Oscar Pistorius - Discussion Thread #64 ~ the appeal~

[Interested Bystander]

I have never held or shot a gun, ever, but I know full well that a bullet can richochet. Are some forum members really saying that OP was an idiot who passed stringent gunholder licence tests but was not aware of this? It beggars belief? :gaah:

 

[Colin de France]

I have never held or shot a gun, ever, but I know full well that a bullet can richochet. Are some forum members really saying that OP was an idiot who passed stringent gunholder licence tests but was not aware of this? It beggars belief? :gaah:

.....that's reality i'm afraid........a bullet will bounce off a flat wall......not everyone is going to take that into account on the moment.....as he was in a blind rage and just not thinking, he did take avoiding action though, not knowing that whilst going for the gun she had slightly turned.......going from using the bat to the gun to make a hole in the door is far more plausible than hitting the door with the bat and then deciding to kill her......i think it's that last scenario that beggars belief, he's just not a murderer........just completely stupid and reckless.....he took a risk shooting and that he shouldn't of .....and now he will have to pay ...

 

[cottonweaver]

......i'm trying to see further than the appeal.......and what may happen afterwards.......it's a shame the thread title restricts one just to the appeal because the discussion seems general.....yourself and other's included....

.BIB " i'm trying to see further than the appeal and what may happen afterwards.." - what do you mean?

 

[Colin de France]

.BIB " i'm trying to see further than the appeal and what may happen afterwards.." - what do you mean?

.......if he get's murder he may well decide to appeal on the basis of a new version of events........i can't see him accepting murder if the truth really was that he used the gun to make a hole in the door but instead chose to use the intruder version as he didn't have the courage to admit to manslaughter........at the moment it's possible the whole debate of intruder versus intentional murder is completely off the mark and that the truth of really what happened is somewhere else.......

 

[cottonweaver]

.......if he get's murder he may well decide to appeal on the basis of a new version of events........i can't see him accepting murder if the truth really was that he used the gun to make a hole in the door but instead chose to use the intruder version as he didn't have the courage to admit to manslaughter........at the moment it's possible the whole debate of intruder versus intentional murder is completely off the mark and that the truth of really what happened is somewhere else.......

if he get's murder he may well decide to appeal on the basis of a new version of events...

But you can't do that. ie. if he appealed in say, December, it would be an appeal to CC based on the SCA's finding on the original version he presented at court.

 

[Colin de France]

But you can't do that. ie. if he appealed in say, December, it would be an appeal to CC based on the SCA's finding on the original version he presented at court.

........at any moment he could turn around and say............"this is really what happened, forget the rest"......that's why i'm hoping he does get murder because it's the only way he's going to tell the truth...it would also serve as a test.....there is also a remote possibility that he could come out with another version before the appeal, but that's very slender, but even so, tactically sound......

 

[cottonweaver]

........at any moment he could turn around and say............"this is really what happened, forget the rest"......that's why i'm hoping he does get murder because it's the only way he's going to tell the truth...it would also serve as a test.....there is also a remote possibility that he could come out with another version before the appeal, but that's very slender, but even so, tactically sound......

What's in it for him?

.that's why i'm hoping he does get murder because it's the only way he's going to tell the truth..

So you said on the last page, he wouldn't accept the DE murder upgrade by SCA- the likely one, due to sentence length etc.

So let's pretend SCA upgrade him to DE for which he gets say 15 years, (inclusive of what he has served, some of it again house arrest. )
So at this point you think it's in his interest to say he committed perjury previously, that he knew it was Reeva, but he wanted to "miss her" with the black talons and just open the door etc etc.
How does this help him?

.......there is also a remote possibility that he could come out with another version before the appeal, but that's very slender, but even so, tactically sound.

How does this work for him tactically when the SCA can only judge on the findings of the original version ie not a new version that never appeared before masipa?

 

[Colin de France]

What's in it for him?
So you said on the last page, he wouldn't accept the murder charge- the likely one, due to sentence length etc.

So let's pretend SCA upgrade him to DE for which he gets say 15 years, (inclusive of what he has served, some of it again house arrest. )
So at this point you think it's in his interest to say he committed perjury previously, that he knew it was Reeva, but he wanted to "miss her" with the black talons and just open the door etc etc.
How does this help him?

How does this work for him tactically when the SCA can only judge on the findings of the original version ie not a new version that never appeared before masipa?

......it seems you haven't given any thought whatsoever to my post.......obviously manslaughter is a lesser charge than murder and admitting to the truth before the appeal would be seen as to wanting to avoid extra work, time, expenses and moreover emotional strain for Reeva's family.........

 

[cottonweaver]

......it seems you haven't given any thought whatsoever to my post.......obviously manslaughter is a lesser charge than murder and admitting to the truth before the appeal would be seen as to wanting to avoid extra work, time, expenses and moreover emotional strain for Reeva's family.........

Wow - that's really very rude.

Maybe other posters would like to give your posts some thought instead eh?

 

[Colin de France]

Wow - that's really very rude.

Maybe other posters would like to give your posts some thought instead eh?

....no intention to be rude at all and i'm deeply sincerly sorry if you received it as such it really wasn't my intention........it was an observation based on the speed of your reply and it's contents, i got the impression you didn't understand what i've wrote......which i thought were pretty obvious....lastly i always welcome any input from posters as long as its relative to the discussion and not just trying to force through a point of view in numbers............

 

[cottonweaver]

....no intention to be rude at all and i'm deeply sincerly sorry if you received it as such it really wasn't my intention........it was an observation based on the speed of your reply and it's contents, i got the impression you didn't understand what i've wrote......which i thought were pretty obvious.....

it was an observation based on the speed of your reply

Averaging half an hour speed twixt replies Colin. Too fast or too slow?

No, you said I am not giving your posts any thought but.....
If you're quoted Colin, and a poster replies to your specific points you can pretty much guess that they have read your post and given it some thought.
If they quote evidence, provide links, signpost you to evidence you can be sure that a poster is making an effort.

which i thought were pretty obvious...

No, not always

 

[Colin de France]

Averaging half an hour speed twixt replies Colin. Too fast or too slow?

No, you said I am not giving your posts any thought but.....
If you're quoted Colin, and a poster replies to your specific points you can pretty much guess that they have read your post and given it some thought.
If they quote evidence, provide links, signpost you to evidence you can be sure that a poster is making an effort.


No, not always

.........i understand.......back to subject......

 

[cottonweaver]

.........i understand.......back to subject......

Ok Colin. I'll accept your apology, as I have u'stood your points, if you go and find out what are the sentencing guidelines for his level of "aggravated" perjury and estimation of size of litigation suit he would put himself at risk of.

ETA plus sentencing guidelines for CH compared to DE!

 

[Colin de France]

Ok Colin. I'll accept your apology, as I have u'stood your points, if you go and find out what are the sentencing guidelines for his level of "aggravated" perjury and estimation of size of litigation suit he would put himself at risk of.

.....that's fine i"m so glad you've accepted my explanation, no point in enticing in unneeded moderation is there ........yes i can well imagine a whole lot of complications if he did change his version, interesting times ahead.........

 

[soozieqtips]

Ok Colin. I'll accept your apology, as I have u'stood your points, if you go and find out what are the sentencing guidelines for his level of "aggravated" perjury and estimation of size of litigation suit he would put himself at risk of.

I think he'll take the truth of what happened that night to the grave. Look at the debacle over the Tasha's incident. Deny deny deny. That seems to be his mantra... even when the proof he's lying is right there in front of him.

 

[cottonweaver]

.....that's fine i"m so glad you've accepted my explanation, no point in enticing in unneeded moderation is there ........yes i can well imagine a whole lot of complications if he did change his version, interesting times ahead.........

Well we're on thread 64 now, so yes, if we're unlucky/lucky it could get to a hundred on this case
no point in enticing in unneeded moderation is there

....... if I find something rude, rest assured, I am happy to fight my own corner. And I think mods have something better to do than cruise threads

And as I have to be elsewhere in 30 mins - I can't get into the further "complications" now .:late:

 

[Viper]

I'm not a computer expert but having just a hard drive seems weird, although authorities have not disclosed a full list of all of the contraband that was seized from OPs cell.

Maybe someone here can elaborate but I believe that OP would need a computer to plug the hard drive in to in order to use the device, and perhaps prisoners do have access to one from time to time. Even so, having the hard drive is a big no no and authorities are now reading the information that it contains, hmm...

 

[G.bng]

Can you please post your link? TIA

Sorry CW, no link since I downloaded the 599 page pdf way back last year and for the life of me I wouldn't be able to remember from where even if I tried (I did just try googling "oscar pistorius transcript testimony download" with no result). I could try uploading it somewhere but I'm pretty sure another poster here has already done that since I'm pretty sure I must have got the link I used from here in the first place.

P.S. When I said "official" that was my assumption/feeling at the time which may not be correct, but it does have some discrepancies with the transcript I was in the middle of compiling little by little but stopped when I found the full one.

 

[Colin de France]

I think he'll take the truth of what happened that night to the grave. Look at the debacle over the Tasha's incident. Deny deny deny. That seems to be his mantra... even when the proof he's lying is right there in front of him.

...........what proof ? .......the thing about this case is that there's no proof about anything.... anywhere ......whatsoever.....

 

[soozieqtips]

I'm not a computer expert but having just a hard drive seems weird, although authorities have not disclosed a full list of all of the contraband that was seized from OPs cell.

Maybe someone here can elaborate but I believe that OP would need a computer to plug the hard drive in to in order to use the device, and perhaps prisoners do have access to one from time to time. Even so, having the hard drive is a big no no and authorities are now reading the information that it contains, hmm...

BIB - I'm no expert either, but I'm pretty sure you can't access/read a hard drive without a computer. But you have to laugh at this:

Anneliese Burgess, spokeswoman for the Pistorius family, said she had no knowledge of ‘the specifics’ of the search, but added, ‘there is no way that Oscar would do anything that is against prison regulations or be in possession of anything that had not been vetted by prison authorities’.

So she has no knowledge of the 'specifics' of the search - but she does know OP wouldn't do anything against the regulations? Does she know that because he's always been such a well-behaved law-abiding citizen in the past?