PA - Assassination attempt, shooting injures former POTUS Donald Trump, leaves 1 spectator deceased two in critical condition, 13 July 2024 #4

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Simply Southern said:
All my opinion .... A little bit of food for thought

Let's change the verbage to outdoor events.

My perspective changes.

Do we really want to prevent/discourage Presidents, VPs, First Ladies both past and present from participating in outdoor events?

No more college commencement, no sports events, no throwing the first ball out before a major league game, no Olympics, no outside events in foreign countries- for sure, no more placing a wealth on the Unknown Soldiers Tomb, no more trips to the ice cream shops, outdoor restaurants, lawn and garden parties or cookouts. This is just a few events that would be prohibited.

All because we can't trust the SS to develop safe site plans, snipers, drone aerial surveillance, communication for all involved, and more. They don't seem to be able to take responsibility and as we have heard there is no accountability. The new director is hurt, the staff are sad, upset, low morale, and concerned about protecting themselves.


Since Butler I've learned and researched on federal processes extensively. SS only protects the inner perimeter, they delegate everything else to local police with no support, training or communication. Large cities are able to do a great job, It's a little small towns, with small police forces that struggle, they may not have inside venues or transportation to travel to an inside venue.

Should we only have events in cities like Chicago, Milwaukee, or New York City, because they have the resources training and staff? What about the people of rural America, the children hoping to get a lifetime chance to see a current a former president or first lady. I'm remember the first time I saw a president, it was a feeling of aw and vast emotions, I was 12.

I say no, we can't discourage outside events because an agency with a 3 million dollar budget it's incapable of protection. Are we going to force protectees to run scared because the agency can't function as mandated by Congress.

If the Secret Service cannot protect protectees, we need to look to another agency.

Should we consider the military, they have more than enough people, the best resources in the world? Possibly create a new protection division.

Just shut down the protection division of the Secret Service.
They've been plagued by one scandal after another for the last 30 years and been unable to recover.

Anyone have any thoughts...
Click to expand...
I like your verbiage. :)
I don't really believe indoor events are that much safer than outdoor events, unless the "indoors" is an actual hardened target like a meeting area on a military base. Even there, you always have the possibility of someone like Nidal Hasan.
There have been numerous reports of the SS failing recently. But the Butler rally was such a shitshow, on so many levels, at so many intersections and for such an extended period of time that, IMHO, logic strongly suggests that something sinister is going on - knowledgable neglince at best, and very bad things beyond that. The lockdown on facts reinforces that suspicion. We really need answers on what happened here before we can even try to fix it going forward. But time marches on, which is why stonewalling is historically such an effective tactic.
 
How in the world are political leaders suppose to wave to the crowds while exiting/entering their aircraft?! See, it's just best they don't travel at all. Oooooh more taxpayer savings!! The benefits are growing every moment. ;)

jmo
 
fred&edna said:
I've already forgotten...when is the next hearing scheduled? I want to be sure to watch Rowe testify or rather test-a-lie, again.

TIA

jmo
Click to expand...
The Senate and House spend August in their home state office. They meet with constituents, attend events and keep in touch with Interns and Aids working in their DC office.
Both houses are due to return September 9th. That's not just saying it there's an emergency, they can reconvene quickly.

I didn't check the Senate website calendar and no hearings are showing scheduled for any committee. I assume they'll schedule when they return.
Moo
Link to Congressional calendar below
 
About the apparent lockdown on facts and information :
The secret service and others above their paygrade are hoping we'll just forget about what happened ?Sorry ... but my memory is better than that !
Why have none of those people been called in for an interview or at least questioned by their superiors ?
No one is going to be fired or at least put on suspension while it's being investigated ?
I realize this has been asked before now.

If a former president isn't safe, than none of us are safe .
Moo.
Omo.
 
layer said:
I like your verbiage. :)
I don't really believe indoor events are that much safer than outdoor events, unless the "indoors" is an actual hardened target like a meeting area on a military base. Even there, you always have the possibility of someone like Nidal Hasan.
There have been numerous reports of the SS failing recently. But the Butler rally was such a shitshow, on so many levels, at so many intersections and for such an extended period of time that, IMHO, logic strongly suggests that something sinister is going on - knowledgable neglince at best, and very bad things beyond that. The lockdown on facts reinforces that suspicion. We really need answers on what happened here before we can even try to fix it going forward. But time marches on, which is why stonewalling is historically such an effective tactic.
Click to expand...
Bbm.

ITA.
They're hoping the public will forget after a lengthy amount of time passes.
Omo.
 
SECOND SECURITY BREACH
***WITHIN 18 DAYS***

I am thoroughly convinced this cannot be fixed.
The media has downplayed much of MSM did not cover.

Two individuals made it through the first screening point and then BREACHED the area that was suppose to be the most secure !!!! I've learned SS is 100% responsible for the inner perimeter.

Yes, they found the two individuals, the article didn't say who located them only that the Secret Service spoke with them and no charges were files. So they don't hold employees accountable and now they're not holding the general public accountable.

They could have of easily planted a couple of bombs in the inner perimeter.

What in the world is going on!!

Wonder who discovered the breach?
*A private citizen
*Local law enforcement
*Tennessee State Police
*Secret Service

Does the new director...
Not care, he stated plans would be reviewed by multiple supervisors?
Are the supervisors going to be reprimanded for another breach?

Is the SS short staffed due to sadness, hurt feelings, afraid to act and perform job functions?

I think this 100% validates everything The whistleblower sniper wrote in the letter!!!!

I'm waiting for a statement from Rowe.... Silence
Moo ....

nypost.com

Exclusive | Secret Service delayed Trump from taking Nashville stage after another security lapse: sources

The latest security slip-up came around two weeks after Trump was grazed by a sniper’s bullet during a rally in Butler, Pennsylvania where three rally goers were shot, including one fatally.
nypost.com nypost.com

...
The Secret Service said in a statement to The Post Monday night the two were “credentialed and screened,” but were removed from the premises because they didn’t follow proper entry protocol.
....After the two people were tracked down, they were ejected from the event and questioned, sources said. Neither person has been criminally charged.

The two did get stopped at an initial checkpoint before they bypassed the second screening, sources said.
 
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Chimera said:
Rowe may have been brought in to do some major damage control ?
Imo.
Omo.
Click to expand...
Well they got the wrong guy.

Rowe's is a social worker in my book, not a leader. Leaders don't wallow in self-pity and blame others. He's hurt, this people are hurt, it's not their fault. He needs to be removed immediately.

Leaders stand up, pull the team together and move forward. He's a former marine, makes me a shame. Think Patton, his troops followed him straight into war. He didn't back down, he had a job to do and he did it exemplary.

Moo...
 
Simply Southern said:
The Senate and House spend August in their home state office. They meet with constituents, attend events and keep in touch with Interns and Aids working in their DC office.
Both houses are due to return September 9th. That's not just saying it there's an emergency, they can reconvene quickly.

I didn't check the Senate website calendar and no hearings are showing scheduled for any committee. I assume they'll schedule when they return.
Moo
Link to Congressional calendar below
Click to expand...

Thank you for the info. IIRC Rowe committed to having the "involved" SS agents available to committee members within days, and I assume any info gleaned will be included in the open record... am I correct? And, if you know, is this record viewable only to committee members or can it be accessed by the public & news reporters and if so, when? (Only after Aug 14 or ?) TIA!

PS: I don't know how I forgot Rowe lying prone on that roof... thank goodness I'm not a SS agent ;)
 
Simply Southern said:
All my opinion .... A little bit of food for thought

I say no, we can't discourage outside events because an agency with a 3 million dollar budget it's incapable of protection. Are we going to force protectees to run scared because the agency can't function as mandated by Congress.

If the Secret Service cannot protect protectees, we need to look to another agency.
.
Click to expand...
snipped for focus, BBM

Well said but -

It's $3 BILLION - not 3 million.

which just emphasizes your point.
www.cbsnews.com

The Secret Service budget has swelled to more than $3 billion. Here's where the money goes.

Almost half the Secret Service's personnel is tasked with protecting the president and other elected officials. Here's what to know.
www.cbsnews.com www.cbsnews.com
 
fred&edna said:
How in the world are political leaders suppose to wave to the crowds while exiting/entering their aircraft?! See, it's just best they don't travel at all. Oooooh more taxpayer savings!! The benefits are growing every moment. ;)

jmo
Click to expand...
Maybe the election process in the US needs to be changed. To put all candidates on a level playing field. Maybe a potential candidate shouldn't be allowed to campaign from the day they were inaugurated. That puts a tremendous strain on all aspects of the government; from providing security for the candidate to vetting the locations, using local LE personnel who provide additional security.

According to this article, wealthy candidates can always provide their own security and pay for it out of their own pocket or use campaign funds for security details. Even regular-Joe congressmen and women have to make a personal decision on how to protect themselves from wingnuts yet without being provided regular security. The number of threats that SS deal with every year aren't limited to presidential candidates - they run from Supreme Court judges, congressmen and women, senators and private citizens like Paul Pelosi (although Nancy's personal detail followed her and no one was protecting her husband). So there's another lapse in security. Trump is the first former president to actually run again so he presented a much different circumstance than let's say, Jimmy Carter or George W H Bush. I believe that difference is why there was a lapse in security. I doubt it will happen again.

ny1.com

FEC wants to allow campaigns to pay for security amid rise in threats

Threats against Congress members rose eightfold since 2016.
ny1.com ny1.com

rollcall.com

Capitol Police knew security precaution lapsed ahead of Paul Pelosi attack - Roll Call

The Capitol Police let a security precaution lapse for months ahead of the October 2022 break-in and attack on Paul Pelosi.
rollcall.com rollcall.com

In Canada where I live there is a limit to when a candidate can start campaigning. Once the election is called usually between 37 to 51 days the candidates can start campaigning. Some drop out because they don't have the funding (usually the fringe type candidates). Here's a chart that shows the differences in voting.

Federal Elections Comparison Table | Elections Canada's Civic Education

Comparable
electionsanddemocracy.ca electionsanddemocracy.ca
 
I'll
fred&edna said:
Thank you for the info. IIRC Rowe committed to having the "involved" SS agents available to committee members within days, and I assume any info gleaned will be included in the open record... am I correct? And, if you know, is this record viewable only to committee members or can it be accessed by the public & news reporters and if so, when? (Only after Aug 14 or ?) TIA!

PS: I don't know how I forgot Rowe lying prone on that roof... thank goodness I'm not a SS agent ;)
Click to expand...
I'm not sure if this combined committee will release information like Chairman Grassley. I did check his website today, no additional updates.

If the interviews are scheduled this week, I am confident that the senators or some of them will stay to conduct the interviews.

I've had the honor of attending several Congressional Hearings during my working career. We take a high school field trip every year to DC. If Congress is not in session, we arrange to attend a congressional hearing. Any congressional representative can help arrange a visit to Congress or a congressional committee. If you're ever in the DC area it is an awesome, one of a kind experience.

Moo...
 
Last edited:
branmuffin said:
Maybe the election process in the US needs to be changed. To put all candidates on a level playing field. Maybe a potential candidate shouldn't be allowed to campaign from the day they were inaugurated. That puts a tremendous strain on all aspects of the government; from providing security for the candidate to vetting the locations, using local LE personnel who provide additional security.

According to this article, wealthy candidates can always provide their own security and pay for it out of their own pocket or use campaign funds for security details. Even regular-Joe congressmen and women have to make a personal decision on how to protect themselves from wingnuts yet without being provided regular security. The number of threats that SS deal with every year aren't limited to presidential candidates - they run from Supreme Court judges, congressmen and women, senators and private citizens like Paul Pelosi (although Nancy's personal detail followed her and no one was protecting her husband). So there's another lapse in security. Trump is the first former president to actually run again so he presented a much different circumstance than let's say, Jimmy Carter or George W H Bush. I believe that difference is why there was a lapse in security. I doubt it will happen again.

ny1.com

FEC wants to allow campaigns to pay for security amid rise in threats

Threats against Congress members rose eightfold since 2016.
ny1.com ny1.com

rollcall.com

Capitol Police knew security precaution lapsed ahead of Paul Pelosi attack - Roll Call

The Capitol Police let a security precaution lapse for months ahead of the October 2022 break-in and attack on Paul Pelosi.
rollcall.com rollcall.com

In Canada where I live there is a limit to when a candidate can start campaigning. Once the election is called usually between 37 to 51 days the candidates can start campaigning. Some drop out because they don't have the funding (usually the fringe type candidates). Here's a chart that shows the differences in voting.

Federal Elections Comparison Table | Elections Canada's Civic Education

Comparable
electionsanddemocracy.ca electionsanddemocracy.ca
Click to expand...
In the US, the first amendment right to free speech would prohibit a limit on campaigning.

We do have a law .... Certain presidential candidates can receive SS protection 120 days prior to election date.
 
SouthAussie said:
"Just over two weeks after he was injured in an assassination attempt at a rally in Butler, former President Donald Trump returned to Pennsylvania on Wednesday for a campaign rally in the state capital.

Trump took the stage at about 7 p.m. ...... saying he wasn’t going to give up outdoor rallies."

Trump campaigns in Harrisburg in first trip back to Pennsylvania since assassination attempt
Click to expand...
The problem is that there aren't enough indoor venues in key locations that are large enough for President Trump to hold rallies for those who want to attend. An indoor venue with only the capacity of 7,000 - 8,000 people and that leaves another 10,000 people outside is not ideal during a campaigning period. So it is understandable that outdoor venues may be selected, and ideally outdoor venues that are less of a security challenge than apparently Butler was for the SS.
 
GRT said:
I agree that it's irresponsible for leaders to promote conspiracy theories, but when there's a news vacuum, people often resort to conspiracies to explain the situation.

SS dropped the ball--not only at the attempted assassination but also afterward. Rowe claimed he wanted to wait until the investigation was complete to fire anyone, and I get that. Still, all agents who were in a position to hear/see/act in a different way that might have prevented the shooting should have IMMEDIATELY been temporarily relieved of their duties pending the results of an investigation.

That's what LE typically does when there's a big investigation--just to maintain integrity. Not doing so in this case is creating a partisan feel, and that opens Pandora's Box to conspiracies.

But, more than that--it's actually putting Trump in a more favorable light with voters. Had SS come out with a strong message that they would NOT tolerate this type of ineptness and really thrown their messaging behind that--they'd look better now.

All JMOO
Click to expand...
Conspiracies are real and happen every day, especially in politics where power, control and money are driving factors. The term "conspiracy theory" was put forth by the CIA to discredit those who questioned the official story in the JFK assassination. They tried to make people look crazy who dug for the truth.
 
Rowe to receive request from Senate Appropriation Committee
....
“Recognizing the importance of this mission, Congress provided more than $190 million to the Secret Service in Fiscal Year 2024, specifically for protection requirements related to the 2024 presidential campaign, plus an additional $22 million above President Biden’s budget request for protection-related travel costs.”

www.murphy.senate.gov

Home | U.S. Senator Chris Murphy of Connecticut

The official U.S. Senate website of Senator Chris Murphy of Connecticut
www.murphy.senate.gov www.murphy.senate.gov
The senators requested Secret Service provide answers to several questions regarding the agency’s funding needs, including:

How has the Secret Service obligated the funding provided by Congress for the 2024 Presidential campaign, including travel-related protection expenses?
Please detail the amount of this funding obligated to date, and the proposed plan for any remaining balances.

Did the Secret Service provide a level of protection for former President Trump’s Pennsylvania rally equivalent to the protection provided for President Biden’s campaign rally in Michigan the previous day?
Why or why not?

The Washington Post and New York Times have reported that the Trump campaign had requested additional Secret Service protection in recent months, but the Secret Service rejected those requests.
Did the Trump Campaign request additional protection, including for the Pennsylvania rally?
If so, provide the details of the requests, including the dates, the disposition of such requests, and the rationale for each decision.

Was the security failure at the Pennsylvania rally the result of insufficient resources?

In addition to providing protection to new presidential and vice presidential candidates, what changes, if any, is the Secret Service considering to its protection practices for the remainder of the presidential campaign?

Is the Secret Service currently projecting any funding shortfalls for Fiscal Year 2024?
If so, provide in detail the basis and rationale of such shortfalls.

Given the 2024 election will take place in Fiscal Year 2025, do you believe additional resources above those requested in the President’s FY25 budget request, will be required to adequately meet the Secret Service mission, including, the protection of presidential candidates, existing protectees, the election certification, and the Inauguration?

Full letter
 

Attachments

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Chimera said:
Bbm.

ITA.
They're hoping the public will forget after a lengthy amount of time passes.
Omo.
Click to expand...
I think that is likely the case, but how can U.S. citizens forget about an assassination attempt on one of their presidents? I've never forgotten the assassination of JFK, or the attempted assassination of President Reagan, and now will never forget the assassination attempt on President Trump, the most recent in our lifetime. President Trump's assassination attempt took place on live television with thousands of people watching and tens of thousand people at the event itself. This is something that will be etched on our memories forever. As sad as that is.
 
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