Oscar Pistorius - Sentencing - 6.13.2016 #2

[Really?]

Everyone here (and online in other places, SA attorneys included) is just guessing! Geez, Masipa could just as easily throw 25 years at him to regain her respect.

How many more days Really??? :smile:

1..............:jail:

 

[JudgeJudi]

We have written an open letter to Barry Roux to ask him some questions about his conduct in court. Read here

I'm having serious connectivity issues tonight. After trying to send a PM for a couple of hours, I went to DS and found this link.

Aaaaah, excellent letter. My thoughts on Roux are well known so I loved every bit of this.

 

[JudgeJudi]

BIB mmm very astute.

I'd always mentioned a "mentor" but never thought they may be out of the system.
I hope this guru isn't you know who .....

Absolutely cotton. We'll know when she's reading her sentence if she starts stopping and starting, making alterations and maybe even calling a brief adjournment.

 

[mrjitty]

I'm having serious connectivity issues tonight. After trying to send a PM for a couple of hours, I went to DS and found this link.

Aaaaah, excellent letter. My thoughts on Roux are well known so I loved every bit of this.

In a way it should be an open letter to the Judge as many of those things I feel are more the role of the Judge to police!

Of course Counsel may claim this that and the other thing!

You know that I also share your view that Mr Roux mislead the Court on multiple occasions.

 

[Hazy]

In a way it should be an open letter to the Judge as many of those things I feel are more the role of the Judge to police!

Of course Counsel may claim this that and the other thing!

You know that I also share your view that Mr Roux mislead the Court on multiple occasions.

It just shows that Masipa did not do any serious analysis of any evidence. Lazy judging.

 

[Really?]

First things first.........

Where is that missing phone.....duh, .....someone gets killed....ends up dead.......and vital records of the night go missing......

BAM......guilty is as guilty does.

 

[JudgeJudi]

I think some of his sentence will be suspended. He won't serve the entire time in prison given a sentence say of 10 years. He can't be given Correctional Supervision from what i've read because he's had the maximum allowed of 5 years for Culpable Homicide, even though this is resentencing for different conviction of Murder , it is taken into account what he was given before for CH, like time served (a pathetic year only). I don't think his entire sentence will be suspended, he'll have to do some prison time.

One thing i think we could all agree on is that the effect on the Familiy, ie Barry Steenkamp hit many a nerve and you couldn't have helped be moved by his testimony on how losing his daughter in such a brutal way will affect the rest of his life. If Judge Masipa takes this impact testimony into account, which i'm sure she will, anything less than Pistorius having seen to be 'paying for what he did' which was Barry's wish, would be a complete injustice and cause worldwide criticism of the SA Justice system and Pistorius being seen more of the victim in all this than Reeva.

From Sentencing Guide: South Africa

In addition to the mandatory minimum sentences, the mandatory minimum sentencing regime also restricts the ability of judges to suspend parts of custodial sentences they impose. The Criminal Procedure Act provides that a court, after it convicts a person for a crime for which a prescribed minimum sentence is applicable, may suspend up to five years of the prescribed sentence on the basis of various conditions, including compensation, community service, submission to correctional supervision, good behavior, or any other condition that it deems fit. The mandatory sentencing regime prohibits the suspension of a mandatory minimum sentence

https://www.loc.gov/law/help/sentencing-guidelines/southafrica.php

 

[Marfa Lights]

He didn't get 48 hours last time but maybe a longer sentence warrants that 'to get his affairs in order' ?

Up to judge I guess.

I hope to see him pass off one of his expensive watches to Uncle Arnie again...

 

[Cloen]

In a way it should be an open letter to the Judge as many of those things I feel are more the role of the Judge to police!

Of course Counsel may claim this that and the other thing!

You know that I also share your view that Mr Roux mislead the Court on multiple occasions.

The way he cross examined those nervous neighbours who were adamant they heard Reeva screaming made me want to smash the tv,
I can not still believe Masipa allowed him to confuse and twist what they were saying, it went too far, she gave Roux too much free rein he took advantage of it, and i was willing Nel to get up and object to Roux's badgering of the witnesses. I thought Masipa must be deaf not to have stepped in.

For me the very first witness , the neighbour who said she heard Blood Curdling screams and it still haunted her was the most damning , so many things wrong with this trial , and can imagine the embarrassment of Judges like Leach having seen that , if he did.

 

[Cloen]

First things first.........

Where is that missing phone.....duh, .....someone gets killed....ends up dead.......and vital records of the night go missing......

BAM......guilty is as guilty does.

Ask Carl and Oscar where that phone is.

Oh , interesting news , which some of you may already know , -- Carl P is dating Karen Maughan one of the Legal journos who's been reporting on the trial and been on SA news shows etc updating on this trial since Day One, conflict of interests ? My jaw dropped too.
Some may recognise her ....
https://twitter.com/karynmaughan

 

[Cloen]

Absolutely cotton. We'll know when she's reading her sentence if she starts stopping and starting, making alterations and maybe even calling a brief adjournment.

As before the Lawyers could have discussed the sentencing in Chambers already before it starts tomorrow, so they'll know which way it will go
All eyes on Nel..

 

[Cloen]

I'm having serious connectivity issues tonight. After trying to send a PM for a couple of hours, I went to DS and found this link.

Aaaaah, excellent letter. My thoughts on Roux are well known so I loved every bit of this.

He's a private Lawyer , getting paid megabucks for representing Pistorius , it's his job to defend ,
as it was Shapiro in OJ Simpson Trial
He was able to get away with twisting things to help his client because the Judge gave him leaway too,
If he could get Pistorius a Culpable Homicide sentence the first time round , he could get any guilty criminal off anything again, he's very good, and it was the Police failures that Nel had to work with too , must have been very frustrating being a Lawyer knowing the guy is guilty as sin of cold blooded murder and Reeva screamed for her life but not being able to convince the Judge because of Lawyers like Roux with little defence , creating a good enough story to rebut that it went the way it did, in Pistorius's favour. Very sad for the Steenkamps.

I hope for their states of mind that Reeva's family get some justice tomorrow and Pistorius does PAY for what he's done.

 

[Cloen]

Agree. But I'm still dumbfounded of how the minimum sentence for murder is 15 years; But he still hasn't been sentenced yet. What's the problem.

I'm sure he can appeal it later while staying out of jail.

So what's the problem.

this is Murder conviction now
I think he'd have to go to prison and Appeal process go while he's inside , if she sentences him to Prison
I don't think he can stay out on bail while he appeals a sentence given for Murder , i'm not sure , but i think that's correct this time round.

 

[Hazy]

Ask Carl and Oscar where that phone is.

Oh , interesting news , which some of you may already know , -- Carl P is dating Karen Maughan one of the Legal journos who's been reporting on the trial and been on SA news shows etc updating on this trial since Day One, conflict of interests ? My jaw dropped too.

Och. Poor Karen!

She therefore shouldn't be reporting in it.

 

[Viper]

this is Murder conviction now
I think he'd have to go to prison and Appeal process go while he's inside , if she sentences him to Prison
I don't think he can stay out on bail while he appeals a sentence given for Murder , i'm not sure , but i think that's correct this time round.

Barry Bateman (check his twitter account) says OP can apply for bail awaiting the outcome of his appeal against this sentence, if he appeals it.

ETA: But it wouldn't make sense to apply for bail because there is no way he'd get a non custodial sentence from the SCA, so just spending money to delay the inevitable.

 

[Cloen]

Today's enca

http://www.enca.com/south-africa/preview-oscar-pistoriuss-sentencing-procedures

this is from a link from the other forum, thought I'd move it over here, thanks .

edit - just checked , i can't find where it apparently says URoux "says Oscar should have 48 hours to report to prison after sentencing ...He also said Oscar could apply for bail if he decides to appeal the sentence."

it does have the live feed broadcast for tomorrow at the top though.

it's not as easy to find the interview with Ulrich Roux as it looks
When looking at the screen on your link - go to the arrow on the actual still VT for the live broadcast tomorrow,and it will scroll to the next VT , which is the interview with Ulrich Roux

On that link

Live court proceedings are expected to start at 9:30am on Wednesday, 6 July.
I read it was 9am , but says 9.30am on this ENCA link

 

[Viper]

Och. Poor Karen!

She therefore shouldn't be reporting in it.

Must be an extreme shortage of employed males of marriage age in SA?

 

[mrjitty]

He's a private Lawyer , getting paid megabucks for representing Pistorius , it's his job to defend ,
as it was Shapiro in OJ Simpson Trial
He was able to get away with twisting things to help his client because the Judge gave him leaway too,

JJ is aware of this

However in the legal world JJ and I are familiar with, a barrister has strong duties to the Court and would not normally compromise those out of a desire to win a particular case.

It's hardly great for the rest of your career if the High Court bench at large gets the idea that you are devious.

That said, I do go along with the idea that the Judge failed to maintain the appropriate standards.

In NZ, some of the defence conduct would certainly have drawn strong criticism from the bench.

Especially Roux's habit of leading hearsay evidence or making claims not in evidence.

This is where I felt it was obvious that the Judge was simply too weak on High Court procedure and was lax on evidential law.

If you've spent 20 years arguing in the High Court, then evidential procedure is simply second nature when you become a judge

 

[Cloen]

Och. Poor Karen!

She therefore shouldn't be reporting in it.

Doesn't seem right does it,
She is his rumoured grilfriend ,
i read her twitter nothing recent on Pistorious trial

 

[Cloen]

JJ is aware of this

However in the legal world JJ and I are familiar with, a barrister has strong duties to the Court and would not normally compromise those out of a desire to win a particular case.

It's hardly great for the rest of your career if the High Court bench at large gets the idea that you are devious.

That said, I do go along with the idea that the Judge failed to maintain the appropriate standards.

In NZ, some of the defence conduct would certainly have drawn strong criticism from the bench.

Especially Roux's habit of leading hearsay evidence or making claims not in evidence.

This is where I felt it was obvious that the Judge was simply too weak on High Court procedure and was lax on evidential law.

If you've spent 20 years arguing in the High Court, then evidential procedure is simply second nature when you become a judge

I agree, he was more than devious ,and i blame Nel too as well as the Judge for not objecting ,
but had Nel done so he'd have been UP out his seat all the time.
I only heard her once in the recent trial tell Roux that he was confusing the witness.,that was the Prison Staff woman who gave testimony on Pistorius' conduct in Prison
I did not like the way Roux seems to TELL THE JUDGE WHAT SHE MUST DO ....... very arrogant and too far. .