Found Deceased OK - Mark Chastain, Billy Chastain, Mike Sparks, Alex Stevens, Okmulgee, 9 Oct 2022

[Rocky Mountain Hi]

I think LE wants to be careful since they'd have to affirmatively prove A) He shot them B) It was a criminal act rather than self-defense. Something else also occured to me today in that the scrapyard owner might have been the victim and possibly even framed. With that 5th person informant who decided not to participate, it's possible there was as-yet unidentified/unknown 5th member who killed everyone and took the loot all for themselves. If there was a replacement 5th person, it could explain a lot. I'd imagine the crew wasn't just planning on giving away easy money so a 5th person might have been needed rather than a criminal crew just giving away part of their share of the loot...alternatively the 5th person replacement could have been friends with the salvage guy where the replacement 5th and the salvage guy jointly killed and disposed of the the four, which this explanation of a replacement person being in cahoots with the salvage guy would be the easiest explanation for how the bodies were disposed of so quickly.

Interesting. A new theory. It's possible.

 

[Data Sleuth]

I think LE wants to be careful since they'd have to affirmatively prove A) He shot them B) It was a criminal act rather than self-defense. Something else also occured to me today in that the scrapyard owner might have been the victim and possibly even framed. With that 5th person informant who decided not to participate, it's possible there was as-yet unidentified/unknown 5th member who killed everyone and took the loot all for themselves. If there was a replacement 5th person, it could explain a lot. I'd imagine the crew wasn't just planning on giving away easy money so a 5th person might have been needed rather than a criminal crew just giving away part of their share of the loot...alternatively the 5th person replacement could have been friends with the salvage guy where the replacement 5th and the salvage guy jointly killed and disposed of the the four, which this explanation of a replacement person being in cahoots with the salvage guy would be the easiest explanation for how the bodies were disposed of so quickly.

When you mention that the 5th person was an informant, it sounds like you are insinuating that he worked for LE.
My understanding is that he is an associate of the “4 bicyclists “ and was asked if he wanted in. Sounds like he was a friend of theirs and after the 4 bodies were found he came forward with information (or was questioned by LE) regarding the proposed “big Lick” that was going to go down.
I have never heard the term informant utilized in any of the Police briefings, however I could be mistaken.

 

[Lyanna]

I am thinking that the term "Hit a lick" is more southern than east coast.

For example, I first heard the term directly decades ago from wayward youth types in east Texas. East Texas is an extension of the deep south.

Likewise, Oklahoma has big doses of southern influence starting with first white and black settlers who were almost all from the deep south.

I just cant see what the original meaning was. For example, the old term "On the Ball" for timeliness comes from Ball pocket watches being among the best produced in the USA and thus used for railroad time keeping.

But..... "Hit a Lick"? What in the heck did that mean originally?

Not gotta clue but there's a film called 'Hit a lick'

Moo

 

[carbuff]

I dunno. None of the deceased looks to me like Latin Kings material...

 

[Rocky Mountain Hi]

Agree, as a resident of Daytona area & after catching up some on WS, the @Ed Teach description of the Okmulghee, Ok, the residents, the scrap yard, businesses etc.. has me wondering what brings a 67 year old scrap yard Owner from a remote small town in the heartland of our country to Daytona Beach Shores, FL., was he temporarily staying at a hotel or passing through going south, has he been here before?

FWIW, our area has the following surrounding small municipalities with the Shores being #1 in terms of highest probability to be pulled over for speeding, tag stickers, blinkers, red lights. Not only that, its the only place where I see them pull you over in lane of traffic, no chance to even pull off into a parking lot:
City of Ormond Beach
City of Holly Hill
City of Daytona Beach
City of Daytona Beach Shores
City of South Daytona
City of Port Orange
City of Ponce Inlet
Each of these have their own police department and the jurisdiction area is the smallest in the Shores because it is situated on the beach side, narrow width between Atlantic Ocean and Intercoastal Halifax River. With only 2 main roads running north & south, AIA and S. Peninsula, it is well known that The Shores police will pull you over for 40 in a 35. I told my teenage sons and anyone visiting Shores, or driving to Port Orange/Ponce Inlet, set your cruise control in the Shores. They are also known for random running of tags in parking lots of bars/restaurants. Recent arrest where they waited for person to leave the bar, got in car and made arrest. JK was arrested at the Botehfur beach approach which leads me to believe he may have been parked illegally as there are no beach approach parking spaces between A1A and beach. IMO.. it is very possible JK would still be at large if he did not pass through Daytona Beach Shores.

He is scheduled to appear at 1:30PM today, News 9 is scheduled to report from courthouse and the Charging Affidavit has not been posted yet. AMOO

Keep us posted as to that news report, please.

 

[Rocky Mountain Hi]

When you mention that the 5th person was an informant, it sounds like you are insinuating that he worked for LE.
My understanding is that he is an associate of the “4 bicyclists “ and was asked if he wanted in. Sounds like he was a friend of theirs and after the 4 bodies were found he came forward with information (or was questioned by LE) regarding the proposed “big Lick” that was going to go down.
I have never heard the term informant utilized in any of the Police briefings, however I could be mistaken.

He was an "informant" insofar as he provided info to LE.

 

[Razz]

Still perplexed why whoever dumped the body parts in the river. Living in that area, certainly he would have known how shallow the water is.( And where he tossed them in)

Also, why not mangle the bodies with the crusher that may have been used to crunch the bikes? And make it all 4 neat packages?

 

[SpanishInquisition]

When you mention that the 5th person was an informant, it sounds like you are insinuating that he worked for LE.
My understanding is that he is an associate of the “4 bicyclists “ and was asked if he wanted in. Sounds like he was a friend of theirs and after the 4 bodies were found he came forward with information (or was questioned by LE) regarding the proposed “big Lick” that was going to go down.
I have never heard the term informant utilized in any of the Police briefings, however I could be mistaken.

I'm not insinuating that they worked for LE, but rather a criminal informant is someone who informs LE about crimes especially about others engaging in criminal activity instead of someone merely being a witness, like seeing someone riding a bike...which I called that person an informant because they informed LE those people killed were out engaging in a criminal enterprise and was offered a piece of the action as they were directly involved being offered a criminal job not just a 3rd party. If they hadn't been killed but instead were living, I don't think there would be any question about calling that person an informant but I guess since they're dead it throws people off. Usually there's some kind of quid pro quo with LE informants, but there doesn't have to be - if you go LE after some friends of yours offered you a place in their criminal enterprise, you would be a LE informant providing information on criminal activity.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Why not Fla? Have you been there? (Just kidding!?)

Trust me, gobs of criminals escape to florida....
live there, know that.
moo.

 

[NoSpoonFeeding]

Still perplexed why whoever dumped the body parts in the river. Living in that area, certainly he would have known how shallow the water is.( And where he tossed them in)

Also, why not mangle the bodies with the crusher that may have been used to crunch the bikes? And make it all 4 neat packages?

In the satellite view, I'm not seeing any crusher and there are no stacks of flattened vehicles. I can see how he didn't know about the water level as the river doesn't seem visible from the road, and it was night in a remote area. It doesn't look like he would normally be driving across that bridge, it's not on the way to and from his salvage yards.
The yards are full of cars/trucks, as in a you-pull auto parts operation and it looks like he sold cars too. It looks like they have been accumulating for years and not crushed as to go to recycle.

I'm not insinuating that they worked for LE, but rather a criminal informant is someone who informs LE about crimes especially about others engaging in criminal activity instead of someone merely being a witness, like seeing someone riding a bike...which I called that person an informant because they informed LE those people killed were out engaging in a criminal enterprise and was offered a piece of the action as they were directly involved being offered a criminal job not just a 3rd party. If they hadn't been killed but instead were living, I don't think there would be any question about calling that person an informant but I guess since they're dead it throws people off. Usually there's some kind of quid pro quo with LE informants, but there doesn't have to be - if you go LE after some friends of yours offered you a place in their criminal enterprise, you would be a LE informant providing information on criminal activity.

I think the friend is a witness, I'll bet he's referred to that way in any report, affidavit, filings, etc.

 

[sgmet]

Still perplexed why whoever dumped the body parts in the river. Living in that area, certainly he would have known how shallow the water is.( And where he tossed them in)

Also, why not mangle the bodies with the crusher that may have been used to crunch the bikes? And make it all 4 neat packages?

Throwing bodies in the crusher would only ensure that there's a ton of evidence positively linking him to the killings.

I would theorize that that the shooter likely found himself in the unexpected predicament of having just shot four burglars and wondering "what do I do now?"

This would be especially complicated had he felt that defending his property was justified... Then realizing that deadly force was likely not justified. And there just aren't a lot of ways for this story to end well. Perhaps already being under a 10 year suspended sentence weighed in the decision process as well.

 

[Magnoliabeach]

I am thinking that the term "Hit a lick" is more southern than east coast.

For example, I first heard the term directly decades ago from wayward youth types in east Texas. East Texas is an extension of the deep south.

Likewise, Oklahoma has big doses of southern influence starting with first white and black settlers who were almost all from the deep south.

I just cant see what the original meaning was. For example, the old term "On the Ball" for timeliness comes from Ball pocket watches being among the best produced in the USA and thus used for railroad time keeping.

But..... "Hit a Lick"? What in the heck did that mean originally?

Born and raised in S. FL have never heard that term, wording or slang.

 

[Data Sleuth]

I'm not insinuating that they worked for LE, but rather a criminal informant is someone who informs LE about crimes especially about others engaging in criminal activity instead of someone merely being a witness, like seeing someone riding a bike...which I called that person an informant because they informed LE those people killed were out engaging in a criminal enterprise and was offered a piece of the action as they were directly involved being offered a criminal job not just a 3rd party. If they hadn't been killed but instead were living, I don't think there would be any question about calling that person an informant but I guess since they're dead it throws people off. Usually there's some kind of quid pro quo with LE informants, but there doesn't have to be - if you go LE after some friends of yours offered you a place in their criminal enterprise, you would be a LE informant providing information on criminal activity.

Ok so just to make certain that I understand your point of view:
If I am at Walmart and observe someone leaving the store with items that they shoplifted and then I tell a police officer in the parking lot I would be considered a police informant?

 

[Allabouttrial]

For some clarity. This is the legal definition of a police informant.

---

Informants are used often in organized crime cases. There are four types of informant: a member of the public, a victim of a crime, a member of an organized criminal group or police officers themselves. Informants are also referred to as "justice collaborators" or they may be known as "cooperating witnesses" (UNODC, 2008).

Most informants are criminals who cooperate with the police in exchange for a reduced charge, sentence, or immunity from prosecution, depending on the judicial system. In some cases, however, honest citizens simply wish to report wrongdoings. Whatever the case, informants often desire to remain anonymous. Many courts have held that the identity of an informant can be kept confidential, but this not universal. In some jurisdictions, if the defendant can demonstrate that it is relevant to the case, the informant's identity may be revealed (Brown, 1985; Feuer, 2001; Schreiber, 2001). More at link.

---

Organized Crime Module 8 Key Issues: Special Investigative Techniques - Informants

Doha Declaration - Education for Justice (UNODC)

www.unodc.org

 

[SpanishInquisition]

Ok so just to make certain that I understand your point of view:
If I am at Walmart and observe someone leaving the store with items that they shoplifted and then I tell a police officer in the parking lot I would be considered a police informant?

'Witnesses' and 'informants' are both witnesses, just what differentiates a 'witness' from an 'informant' is how close they are to the crime. If you see/hear something as an uninvolved 3rd party you're a 'witness' but if you're first hand involved then you're an 'informant.' In your example seeing some stranger shoplift would make you a 'witness' while if that shoplifter was arrested and offered up their fence that would make them an 'informant' (a disgruntled ex who had first hand knowledge of the shoplifter who ratted on them out of spite would also be an 'informant'). I'm not calling this person an informant as something derogatory but quite the opposite. Them being an informant with first hand knowledge of the criminal activities of the deceased really helps advance the case to hopefully bring whoever committed the murders to justice where if this was just a mere witness who thought they overheard some people talking about committing a crime wouldn't be nearly as helpful. Just think how different things would be if we were left thinking four friends out bicycling got horrifically murdered with just some random person thought they might have overheard they were planning a crime, like I don't even know that we could discuss that without violating the TOS for being victim-friendly but an actual informant opens up the discussion here.

 

[Magnoliabeach]

 

[FrostedGlass]

I'm still not making any sense of this at all. If the crime happened next door to the salvage yard a mile from where they left, and it was as violent as they described, I'm assuming the killer dismembered them there. Did he take time to clean up before going to the gas station? What did he do with the bodies? Why take them all the way down to the other salvage yard instead of just driving on down to the river and dump them?

I thought it was interesting that LE said the area where the bodies were found appeared to be a dump site. It just seems kind of strange to me that someone with 2 salvage yards and a rural property would need to use a dump site, with no effort to hide the bodies.

I'd sure like to know more about the 5th guy; they must have trusted him to include him in their lick.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

I'd never heard of Hit a Lick, here in Australia.

Never heard it in any movie or TV programme. Never seen it in any news report til now.
Fence on the other hand I've known for years, maybe due to watching The Bill, or Minder, and have also seen it numerous times in news reports of crime cases here.

Here is something on the origins of Hit a Lick. Seems the expression has been around for 100 years, but the meaning has changed.

Hit a Lick - Meaning, Origin and Usage - English-Grammar-Lessons.com

Did you just win some money at the casino? You could say you “hit a lick” at the slots. This slang phrase has plenty of use in modern language, and its origin

english-grammar-lessons.com

"the “lick” refers to the feeling of instant gratification a person receives from licking a lollipop or ice cream cone"


One phrase I do know is "a lick and a promise". I think it means you do a little bit of a cleaning job now, and promise to give it a thorough clean later.

 

[Mojito]

I think too much is being made about what is a common slang term:

Urban Dictionary: hit a lick

a robbery

www.urbandictionary.com

Yes, y'all don't get lost in the weeds about the term. It just means something of value to steal. That meaning has been around for at least 15 years. How do I know? I heard it used a lot on the reality show The First 48. TF48 junkie here.

 

[Friday Fan]

I'm still not making any sense of this at all. If the crime happened next door to the salvage yard a mile from where they left, and it was as violent as they described, I'm assuming the killer dismembered them there. Did he take time to clean up before going to the gas station? What did he do with the bodies? Why take them all the way down to the other salvage yard instead of just driving on down to the river and dump them?

I thought it was interesting that LE said the area where the bodies were found appeared to be a dump site. It just seems kind of strange to me that someone with 2 salvage yards and a rural property would need to use a dump site, with no effort to hide the bodies.

I'd sure like to know more about the 5th guy; they must have trusted him to include him in their lick.

I get the impression they're mostly small time and for whatever reason this guy just didn't go with them. Maybe he didn't feel comfortable with it or maybe he just had something else to do that day. It's hard to say.