GUILTY OH - Two women & child killed, 13yo abducted, Apple Valley, 10 Nov 2010 #8

[snapdragon]

Has anyone considered HOW he returned home or to TH's house after he left her truck 7 miles away? Someone had to have seen him-either walking or someone gave him a ride.

I think he brought SM home in middle of nite to his house. Someone heard or saw something and tipped off LE, who was building a case, researching the receipt, and had to get a Search Warrant. LE KNEW SM was in MH's house.

 

[CKay]

Is the garage attached or unattached?


If he did everything with the jeep, why would he come back and move the truck to near the college? Doesn't make sense-why not leave it there? I think he PUT SS's car in the garage to HIDE it.. I mean, he wouldn't know if SS's family/kids would be looking for her... first place they might ck was TH's house. But if no car outside, then no suspicion. On the other hand, from statements alluding to the fact that he was watching the Herrmann/Borders household, I think he very well KNEW when Borders would be gone, and who typically came and went.

I think the "evidence" they found in SS's car was MH's fingerprints/and or hair from moving it into the garage. I think he loaded the back of the truck, and perhaps took SM at that time as well.

The garage is attached.

The "why" of it all is mind boggling. Perhaps he realized he left something and went back? Then decided to take other truck? Better joy ride? It was more of a zoom zoom'ish truck (I think). Who knows how this sicko thinks *shiver*

 

[CKay]

Has anyone considered HOW he returned home or to TH's house after he left her truck 7 miles away? Someone had to have seen him-either walking or someone gave him a ride.

To add: I think he probably was on foot when he arrived at TH's house. If where he was spotted, after the truck was found, is where he originally left his car, that puts him on foot on the Kokosing Gap Trail. He's fit and a wilderness guy. Not a stretch, no matter how far it seems.

Then he leaves the house (after the crime) with SS's Jeep, drops Sarah at house, disposes of bodies, and was probably planning on going back for car at that point. Did he realize he forgot something at house and return, park SS's Jeep back in garage, leave in TH's truck ??

But the truck is found back near the trail. He is spotted by LE a few hours later, sitting in his car (close enough to be watching LE). He would have had to drive by LE to get out of parking lot, and maybe he just sat that and hoped they didn't notice (or enjoyed watching them scramble around).

 

[passionflower]

Has anyone considered HOW he returned home or to TH's house after he left her truck 7 miles away? Someone had to have seen him-either walking or someone gave him a ride.

and what about his bloody clothes???
then again, it was hunting season....deer archery I believe.
odd no hunters in the woods he was in...............

 

[CKay]

and what about his bloody clothes???
then again, it was hunting season....deer archery I believe.
odd no hunters in the woods he was in...............

That (very-chatty-to-the-media) neighbor did say that he made fires in his backyard. One on that Wednesday night, but she didn't say what time. If not there, anywhere. Another hollow tree? Who knows.

 

[passionflower]

There's something relevant about MH to me. We all ask how someone could be so awful? How can someone do such things to another human being? It's so utterly preverse we feel a need to know or understand.

The first thing I noticed about this guy in the few photographs we have seen of him is that he has Sanpaku Eyes. The three whites we call them. Of course this can be dismissed as pure bull. However there's something to it. We actually had a thread in the Jury room on it. People with these eyes included Diane Downes. I call them upsidedown eyes.

Here's a link to some of the information. Basically these people are prone to depression, anger, putting themselves at high risk. This MH did all that.


http://www.redicecreations.com/article.php?id=4762

Again, I am not saying this is a given. I learned about it years ago from a friend who did a clinical in a Psyche Hospital. From that point on I have always looked out for that.

Thanks Filly, I just learned something new............
great example:
The second type is yang sanpaku, white showing above the iris; here the iris sinks downward toward the bottom eyelid. This reveals a dangerous or violent character. Charles Manson has beautiful yang sanpaku eyes.

I'll never forget the Manson eyes!!!

 

[Texas Mist]

There's something relevant about MH to me. We all ask how someone could be so awful? How can someone do such things to another human being? It's so utterly preverse we feel a need to know or understand.

The first thing I noticed about this guy in the few photographs we have seen of him is that he has Sanpaku Eyes. The three whites we call them. Of course this can be dismissed as pure bull. However there's something to it. We actually had a thread in the Jury room on it. People with these eyes included Diane Downes. I call them upsidedown eyes.

Here's a link to some of the information. Basically these people are prone to depression, anger, putting themselves at high risk. This MH did all that.


http://www.redicecreations.com/article.php?id=4762

Again, I am not saying this is a given. I learned about it years ago from a friend who did a clinical in a Psyche Hospital. From that point on I have always looked out for that.

Interesting, Filly -- maybe that's why some people give us the creeps...the subconscious noticing those yang sanpaku eyes...I'm gonna start paying a lot more attention to perps & suspects, and the folks I see IRL.

 

[passionflower]

Do we have any close up pix of MH eyes to study what kind he has?
All I saw in the videos was very cold blank eyes, now I would lik to see the whites.......

 

[CKay]

For anyone wondering about where TH's truck was found, in relation to where MH's car was spotted by LE "in the area", KAE made this map:

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=U...75615,-82.4054&spn=0.003797,0.007188&t=h&z=18

Notice the Kokosing Gap Trail? It goes north and near (enough) to TH and SS's houses.

 

[CKay]

That's also near where the garbage bags (duct taped) and tarp where found by searchers (forget which day).

 

[SmoothOperator]

Here's the proof that Hoffman was in his car watching at the time the Herrman truck was found.. here's snip and link...

snipped~
Barber revealed for the first time at his press briefing Monday that a sheriff’s deputy talked to Hoffman in the area where a truck belonging to Herrmann was found late Thursday. Hoffman was sitting in his vehicle at a parking lot of the Kokosing Gap Trail, near the Brown Family Environmental Center, around the same time Herrmann’s truck was found there later in the evening. Barber said it is routine for deputies to check out people in a situation like that and sometimes run a check on the car and its registration.

http://www.mountvernonnews.com/local/10/11/16/search-continues-for-missing-trio-2

 

[CKay]

Here's the proof that Hoffman was in his car watching at the time the Herrman truck was found.. here's snip and link...

snipped~
Barber revealed for the first time at his press briefing Monday that a sheriff’s deputy talked to Hoffman in the area where a truck belonging to Herrmann was found late Thursday. Hoffman was sitting in his vehicle at a parking lot of the Kokosing Gap Trail, near the Brown Family Environmental Center, around the same time Herrmann’s truck was found there later in the evening. Barber said it is routine for deputies to check out people in a situation like that and sometimes run a check on the car and its registration.

http://www.mountvernonnews.com/local/10/11/16/search-continues-for-missing-trio-2

For more details see:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=119680&page=18

 

[SmoothOperator]

Originally posted by antiquegirl
Do you have a link saying "after school"? I don't recall anyone saying when Sarah saw her mother and brother in the house. It could have been before school for the mom. Or, she could have seen her mother already tied up when she and Kody arrived home.
Quote:
that it was the 3 of them in the home when MH arrived,
Please, again where does it say that Sarah saw MH arriving?

Here ya go, antique girl..what you requested several times in the above post...

And here is where Barber does say that it was the three of them in the home{mom, Sarah, Kody} when contact was first made with Hoffman inside the King Beach Road residence..it is asked was Stephainie also present at this time? and Barber says that he IS NOT SURE OF..

SNIPPED~
QUESTION: Without revealing details about specifics about what they say (OFF-MIKE) compromise that (OFF-MIKE) try to find these other three individuals, what did she tell you about the first time she came in contact with this man, where that took place, how it occurred, what happened...

(CROSSTALK)

BARBER: For investigative purposes, I can't discuss statements made by her.

(CROSSTALK)

QUESTION: Is it inside the home, outside the home?

BARBER: Where did what happen?

QUESTION: Where did she first see this man Matthew Hoffman?

BARBER: Inside the house.

QUESTION: Inside the house? And, at the time, she was with her mom and her brother?

BARBER: Everyone was at home.

QUESTION: So, Stephanie was also in the house at that time?

BARBER: That, I'm unsure of.

http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1011/15/cnr.07.html

 

[antiquegirl]

Here ya go, antique girl..what you requested several times in the above post...

And here is where Barber does say that it was the three of them in the home{mom, Sarah, Kody} when contact was first made with Hoffman inside the King Beach Road residence..it is asked was Stephainie also present at this time? and Barber says that he IS NOT SURE OF..

SNIPPED~
QUESTION: Without revealing details about specifics about what they say (OFF-MIKE) compromise that (OFF-MIKE) try to find these other three individuals, what did she tell you about the first time she came in contact with this man, where that took place, how it occurred, what happened...

(CROSSTALK)

BARBER: For investigative purposes, I can't discuss statements made by her.

(CROSSTALK)

QUESTION: Is it inside the home, outside the home?

BARBER: Where did what happen?

QUESTION: Where did she first see this man Matthew Hoffman?

BARBER: Inside the house.

QUESTION: Inside the house? And, at the time, she was with her mom and her brother?

BARBER: Everyone was at home.

QUESTION: So, Stephanie was also in the house at that time?

BARBER: That, I'm unsure of.

http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1011/15/cnr.07.html

Thanks so much! My only remaining question is about the word "arriving". Barber didn't say that Sarah saw MH arriving, only that she saw him for the first time in the house. He could already have been there when she and Kody got home from school, no? I really suspect that that was the case.

JMO

 

[VicVixvi]

Someone mentioned earlier about the topix thread with the CB replies. Not sure if they found what they were looking for, but I think it was in this thread.

http://www.topix.com/forum/city/mount-vernon-oh/T9S80OKSVLB9U6QO5

 

[SmoothOperator]

Thanks so much! My only remaining question is about the word "arriving". Barber didn't say that Sarah saw MH arriving, only that she saw him for the first time in the house. He could already have been there when she and Kody got home from school, no? I really suspect that that was the case.

JMO

Absolutely he could've already been in the home..In my post where I wrote two separate theories, the newest being altered to fit Sarah's acct of it being her, mom, and Kody in the home when contact was first made with Hoffman.. I specifically said that I believed that it was either before the kids arrived, as the kids arrived, or immediately thereafter the kids arrived..

So, if it was taken that I thought he entered AFTER the fact, that wasn't my intentions or thoughts..Rather in my scenarios/theories there is nothing DEFINITE and can be added to, edited out, and updated as new info comes to light..

 

[passionflower]

Interesting, Filly -- maybe that's why some people give us the creeps...the subconscious noticing those yang sanpaku eyes...I'm gonna start paying a lot more attention to perps & suspects, and the folks I see IRL.

looking into the sanpuka eyes........John Wayne Gacy !!!

 

[Noway]

The discussion about where they were killed stemmed from this article dated 11/21, which stated that according to the autopsy report, where they were killed was unclear. BBM

The three, along with Herrmann's 13-year-old daughter Sarah Maynard, disappeared Nov. 10. According to the autopsy, all three were killed the same day.

Sarah was found Sunday, bound and gagged but alive, when a SWAT team stormed the home of Matthew Hoffman, who was arrested and charged with kidnapping.

"The story of Sarah Maynard's rescue will forever be remembered as an example of extraordinary detective work and bravery," Ogle said today.

Though the bodies of Herrmann, Sprang and Kody Maynard were discovered in the Kokosing Lake State Wildlife Area in Knox County, it was still not clear where the three were killed, according to the autopsy report.

I think Tina's house is absolutely where they were killed. The uncle was quoted in a news story as saying there was so much blood in a few rooms that they had to be gutted. He also said something to the effect that everything led back to the bathroom.:sick:

add in: the follow text from here http://www.kansascity.com/2010/11/20/2455715/coroner-2-ohio-women-boy-stabbed.html

Blood covered so much of an Ohio home where two women and an 11-year-old boy were stabbed to death that several rooms have to be gutted, a family friend said.

snip

Pejsa, the uncle of Herrmann's former live-in boyfriend, Greg Borders, said he was the first person allowed inside Herrmann's home after investigators cleared the scene. He cleaned blood off the bathroom walls with bleach so his nephew wouldn't have to see it.

"It was terrible," he said. "Everything led back to the bathroom."

 

[Noway]

I guess I can understand the sheriff trying to downplay the amount of blood that was in the house so their wasn't panic among locals. But it doesn't match what I imagined after reading what the BF's uncle said.

"There is blood in the house. There is a sign of injury to a person or persons," Barber said Friday.

http://articles.cnn.com/2010-11-13/justice/ohio.missing.family_1_children-wsyx-cnn?_s=PM:CRIME

 

[Noway]

Experiencing computer problems again ... server taking too long ... disconnected over and over ... no patience for this. BBL tomorrow.