Is that the clip where he's rather upset that things are off script or is that the beginning where Joran's lawyer phoned the prison telling them to cease? Guess I should watch the video ... in a bit.
GUILTY Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #24
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Is that the clip where he's rather upset that things are off script or is that the beginning where Joran's lawyer phoned the prison telling them to cease? Guess I should watch the video ... in a bit.
Hazel
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Yes otto!! That's the one.....I believe it is almost at the end....
I think I got all confused with all the tabs and windows I have opened at the moment, I was supposed to post that link on the other thread
:floorlaugh: only now I noticed it
You're quite right. Peter was upset that the discussion was off script. As for what was said about having spoken with authorities in Peru, the US and Aruba, with a promise that Joran could have his life back ... that was not based in fact. That's okay, truth isn't a given when it comes to Joran ... not anymore, not ever. Anyone that lies like Joran does not deserve the truth from others.
However, Joran did contact Aruban authorites shortly thereafter requesting a transfer to Aruba in exchange for information about Ms Holloway's whereabouts. The Arubans refused ... and essentially a request like that has to be made to the Queen ... I think. That is, the request has to made to the Netherlands and it was refused ... although I think they might have made the transfer if Joran had accepted a psychiatric placement. The Peruvians wouldn't be interested Joran having a psychiatric incarceration because it is very soft (not like prison in Peru). The Peruvians wanted Joran to be punished for the murder of Stephany ... especially with her father's connections with police.
It will be interesting to see if any of this is introduced in the trail, starting January 6. Knowing how many days are scheduled for the trial would help in knowing how much detail or defense will be introduced.
Now that you mentioned it, I am now starting to wonder whatever happened of the exchange of emails? Do you know if BH contacted his lawyers or viceversa?
What came out of that?
PEACE
Even Peter knew when Joran said it that it would never happen (the difference he remarked on between a reporter and media layperson). Joran said ... "sure, give me your email address" ... "yes, let's have lunch" ... and what's with the "three muskateers" ...here's the name of my lawyer.
If Beth contacted Joran's lawyer, we haven't heard about it. I'm pretty sure that Joran did not contact Beth.
Hazel
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Seriously? So that happened after the visit? I had been wondering if something else happened afterwards, why give her his lawyer's card, and request her email if it wasn't to keep in contact, right? so that's interesting to know that he made that request afterwards......but I don't understand why he went aheard and do that?
Glad the Arubans refused, though IMO it was not up to the Arubans, but to the Peruvians, isn't it? and no way they would have accepted a transfer.
Just recently there has been a new law introduced regarding transfer of prisoners to their own countries, but they specify very clearly, that it does not apply for crimes like terrorism I believe, and murder. The article even mentions JvDS as an example that he does not qualify.
Still, it's interesting to know that J. made that request after her visit nonetheless.
Thank you otto for updating me.
I haven't read anything about how long the trial is scheduled to last, they call it "juicio oral", so I guess is more like a preliminary period, will just have to wait and see what is decided then.
Hazel
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I'm also sure J didn't contact Beth. J. was quite adamant that he could not talk to her without his lawyers present. I assume his lawyers had already instructed him not to talk to anybody without them present, and her starting by saying I don't hate you would have been enough to raise lots of red flags, bells ringing, alarms sounding LOL, I can just imagine he knew right there and then that she was up to something.
I am pretty sure by then he already knew about the FBI sting, cannot blame him for distrusting her after that.
What was that all about the 3 musketeers? Was that a 'code' message? I know that he had been eating one while on Aruba, I think at the hotel with her lawyer or was it with the FBI agents? so her bringing up the 3 musketeers kind of made a 'connection' with that event.....of course the Peruvian guard would have had no idea what that was all about.....seems she expected Joran to 'understand' the meaning, but he didn't.
If it was her way of wanting to bring him a 'treat' and like she said she couldn't find any 3 musketeers (which is kind of unbelievable, but oh well), why bring him a photocopy? wouldn't it had been better to get him another chocolate bar instead, something he could actually enjoy :floorlaugh:
Why wouldn't he? It's much more comfortable in Aruba than Peru. He really thought he was clever in committing a murder in Peru and assuming that he could avoid expulsion to Peru by fleeing to Chile. He fully expected that he could be sent back to Aruba where he would deal with the money investigation and the murder allegations. He made a bolt for the airport after he first left the hotel, but saw police officers with guns, thought they had discovered the body and fled via taxi.
I'm going on memory about him making a request, but I think he did. He's sneaky ... the below video stills were taken faking knocking on the door and being locked out
as he was leaving the hotel room, after changing, getting coffee and something to eat.
After being on the run for a couple of days
After arrest
I'm going on memory about him making a request, but I think he did. He's sneaky ... the below video stills were taken faking knocking on the door and being locked out
as he was leaving the hotel room, after changing, getting coffee and something to eat.
After being on the run for a couple of days
After arrest
The only meaning Joran would have gotten from it was the ruse that he and the Deepak brothers were involved ... I suspect. The code was that Joran showed up at the meeting to collect the $25k sweepstakes (something like that) eating a 3 Muskateers bar so Beth thougt it was significant, and wrapped some other bar in a xerox copy of the wrapper. I think the meaning was lost on one level, but not on another. It could be interpretted as an allusion to Joran and the Deepak brothers lying to police about the events of the night ... 3 Muskateers.
redheadedgal
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Joran's story seems to be that Stephany was still alive when he returned with the coffee, but that is impossible given the timeline. She was probably murdered closer to 6 or 6:15 AM?? It was a brutal, violent murder. He claims that his anger was triggered by her curiosity, starting by hitting her in the head with his elbow. He claims that he then proceeded to beat her. While on the floor, he did something with her clothing ... like remove her pants?? There was no sexual assault. Then we see him sneaking out of the hotel room, checking the hallway for witnesses, but apparently unconcerned about the camera in the hallway above the light. He tried to pin the murder on two police men that supposed harassed them on the way home and then supposedly entered the room, but the camera footage proved that no one else had entered the room.
redheadedgal
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otto--
you have been asking how long the trial is expected to last? i read an article waaay back that stated it was expected to last at least SIX months... seems like a very long time, no?!
you have been asking how long the trial is expected to last? i read an article waaay back that stated it was expected to last at least SIX months... seems like a very long time, no?!
I tried to separate your post from the one above, where you posted into the other post ... hope I got it right.
Which defense attorneys have lied?
Threatened with solitary confinement if he didn't do what?
otto--
you have been asking how long the trial is expected to last? i read an article waaay back that stated it was expected to last at least SIX months... seems like a very long time, no?!
Six Months! I was expecting a few weeks. Could it be like the Italian trial process ... is Peruvian law based in Roman law with an US influence, by any chance ... kind of a brutal system of punishment based on a drawn out fair litigation?
redheadedgal
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otto--
i was posting re: my own personal opinion about lawyers from other cases...
if he --jvds- didn't attend the meeting with beth. i linked that article in this thread somewhere... 2-3 pp back maybe.
i was posting re: my own personal opinion about lawyers from other cases...
if he --jvds- didn't attend the meeting with beth. i linked that article in this thread somewhere... 2-3 pp back maybe.
redheadedgal
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i was stunned too. i don't want to read about him for that long lol
i have no idea about the law in peru. if you find out, i'm interested too.
i'll try to find that article... oy!
Kelly was not happy with Beth that he was excluded from information about her meeting with Joran. He advised against it, pointing out the possible legal ramificaions.
Twitty's lawyer, John Q. Kelly, confirmed to ABC News hat Twitty had made the trip to the notorious Castro Castro prison on Wednesday with Dutch television reporter Peter R. de Vries. Kelly didn't learn of her plans until the day before, when Twitty had already been in Peru for two days.
"There wasn't much I could say," Kelly said. "She was there."
...
"I wanted to get back at Natalee's family. Her parents have been making my life tough for five years," the newspaper quoted him as saying from prison in Peru. "When they offered to pay for the girl's location, I thought: 'Why not'?"
...
van Der Sloot blamed himself for landing in a rat-filled Peruvian prison cell, but he suggested that the FBI lured him to Peru in a botched sting operation.
...
When asked by a reporter about the murder of Flores, van der Sloot replied, "I have been framed. What happened exactly, I will explain later."
http://abcnews.go.com/US/natalee-holloways-mother-sneaks-prison-joran-van-der/story?id=11662712
Joran's lawyer couldn't attend the meeting with Beth because he only learned about it after it was underway.
redheadedgal
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well, that wasn't hard. i merely googled "joran van der sloot trial six months" and voila!
The chief of the Superior Court for Peru's capital says the murder trial of Joran van der Sloot should take about six months. An independent expert says it actually might take 18.
...
Criminal court attorney Jose Balcazar says the defense is likely to try to draw the trial out.
http://www.wndu.com/nationworldnews/headlines/97200234.html
this was from 2010 so maybe things/timeframes have changed? IDK.
I haven't read about Peru/US/Dutch law recently. The last I remember was that an official prisoner exchange treaty was being arranged between the Netherlands and Peru. That was at least a year ago ... but it sounds like murder is excluded from that exchange.
In Italy, the process is such that everything is open to interpretation and debate, even during appeal. Sentences are focused on rehabilitation. That involves many debates that can be scheduled days apart ... lasting several months.
<snipped>
So ... if the "he" was Joran, who was the lawyer that didn't attend the meeting. John Kelly didn't attend the meeting because he didn't have enough notice, same with Joran's lawyer.
Do I have the wrong meeting? I'm thinking the meeting at Castro Castro prison.
... and why was Joran threatened with solitary confinement? Did he serve any time in some sort of solitary confinement in the sewers of Peru, or was he playing bridge with the gangster in the next cell?
redheadedgal
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otto--
not really sure of your point with that post about the two lawyers...
i linked an article a few pages back (please go read it for clarity) where jvds' lawyer stated jvds had been threatened with solitary if he (jvds) didn't attend the meeting with beth (guess he was implying prison officials threatened joran?). his lawyer didn't necessarily have to be there or know about it then... jvds told him later?? IDK.
k-- good night.
not really sure of your point with that post about the two lawyers...
i linked an article a few pages back (please go read it for clarity) where jvds' lawyer stated jvds had been threatened with solitary if he (jvds) didn't attend the meeting with beth (guess he was implying prison officials threatened joran?). his lawyer didn't necessarily have to be there or know about it then... jvds told him later?? IDK.
k-- good night.
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