POLL ADDED Connect The Dots-Working theories thread #2

[cluciano63]

If Terri's goal was to get rid of Kaine at some point, she would no longer have custody of Kyron, so I am ruling out anything to do with Kyron personally as a motive. I think she meant to hurt the school, or Kaine and/or Desiree, by lashing out at Kyron. I think if she ever wanted Kaine dead, she still did, just hadn't figured out a way to do it yet. Ultimately, she may have wanted a life with only baby K and Kaine's life insurance. Kyron would not have been in her way, except that she could not inherit if he were still alive; he'd get the money and go to Desiree. So it seems that Kyron dead would be useful, not because she did not want to care for him and his "issues" but in order to get the money.

But she couldn't possibly have thought that Kaine and Kyron dying would leave her free of suspicion...unless of course she is psychotic and has no connection to reality.

 

[SmoothOperator]

Okay here's some of my latest thoughts on a theory involving Dede Spicher as a "main player" involved totally not just partially or after the fact. I am not sure whether I believe that she is indeed this much of a "key player" in the "disappearance" part[as I personally don't have a prob with Terri being perfectly capable of all that needed to be done in and around Skyline that morning of the 4th] but still it is being insinuated by some that Dede possibly deeply involved so Its from that thought that I have this theory involving her.

The morning of the 4th Terri and Kyron show up to Skyline for the Science Fair.[with or without baby K,cuz that still is very unclear to me even with Kaine saying she was]. Terri ensures the key items of importance are met and taken care of. I will also add here that I think turf tech threw Terri's original timeframe off, meaning that I think originally she had every intention of all items of importance done and them gone from the school all before EVERYONE arrived, however ironically IMO I think this detail that forced them push things back to a time that EVERYONE had arrived actually worked in Terri's favor as far as getting Kyron out of the school unseen[as far as we know]. I think the vast amt of ppl, the chaos and hecticness allowed them to leave under the cover of "plain sight"[IMO quite possibly Terri out the front door and Kyron to exit outthe side door nearest the access road]..

I think once they got there Terri ensured all key items were done. being seen touring the fair as mom and son, getting the pix to be posted on FB hours later, give the dr appt excuse(its Terri herself in her email that says that it was Fri the 4th when the mix up about the appt happened), and also ensuring that Kyron was seen WITHOUT Terri(older child in gym sees Kyron with some other boys and also sees white truck)..

I think that the timeline getting pushed back that at approx 845 Terri tells Kyron she is going to get the truck and pull it around to the side door and for Kyron to come out that door(I have already told what I think was her excuse for him to leave, I believe she used the dr excuse and a way of ensuring him not to be running around telling everybody thats where he was going was that she had told him it was appt for something "bad", possibly some type testing and telling him that other kids would laugh at him or not like him if they knew that he was going to be tested for "something". I think this would be MORE THAN ENOUGH to ensure a 7yr old shy and timid little boy would not dare even think of telling anybody)

So, Terri having parked originally in front of the school tells Kyron she is going to pull the truck around.(we know turf tech left 845)So Terri leaves out the front door and heads to the area where the truck is parked...

[Now let me just say this is where in this theory I am going to interject Dede, but let me also say that I am more convinced as I said that Terri acted alone in the school portion of the "disappearance" so that said, the things in this theory that Dede are doing know that in my original theory it is Terri herself doing these things that Dede are theoretically doing]

Dede is also parked A car in this exact vicinity(not necessarily the blue explorer and possibly even a similar white truck-BUT THAT IS NOT A NECESSITY). I think quite possibly that she is already in(as witnesses have claimed to see)or she gets into the Hormans F250 and she leaves Skyline headed towards the next stop[the 1st FM] we are pretty sure that "Terri" went to IMO setting up alibi, but Dede does this dressed in workout clothes, hat&ponytail, w/possibly glasses. She enters FM and gets the much needed "receipt" time stamped for 912 AM.

When Dede is leaving Skyline in the Horman truck Terri pulls around in the other vehicle(which possibly could be another white truck but not necessarily)and drives up the access road where Kyron exits the school from the side door nearest the access road(Kimsters new detailed pix show that there is a good portion of that exit and access road that is pretty well hidden).Kyron gets in the truck and its now 855-9AM a full 10-15 mins AFTER turf tech has left Skyline.. And Terri and Kyron drive away unseen [from what we know]

My gut instinct for some reason doesn't think Dede was involved this early but nonetheless I do suppose it is possible (THO MY THEORY WHERE IT IS TERRI HERSELF DOING ALL OF THESE ACTS I VERY MUCH BELIEVE TO BE VERY CLOSE TO WHAT HAPPENED THAT DAY).

Because its at this point when Terri and Kyron leave the school that Dede after getting the much needed FM receipt at 912 they meet back up to exchange back vehicles. With Dede heading to the farmyard to work for a short amt of time until she is possibly needed again to assist Terri in some way...

 

[cluciano63]

But what do they do with Kyron, in this scenario? And why?

 

[Morag]

But what do they do with Kyron, in this scenario? And why?

Well, of course, they have to brutally murder him in cold blood, then dispose of his mutilated litte body in a very degrading fashion. Because, of course, Terri is the Queen of Hades and DeDe is her handmaiden. Oh, there's an alternative possiblity?

 

[cluciano63]

Well, of course, they have to brutally murder him in cold blood, then dispose of his mutilated litte body in a very degrading fashion. Because, of course, Terri is the Queen of Hades and DeDe is her handmaiden. Oh, there's an alternative possiblity?

Yes, see stranger abduction possibility thread...

 

[SacreBleu]

This is not directed at any particular poster, but people murder people in cold blood all the time - sometimes those murdered are even their own children. Unfathomable, to me at least; but a fact (honor killings, for an example). I am not even saying that Kyron has been murdered, because I don't know. I am just saying that anything is possible, and should not be discounted because We. Just. Don't. Know.

 

[cypress]

This is not directed at any particular poster, but people murder people in cold blood all the time - sometimes those murdered are even their own children. Unfathomable, to me at least; but a fact (honor killings, for an example). I am not even saying that Kyron has been murdered, because I don't know. I am just saying that anything is possible, and should not be discounted because We. Just. Don't. Know.

BBM

Shouldn't the possibility of Terri's innocence be included as well? If we don't know, then isn't her innocence equally possible?

 

[debs]

This is not directed at any particular poster, but people murder people in cold blood all the time - sometimes those murdered are even their own children. Unfathomable, to me at least; but a fact (honor killings, for an example). I am not even saying that Kyron has been murdered, because I don't know. I am just saying that anything is possible, and should not be discounted because We. Just. Don't. Know.

You're right; but we. just. don't. know. that Terri is one of these people, even if we try to gin up a profile and fit some round pegs into round holes that just don't quite fit anyway.

 

[SacreBleu]

BBM

Shouldn't the possibility of Terri's innocence be included as well? If we don't know, then isn't her innocence equally possible?

Absolutely.

Finding out what happened to Kyron and who is responsible (if anyone - perhaps he did just wander away) is the ultimate end. I have no doubt that everyone here would be ready to throw away the key if we could jail a party or parties that are proved to be responsible for his disappearance.

We each build our own list of pluses and minuses regarding a certain situation, colored perhaps by our own experience or prejudice, and make a judgment. It may come close to the truth of what happened; it may not. Because, in all honesty, we have very few "facts" other than Kyron is missing, his stepmother took him to school, he was marked absent at 10:00 am.

I'm just saying we can respectfully disagree, is all.

 

[SmoothOperator]

But what do they do with Kyron, in this scenario? And why?

Sorry I had to end it so very abruptly as my next client arrived so I just had snip it off until I could get back to it later..

That said.. I really really am having a hard time with my above theory. as I state several times in my above post that I just really feel as though Terri carried out the majority of this plan herself..

With so many thinking that Dede's IN IT up to her eyeballs I decided to throw out a scenario/theory with Dede being a more involved "main Player" but my instincts are so very strong that she was not involved in it, atleast not involved as deeply as some believe..

With that said I am not even going to add to my theory and since we cannot delete our posts ourselves after a few mins of posting then I guess I am going to request that a mod delete it for me...However I am not deleting it because of a change of mind of Terri's involvement and ya darn well better believe I think she is cold blooded in "whatever" SHE DID TO KYRON. imo

AS I stated also in my above post I do believe it was Terri carrying out those exact things as I described them . I am currently still doing a little searching around to "firm up" a couple of aspects of my COMPLETED theory and cluciano you'll be glad to know it will include a theory of what happened to Kyron and why, tho of course it will be JMO

Sorry to have posted an unfinished thought in my above post. I knew Id eventually have time to come back to it and now that I have I am even more now than ever "feeling" as tho Dede is not a "main player".. but of course JMO... Only time will tell us all what is the truth of the matter here(atleast I hope for Kyron and his loved ones thats the case)

 

[nonfictionrocks]

I have two sons; one is one year older than Kyron, the other is one year younger and I cannot imagine either one of my boys putting together a project such as Kyron's without A LOT of assistance by my husband or myself, well not really me, but you get the point.

What if during the tours another child questioned Kyron about his project and accused him of it being entirely done by his parents and he unsuccessfully tried to defend himself? Could this upset him enough that it caused him to run off and hide outside the school? Did he become lost in the brush outside or get picked up by someone who never set foot inside the school?

Were his eye glasses secured by a head band so that if he had slipped or fallen they would remain somewhat in place or could they have flung far enough away that he could not find them and in trying to find a way out he went further into the dense area and farther from the school.

There was an approximate 7 hour head start and although I am not sure how far he could get through the thick foliage, he is rather small and might be more successful than a larger person. Just a thought.

 

[cypress]

While we're working out theories, this question is primarily for the fencesitters -- what keeps you on the fence as opposed to saying, "I don't think she did it."

It'd be interesting to share answers and then maybe theorize from there.

 

[nonfictionrocks]

While we're working out theories, this question is primarily for the fencesitters -- what keeps you on the fence as opposed to saying, "I don't think she did it."

It'd be interesting to share answers and then maybe theorize from there.

This a good idea for a new thread. In answer to your question, I remain on the fence for the same reason that so many believe TH to be guilty; it is a combination of things. I need more time to string together all of these but my doubts certainly begin at the school. I don't think the school or it's staff are that forthcoming or really clear with information about that day. They have a great deal at stake here and as long as TH remain's the focus of this investigation, the spotlight stays off of them. And speaking of the school, the reporting of information about the GK, after the release of flyer (yes that is how we spell that in Canada) makes me wonder just how many other people affiliated with Skyline School were never interviewed - never mentioned to LE.

Often, as we all know, family members or the last known person to see a missing child/person becomes the focus. Sometimes with just cause but I believe there are just as many falsely as there are rightly accused and I have never been a fan nor a member of the court of public opinion.

I believe that Kaine, Desiree, Tony and LE all have their own motivesor reasons as to why they need TH to be guilty. I will leave it at that for now and hope that a thread will be opened soon.

 

[STEADFAST]

Something just occurred to me. I was going through the case thinking in terms of what things that happened HAD to happen for a plan to work, if there was a plan. So I was thinking in terms of X had to Y, and I got to "Terri had to wave goodbye to Kyron from down the hallway instead of walking him to his classroom at the time the bell rang." What if she did wave goodbye in the crowded hallway, to be seen, but Kyron was not in the hallway at all? If anyone did look to see where Kyron was, they would just assume he'd walked into his classroom immediately before they looked. Anyway, that leads to the idea that Kyron could have been taken or lured out of the building at any time between, say, 8:15 and 8:35 or so. Anyway, just a thought.

Along the same lines, you could start with "Terri had to go to a store and buy something soon after 9 a.m. and had to go to a second store and be there until about 10 a.m." Roll would be taken at 10, until then the children were walking in groups, both Kaine and Terri expressed that the abduction must have happened between 9 and 10. So that all leads me to think Terri had to get to the first FM quickly to get a receipt to prove she couldn't have been at the school at 9. But once she got the receipt, she couldn't just hang around the store, so she went to the second FM and struck up a memorable conversation with someone -- I bet it could have been anyone -- and hung around until 10. So now she is alibied for the window of time that she supposes they will think Kyron was abducted.

 

[Blondie in Spokane]

I had not thought of it from that perspective....but that makes a whole lot of sense....and throws a wrench into the timeline we have been working with all along.

What a good thought....now I need to ponder this for a bit because that opens up a lot of possibilities. Hmmm....you really have me thinking now....

 

[SurfieTX]

Something just occurred to me. I was going through the case thinking in terms of what things that happened HAD to happen for a plan to work, if there was a plan. So I was thinking in terms of X had to Y, and I got to "Terri had to wave goodbye to Kyron from down the hallway instead of walking him to his classroom at the time the bell rang." What if she did wave goodbye in the crowded hallway, to be seen, but Kyron was not in the hallway at all? If anyone did look to see where Kyron was, they would just assume he'd walked into his classroom immediately before they looked. Anyway, that leads to the idea that Kyron could have been taken or lured out of the building at any time between, say, 8:15 and 8:35 or so. Anyway, just a thought.

Along the same lines, you could start with "Terri had to go to a store and buy something soon after 9 a.m. and had to go to a second store and be there until about 10 a.m." Roll would be taken at 10, until then the children were walking in groups, both Kaine and Terri expressed that the abduction must have happened between 9 and 10. So that all leads me to think Terri had to get to the first FM quickly to get a receipt to prove she couldn't have been at the school at 9. But once she got the receipt, she couldn't just hang around the store, so she went to the second FM and struck up a memorable conversation with someone -- I bet it could have been anyone -- and hung around until 10. So now she is alibied for the window of time that she supposes they will think Kyron was abducted.

I've been thinking about this for a while. Really, we only have Terri saying what time she walked him down the hall. I *think* that LE retracted the 9:00 a.m. sighting a week or two later. Also, as you pointed out, in order to get the receipt from the FM shortly after 9, she HAD to leave sooner than 8:45. Also, I think the email to the teacher in the afternoon was a fishing expedition to see if there were any red flags at the school by that time.

 

[mmmagique]

I've been thinking about this for a while. Really, we only have Terri saying what time she walked him down the hall. I *think* that LE retracted the 9:00 a.m. sighting a week or two later. Also, as you pointed out, in order to get the receipt from the FM shortly after 9, she HAD to leave sooner than 8:45. Also, I think the email to the teacher in the afternoon was a fishing expedition to see if there were any red flags at the school by that time.

BBM

I've thought this for a while now. She was "ready" and wanted to get this ball rolling. She couldn't believe it when the time for the bus rolled around and she still had not been contacted! Sheesh! She could have taken her time instead of rushing around like a mad woman. *lol*

IIRC, didn't she send two seperate emails to the school that day? Or am I thinking of something else?

Tia!

 

[stmarysmead]

My previous wacky "Tree Frog" scenario having crashed and burned LOL!...I'm thinking now this all goes back to the Gym.

I haven't reviewed the whole thread, so I may be building on someone's else theory but here goes.

I think Terri got involved through Body building with a group of sketchy people at her gym. Maybe the common factor is body-building drugs...something not legal but that they might find "okay" in the body-building culture and feel justified in taking and/or selling.

I think DeDe fits in here.

I'm also wondering about the Landscaper...didn't Kaine say he had no idea she'd hired a Landscaper? Well, maybe she hadn't.

Maybe The Landscaper is one of the "crowd" from the gym. Maybe when pressured by LE, he gave up some "intimate" exchanges between him and Terri...and this Murder for Hire thing...to cover for whatever money-making deal was really going on.

In this new scenario of mine, Terri gets gradually pulled more and more into the "dealings." She starts making some real money (maybe the source of the $350,000) She feels the stuff they ate selling SHOULDN'T be illegal...so she feels a sense of justification. Plus Kaine is "cheap" and she sees justification there too.

Then Kyron stumbles onto something.

PANIC!

He might tell his Dad..or his LE Stepdad. No way can they let Kyron go see that Step-Dad and Desiree for the weekend. Who knows what the kid might say? They can't trust a bribe or explanation to keep a little boy quiet!

Terri could go to jail...never see Baby K again. Baby K needs her. Dede could go to jail. The whole group involved... going back to the criminal "sources"of what they sell...could be in real jeopardy. What to do?

Maybe they convince Terri that they will "relocate" Kyron. Not hurt him...but "stash him" as Desiree says. Terri has to choose, in a sense between Kyron's welfare...and her own, and by extension...what she perceives as Baby K's welfare (being with her Mom)

The plan is made. Kyron is gone before he can spend the weekend with his LE stepfather. Terri lets herself believe they won't harm him.

But now I think LE knows what was going on at the gym. I think that is the "elephant in the living room." So far , out of fear of the others or just for herself, Terri and DeDe refuse to tell LE who else is involved, who took Kyron, to whom they passed him off. That's what "not cooperating means to Kaine and Desiree. They know Terri knows.

This would explain why Kaine and Desiree still cling to hope he's alive...because that WAS the original plan. This would explain the pleas to Terri to "tell what she knows." This would explain trying to use the divorce to force Terri to account for new found money.

They know what the Group at the Gym was doing. Terri knows that they know too. "How do you want to be remembered?" Desiree asks her?

As the woman who protected The Group or brought Kyron home...

That's my current theory...for today.

 

[SacreBleu]

Working off a comment on OLive - is there anyway this might resolve some timeline problems and still reasonably work into any theory?

Terri did leave Skyline at 8:45, go to FM#1, go to FM#2, then return to Skyline, with or without a 2nd adult, before the 10:00 bell? Granted, she still has to get Kyron out to the truck without being seen, but thought I would pose the question just because...

 

[cypress]

In an effort to stay objective, I decided to look at this from the perspective that Terri is guilty, and using information we know, or we can infer from published news reports, attempt to analyze it.

My approach was based on three key pieces of information --

1. Terri being near the second FM around 10:00 a.m., which is supported by Andrea, and the leaked news report that begins her unverifiable time at 10:10 a.m.

2. The leaked reports of her cell phone pinging near Suavie Island. As a data point, I picked an area (a nature trail) close to the water on the Portland side of Suavie Island, although there are many choices.

3. Terri arriving at the gym at or around the time inferred in her e-mail and leaked in a news report, which was roughly 11:39 a.m.

As I was analyzing this information, I added in addresses on NW Germantown Rd (where Dede was working that morning) and the driving time alone, from where we know Terri was, to my fixed data point on Suavie Island, back to NW Germantown Road, and then to Terri's gym, was longer than the time Terri's time is unverifiable.

On the Google map, A = the second FM, where Andrea saw and spoke to Terri, B = a randomly selected address on the Portland side of Suavie Island, and C = Terri's gym.

Driving time alone between these three points is 1 hour and 8 minutes. This doesn't take into account the time it would take to kill Kyron, dump his body, get in and out of a vehicle, park, etc.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&sou...22.810755&sspn=0.035393,0.090895&ie=UTF8&z=14