Hi Xavier,
I saw you mention some of this info in your previous post and I wanted to read your link right then but I was balancing a six month old on one hip with my laptop on the counter and the sky growing steadily dark out my window.
I returned bebe to his rightful owners and did my chores with a flashlight and am back! Ijust read your link in your post, :Banane37:
I do not know a lot about gangs but I have some preconceived notions that I will "cop to" :blushing:
I think of them as being youngish. think of them as being minorities.
So I read your article at the link...
This stood out to me:
Police say that Latino gangs, like the black gangs that preceded them, tend to hang out on the street, handling their business in public. In that regard, they are unlike the Russians and Asians, who cops like to say have "graduated to the next level," meaning they engage in organized crime, high-tech scams, extortion and fraud. As one officer puts it, those latter groups "got smart. You don't see them out on street corners throwing hand signs and selling dope
So this makes me think that JH wouldnt have been accepted in to either a black gang or a latino one. But I did think the comments on the Russian and Asians was interesting. But I dont know if they would take JH either.
If he was part of a gang he will probably have tattoos right? Some kind of gang identity?
I like the fact that the idea opens up a whole other dimension of possibilities but I am not seeing where in his 20's white guy living in a nice apartment, married and a Jehovah's Witness, is accepted in to a gang. But keep developing your theory and I will keep reading because all I want is to know the real truth.
I dont think it sounds goofy at all and I wholly agree with you that this type of crime is on the rise. I actually think this is more likely than a street gang. My one hang up is I think that JH would crumple and be singing like a canary once in jail if he thought he could help himself. I think he is weak in his core personality. I think that is exactly the type that turn states evidence if and when they can. What do you think about JH in that regard? Do you think he could hold strong in jail and protect accomplices?
And you also Xavier!
GLOW-- Thanks. I'm friends with a couple of the District 2 LE detectives here in Cincinnati,OH and though we're not a hotbed for gangs, we do have some "small potatoes" type of gangs.
What I learned from these detectives recently is that you don't necessarily have to be Latino/Blatino, Asian, Russian, SkinHeads White Supremicists to belong as a member of any of these gangs. They all have their own codes, like the Mafia will accept some members who are'nt 100% Sicilian.
They said the "signature" of most gangs is a double tap head and/or body gunshot and the more a victim is shot, the more the gang leaders see a "fearlessness" in that gang member, which is a quality they want in their members.
Shooting WH 4 times, twice to her head/face and twice more to her torso area give me the sense this could be gang related. This excessive brutality, execution style almost is clear as day this crime was not an accident by struggle or out of failure to submit to sex, etc.
What opened my eyes to this being possibly a gang related inititation of Holt is because so much crime conduct, behavior of this crime and Holt's behavior over the past few months has the pure look and feel of being gang related.
I feel it's very possible Holt was going through an initiation into a gang. I also think the gang leaders decided during this crime that they wanted to "dump" Holt as a recruit, maybe felt Holt did'nt fit in or have the chops/make-up to cut it in the gang. Maybe they realized he was too weak, could be easily bullied. So they cut him loose, let him commit the crime, because they no longer cared about Holt.
Maybe they "played" or toyed with Holt telling him he needed to rape WH and shoot her 4 times per the gang code.
Then the gang leaders distributed evidence to easily implicate Holt since they no longer wanted Holt in their gang. Then they threatened him if he talked, they'd wipe out his family, friends, wife.
Detectives have told me, some gangs are such psychopaths they'll kill everyone close to the victim, even the family pets.
The clincher for me was the leaving the weapon in clear view of LE in broad daylight. It was as if Holt was being told what to do and when to do it.
Then Holt "throwing his hands, arms up" in frustration after leaving the ammo/gun(s). This weird reaction was as if Holt was frustrated "Why did I do this crime?" or "Why did I get talked into doing this crime?" ...
The impulsive driving off with a friend's rental car for almost the entire day while the friend was shopping and Holt waited in the car? Maybe this was part of the gang inititation. The detectives told me gang recruits will be asked to do all sorts of things, like stealing a car, breaking and entering, shoplifting, beating up someone, etc. Maybe stalking WH and stealing from the Heichels was part of the initiation too?
Maybe Holt had passed all the tests so far and graduation was sexually assaulting/killing WH. Detectives have told me gangs have these rituals.
Then Holt confessing easily, volunteering all kinds of implicating and irrelevant information, the 24 hour suicide watch going on for a long time, the constant crying, endless anxiety, tormented as if he was scared straight what would happen to his family, wife if he fingered the gang leaders.
I think it's very possible Holt got in way too deep with some bad people and they knew too much about him, the Heichels, his family, etc.
This is just my opinion and I could be really far off from what really happened. LOL