Penn State Sandusky Trial #11 (Verdict - GUILTY!)

[J. J. in Phila]

imagine your the judge...

jer insists, i didnt no nuthin to those boys but touch em on the legs and shower with them some

now, are u gonna allow him to potentially walk the streets again?

think about it.....

even judges have to live in the community....

I can imagine the judge, not wanting to be overturned on appeal. The community that judges live in is other judges. They are separate and independent.

Here is the case I was referring to: http://www.abc27.com/story/15209730/ex-marysville-officer-pleads-no-contest-to-molestation-charge

Pavlovich, perpetrator, was a cop; he used the prestige of his badge to commit crimes. Many crimes, with victims including a mentally challenged girl. I would argue that was slightly worse than Sandusky.

His sentence, 10-19 years, in 10 (possibly 9 1/2, I'm not too sure) years, he's eligible for parole. He'll be 50-51 years old. At best, they will have to let him out at 60-61.

Who is a bigger threat to society? A predator, late 70's or early 80's that doesn't understand how the police work or one about 51 that does understand how police work?

 

[costalpilot]

judges are not independent of living in the community.

they live there.

period.

plus. not sure what an appeal has to do with sentencing...as long as hes within the guidelines

a judge doesnt have to worry about appeal of sentencing

its entirely his discretion

 

[Quiche]

It is not only possible but probable on at least some of the charges.

Here is an example, a former cop: http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2009/06/new_sentencing_date_set_for_fo.html

He was convicted of some of the same charges, and had about half the number of charges. He was sentenced to 10-19 years, and can be paroled in just under ten years. The difference is, he'll be 50-51 when that happens.

Sandusky will be, at best, in his late 70's, and he'll be on Meagan's List for the remainder of his life.

If we are lucky, it might be 15-30, and Sandusky will be out by his 85th birthday.

Your legal arguments are accurate, but we are also looking at prison justice. Imo, if the sentencing is too lenient Jerry will get "taken care of" by other means. In fact, a very lenient sentence could be equated with a death sentence, and a fast moving one. Plus, what are the odds that some of those Second Mile "kids" are one and the same with a certain percentage of the inmates in that Bellefonte jail? There could even be PERSONAL vendettas against him in there.

Jerry's lawyers need to get real and begin speaking with him in hard cold facts... Let him know that this is it, and very little can be done to smooth his way to something less fortunate. He's a baby raper, the lowest of the low in his new prison community-- he's the scum that other villains want to be rid of... So sit tight, Jer, and quit complaining about your private cell and the food that everyone has to eat. Just sit tight and shut up. :jail:

Save the b*tch, moan, and groan for Dottie.

 

[bayouland]

Your legal arguments are accurate, but we are also looking at prison justice. Imo, if the sentencing is too lenient Jerry will get "taken care of" by other means. In fact, a very lenient sentence could be equated with a death sentence, and a fast moving one. Plus, what are the odds that some of those Second Mile "kids" are one and the same with a certain percentage of the inmates in that Bellefonte jail? There could even be PERSONAL vendettas against him in there.

Jerry's lawyers need to get real and begin speaking with him in hard cold facts... Let him know that this is it, and very little can be done to smooth his way to something less fortunate. He's a baby raper, the lowest of the low in his new prison community-- he's the scum that other villains want to be rid of... So sit tight, Jer, and quit complaining about your private cell and the food that everyone has to eat. Just sit tight and shut up. :jail:

Save the b*tch, moan, and groan for Dottie.

I had lunch with our local DA's secretary yesterday and she said her boss told her that if JS's sentence is not stringent enough, he won't live a year. He also said if he goes in general population he won't last a month.

So, I agree, quit b$%$% Jerry and be grateful that you are in solitary...enjoy it while it lasts.

Just thought it was worth repeating...

 

[~n/t~]

o/t - Was a thread started for Drew Peterson's trial? I tried the search function but nothing came up. TIA :seeya:

 

[J. J. in Phila]

judges are not independent of living in the community.

they live there.

period.

plus. not sure what an appeal has to do with sentencing...as long as hes within the guidelines

a judge doesnt have to worry about appeal of sentencing

its entirely his discretion

You've seen how other sentences go, in PA, even for more disgusting crimes. You have seen the sentencing guidelines. Links have been posted, as requested.

You are also aware that Amendola is asking for concurrent sentences. I can almost guarantee that most of them will be concurrent.

Now, you may not like that, but that is what sentencing is like in PA. Count you blessings if Sandusky will be eligible for parole in 15 years, as opposed to 10.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Your legal arguments are accurate, but we are also looking at prison justice. Imo, if the sentencing is too lenient Jerry will get "taken care of" by other means. In fact, a very lenient sentence could be equated with a death sentence, and a fast moving one. Plus, what are the odds that some of those Second Mile "kids" are one and the same with a certain percentage of the inmates in that Bellefonte jail? There could even be PERSONAL vendettas against him in there.

He'll be isolated and protected. [sarcasm]Part of the joys of the prison system.[/sarcasm]

 

[AngelWings444]

I have no doubt that Jer will be in prison the rest of his life. I have faith the judge is going to give him a very harsh sentence. It's not going to help Jer that is attitude has been so outrageous, and he hasn't admitted guilt. Judges do not like a criminal who doesn't take some responsibility.

If the judge doesn't give him a very harsh sentence, I believe there will be other criminal charges filed by prosecutors, on behalf of the numerous victims who didn't get justice in the courtroom. If he does get a harsh sentence and there is no chance he will ever get out, I believe the victims will just take the $$ and spare themselves from having to relive it in the courtroom.

JMO

 

[faw720]

just bewteen us, ole jer is done. ya gotta remember that he hasn't faced reality yet, and I would be shocked if he is able to b4 the sentencing, in which case the judge will certainly sentence him to an effective death-in-prison sentence.

imagine your the judge...

jer insists, i didnt no nuthin to those boys but touch em on the legs and shower with them some

now, are u gonna allow him to potentially walk the streets again?

think about it.....

even judges have to live in the community....

I agree that he hasn't accepted reality!! He says he is innocent. I would love it if someone interviewed him. I'm interested in knowing his definition of sexual abuse. Perhaps he thinks it isn't sexual abuse if you're a famous coach. And he's complaining about being in solitary confinement...........what does he think jail is........a country club?????? He thinks he's supposed to be enjoying himself????????? Sounds to me like total loss of reality.

 

[gitana1]

Well, everything posted was from other states. They are not applicable for Pennsylvania. I've also posted the sentencing guidelines and it's 10 years.

Amendola asked for concurrent sentences today:
http://edition.cnn.com/2012/06/25/justice/pennsylvania-sandusky/index.html That would be a maximum of 20 years. He can make parole in 10 years.

There is another question, at 78 years old, and after 10 years in prison, how healthy is Sandusky going to be? They may look at threat assessment as well; that is where his age comes into play. And, of course, he'll have to live that long.

After 10 years, and no successful appeal, Sandusky probably will. I doubt if he'll admit to it until after his appeals are exhausted.

Pennsylvania laws on sexual abuse have undergone an overhaul to make them tougher yet they still do not go far enough, as most around the country do not.

It should be mandatory that child sex abusers get life or close to. Any violent sex abuse of any kind, and/or any systematic, pervasive sex abuse of a child or incapacitated person and/or any sexual abuse of a child, even if it happened only once, when the perp is at least 5 years or so older than the victim, should result in life in prison or at least substantial time (over ten years actual time to be served).

We still treat kids in this country as if they don't matter.

But, J.J., I'm confused as to why (with respect), you feel you know more than every legal expert who has commented on this case. Sandusky can get concurrent sentences and can be sentenced to no more than 20 years, but due to the notoriety of this case, the pervasiveness of what he did - the multiple victims - the fact that he used his position of power to commit and cover up his crimes, the nationwide outrage, it is highly unlikely that he would a) be sentenced to less than 60 years, or; b) ever be granted parole prior to serving 20 years in state prison (unless he was very sick and incapacitated by such illness and even then...).

The fact that Amendola requested that Sandusky serve concurrent sentences proves that they need not be concurrent. That's a fact.

And, it is disingenuous to pretend that there are not cases in liberal PA in which child molesters are sentenced to wonderfully-long prison terms:

A Lancaster County judge called James Conrad Pruitt's eight years of sexually abusing three girls the "worst case" of its kind he's ever seen here.
And then he made sure Pruitt won't have the opportunity to do it again.
President Judge Joseph Madenspacher ordered Pruitt to state prison for 60 to 120 years for a "horrendous" pattern of abuse that started when the girls were pre-teens.
The sentence likely will keep the 46-year-old Quarryville man behind bars for the rest of his life.

http://lancasteronline.com/article/...-gets-60-120-years-in-jail.html#ixzz1yvIAW9yP

HARRISBURG, Pa. — A New Oxford, Pa., couple was sentenced Tuesday to a total of 60 years in prison on sexual exploitation of a child and child *advertiser censored* charges. The case was investigated by U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement's (ICE) Homeland Security Investigations (HSI), with assistance from the U.S. Postal Inspection Service, FBI and officers from the Pennsylvania State Police Mobile Computer Crime Lab.
Michael Strausbaugh, 31, was sentenced to 45 years in prison, followed by a lifetime of supervised release. He was also fined $3,500. His wife, Rebecca Strausbaugh, 33, was sentenced to 15 years in prison followed by five years of supervised releases. She was fined $1,200.

http://www.ice.gov/news/releases/1205/120508harrisburg.htm

TUNKHANNOCK - A 42-year-old Taylor man will serve 50 to 100 years in prison for sexually abusing five children, several of whom spoke at the man's sentencing hearing Tuesday.

http://thetimes-tribune.com/news/ta...-years-for-sexual-abuse-of-children-1.1294895

The man who’d done immeasurable wrong, 40-year-old Michael Pavlyik, formerly of Greenwich Township, turned to watch Curwin as she read, a look seemingly of disbelief on his face.

In April, he was convicted of several forms of sexual abuse, including intercourse, upon the victim, his stepdaughter. The girl endured the abuse between ages eight and 11.

Pavlyik, who more recently lived in Dover, Pa., will pay with 33 years in prison altogether. He must serve at least 85 percent of the term before he’s eligible for parole.

http://www.abolishsexabuse.org/inde...-stepdaughter&catid=54:latest-news&Itemid=179

So, based on the above, can we stop pretending that such sentences do not occur in Pennsylvania and that the same is totally unlikely to happen to Sandusky?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

But, J.J., I'm confused as to why (with respect), you feel you know more than every legal expert who has commented on this case. Sandusky can get concurrent sentences and can be sentenced to no more than 20 years, but due to the notoriety of this case, the pervasiveness of what he did - the multiple victims - the fact that he used his position of power to commit and cover up his crimes, the nationwide outrage, it is highly unlikely that he would a) be sentenced to less than 60 years, or; b) ever be granted parole prior to serving 20 years in state prison (unless he was very sick and incapacitated by such illness and even then...).

First, neither of these is actually a violation of state statute:

HARRISBURG, Pa. — A New Oxford, Pa., couple was sentenced Tuesday to a total of 60 years in prison on sexual exploitation of a child and child *advertiser censored* charges. The case was investigated by U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement's (ICE) Homeland Security Investigations (HSI), with assistance from the U.S. Postal Inspection Service, FBI and officers from the Pennsylvania State Police Mobile Computer Crime Lab.

http://www.ice.gov/news/releases/1205/120508harrisburg.htm

Federal crime (we'll have to wait for that).



I think this is in New Jersey.

http://www.abolishsexabuse.org/inde...-stepdaughter&catid=54:latest-news&Itemid=179

We have "Common Pleas Court Judges," at the county level; the Superior Court is an appellant court that meets en banc, so it wouldn't be a single judge.

What happens in Woodbury, NJ has no bearing on Bellefonte, PA, in terms of a sentence.

On these two there are different charges:

At least one of the girls was physically beaten and all of them were threatened, according to a psychologist who testified.

Read more: http://lancasteronline.com/article/...-gets-60-120-years-in-jail.html#ixzz1yveAq71C

This is a much more serious charge under PA statutes, because it included a violent physical assault. That ups the penalty.

Mr. Clark was sentenced on 34 separate counts, including rape of a child, involuntary deviate sexual intercourse, aggravated indecent assault and related counts.

http://thetimes-tribune.com/news/ta...-years-for-sexual-abuse-of-children-1.1294895

This one actually lists the charges. "Rape of a child" is a specific offense http://law.onecle.com/pennsylvania/crimes-and-offenses/00.031.021.000.html,

So is aggravated indecent assault http://law.onecle.com/pennsylvania/crimes-and-offenses/00.031.025.000.html.

Sandusky wasn't even accused of either.

These things are all very specific crimes with different standards in PA; there is a lot of case law on them as well. All types of child abuse are not the same and are not treated the same legally.

If you want to check my track record, check here: http://www.centredaily.com/2011/11/19/2992124/speculative-reasons.html

I wrote it on 11/19/11; you can see how well I did. BTW: I have the easy job; I look at what the lawyers do and figure out why they are doing it.

As for concurrent/consecutive, we were talking about it before Sandusky was found guilty. I suspect that most of the charges will be concurrent, with probably one consecutive thrown in (probably the IDSI). It is about average for this type of crime.

 

[bayouland]

 

[J. J. in Phila]

It looks like Cleland is royally upset over who leaked the tape of Matt to NBC:

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2012/06/sanduskys_attorneys_called_to.html

I hope it was not the prosecution.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Hello, dear 'Sleuthers. I haven't had a chance to catch up on the thread since leaving for my weekend getaway on Mackinac Island but will do so when I finish unpacking. We heard frequent updates on the verdict (which we already knew about) on the trip up north and weekend coverage on CNN/HLN. The only new info was that Amendola won't handle the appeal for JS but will be a witness. I'm sure that there are many posts about the appeal, and I look forward to learning more about the process.

OT: If you've never visited Mackinac Island, MI, you might not appreciate the humor in this video, but I'm posting it for your pure pleasure. Enjoy!

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5tJaRrZZMs"]Pure Michigan: Mackinac Island - YouTube[/ame]

 

[gitana1]

First, neither of these is actually a violation of state statute:

HARRISBURG, Pa. — A New Oxford, Pa., couple was sentenced Tuesday to a total of 60 years in prison on sexual exploitation of a child and child *advertiser censored* charges. The case was investigated by U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement's (ICE) Homeland Security Investigations (HSI), with assistance from the U.S. Postal Inspection Service, FBI and officers from the Pennsylvania State Police Mobile Computer Crime Lab.

http://www.ice.gov/news/releases/1205/120508harrisburg.htm

Federal crime (we'll have to wait for that).



I think this is in New Jersey.

http://www.abolishsexabuse.org/inde...-stepdaughter&catid=54:latest-news&Itemid=179

We have "Common Pleas Court Judges," at the county level; the Superior Court is an appellant court that meets en banc, so it wouldn't be a single judge.

What happens in Woodbury, NJ has no bearing on Bellefonte, PA, in terms of a sentence.

On these two there are different charges:

At least one of the girls was physically beaten and all of them were threatened, according to a psychologist who testified.

Read more: http://lancasteronline.com/article/...-gets-60-120-years-in-jail.html#ixzz1yveAq71C

This is a much more serious charge under PA statutes, because it included a violent physical assault. That ups the penalty.

Mr. Clark was sentenced on 34 separate counts, including rape of a child, involuntary deviate sexual intercourse, aggravated indecent assault and related counts.

http://thetimes-tribune.com/news/ta...-years-for-sexual-abuse-of-children-1.1294895

This one actually lists the charges. "Rape of a child" is a specific offense http://law.onecle.com/pennsylvania/crimes-and-offenses/00.031.021.000.html,

So is aggravated indecent assault http://law.onecle.com/pennsylvania/crimes-and-offenses/00.031.025.000.html.

Sandusky wasn't even accused of either.

These things are all very specific crimes with different standards in PA; there is a lot of case law on them as well. All types of child abuse are not the same and are not treated the same legally.

If you want to check my track record, check here: http://www.centredaily.com/2011/11/19/2992124/speculative-reasons.html

I wrote it on 11/19/11; you can see how well I did. BTW: I have the easy job; I look at what the lawyers do and figure out why they are doing it.

As for concurrent/consecutive, we were talking about it before Sandusky was found guilty. I suspect that most of the charges will be concurrent, with probably one consecutive thrown in (probably the IDSI). It is about average for this type of crime.

I see what you are saying. However, a few points. One, Sandusky was indeed accused of aggravated indecent assault. It was dismissed. Two, the fact remains that the judge has the option of sentencing him consecutively as your previous post shows (his attorney requested concurrent sentencing). Three, aggravated indecent assault, which you state Sandusky was not even accused of, and which you use to differentiate from some of the cases I cited, has a maximum of 20 years. So does unlawful contact with a minor and IDSI. Sandusky was convicted of 8 counts of each. Four, I'm not sure how your blog relates to what will happen at sentencing.

Here is another example of a case in which a man was sentenced to more than 20 years.

An Allentown man who was convicted of molesting two children in 2001 has been ordered to serve 25 1/2 years to 51 years in prison. In October, a Lehigh County jury convicted Ismail Mohamed, 56, of the 500 block of N. Sixth Street, of aggravated indecent assault, indecent assault, two counts of involuntary deviate sexual intercourse and corruption of minors.

http://articles.mcall.com/2005-03-05/news/3586396_1_molesting-indecent-assault-children

Again, aggravated indecent assault is no different, from what I can tell, when it comes to potential sentencing, from IDSI or unlawful contact with a minor:

a) § 3123(a): Involuntary Deviate Sexual Intercourse
􀂃 Grading: a felony of the first degree.􀂃 Penalty: Maximum incarceration sentence and the maximum fine: shall not exceed 20 years and $25,000.

a) § 3125(a) Aggravated Indecent Assault
􀂃 Grading: a felony of the second degree.􀂃 Penalty: Maximum incarceration sentence and the maximum fine: shall
not exceed 10 years and $25,000.

http://www.havinpa.org/pdf/chapter8.pdf

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I see what you are saying. However, a few points. One, Sandusky was indeed accused of aggravated indecent assault. It was dismissed. Two, the fact remains that the judge has the option of sentencing him consecutively as your previous post shows (his attorney requested concurrent sentencing). Three, aggravated indecent assault, which you state Sandusky was not even accused of, and which you use to differentiate from some of the cases I cited, has a maximum of 20 years. So does unlawful contact with a minor and IDSI. Sandusky was convicted of 8 counts of each. Four, I'm not sure how your blog relates to what will happen at sentencing.

You have yet to cite one case, however, where all charges were consecutive. I've indicated that I'd expect 1 or 2 to consecutive, and when half the sentence is served, the person is eligible for parole.

And yes, there was one aggravated charge that was dismissed; it isn't a factor in sentencing.

Here is another example of a case in which a man was sentenced to more than 20 years. http://articles.mcall.com/2005-03-05/news/3586396_1_molesting-indecent-assault-children

On this, there might be other factor, priors and level of violence; it also might be IDSI with a child, which has a maximum of 40 years. From the account, we can't tell.

Again, aggravated indecent assault is no different, from what I can tell, when it comes to potential sentencing, from IDSI or unlawful contact with a minor: http://www.havinpa.org/pdf/chapter8.pdf

Well, what you posted is not the the guidelines; a link was posted a few pages ago. The guidelines say ten years; the site says that judges follow the guidelines 99% of the time. If that's the case, Sandusky is out on parole by 79, if everything is concurrent. I'm expecting one or two consecutive sentences, maybe, but at best 15 years before parole.

I'm not overly worried about a guy that's monitored, late 70's to mid 80's, who has been in prison for a decade or more.

 

[Minette]

From the article J. J. linked above about the leak of the Matt Sandusky tape to NBC:

When asked if the defense leaked it, Rominger said, "that would be illogical. I think the logical answer is someone who wants to impugn Jerry Sandusky further."

Because after being convicted of 45 sex-related crimes against children Sandusky still has so much reputation to lose.

:what:
:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

P.S. I must have watched the perp walk 9-10 times already. It was magnificent!

 

[Marigold]

Libidos tend to fade in males with age.

(Bolded and snipped by me for emphasis)

Imo, libido has nothing to do with any form of rape. Sexual predators derive their pleasure from the assault, the victimization they perpetrate. Their crimes have little to do with actually seeking sexual release. I seriously doubt that Jerry Sandusky's motives were libidinous in nature.

 

[Minette]

Respectfully snipped by me:

I'm not overly worried about a guy that's monitored, late 70's to mid 80's, who has been in prison for a decade or more.

I am. Child molesters don't stop until they are imprisoned or die. Maybe he would be monitored, but with family members (mostly) still in full-on denial mode, he very well could still have access to children. Maybe he would no longer have the energy for all those weekend trips & sleepovers, but I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that he would still feel the compulsion to have inappropriate contact with young boys regardless of his age.

 

[gitana1]

You have yet to cite one case, however, where all charges were consecutive. I've indicated that I'd expect 1 or 2 to consecutive, and when half the sentence is served, the person is eligible for parole. We don't need ALL charges here to be consecutive. And if you expect 1 or 2 to be consecutive, then that could easily lead to at least 40 years.

And yes, there was one aggravated charge that was dismissed; it isn't a factor in sentencing. I know. But you said he wasn't even accused of that. I'm clarifying that that is incorrect.

On this, there might be other factor, priors and level of violence; it also might be IDSI with a child, which has a maximum of 40 years. From the account, we can't tell.

Well, what you posted is not the the guidelines; a link was posted a few pages ago. The guidelines say ten years; the site says that judges follow the guidelines 99% of the time. If that's the case, Sandusky is out on parole by 79, if everything is concurrent. I'm expecting one or two consecutive sentences, maybe, but at best 15 years before parole. Fair enough. You may be totally right. Sandusky may only be sentenced to 20 years and paroled after 10. But I have yet to hear one legal expert agree with that assessment. So, for now, I am going to believe the legal experts that have expounded on this case, rather than a blogger named J.J. Phila, no matter how nice, or informed, that blogger may be.

I'm not overly worried about a guy that's monitored, late 70's to mid 80's, who has been in prison for a decade or more.

Purple commentary is mine.

Finally, I am concerned about an old, pedophile who is released from prison, no matter the age. Pedophilia has to do more with evil than it does with sex:

Bergeron, 80, was charged with 12 counts of oral sexual battery, 12 counts of indecent behavior, and one count of sexual battery in December. He pleaded guilty to all charges. The prosecution called Bergeron the "sickest of the sick," according to the American Press.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/22/charles-lee-bergeron-molested-boys_n_1618842.html

Claude Lee Coker, 80-Year-Old Molester of Little-Girl Relatives, Gets 15 Years to Life in Prison

http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/2011/04/claude_lee_coker_80_molest.php

80-year-old Maurice "Jimmy" McAllister had a preliminary hearing at the Giles County Courthouse Thursday afternoon. That hearing brought him face-to-face with his accuser.McAllister was charged with aggravated rape, sexual battery, and burglary earlier this month.

(He was in his 70's when the abuse took place). http://www.waff.com/story/18619774/...ainst-80-year-old-man-accused-of-sexual-abuse

An 89-year old Warren County man, accused of sexually abusing children in his neighborhood, showed up for his first court hearing on Friday and faced the judge with the help of a walker.

http://www.local12.com/news/local/s...Shows-Up-In-Court/6z6cV2TjFE6twlCpepoc3g.cspx

An 80-year-old man is in Bell County Jail after police said he molested a mentally challenged 11-year-old girl.

Melvin Rae was charged with indecency with a child by contact. Justice of the Peace Bill Cooke arraigned Rae on Thursday, setting the Killeen man's bail at $75,000.

http://www.kdhnews.com/news/story.aspx?s=67266