OH - Pike County: 8 People From One Family Dead As Police Hunt For Killer(s) #36 *Arrests*

[Gracie55]

I've wondered, all through this, if they tried to make it appear that KR did this, or, with KR being different, they were trying for the drug deal gone bad, angle, and KR was the head honcho. DS, while I think he's a sketchy fella, I think that he came off as being more-so sketchy, because he'd tried to pull a fast one over on his wife that night, and had claimed to be at KR's. He wasn't, he was with a female friend. When they asked him to go check on KR, he knew his cousin was likely dead, and he knew he was going to look suspicious, in addition to his marriage was likely going to be over too (and it was), in addition, it appears that the Rs and Ms have kinda ostracized him. He may have taken something, thinking, in his eyes, that LE is going to take it anyway, so I'll just take it before they do.

I initially suspected DS, but it appears to me he was another victim of the W's selfishness. A lot of the important peeps in his life died, regardless of how up-and-coming his life was or is. ChSr was likely a stabilizing influence for him. How will this poor family ever repair themselves, be it Rs or Ms or Gs or who did I forget? Not to mention the biggest victims, who lost their parent.(s). The echoes of this family annihlation will reverberate through generations, lost history never made.

 

[Betty P]

BETTYP Oh for sure...some are "considering" entering a plea. JW is the weakest link. IMO... I think the parents will protect their youngest and IV will always be the big brother, even though I think he had the weakest motive. (Only what I have seen in other cases...but who knows....it is not as if they can all sit at FW's dining table and make future plans)
"...BOTH… the judge AND the prosecutor… want to make sure the defense attorney is not being negligent or committing malpractice in advising their client or allowing their client to enter a plea of guilty. EVEN IF the defense attorney wants to commit career-suicide and throw their client under the bus for WHATEVER reason, the prosecutor and judge should be making sure it doesn’t happen."
https://www.quora.com/If-someone-pl...lso-when-would-the-sentencing-occur-Would-the

I agree. Even this early in the process, some of the perps may be thinking about a plea deal. The Wagners don't need to look at the evidence, they already know what took place, what weapons were used, how victims were killed, in what order, what phone calls were made, who hacked phones and email, etc. From the indictments, they know that LE has all the electronic, internet, social media, ballistics, etc. evidence. JMO, they very clearly see the handwriting on the wall.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

That is such an interesting theory.

Two questions. 1. Did we ever find out who Clarence R's victims were and 2. How do we know JW was trying to get back with HR? Was there some reporting on that?

Yes it was in the first interview he did I think. He said he was hoping HR would come back to him.

 

[Julia966]

Thank you for the abbreviation list from a ways back. I've been wondering what "BBM" means forever!

 

[Jax49]

Thank you for the abbreviation list from a ways back. I've been wondering what "BBM" means forever!

There is also a lingo list not unique to this thread.

Websleuths Lingo

 

[Julia966]

There is also a lingo list not unique to this thread.

Websleuths Lingo

Oh, that's great, thank you! I was doing all right but BBM had me stumped.

 

[gracehatter]

I agree. Even this early in the process, some of the perps may be thinking about a plea deal. The Wagners don't need to look at the evidence, they already know what took place, what weapons were used, how victims were killed, in what order, what phone calls were made, who hacked phones and email, etc. From the indictments, they know that LE has all the electronic, internet, social media, ballistics, etc. evidence. JMO, they very clearly see the handwriting on the wall.

When I said it’s too early in the process for plea deals I mean in the legal process the professionals will not put those on the table until at least the pretrials. Sure defendants think about them but no professionals will advise that at such an early stage, mainly because they haven’t even entered their pleas, that is the purpose of the arraignments and there is a procedural process that has to take place...dot the i’s and cross the t’s.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

That's awesome, Dudly! I get why some folks like the trophies, I get why some folks don't. Either or, the heads on the wall didn't disturb me as much as the "selling point" of their Alaskan Dall Rams as; Give'em a few more years and they'd look good mounted. That's not hunting, and although you'd probably eat them, I've never known anyone to mount a cow's head that they've taken from the farm, to the freezer. I just found it odd.

On another note, back to the house, it was not painted red until after the murders. Sometime after June 2016, when they were building the stock barn and open side barn across the road.

bbm

it was not painted red until after the murders.

I cannot tell you on how many levels that disturbs me.

Graphic recreation of the crime scene?

JMO

 

[RAISINISBACK]

I always kinda wondered about KR. His murder just stands out as different. Location is different altogether. Only one shot. The cash at his feet. It almost seems like they intended for it to appear that he committed the murders. Only thing missing was the gun. Or guns. That leads me to wonder about the cousin who found him. He just seems kinda shifty to me. He doesn't come off as believable or sincere. May just be how he is. Part of me thinks he *may* have taken advantage of the situation and rummaged for anything he may want for himself. If he did that, could he have taken any gun or guns he saw and wanted? What about the gun that KR supposedly kept under his pillow? Was it found?
If the gun or guns used to kill the rest of them was found with KR, I don't think we would be talking about it now. Just my random thoughts as I battle insomnia tonight.

I think KR's son was with him when he discovered the body. IIRC

 

[RAISINISBACK]

They had a lot of animals on there, and did set it up to earn a living from it, but, I concur, it is not the type of farm that I was raised on either. No room for furry pet pigs and pocket beagles... That's why I call it an animal pyramid scheme most times.

However, why would they plan a murder for months, buy a farm, build barns, paint-paper, buy and/or move animals there, then, all of a sudden, act very guilty and start selling the animals off, along with their home, and make a big move to AK? It really made them appear as guilty as sin.

BBM

It is because they knew they were guilty. That kind of knowledge cannot be kept inside. It is why family and friends are asked if they observed someone acting strangely after a murder. That kind of guilty knowledge has a way of showing itself.

JMO

 

[RAISINISBACK]

A lot of work and money too. They had all new fencing put in, the barn seemed very nice, and there was the other work barn across the road to store machinery/trucks/tools etc... Fencing alone is not cheap and neither are barns. Something must have happened around the time they put it up for sale. Were there any other murders around June or July in that area, I wonder?

Maybe that is when they realized that LE was looking at them as suspects and they may get caught and go to jail. Their first urge was to run. As far away as they could get, like Alaska.

 

[Gracie55]

bbm

it was not painted red until after the murders.

I cannot tell you on how many levels that disturbs me.

Graphic recreation of the crime scene?

JMO

Probably pic of eerie red house will show up on book cover

 

[Julia966]

Maybe that is when they realized that LE was looking at them as suspects and they may get caught and go to jail. Their first urge was to run. As far away as they could get, like Alaska.

That was my thought too, plus the fact that they had apparently visited before. Do we know why they came back?

 

[Charliegizmo49]

Excerpts and all opinion.

Angela couldn’t remember a time she didn’t have dark thoughts. She had managed to maintain control of them most of the time, until she couldn’t.

When she was small she was confused by them. She loved nothing, no one and didn’t understand those around her that did.

Her confusion was so overwhelming she often acted out with no remorse at all. She apologized for her bad behavior only when her mother demanded it. And Angela was careful not to get caught doing bad things. She knew her mother would try to make things right and that always began with Angela, head down, the forced tears dampening her cheeks mustering remorse more believable with time.

Angela went against the predictable behavior of first hurting animals. She never found satisfaction in hurting a dog or cat.

She started right off with people. The first, she remembered was a boy in 2nd grade who didn’t speak. Stanley looked normal but he never said a word. Stanley was Autistic and lived in the confines of his own little world. He couldn’t defend himself, deny he had done anything wrong, or even tattled on anybody.

That’s why Angela picked him to bear the blame of the damage she herself did in the 2nd grade.

Angela would never forget her 8th birthday at school. Teachers always brought homemade cake for each students birthday. As Angela blew out the candles on her cake the flames brought into focus the bad thoughts she had trouble controlling. Later during the afternoon recess, she mad sure Stanley was behind the building as she poured the gas and oil mixture all over the back wall. The school and the church shared the same building in Four Corners. Otherwise kids wouldn’t get formal learning at all. On that day, Angela would stop school for at least 2 weeks. And put all the blame on Stanley, who just stood 15 feet away mesmerized by the boom when gas met fire.

Carefully looking around to make sure no one who could tell was watching, Angela had poured half of the gas on the back of the church/ school. 10 minutes later Stanley was still watching when she lit it afire and ran.

The teacher found Stanley frozen in the same place watching the school burn and his eyes locked into the flames.

No one was hurt that day. Angela had let the dark out and managed to place Stanley in the right place to take the blame. She laughed all the way home as she lagged behind the other kids. The walk was easier that afternoon and she used the time to think about the next time she’d deal with the dark thoughts she’d had forever.

The next time a human would not be so lucky.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

A member here was looking for this interview. I’m unsure if it was found or posted yet. If it was, please disregard.

Kenneth Rhoden (Gary’s father) interview

 

[Charliegizmo49]

That was my thought too, plus the fact that they had apparently visited before. Do we know why they came back?

Yes. Alaska wasn’t far enough. Most of us looked at them suspiciously even after their church and pastor vouched for them.

They didn’t want to work hard or in the cold, and they didn’t like the Ohio undercovers in their butts.

 

[Betty P]

When I said it’s too early in the process for plea deals I mean in the legal process the professionals will not put those on the table until at least the pretrials. Sure defendants think about them but no professionals will advise that at such an early stage, mainly because they haven’t even entered their pleas, that is the purpose of the arraignments and there is a procedural process that has to take place...dot the i’s and cross the t’s.

Thanks, yes, I understand that. Have followed a few trials. Nevermind, I'm not making my point clearly here, so will drop the topic. There's no point in starting an argument.

 

[kaykay543]

I just had a thought, and it's only a thought that popped into my own head. KyMamma mentioned the $$ around KR, we know that CR1 had a safe in his trailer too (there was an inventory recpt for it). Could they have stolen a significant amount of $$ from the Rs when they committed the murders? If so, were they not bright enough to wait a period of time prior to starting farm renovations? In the pictures for May, she says winter projects are being completed, but that's a lot of projects and you'd have to sell a whole lot of pigs and hair sheep. Just spitballing.

I was told year’s ago that FW is worth millions. I never doubted it.

They may have stole money but it wasn’t for FW imo

 

[Normrock]

That was my thought too, plus the fact that they had apparently visited before. Do we know why they came back?

That first winter probably got them. Also, extended family not close by.

 

[Normrock]

A member here was looking for this interview. I’m unsure if it was found or posted yet. If it was, please disregard.

Kenneth Rhoden (Gary’s father) interview

I was asking about different caliber weapon that was supposedly used to shoot GR. Someone said it was in an interview with his father. Not in this one. You can feel this mans pain through video. Also, turn on CC (close caption) it was worse translation ever.