OR - Militia members occupy federal building in Oregon after protest #1

[KaaBoom]

I'm confused. The father and son did their jail time for the fires. So why do they have to go back.

I thought the judge gave them a fair sentence at first. So why did someone take offense and made it personal to advocate that the judge was too lenient and didn't rightfully sentence them?

Was the original judge a friend of theirs or something? Because not too many people will force the system to give longer sentences after it was all said and done. Jmo

Federal law requires a mandatory five year sentence. The judge did not give them a fair or even a legal sentence.

 

[LolaMoon08]

RSBM

Strange this isn't headline news... anywhere.
Where are CNN, ABC, etc.?
Why so quiet ?
IMO

Domestic terrorism? Over taking the Government? A call to recruit more? Threatening violence... Kill or be Killed? Why ever would this be Headline News? :thinking:

 

[bluesneakers]

RSBM

Strange this isn't headline news... anywhere.
Where are CNN, ABC, etc.?
Why so quiet ?
IMO

NBC calls them protesters and purported militiamen, and they use quotation marks on "patriots" and "militia members." And in the article I read terrorist didn't appear once because it apparently if you say you're not a terrorist then you're not a terrorist. "Someone you know may be held as a terrorist next" is on one of the signs.
JMO

 

[LaborDayRN]

Domestic terrorism? Over taking the Government? A call to recruit more? Threatening violence... Kill or be Killed? Why ever would this be Headline News? :thinking:

:waitasec:

 

[LaborDayRN]

WTF Is Happening in the Oregon Militia Standoff, Explained

Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politic...tia-standoff-explained-20160103#ixzz3wFYfuIVN
Follow us: @rollingstone on Twitter | RollingStone on Facebook

Interesting take on the standoff by Rolling Stone. (I wish there was more coverage, but Rolling Stone will have to do! :rocker: )

 

[Tillicum]

At the very least I don't understand why, apparently, people are being allowed in and out. Seems that law enforcement could stop that, at least. To cut off any supplies.

Yes but what better way to infiltrate?

 

[bluesneakers]

Terrorists? Freedom fighters? Oregon standoff poses quandary for media

Militiamen? Activists? Terrorists?

In the wake of the seizure of a federal wildlife management building in eastern Oregon by armed protesters on Saturday, the news media have struggled with how to refer to the people involved.

The descriptions have included “self-styled militiamen” (Reuters), “armed activists” (the New York Times) and “armed protesters” (The Washington Post), as well as a number of other variations on the theme.

Almost all major news outlets surveyed on Sunday said they were avoiding the use of the words “terrorist” and “terrorism” in connection with the Oregon protest, saying it was unclear that the group’s action was designed to terrorize or harm anyone.

"Kill or be killed" isn't meant to terrorize or harm. Okay then.

 

[LietKynes]

Yes but what better way to infiltrate?

RSBM

Maybe they could send in a pizza with a secret microphone in the box ??
OK that's prob. enough internet for the night....... A pleasant evening to all WS'rs.
Although it might not be too pleasant for those who are standing and shivering around their campfires, out beside a remote building in OR....

I truly hope this ends peacefully !
:seeya:

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Terrorists? Freedom fighters? Oregon standoff poses quandary for media





"Kill or be killed" isn't meant to terrorize or harm. Okay then.

From the article:

Scott Wilson, The Washington Post’s national editor, said the paper is using the terms “occupiers” and “militia members” when those involved identify themselves that way.

“We believe these terms most precisely describe what is taking place, the tactics being used and those involved,” he said. “Further, terrorism is a tactic meant to instill fear in a population or group. In this case, the occupiers, though armed, are not terrorizing, but rather occupying a government building in protest or solidarity.”

Psssst. Dude. They are occupying a government building in protest WITH GUNS. That they've said they'll use. :facepalm:

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Yes but what better way to infiltrate?

I doubt it. These military wannabe types probably have all kinds of passwords and secret handshakes and whatnot to make sure only the "right" people get in.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

And Bundy justified their armed-intrusion this way to OPB’s Amelia Templeton:

“The main reason we’re here is because we need a place to stand,” Bundy said. “We stand in defense, and when the time is right we will begin to defend the people of Harney County in using the land and the resources.”

http://www.opb.org/news/article/explainer-the-bundy-militias-particular-brand-of-mormonism/

And what will they use to "defend" the people? Not their guns, surely. Bouquets of flowers and choruses of Kumbayah, I'll bet.

 

[bluesneakers]

http://www.opb.org/news/article/explainer-the-bundy-militias-particular-brand-of-mormonism/

And what will they use to "defend" the people? Not their guns, surely. Bouquets of flowers and choruses of Kumbayah, I'll bet.

Their words. They talk tough and have a lot of picket signs. That will show the Federal Government.

But if that doesn't worked they are also heavily armed.

 

[SophieRose]

http://www.courthousenews.com/2014/02/07/65197.htm

The federal appeals court found that Steven and Dwight Hammonds' sentences of one year and three months in prison, respectively, were far below the five-year mandatory minimum for a federal arson conviction.

snip

Though the ranchers - the elder being in his 70s and the son in his 40s - faced a five-year mandatory minimum sentence and fines of up $250,000, U.S. District Judge Michael Hogan in Eugene gave them relatively light terms behind bars, citing Eighth Amendment concerns and conjecturing that Congress had not meant for the stiff sentence to apply to fires in "the wilderness."

=========

Why did it take until 2012 to sentence them for the 2001 and 2006 fires?

 

[EmmaliLucia]

I'm confused. The father and son did their jail time for the fires. So why do they have to go back.

I thought the judge gave them a fair sentence at first. So why did someone take offense and made it personal to advocate that the judge was too lenient and didn't rightfully sentence them?

Was the original judge a friend of theirs or something? Because not too many people will force the system to give longer sentences after it was all said and done. Jmo

Harney county has a population of less than 7,500 people. Everyone knows everyone and I wouldn't be surprised if the judge was their friend and that was the exact reason.

My father lives fairly close to there and was a politician in a nearby region for decades. There is definitely a "Good ole boys" club out in Eastern Oregon and they really do stupidly illegal things and think that they are above the law because they are friends with all of the police.

 

[Plombage]

Sedition: the crime of saying, writing, or doing something that encourages people to disobey their government, incitement of resistance to or insurrection against lawful authority.

U.S. Code Title 18, Part 1, Chapter 115, § 2384 - Seditious Conspiracy
If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.

 

[EmmaliLucia]

Terrorism - (Noun) - the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, especially for political purposes.

 

[Lilibet]

Some wondered earlier why this isn't receiving MSM coverage. The occupation was the lead story when I looked at CNN online around 9:00 a.m. PST this morning, so I would say it received immediate national attention. I almost started a thread, but I didn't have time.

I had occasion to study the Patriot groups and the Militia in 2013. An Oregon miner named Lennie Ames had a very active YouTube channel promoting these groups and had many followers. He was the boyfriend of Stephanie Warner who disappeared July 4, 2013 from Ruch, Oregon. (If you can see my signature, you can link to her threads.) Even before he was named a POI (and recently a suspect) in this case, I was sleuthing him. Viewing the videos, I realized immediately that he was a very dangerous man. Further research convinced me that these are very dangerous groups. At the time I even wondered if LE seemed to be moving slowly in Stephanie's case because of the danger he presented to the community if they pushed too hard.

These groups are extremists who feel that they are above the law because they are "protecting" the constitution from the government. Militia groups come out of the Patriot Movement according to Wikipedia. Read the link to understand the variety of their beliefs.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_movement

This is not the first militia event in Oregon recently. Last spring they were called in by a miner in Josephine County in Southern Oregon who was in a dispute with the BLM to protect his mining claim.
http://www.oregonlive.com/environment/index.ssf/2015/05/judge_bars_blm_enforcement_in.html

Because these groups thrive on anti-government conspiracy and persecution theories, I can understand why the authorities are not going in for a confrontation. The government is between a rock and a hard place because any action it takes will escalate the situation and also motivate more people to join these groups. Although the occupation in Harney County may eventually end, the threat from these groups will continue. JMO

 

[pappa rob]

Maybe blast them 24/7 with Justin Bieber songs?

In this day and age that would never fly, that's cruel and unusual punishment. I know for me I'd rather be water boarded or even put on the rack than that..

 

[pappa rob]

This is just childish, like he's a little kid playing war... except he's a grown up and he and his people have grown up weapons.

He might be an adult, but I don't think grown up would be applicable here.

 

[SophieRose]

Doesn't sound like the locals are very enthusiastic about these militia groups coming to the area. The Hammonds will serve their prison time in San Diego. Seems like they should be able to leave their home in Diamond Oregon to San Diego without the militia interfering.

http://www.capitalpress.com/Oregon/...rters-distance-themselves-from-militia-groups

“The Bundy group seems to be rubbing quite a few people the wrong way,” she said.

Their tactics may be too aggressive for a county heavily dependent on government employment, Molt said. “Bundy’s direction would put more than half of the people in this county out of a job,” she said.

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...hrow-government-says-sheriff?CMP=share_btn_tw

They have both served time in prison and are due to report to a jail in San Diego on Monday in order to serve some more.