OR - Kyron Horman, 7 yo Second grader, Portland, 4 June 2010 - Part #15

[Pensfan]

Sort of on topic question - Post Partum depression. Can it manifest after 1 1/2 years or is it something that is very apparent from the get-go? This might be more of an opinion question too.

No, it would not suddenly appear 18 months after delivery. Postpartum depression is a depression begins shortly after childbirth; it develops within 6 months of delivery and usually within four weeks of delivery.
http://www.depressioncenter.org/understanding/postpartum.asp

 

[mamaeb]

ohh I thought the carol posting on this page was kyrons grandma... but it isn't

edit:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/pages/Missing-Kyron-Horman/125336750831264
under the third link "Divers search Sauvie Island for Kyron Horman".. end of the comments

 

[sofia76]

The photo is a little creepy to me, too. Not because of the can (which I hadn't really noticed) but because the door to the classroom is so dark.

Shutter - You're right...it is kind of creepy. The room is dark, the hallway is semi dark/dimly lit, there is a chair sitting there as if someone had just gotten up from it and walked away...and then there is that trashcan...

 

[revampz]

I'm thinking more along lines of parking lot, if Kyron came back outside and wanted to go home...or got into the car....that kind of thing...again, IF a family member was responsible...

I am totally agreeing with this......I think a boiling point was hit that day and maybe something in the parking lot or driving in the car and Kyron taking off.....to me this makes sense if they searched around the school, the woods, the neighbourhood houses, he may have been terrified and took off and has hid....

Hence also the stepdad talking to him direct, maybe they thought if somehow he was near a tv!!!! (cant see it but it may be a last ditch thing)......

This could be why mum was cold to sm at the press conference....maybe they do know there was some sought of altercation and she told them he took off.....

now however after ten 10 days they are looking closer into a phone checking where the pings are since the above search turned up nothing where they thought he may have run to.

 

[Katarina]

Yes, now that's what I was kind of thinking. The best things my children ever did in school were their own interpretations of the impressionist masters. They were quite proud of them. But it wasn't really something introduced to them until later elementary.

In Oregon we have Art Lit in all elementary levels, kindergarten through 5th grade

All schools - public & private

It's run by parents / volunteers

If they do an artist, all grades do the same artist, just the level of detail differs

 

[pufnstuf]

I'm going to say something possibly very unpopular, but here goes.

While I appreciate little Kyron's artistic talents and think he's a talented boy, I don't see a connection of his artwork and a discussion of other people's kids' artwork to this case. As someone who is hoping to stay focused on the fact that he's missing and trying to figure out what happened that day, it would be nice if discussions that have nothing to do with any of that could occur in a separate place (or a separate thread)?

It's challenging enough to keep up on info about the case and many folks have only limited time to look at the case thread(s).

I think that there's an off-topic Kyron thread in the parking lot. If not, I'm sure that the mods wouldn't mind starting one.

I personally think that this case is as deserving its own forum as any other--but I know that mods in charge of forum technical stuff do have their hands full. Maybe in good time, we'll see a Kyron forum.

 

[JBean]

I can't believe you guys are buying into all the bogus comments I left over at that site :floorlaugh:
Just kidding of course.

Rumors and comments are just that rumors and comments from anonymous people posting on the web.

Could some of it be true? Sure, but I don't see that happen very often and I follow a lot of cases. As a matter of fact I rarely see any of that turn out to be true.The ones posted and/or kept as "secrets" and not posted in the Caylee Anthony forums were rich and oh so wrong!


So here is the dealio.

if you guys want to generally discuss comments left on other sites that is fine provided:
1. You link to the source but do not carry any posts here to this forum.
2. Every single time you discuss one of these comments you make it clear as a bell that it is an unfounded rumor. Otherwise people stop in, pick up a little info and spread it as fact because that is what is people typically expect to be posted here.

I am going to ask the moderators of this forum to keep a close eye on the rumor discussions and if they become too much work for the mods or people are careless in their posting, then that will be the end of it and all rumors will be off limits. I have asked them to shut it off if there are any problems at all.

Let others know ( nicely please) if they seem to be violating,because it is the responsibility of each of you to keep up with the rules as they change.


Those of you that prefer to discuss that available facts, just scroll by any of the gossip chatter.

Thanks and keep posting

 

[eyes4crime]

I think it's important to remember there are always all kinds of agendas to rumors - some want to destroy the life of a person they are jealous of, some can't stand an intelligent person, or a pretty person, or an educated person...and will say what they can do destroy an image. Those without an agenda usually call 911 or a tip line. MOO JMO MHO

 

[CharlestonGal]

First she said she heard the cell info on the news (which there has been no such thing) then she goes on to say she heard it from a friend who heard it from a teacher who heard it from two teachers that saw...

Then she goes on to say later that she heard it from "valuable" sources


It sounds like a rumor. Nothing more than a game of telephone tag.

JMO

Of course the story varies the further down the line it gets. It is known that two teachers saw SM with Kyron. The school superintendent reported that himself. It did kind of grow legs when it turned into "and the teachers SAW her leave with him." I think what started out as "the teachers knew SM left with him" became SAW. Which I believe is incorrect. I believe the teachers knew she left with him, but not that they actually visually saw it.

That's how most rumors start - with a foundation of truth and then it grows.

 

[GrainneDhu]

If LE had two reliable witnesses saying that they saw with whom he was leaving, there would have been NO search of the woods behind the school, no dogs tracking the school grounds...

My SAR friend who took part in the search doesn't have any vacation time saved up this year because it has been spent on training and other call-outs already. This means that she drove something like 12 hours each way and had to take three uncompensated days off work in order to help with the search. Her situation is not atypical at all.

If the rumour is correct, then her donation of her time, energy and expertise would have been for nothing.

When I was involved in SAR, LE agencies were usually almost apologetic about call outs, assuring us over and over that they were sharing the best information they had, saying over and over they wished they had more information to share.

I find it hard to believe that any LE agency would abuse the good will of so many SAR personnel that way. For one thing, call outs are optional, not mandatory. An agency that had a record of calling out without good reason would quickly find that the number of responders drops dramatically (this has happened in a few isolated cases).

For another, abusing SAR personnel that way would just not be ethical and the vast majority of LEOs are fine, ethical people.

 

[Kimster]

JBean, I didn't want to repeat some of the Caylee rumors I've heard for fear someone would come by and run with it, but you are right! Some of them have been totally unfounded! :yow:

 

[Wise Old Owl]

BBM
Ummm....we know that the home was NEVER roped off and processed as a crime scene, that takes many days and would be the FIRST and most important place to look at in any case like this if a WITNESS said what is being rumored. The car would be in police custody and held there, it was not, as we saw it on video being driven. I have no problem with the searches and did not imply worng anything about them. But if the child was seen LEAVING THE AREA, the searches would have been centered in an entirely different location. AND once again, you don't search for him at the school if two witnesses said that they saw him LEAVE the school.

The home would not be roped off and declared a crime scene as there is no evidence that he was taken back home. All the witness said is that he was seen leaving the school with someone. The car. We don't know what car was being driven and we also don't know if LE has looked at it. It only takes a visual inspection to see if anything is "amiss". If this pans out the way I think it is going to, the car will be impounded and gone over with a fine tooth comb - but I think LE already knows there isn't anything there and besides, just like the pontiac and KC, Kyron was in that car everyday - his DNA, hair, footprints, fingerprints, etc. are all over it - hard to distinguish any solid evidence there.

The searches started logically - the last place the child was seen and panned out from there. I believe this is due to the fact that it takes a few days to get the cell pings from the provider - hence LE's comment in the presser about having it wrapped up by the end of the week. Once they got those ping records is when we saw the "shift" in the search areas and the now public request for video of certain roads.

Also, this is a very delicate and explosive situation. LE will do and say things just to keep everyone calm and especially not inflame the person. This situation is more than walking on eggshells - its like a blind person trying to walk through a mine field.

 

[BeanE]

Gossip from locals is always interesting. LE and reporters talk to their spouses and friends, who talk to their friends, etc. Witnesses do it, too. People can't seem to help themselves and eventually everything gets out.

It's like Whisper Down the Lane. Those rumors have certainly morphed since I first heard them.

 

[krazyfingerzz]

I read the name of Roy Kronk the day Caylee's body was found on a blog. Then it disappeared. I told some friends off the board that I thought it seemed credible while others were wondering who found her. (He didn't want to have his name released for quite a period of time).

We also knew who killed Elizabeth Olten because of blogs on websites.

BUT!!! I've also read a ton of stuff that didn't ring true also, like who the father of Caylee Anthony was and that sort of thing. Blogger posts are hit and miss and that's why we don't run with them on Websleuths.

I was about to say the same thing, and Ethan's case was the most recent one where I saw something posted that ended up being partially true. The problem is, you can never tell, and until LE comes out with something, it's rumor. I find it hard to believe they'd let the SM spend time with the baby if they had reason to suspect. On the other hand, they may really need help finding Kyron. I cannot imagine the anguish that the other parents (mom, dad, etc.) would be feeling, how they'd not wring someone else's neck and put on such a good show. Good show to me is not killing the person who harmed my child. However, Occam's Razor (kudos to whoever's posts those are) strikes me. On the other hand, Occam's Razor is not always the correct approach. We just don't know. I really wish we did because this is tough, plain and simple.

I want to say keep things logical and go with what we know:

-not an isolated incident...would LE say that and risk the lives of other kids if that weren't true? Probably not, so they have an idea that it's related to Kyron, somehow.

-if they know they above, do they have someone in mind? I guess they'd kind of have to or they couldn't call it an isolated incident.

-Why haven't they arrested anyone and why did it take so long to look where they are now (as opposed to the first week)? No clue. Something either changed or they're still grasping at straws but if you go back to my first point, can they really be grasping at straws?

 

[Jaxson]

If LE had two reliable witnesses saying that they saw with whom he was leaving, there would have been NO search of the woods behind the school, no dogs tracking the school grounds, not THREE or more searches of the school, the person whose car he supposedly got into would not have unrestrained access to that car to go to the gym, nor would a liason police officer or anyone else be allowed to continue living in a home that had not been processed as a crime scene. If there were witnesses to him leaving the area the dog tracking and search grids would have begun from another address entirely.
Once again, logic should prevail over rumor. You don't search for a child in a building that witnesses have reported seeing him leave.

jmo

ITA raeann, I think a lot of rumors are being started by people who are just sure it is Terri and a lot of logic is going out the window to promote a theory. It doesn't make sense to me. It would be much easier to lose him from his yard this summer if that is what she wanted to do.

Or, the keystone cops are investigating this vanishing and haven't a clue what they are doing, and to top it off they are spending a lot of money doing it.

 

[pufnstuf]

I can't believe you guys are buying into all the bogus comments I left over at that site :floorlaugh:
Just kidding of course.

Rumors and comments are just that rumors and comments from anonymous people posting on the web.

Could some of it be true? Sure, but I don't see that happen very often and I follow a lot of cases. As a matter of fact I rarely see ay of that turn out to be true.The ones posted and/or kept as "secrets" and not posted in the Caylee Anthony forums were rich and oh so wrong!


So here is the dealio.

if you guys want to generally discuss comments left on other sites that is fine provided:
1. You link to the source but do not carry any posts here to this forum.
2. Every single time you discuss one of these comments you make it clear as a bell that it is an unfounded rumor. Otherwise people stop in, pick up a little info and spread it as fact because that is what is people typically expect to be posted here.

I am going to ask the moderators of this forum to keep a close eye on the rumor discussions and if they become too much work for the mods or people are careless in their posting, then that will be the end of it and all rumors will be off limits. I have asked them to shut it off if there are any problems at all.

Those of you that prefer to discuss that available facts, just scroll by any of the gossip chatter.

Thanks and keep posting

Those comments are something I heard on Friday, and I didn't hear it through a rumor mill.

Just wanted to clarify that.

I consider my source impeccable. However, I know that it's still considered rumor... just wanted to say that not all the "rumors" are coming through comments on news articles and facebook groups.

Thanks.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

did you guys notice that step-mom's mother is now commenting on the rumors?

edit:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/pages/Missing-Kyron-Horman/125336750831264
under the third link "Divers search Sauvie Island for Kyron Horman".. end of the comments

How do we know the posts made by SM's Mother?
What name is she useing?

 

[raeann]

My SAR friend who took part in the search doesn't have any vacation time saved up this year because it has been spent on training and other call-outs already. This means that she drove something like 12 hours each way and had to take three uncompensated days off work in order to help with the search. Her situation is not atypical at all.

If the rumour is correct, then her donation of her time, energy and expertise would have been for nothing.

When I was involved in SAR, LE agencies were usually almost apologetic about call outs, assuring us over and over that they were sharing the best information they had, saying over and over they wished they had more information to share.

I find it hard to believe that any LE agency would abuse the good will of so many SAR personnel that way. For one thing, call outs are optional, not
mandatory. An agency that had a record of calling out without good reason would quickly find that the number of responders drops dramatically (this has happened in a few isolated cases).

For another, abusing SAR personnel that way would just not be ethical and the vast majority of LEOs are fine, ethical people.

EXACTLY.....LE would have taken a completely different direction from day one if this RUMOR was remotely true. They would never risk the time, the safety, and the cost of tramping people from all over the state through woods and ponds if they had a reason to KNOW that the child never wandered away. Anyone who would imply that they did this frivolously when they had witnesses that proved it was unnecessary would be beyond unreasonable.

jmoo

 

[Angel4u2Whisper2]

But aren't they still looking for him? LE are hoping to find him alive but hope to find him and bring him home in anyway they can, thus they are still searching. Today is when they indicated that they sent many SAR home and thanked them very much for there time as seen in snip below:

Published: Monday, June 14, 2010, 4:47 PM
Hours after a press conference where officials reiterated the scaled-back operation, a dive team searched parts of the Multnomah Channel near Sauvie Island -- where search and rescue units had been seen for days. Officials from the Multnomah County Sheriff's Office confirmed the team was part of the search for Kyron. When officials announced the end to the large-scale search and rescue effort, they did say local crews would remain on call to follow up on future leads.

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/06/search_for_kyron_horman_switch.html


God bless all the searchers and there families for the sacrifice they have made, the countless hours they have selflessly given to find Kyron!

 

[CharlestonGal]

Although Kyron's disappearance is now classified as a criminal investigation, Gates said authorities still believe it's an isolated case and that there is "no reason to believe that kids are in any danger."

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/06/search_for_kyron_horman_switch.html

Thats good!

Interesting. If a random stranger or SO brazenly waltzed into a school full of people and whisked away a 7 year old child under the eyes of everyone I would think kids in the area would be in plenty of danger. Period.

I guess they believe it didn't happen that way.