinking: j.k.), but I'm pickin' up what you're layin' down. It is strange. We know that little B exists, we've seen photos of S, but don't know the dates the photos were taken, but she does seem older in the most recent one. I know that you are speaking "tongue in cheek", as am I, but I was re-reading, again, last night and, again, nothing adds up.

HHG's Momma:
But sheriff's squad cars blocked Union Hill Road by the time she and her husband, who worked with Frankie at a local sawmill, got there. She pleaded with them to tell her what was going on. She begged for any information. She was hollering at them and, as the minutes wore on, screaming. Frantic, she called a friend who made it up the road before it was blocked. Please, please, please tell me if HHG is OK, she asked. "I just kept asking: 'What about HHG ?' " AC said in an exclusive interview with the Enquirer. "But she didn't want to tell me. She didn't want to.

AC spends most days believing HHG is still alive. Sometimes, she calls her older daughter, MG, to confirm that HHGis dead. MG saw her sister after death; AC did not.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2016/10/25/ohio-family-massacre-rhoden/92757182/

From what I've understood, from following this, throughout the past year, HHG's mother lived less than 10 miles away from UHR, and the sawmill is barely over 12 miles, where AC's husband worked w/FR.

Little B's Momma:
She doesn’t have to look at her phone to recall that it was 8:14 a.m. on April 22 when she got the news. She left her job at a doctor’s office in Portsmouth, stopped to pick up her mom and made the normally 45-minute trip to Union Hill Road in Pike County in 20 minutes. They arrived before all the roads were blocked off ...

http://www.dispatch.com/content/sto...d-pike-county-shootings-learns-to-adjust.html

Again, from articles and what I've gathered from following this throughout the year, it's right at a 50 mile drive.

I'm not saying anything negative about either of the above, but, how could one get there, from Portsmouth, pick up their Mom, and arrive before the roads closed? Yet a mother, and step-father, living and working within fifteen minutes or less, did not make it before the roads closed? Who are all of these people who made it within the perimeter? Who called who, and told them their kin was dead? It doesn't sound like it was LE that spread the word, but what I find odd, is since that day not one of them has leaked nary a word for an entire year. Were those at the scene sworn to silence? The two people with BJM have flown way under the radar. Not one single interview (not that I blame them) or soundbite.

I'd think there'd be sirens since there were children, reported alive, within the homes. Helicopters overhead. I'd have been online, and on the phone, purely out of wondering what was going on, and b/c I had family in the area that all of the commotion was rolling toward. I've had my family call if a slew of LE, Ambulances, etc... come rolling down the road, just to make sure it's not one of us. How did some of these folks get in but others did not, who lived so close?

I'm like you Raisin, this is just too weird.

These two people were never named either, that I recall. It was a male friend of BJM and his wife? And they might have followed her into one of the homes? Not even LM slipped up and named them. I suppose we can't talk about them either since they haven't been named in MSM...

 

[rsd1200]

UPDATE: Attorney: Family investigated in 8 killings has cooperated

http://www.wsaz.com/content/news/Oh...in-Rhoden-murder-investigation-429462583.html

the Wagner family provided laptops, phones and DNA samples to investigators and agreed to be interviewed about the Rhoden family slayings in Pike County in April 2016

Providing one's laptops, phones, and dna samples, along with voluntarily being interviewed, is no small thing. I personally would like to keep my dna to myself (but I'm just funny like that), no one touches my tech stuff, and I'd talk to no one w/o my lawyer present. I'm not the most trusting of individuals, but that's just me. I'd have never told LM that I trashed that GPS tracker. See what happened there?

 

[rsd1200]

Not just Reader. Likely Junk feels the same way. DeWine wants nothing to do with it. He probably wishes he'd never heard of this case, would like it to all just go away.

ETA: I've always wondered about this case for this reason. Do they hammer the public and threaten their safety as a front to make it look like they want people to send in tips, but they don't really want them to?

Is that why they refused to even talk about a reward fund, why they seldom discuss the paltry one they now have?

They want to talk trash about people in the community, but don't want them to talk about the crime going on there? They just want them to turn themselves in for smoking a joint or taking heroin, but not talk about who the dealers or big bosses are? Is that the drift I'm picking up here?

"Tell us who killed the Rhoden's, but don't tell who was behind it?" Is that the message from LE? Cause it might interfere with the next election or something?

I'm kinda feeling your vibe. I sometimes feel that Reader is a man who wants this solved but his hands are tied, I've seen emotion in his eyes, and heard it in his voice, and wondered if he knew what he was stepping into when he agreed to interim Sheriff's position. Maybe he thought he could make a difference. In the very beginning I think many elected officials start off with that pie in the sky idea.

 

[rsd1200]

These two people were never named either, that I recall. It was a male friend of BJM and his wife? And they might have followed her into one of the homes? Not even LM slipped up and named them. I suppose we can't talk about them either since they haven't been named in MSM...

No, we can't talk about them, but, BJM remembers blood being everywhere, screaming Rhoden x 3, detail about finding the bodies, how they were beaten, drug to the bedroom, picked up the babies, put one in a sweatshirt, got them out of there, but;

BJM said she thinks one of the people in her car may have followed her into one of the trailers, but she's not sure which one or what they saw.

She said she can't remember many details after the discoveries, including how her older brother, JM, came to find their sister DR dead in her trailer, which is north of the other two trailers on Union Hill Road.

"He could hear the baby crying and he backed up out of there," said his wife, AM, in a separate interview describing what her husband told her. "He didn't want to find his niece like that."

BJM doesn't remember, AM has not divulged anything other than the above as far as I know, and I'm not sure that I've ever heard JM speak about that day, himself. I've not heard any of the other folks there say how JM came upon the scene at DR's. Has LM ever stated publicly how JM happened to be there? I remember that he was upset that JM's truck was confiscated.

http://www.wfaa.com/news/nation-now/ohio-massacre-i-was-not-leaving-those-babies-in-there/185981000

 

[Jennifer17]

No, we can't talk about them, but, BJM remembers blood being everywhere, screaming Rhoden x 3, detail about finding the bodies, how they were beaten, drug to the bedroom, picked up the babies, put one in a sweatshirt, got them out of there, but;

BJM said she thinks one of the people in her car may have followed her into one of the trailers, but she's not sure which one or what they saw.

She said she can't remember many details after the discoveries, including how her older brother, JM, came to find their sister DR dead in her trailer, which is north of the other two trailers on Union Hill Road.

"He could hear the baby crying and he backed up out of there," said his wife, AM, in a separate interview describing what her husband told her. "He didn't want to find his niece like that."

BJM doesn't remember, AM has not divulged anything other than the above as far as I know, and I'm not sure that I've ever heard JM speak about that day, himself. I've not heard any of the other folks there say how JM came upon the scene at DR's. Has LM ever stated publicly how JM happened to be there? I remember that he was upset that JM's truck was confiscated.

http://www.wfaa.com/news/nation-now/ohio-massacre-i-was-not-leaving-those-babies-in-there/185981000

I can understand how JM did not want to see anything more terrible than his sister dead at the door. The baby was crying, she was obviously alive and her mother was not able to tend to her needs. He presumed that HR was dead also. I don't find that strange. He had already seen his sister dead. I think that that is just self protection from horror. He knew someone would come and get the live baby out of there, but he could not handle the horror. Women are a little better at that than men. Women see blood every month, men don't.

 

[rsd1200]

I can understand how JM did not want to see anything more terrible than his sister dead at the door. The baby was crying, she was obviously alive and her mother was not able to tend to her needs. He presumed that HR was dead also. I don't find that strange. He had already seen his sister dead. I think that that is just self protection from horror. He knew someone would come and get the live baby out of there, but he could not handle the horror. Women are a little better at that than men. Women see blood every month, men don't.

How did he know if she was dead or not? How did he know if CR2 was dead or not? What about S or her Mommy. S was picked up at 10:30 the night before if we go by the original statement. Almost two days early. For all intents and purposes, she should have been there. Apparently BJM didn't call her brother. So far it's been hearsay that he saw his sis as he went in the door. JM has never said it himself that I remember reading. 95% of the physicians who've patched me up over the years, have been male so I don't think the blood thing, and females being better with dealing with it, is the reason. I'm not calling him a coward, but, out of all of the family who found family, that day JM has never made a statement as to how he ended up there, what he saw, why he didn't go in, was the door unlocked (it's been said that only KR's was left unlocked), did he have a key if so, did he truly hear the newborn crying or did that get misconstrued, and how did he know that everyone was already past him being able to help them, including S who should have been there that week?

He doesn't have to give a statement, and I'd not, w/o a lawyer by my side, but DR's place has a whole lot of whys for me.

Bobby Jo discovered Chris Sr., Gary, Frankie and Gilley. Her older brother, James Manley, found his sister before he backed out of the trailer, where he assumed his niece, Hanna Rhoden, and his nephew, Chris Rhoden were, family members said.

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...enge-our-hearts-pike-co-family-says/83517330/

 

[Jennifer17]

How did he know if she was dead or not? How did he know if CR2 was dead or not? What about S or her Mommy. S was picked up at 10:30 the night before if we go by the original statement. Almost two days early. For all intents and purposes, she should have been there. Apparently BJM didn't call her brother. So far it's been hearsay that he saw his sis as he went in the door. JM has never said it himself that I remember reading. 95% of the physicians who've patched me up over the years, have been male so I don't think the blood thing, and females being better with dealing with it, is the reason. I'm not calling him a coward, but, out of all of the family who found family, that day JM has never made a statement as to how he ended up there, what he saw, why he didn't go in, was the door unlocked (it's been said that only KR's was left unlocked), did he have a key if so, did he truly hear the newborn crying or did that get misconstrued, and how did he know that everyone was already past him being able to help them, including S who should have been there that week?

He doesn't have to give a statement, and I'd not, w/o a lawyer by my side, but DR's place has a whole lot of whys for me.

Bobby Jo discovered Chris Sr., Gary, Frankie and Gilley. Her older brother, James Manley, found his sister before he backed out of the trailer, where he assumed his niece, Hanna Rhoden, and his nephew, Chris Rhoden were, family members said.

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...enge-our-hearts-pike-co-family-says/83517330/

Have you ever seen a dead person, They do not look like they are sleeping peacefully, they look like they are dead,