Found Deceased PA - Paul Kochu, 22, Allegheny County, 17 Dec 2014 - #2

[Jillybean78]

Interesting post on FB..not sure I agree. I understand that the family will go through many emotions, but I'm wondering if they have something to back up their theory.

 

[heartgoesout]

It says (snipped)....We know you didn't end up in the river own your own accord....

 

[Detective Klimpt]

It says (snipped)....We know you didn't end up in the river own your own accord....

MOO, they don't know anything. What's more, I don't mind saying I'm annoyed with the way they subtly insinuate that someone (read roommates) killed him. The sister made some nasty remark on twitter about the LE too busy eating donuts to investigate the case. The family will never accept that he committed suicide, nor will some of you.

 

[Jillybean78]

MOO, they don't know anything. What's more, I don't mind saying I'm annoyed with the way they subtly insinuate that someone (read roommates) killed him. The sister made some nasty remark on twitter about the LE too busy eating donuts to investigate the case. The family will never accept that he committed suicide, nor will some of you.

Couldn't agree more!

 

[heartgoesout]

Did the coronor announce it was suicide? Last time I check the death was still being investigated.

 

[cluciano63]

No announcement that I have seen. But not sure how they will determine manner of death, if accidental or suicide. Jmo

 

[Jillybean78]

Hmmmm...slitting wrist and emotional AND THEN murder? Not likely. JMHO

 

[LayzeeDayzee]

I always wondered.......the night Paul went missing, had he been upset re: a love interest?........did something happen that night at the bar that caused him strangely to leave and walk home by himself? Maybe someone he was interested in (not sure if he was gay or straight?) turned him down, or told him they weren't interested, or someone he was interested was there at the bar with someone else? It's always sounded to me, when you read between the lines, that something at the bar upset him, he was drunk, became upset and left the bar because he was upset........went home, tried to commit suicide (cut himself, slit wrist?) but didn't succeed or got scared and realized he didn't want to die so he called his friends,upset and drunk, told them he'd cut himself and needed them to come home to help him.....they get home, he tells them some "story" about how he cut himself, they brush it off, they decide to go for something to eat, Paul is still very upset so doesn't go with them.........then takes off without telling anyone, and commits suicide by jumping into the river or if ice on it at that time of the year, intentionally walked onto it and broke thru? Just seems to me that at that age, one of the most common reasons for someone to become really emotional and upset (when drinking), particularly a guy, is due to a love-interest kind of scenario. Thoughts?

 

[Detective Klimpt]

I always wondered.......the night Paul went missing, had he been upset re: a love interest?........did something happen that night at the bar that caused him strangely to leave and walk home by himself? Maybe someone he was interested in (not sure if he was gay or straight?) turned him down, or told him they weren't interested, or someone he was interested was there at the bar with someone else? It's always sounded to me, when you read between the lines, that something at the bar upset him, he was drunk, became upset and left the bar because he was upset........went home, tried to commit suicide (cut himself, slit wrist?) but didn't succeed or got scared and realized he didn't want to die so he called his friends,upset and drunk, told them he'd cut himself and needed them to come home to help him.....they get home, he tells them some "story" about how he cut himself, they brush it off, they decide to go for something to eat, Paul is still very upset so doesn't go with them.........then takes off without telling anyone, and commits suicide by jumping into the river or if ice on it at that time of the year, intentionally walked onto it and broke thru? Just seems to me that at that age, one of the most common reasons for someone to become really emotional and upset (when drinking), particularly a guy, is due to a love-interest kind of scenario. Thoughts?

Exactly what I think happened and I've posted as such. I don't see how COD could distinguish accurately between accident and suicide, but moo common sense says it was no accident. There is only one thing that I'd really like to know and that is if they were able to see any injury to his wrist during the autopsy. I hope the family asks about that so that they can be assured that this injury was self inflicted.

 

[Rshackleford1417]

Hmmmm...slitting wrist and emotional AND THEN murder? Not likely. JMHO

Oh god, here we go again. Don't let your own analysis become a reality, just stick to the facts. Show me one place, in the body of information available about paul, to indicate he was suicidal. Show me one place where the cut is to his wrist and not to his hand. Ben Monito called him "emotional". What does that mean? How are you going to let one person's (who hasn't spoken publicly since) choice of words define what happened? You have created a narrative from one word and your own interpretation of context rather than from fact.

Why are people here so hung up on suicide? there are people here that assume that they know Paul better than his own family. Look at Paul. He was employed at the start of his adult life, he was good looking, well educated, etc. Even if there was a traumatic breakup (although, again you will find no evidence of that) why would you suspect he wouldn't be able to find someone else? It would be one thing if there was any kind of hint that mental health issues were present, but there aren't. So when his family, the people who know him best, say he wasn't suicidal and that he had no intention of killing himself why do you insist they are in denial?

 

[TieDyeJedi]

Oh god, here we go again. Don't let your own analysis become a reality, just stick to the facts. Show me one place, in the body of information available about paul, to indicate he was suicidal. Show me one place where the cut is to his wrist and not to his hand. Ben Monito called him "emotional". What does that mean? How are you going to let one person's (who hasn't spoken publicly since) choice of words define what happened? You have created a narrative from one word and your own interpretation of context rather than from fact.

Why are people here so hung up on suicide? there are people here that assume that they know Paul better than his own family. Look at Paul. He was employed at the start of his adult life, he was good looking, well educated, etc. Even if there was a traumatic breakup (although, again you will find no evidence of that) why would you suspect he wouldn't be able to find someone else? It would be one thing if there was any kind of hint that mental health issues were present, but there aren't. So when his family, the people who know him best, say he wasn't suicidal and that he had no intention of killing himself why do you insist they are in denial?

Probably because the families of lots of people who commit suicide say they had no idea; their loved one seemed fine, etc. Some people hide it extremely well. And people in caregiving professions are at higher risk. (Doctors, nurses, psychiatric professionals, veterinarians, animal rescue volunteers, and so on.)

I'm not sure one way or the other, but dismissing suicidal tendencies because someone "seems fine" or has a lot going for them is naïve.

 

[LayzeeDayzee]

Interesting blog here, the comments: http://killingkillers.blogspot.ca/2015/01/maimed-and-missing-paul-kochu.html

Oh god, here we go again. Don't let your own analysis become a reality, just stick to the facts. Show me one place, in the body of information available about paul, to indicate he was suicidal. Show me one place where the cut is to his wrist and not to his hand. Ben Monito called him "emotional". What does that mean? How are you going to let one person's (who hasn't spoken publicly since) choice of words define what happened? You have created a narrative from one word and your own interpretation of context rather than from fact.

Why are people here so hung up on suicide? there are people here that assume that they know Paul better than his own family. Look at Paul. He was employed at the start of his adult life, he was good looking, well educated, etc. Even if there was a traumatic breakup (although, again you will find no evidence of that) why would you suspect he wouldn't be able to find someone else? It would be one thing if there was any kind of hint that mental health issues were present, but there aren't. So when his family, the people who know him best, say he wasn't suicidal and that he had no intention of killing himself why do you insist they are in denial?

 

[heartgoesout]

Oh god, here we go again. Don't let your own analysis become a reality, just stick to the facts. Show me one place, in the body of information available about paul, to indicate he was suicidal. Show me one place where the cut is to his wrist and not to his hand. Ben Monito called him "emotional". What does that mean? How are you going to let one person's (who hasn't spoken publicly since) choice of words define what happened? You have created a narrative from one word and your own interpretation of context rather than from fact.

Why are people here so hung up on suicide? there are people here that assume that they know Paul better than his own family. Look at Paul. He was employed at the start of his adult life, he was good looking, well educated, etc. Even if there was a traumatic breakup (although, again you will find no evidence of that) why would you suspect he wouldn't be able to find someone else? It would be one thing if there was any kind of hint that mental health issues were present, but there aren't. So when his family, the people who know him best, say he wasn't suicidal and that he had no intention of killing himself why do you insist they are in denial?

!! great post !! It's easy to hide behind a keyboard and make completely insensitive, ignorant remarks. Seems people forget these are real people and real situations. This is not a game, nor a hobby or personal entertainment, nor is it an ego battle. Unless you've had a family member missing or murdered, they just won't get it.

 

[cluciano63]

I think an accidental death is possible, as well as suicide. Sometimes people do commit suicide in a manner that seems sudden or arbitrary. In many, many cases, no true signs were noticed or recognized in advance. Also in many cases, families cannot accept a verdict of suicide.

Worse, it (manner of death) probably cannot be determined, for sure, in this case. Jmo

 

[Rshackleford1417]

!! great post !! It's easy to hide behind a keyboard and make completely insensitive, ignorant remarks. Seems people forget these are real people and real situations. This is not a game, nor a hobby or personal entertainment, nor is it an ego battle. Unless you've had a family member missing or murdered, they just won't get it.

Everyone has the constitutional right to discuss whatever they want. Just don't create fact from fiction-like saying he slit his wrist when there no mention of that anywhere. Also the investigative standard of "other people were surprised" and some anecdotal stats about caregivers doesn't amount to proof of suicide or anything else. Just admit you don't know what happened to Paul, because no one except for Paul really does.

 

[heartgoesout]

Everyone has the constitutional right to discuss whatever they want. Just don't create fact from fiction-like saying he slit his wrist when there no mention of that anywhere. Also the investigative standard of "other people were surprised" and some anecdotal stats about caregivers doesn't amount to proof of suicide or anything else. Just admit you don't know what happened to Paul, because no one except for Paul really does.

I completely agree. Those on here who choose to so adamantly try to say someone killed themselves with extremely little information sitting behind a computer is shameful.

 

[halaliphone]

Paul did not commit suicide. So we can end that line of discussion.

 

[JLSChook]

Waiting for a mod to say what we can and cannot discuss on this case....

:waiting:

 

[TieDyeJedi]

Everyone has the constitutional right to discuss whatever they want. Just don't create fact from fiction-like saying he slit his wrist when there no mention of that anywhere. Also the investigative standard of "other people were surprised" and some anecdotal stats about caregivers doesn't amount to proof of suicide or anything else. Just admit you don't know what happened to Paul, because no one except for Paul really does.

I did not say he committed suicide. The statistics are relevant because it is ridiculous to rule out the possibility based on what you're putting out there, too. As well as the fact that suicide is the #2 killer of young men.

I think what's truly shameful and, frankly, disgusting is this attitude some people have that it's in any way an insult or whatever else to consider suicide a possibility in a case like this. As if we're saying something awful about the victim you need to defend against. No, depression is a disease and sometimes it is terminal. There is nothing shameful about it, nor do you need to defend the deceased from the possibility. That just adds to the social stigma and shame that stops people from getting help.

But then, perhaps people who have never lost someone to suicide or have never been depressed or suicidal won't be able to understand that.

Funny, how that works.

 

[halaliphone]

Frankly, you can all discuss whatever you like. However, since none of you knew Paul, it is alot of speculation. As far as not understanding the nature of depression and loss, or not losing a family member to suicide, I think that maybe you underestimate our family, about which you also know nothing. I have always believed, as do several other of my family members, that there is another fact pattern to Paul's loss and ultimate death. And we may never know that. If you know the stages of grief, you will understand where Paul's immediate family is now. It's been a long three months and then some. God knows, we want answers far more than you do. And the pain of never knowing whether any will arrive is palpable. Let them have their snarky comments and their theories. They earned them.......by heart.