PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #6

[ThePhantom]

He wouldn't necessarily be living in poverty though if he took some assets, fled to say -- Mexico for example -- and worked doing something there. Since he is brilliant and knows the law, he would know how to make all that happen. He might have been 65, but to me he looked younger and seemed to be in good shape/health (?) The world is a big place -- if he was bored with his life and saw nothing head but the same 'ol, same 'ol, he could have methodically set aside some resources, possibly in a foreign bank, obtained whatever documents he needed, and split. Brilliant people can do that a lot better than average sots like me. Especially those with legal knowledge, etc.

 

[ThePhantom]

Food for thought:

http://www.escapeartist.com/efam/45/Disappearing.html

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I get that, but he only made 100K for a short time.

About seven years, 1998-2005.

From what I have read in this time he bought two mortgages, one for PF, helped with his daughter's and bought a car outright plus saved a $100K.

He paid off her mortgage, so it was a partial payment of the $68 K mortgage. His daughter was in college, and her mother had been making more than RFG through most of her life; I don't think LG owned a home at the time.

Further, he was divorced c. 2001, and the house he owned was sold. He had Mitsubishi that was apparently sold prior to getting the Mini.

Does anyone know if Ray was on anti Deppres drugs?

Nothing in his files and his friends said he didn't even take aspirin.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

He wouldn't necessarily be living in poverty though if he took some assets, fled to say -- Mexico for example -- and worked doing something there. Since he is brilliant and knows the law, he would know how to make all that happen. He might have been 65, but to me he looked younger and seemed to be in good shape/health (?) The world is a big place -- if he was bored with his life and saw nothing head but the same 'ol, same 'ol, he could have methodically set aside some resources, possibly in a foreign bank, obtained whatever documents he needed, and split. Brilliant people can do that a lot better than average sots like me. Especially those with legal knowledge, etc.

He was 59 when he disappeared and had family in Slovenia (cousins).

 

[CuriousHousewife]

If you really invest your money wisely, $100,000 a year for seven years is a lot of money, particularly if you move somewhere that the cost of living is much lower.

 

[cloudbuster05]

He wouldn't necessarily be living in poverty though if he took some assets, fled to say -- Mexico for example -- and worked doing something there. Since he is brilliant and knows the law, he would know how to make all that happen. He might have been 65, but to me he looked younger and seemed to be in good shape/health (?) The world is a big place -- if he was bored with his life and saw nothing head but the same 'ol, same 'ol, he could have methodically set aside some resources, possibly in a foreign bank, obtained whatever documents he needed, and split. Brilliant people can do that a lot better than average sots like me. Especially those with legal knowledge, etc.

Problem with that is Ray already made plans to retire at age 60 and he planned to travel with Patty. He even had maps from what I've heard. They were not secret plans but legit plans. He wanted to spend time also with Lara. He was exactly 8 months from his excited plans. I can't see Ray taking a hiding place in life especially when there was no reasons. He had concrete plans. Ray wouldn't like all this drama of his personal life exposed publically. Key question is what stopped Ray from his excited plans?

 

[cloudbuster05]

Wishful thinking. I pointed out that, even in his professional life, RFG had trouble buying legitimate guilty but insane defenses.



Roy did.

JJ Roy was ruled a drowning only because they had no proof of any crime. If you had children you need to stop and ask yourself if that would be the best time to kill yourself, while your youngster was waiting on you to pick him up at school. Ray didn't buy it and neither do I.
JMO

 

[ThePhantom]

I go back to my same question -- how well do you really know a person? They fullfill their obligations, get along with their loved ones, make plans, get all their ducks in a row -- but maybe, inside, they're thinking along the lines of "I can't live like this anymore, I don't want to live like this anymore, I want out!" It's not that they don't care about the people in their lives -- they're just -- done with it -- done being that person people depend on and have expectations of -- but, they can't bring themselves to put it out there, because they don't want to deal with the heartache, nor do they want to explain themselves...they just want to be free

??? I wish I knew him so I could speak intelligently about him.

 

[RTC]

7 years at 100k minus taxes/insur means he brought home approx 420K. we know he paid the 68K for house, 100K in bank, 32K for car? if we allocate him $1500 for living expenses etc, that is 126K so it is possible there was 94K left over, but money blows through my house very quicky. LOL. PF should know this answer. She lived with him.she should be able to calculate how much he spent monthly. She seems like she was on top of him. She worked right outside his door, she knew his email passwords. That sounds very smothering to me.

Life is expensive, one surgery and no insurance could eat up any hidden reserves.

 

[ThePhantom]

Is it possible he could have (somehow) obtained a different SSN in order to obtain Medicare? Could he be added to someone else's insurance policy? Are there affordable insurance policies out there he could purchase? If he had some money channeled into a foreign account, do those accounts earn much interest? Could he have made any investments unbeknownst to Patty? Does he have a wealthy friend out there who may have lent him some money? (that's a reach I know).

 

[J. J. in Phila]

7 years at 100k minus taxes/insur means he brought home approx 420K. we know he paid the 68K for house, 100K in bank, 32K for car? if we allocate him $1500 for living expenses etc, that is 126K so it is possible there was 94K left over, but money blows through my house very quicky. LOL. PF should know this answer. She lived with him.she should be able to calculate how much he spent monthly. She seems like she was on top of him. She worked right outside his door, she knew his email passwords. That sounds very smothering to me.

Life is expensive, one surgery and no insurance could eat up any hidden reserves.

You forgot something very important. He sold a house in a very good housing market; his ex-wife got some of that. He also disposed of his other car.

The car at the time should be below $26 K.

So far as I know, she didn't know his passwords. They shared the home computer, and it might have had a saved password.

Also $1,500 for a guy who paid no rent or house/car payments is gigantic. His cash withdrawals over the 2 1/2 years prior to his disappearance were about $16,000 total.

And, when I say "over" I mean over His salary in 2003, for example, was $120,225.

There are two other factors:

1. Taxes were lower in the mid-2000's than today.

2. Interest rates were higher in the mid-2000's than today.

He should have more.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Is it possible he could have (somehow) obtained a different SSN in order to obtain Medicare?

That is possible and has happened.

Could he be added to someone else's insurance policy? Are there affordable insurance policies out there he could purchase?

Yes to both, when you consider the amount of money he could have.

If he had some money channeled into a foreign account, do those accounts earn much interest?

Yes, and some foreign accounts pay slightly higher interest than US accounts.

Could he have made any investments unbeknownst to Patty?

It is certainly possible.

Does he have a wealthy friend out there who may have lent him some money? (that's a reach I know).

I have not found any.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

If he had some money channeled into a foreign account, do those accounts earn much interest?

I just wanted to through out this possibility. You can get more interest in other countries. Suppose that RFG did just that, not to walk away, but as an investment (or to hide it from the IRS). Some things are interest deferred and he would have to report it until cashed in. That could explain why his assets seem low.

There could be a whole bunch of out there earning interest, waiting to be claimed, untouched and totally unknown.

 

[ThePhantom]

Plenty of people do it, for one reason or another...

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Plenty of people do it, for one reason or another...

Did RFG? Maybe. If he did, how did he get out of Lewisburg?

 

[cloudbuster05]

7 years at 100k minus taxes/insur means he brought home approx 420K. we know he paid the 68K for house, 100K in bank, 32K for car? if we allocate him $1500 for living expenses etc, that is 126K so it is possible there was 94K left over, but money blows through my house very quicky. LOL. PF should know this answer. She lived with him.she should be able to calculate how much he spent monthly. She seems like she was on top of him. She worked right outside his door, she knew his email passwords. That sounds very smothering to me.

Life is expensive, one surgery and no insurance could eat up any hidden reserves.

He also took trips with PF and Im sure spent money on that too. Great post!!!

 

[cloudbuster05]

Did RFG? Maybe. If he did, how did he get out of Lewisburg?

Well the dogs only circled the mini in the lot so common sense would say he got into another vehicle as per Det Z. Its obvious it was not his car, that would be trackable. If we go down your path we end up with Ray breaking laws, using fake identities, costing the county a lot of money for air and ground searches and even costs for sending the hardrive out. Ray destroying his laptop and even separating it and walking away from excited anticipated plans for a normal retirement. A man who worked all his life to give it all away. A man that left a horrible legacy to the county and to his beloved daughter and family. A man who knew his whole personal life would become a spector for the public. All this in trade for??? He traded a stable life with plans for what poverty? JJ money only lasts for so long and even his nephew does not see all this money missing as you are saying. If LE believed that he had all those funds they would of said that. His best friend SS even said on disappeared ID show that investing to Ray was like talking Chinese. If anyone needs proof of that you can find the episode on utube.

 

[cloudbuster05]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLMEUEUtKK0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-jUDUaNWk0&feature=related part 2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XToxQva-dEI&feature=related part 3


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENGY1pVbUlQ&feature=related part 4

 

[cloudbuster05]

I only put up the links to the videos and they ended up like that? I stuck part 1 thru 4 up links but somehow they showed up the wrong way or is that how links show up?

 

[ThePhantom]

"devil's advocate" here -- if he committed suicide, where is his body; and, if he was murdered, with whom of a nefarious character did he affiliate and/or what cases did he prosecute that would result in his murder? Was he a transparent man? Did he have a confident? Did he have assets unknown to others or was he completely an open book? If you are sick of your life and want to end it or change it, do you care what legacy you leave or who you hurt? If you have the skills and intellect to start over, could or would you? Have you ever known someone who seemed perfectly content who then picked up and did something totally different -- like left a marriage, committed suicide or ... methodically made a plan and walked away -- to be free of the old encumberances (sp). How did he get out of Lewisburg - someone drove him....................