POLL ADDED Connect The Dots-Working theories thread #2

[SmoothOperator]

Ok so I couldn't find the post I was looking for so I just researched it myself and found the info I was looking for..

Ok the 2 mins is the amount of time that the body was in contact with the truck. It says that a newly deceased body as recent as under 3 hours Since death had occurred a cadaver dog will "hit on" this area indicating human decomp even tho the body is no longer at this area (as pertaining to this issue of the truck that if his body came in contact with the truck for as little as 2 mins after he died that it would be enough of a scent for a cadaver dog to pick up)... I'll keep searching to see if I can find any info that says the body can be 2mins deceased, but for now this is the info I've found...

Here's the snippet of this particular info...

~begin Snip~
94 per cent when the square had been in contact with the corpse for only two minutes. The research concluded that cadaver dogs were an "outstanding tool" for crime-scene investigation~ end snip~

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/s...uth-behind-the-crimescene-canines-835047.html

Much more at the above link including lots of details about cadaver dogs, how un believably accurate they are, and many other stats, data, and info... Its definitely worth a look and quick read

ETA~ BTW if I'm not mistaken we have no confirmation whatsoever, none, zero, zip, nil that the truck was ever searched by the cadaver dogs do we? Plz point me to this info if I've totally missed it(which could very well be, certainly wouldn't be first thing I've missed)
As far as I know the truck was never impounded for it to be forensically searched.. I know we saw that it was towed from Horman home a couple times in those first days and weeks but I thought we were told that it had nothing to do with LE or the investigation that it was taken in for repairs.. Isn't that correct? .. Plz God, I mean surely this was done, the searching of the vehicles at the Horman residence, specifically the white truck, right??:waitasec:

 

[SmoothOperator]

OT is anyone else having probs with the "thank you" button disappearing on many posts, just seems to be random ones, no rhyme or reason for why some the "thank you" blue box in right hand corner is completely absent?? (and no, they are not posts that I've already thanked, therfor of course the "thank you" button would no longer be present, tho I fully admit I've had alot simpler things go right over my head before) .. lol.. :blushing:

I think you're still in here with me PDXmom? Have you had this prob?.. lol.. or is it just my crazy azz its happening to?:crazy:

 

[butterfly7]

I, possibly, have a theory I'm working on but need some help in case I missed any of the answers throughout all these treads. IMO KH went missing between 9-10. IMO, more than 2 people involved.
First, has it ever been stated anywhere who the volunteer/chaperone was? When did this volunteer/chaperone arrive at school?
When did the volunteer/chaperone leave the school?
Did this volunteer/chaperone ever tell KH to go back and please get something for them from the classroom?
Very interesting how he is only missed once the groups return to classroom and then there is mention of it?

Appears as though there have been individuals in the right place at the right time in this. TH makes quick trip to FM#1 just to get a receipt be on camera. Immediately moves on to FM#2 and, oh my, what a coincidence that she runs into someone from the gym to help establish another alibi. Is it possible that TH really did expect to get a call from the school between 9 and 10??? When that didn't happen, as planned and so the school could be blamed, she goes and calls DS to discuss and decide what the heck to do next??? Hence, going to the gym and trying to act normal at home and placing pic FB, etc., etc.??? All of this is JMHO

 

[froginTtown]

Hmmmm, I have a niggling thread of a thought developing...pulling the thread...follow me on this one...

Terri won a settlement for $250k over the failed Chubby's franchise. She reportedly made a serious statement about the spending of J's inheritance to her ex-husband's parents. She has freely accepted money from her parents over the years, collects child support from the ex who adopted J, collects unemployment, was injured in an accident and (speculating only) possibly collected disability.

Recently, Kaine filed the demand regarding the alleged $350k fee for her attorney, whether the funds used to pay for this came from a marital asset (in which case Kaine is entitled to half) or a marital liability (in which case Kaine could be held liable for repayment). Sounds to me like, to Kaine's knowledge, TH didn't have this kind of money lying around.

But what if she did? What if she squirreled away (pardon the pun) all of this money over the years and didn't tell Kaine about it?

Now, what if she intended to pursue the MFH plot and this would take a hefty chunk out of her money stash and she needed to come up with a creative plan to re-fill her piggy bank. Perhaps she hatched a scheme in which Kyron disappeared from school, she is never suspected, and they later sue the school for negligence and win a huge settlement (she won a settlement before). She later proceeds with the MFH plot on Kaine and she and Baby K get all the money. Or maybe she has Kyron stashed and was planning to make him re-appear later, only something went wrong or the suspicion of her made it impossible to complete her plan.

Something like that, anyway...

I just can't help but think that her plan was to sue the school and make them look bad. Otherwise, if it was just about doing something to Kyron, why not stage a kidnapping from the market, or an accident, or something else. The school was a big risk in the hopes of a big payoff. The image I have of TH is that she's very charming, opportunistic, manipulative and narcissistic.

As always, all of the above is my opinion and speculation only!

This has been my theory all along...although I think she manipulated her friends into helping her somehow... :angel:

 

[butterfly7]

This has been my theory all along...although I think she manipulated her friends into helping her somehow... :angel:

The "Thanks" button wasn't enough!!! Totally agree - TH wants $$ out of the school/school system. Re your statement about the friends - has anyone put together a list of her so-called "friends" and how she knows them? Appears, so far, like it's DS, MC and friends/acquaintances from the gym??? Also, how many "friends" did Kyron have? Did he only have "friends" just at school? Any outside actiivities or birthday parties??? JMHO

 

[SacreBleu]

The "Thanks" button wasn't enough!!! Totally agree - TH wants $$ out of the school/school system. Re your statement about the friends - has anyone put together a list of her so-called "friends" and how she knows them? Appears, so far, like it's DS, MC and friends/acquaintances from the gym??? Also, how many "friends" did Kyron have? Did he only have "friends" just at school? Any outside actiivities or birthday parties??? JMHO

I, too, believe that if Terri is involved in Kyron's disappearance, the motive or one of the motives may have been to cash-in on a suit against the school. [Especially if Kaine was on her about spending money.]

Disclaimer: I am not suggesting that any person or business that may be associated with my next comment is in any way involved in Kyron's disappearance.

I don't think LE is focusing solely on people from the gym that may have known Terri. For instance, it was reported here that J had a horse. It was also reported that Kaine asked a riding area to be searched when Kyron went missing. Could Terri have met someone at the stables that she enlisted to help her?

 

[PDXMom]

OT is anyone else having probs with the "thank you" button disappearing on many posts, just seems to be random ones, no rhyme or reason for why some the "thank you" blue box in right hand corner is completely absent?? (and no, they are not posts that I've already thanked, therfor of course the "thank you" button would no longer be present, tho I fully admit I've had alot simpler things go right over my head before) .. lol.. :blushing:

I think you're still in here with me PDXmom? Have you had this prob?.. lol.. or is it just my crazy azz its happening to?:crazy:

Hey there, sorry, I dropped off to sleep, but yes, I did press the thanks button on your 12:58 post last night before going to bed, and I saw it wasn't there this morning. My thought was that I'd temporarily lost my connection (I have a very bad wifi cloud in my house) and though it registered on my screen, it didn't make it to the server. Maybe?

 

[froginTtown]

WOW....I've been looking everywhere for this video... I had heard about it, but never seen it.... This really shook me up... and has me wondering... http://www.katu.com/news/local/96033344.html?tab=video

 

[wondering1]

I think it is possible that if Kyron were deceased and in the truck for an hour or so, it might not be detected, but someone with knowledge of cadaver dogs or anatomy might know for sure. Fibers, hairs, etc, would not be that unusual in the family truck. Terri being at the first market before 9:12 just confuses me greatly, as I do believe this could have been an act of rage, but can't see where Kyron would be at that time at all. And I also don't see Kyron getting into some other vehicle that morning and leaving with someone else at Terri's request. So in other words, I am completely lost.

I asked that question of someone here who is SAR and the answer was about 4 minutes. I thought it would be a very short amount of time, and it was even shorter than I'd expected. Based on that, I've personally ruled out him being dead in the truck (ack, I hate typing stuff like that) b/c if he was for almost any amount of time, evidence would have been found and TH would certainly have been arrested at that point. jmoo.

 

[PDXMom]

WOW....I've been looking everywhere for this video... I had heard about it, but never seen it.... This really shook me up... and has me wondering... http://www.katu.com/news/local/96033344.html?tab=video

I do remember that video. Sounds like it was during the first full week after June 4th. Interestingly, KH and DY have since gone on to talk TOO much, IMO, and TH has zipped her lip. Nothing in this case seems to be normal. Of course, what's normal in a missing child case? :-(

 

[butterfly7]

I, too, believe that if Terri is involved in Kyron's disappearance, the motive or one of the motives may have been to cash-in on a suit against the school. [Especially if Kaine was on her about spending money.]

Disclaimer: I am not suggesting that any person or business that may be associated with my next comment is in any way involved in Kyron's disappearance.

I don't think LE is focusing solely on people from the gym that may have known Terri. For instance, it was reported here that J had a horse. It was also reported that Kaine asked a riding area to be searched when Kyron went missing. Could Terri have met someone at the stables that she enlisted to help her?

Thanks - hadn't read that "tidbit" about the stables!!! VERY GOOD POINT!!! jmho

 

[Etilema]

OT is anyone else having probs with the "thank you" button disappearing on many posts, just seems to be random ones, no rhyme or reason for why some the "thank you" blue box in right hand corner is completely absent?? (and no, they are not posts that I've already thanked, therfor of course the "thank you" button would no longer be present, tho I fully admit I've had alot simpler things go right over my head before) .. lol.. :blushing:

I think you're still in here with me PDXmom? Have you had this prob?.. lol.. or is it just my crazy azz its happening to?:crazy:

I find that after I post a reply, the thank-you button disappears from other posts on the same page. But if I refresh, it comes back.

 

[purple turtle]

I'm working on a theory, but need some more information. Does anyone know if the Horman truck has underseat or under floorboard storage that might accomodate a child Kyron's size? That said, and after thinking about it a bit more, that might not even have been necessary, if: TH did away with Kyron between 8:45-9:00 am and "stored" him in the truck; got her alibi for 9:00 - 10:00 set; got nervous and did drive around for an hour; went to the gym; got home at 12:45. Kaind did not arrive home until 2:00. That gave her over an hour to dispose of the body - wherever. Perhaps, even on their property? What am I missing, timewise?

I hate hate hate to say things like this :furious: but I'll say it

Okay, the truck has a back seat ... the windows are tinted ... it would be possible for him to be in the truck (she parked in the back of the parking lot at FM) either way and with his size he would go unnotced or she could even have him duck down while she was in the store. Or lay on the seat (drugged?) ... or on the floor of the truck covered with a blanket. I know that LE went over the truck twice but it is his family's vehicle so his DNA, etc is all over in the truck, one would think. Especially if she used a blanket that belonged to baby K ... dunno... just shooting in the dark.

I'm not saying I think she did this, just saying that it is possible.

 

[matou]

What if.....Terri just wanted the teacher to get fired. What if she told Kyron to go somewhere to get picked up later for his 'appointment' (hence a white truck seen at that Jim guy's house and then seeing it again later). She did say she wanted that teacher's job in her complaints to Desiree. She kept saying she was looking for a teaching job. She was fb friends with some staff at the school. Something obviously went wrong in the execution of this plan.

Kyron's little friend who spoke on camera is where the statement about Miss Porter telling the other adult to calm down and that Kyron was probably just in the bathroom or having a drink of water. So all that information comes from this boy. What if the boy was told to say this? Another of Kyron's little friends stated that Kyron knew about his doctor's appointment that day and I think Kyron may have mentioned it to him. This is the boy who was invited to go bowling with Kyron on the Sunday before he went missing.

Terri fired off long e-mails to Kyron's mother, Desiree Young, peppered with complaints.

"She was venting about the teacher and why she should have her job," Desiree said, "and she was venting about Kaine — everything."

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/08/terri_horman.html

"And the teacher said, 'I thought he left with his mom,' because they thought they had a doctor appointment," Kim Holm said. "And then at lunchtime - ****** ate lunch with him every day - he wasn't there at lunchtime. And then I got a call at 4:30ish, saying he didn't get off the bus, I guess. And ****** said, 'Oh yeah, I knew he was already gone all day, Mom.'"

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/98987454.html

for the other link about what Miss Porter said according to a 3rd grader, I have a youtube video but it might embed so I'll let you find it

This is just a dumb theory. Motive is to get back at the teacher and maybe to get Kyron in 'trouble' for leaving the school. JMO

 

[citigirl]

What if.....Terri just wanted the teacher to get fired. What if she told Kyron to go somewhere to get picked up later for his 'appointment' (hence a white truck seen at that Jim guy's house and then seeing it again later). She did say she wanted that teacher's job in her complaints to Desiree. She kept saying she was looking for a teaching job. She was fb friends with some staff at the school. Something obviously went wrong in the execution of this plan.

Kyron's little friend who spoke on camera is where the statement about Miss Porter telling the other adult to calm down and that Kyron was probably just in the bathroom or having a drink of water. So all that information comes from this boy. What if the boy was told to say this? Another of Kyron's little friends stated that Kyron knew about his doctor's appointment that day and I think Kyron may have mentioned it to him. This is the boy who was invited to go bowling with Kyron on the Sunday before he went missing.

Terri fired off long e-mails to Kyron's mother, Desiree Young, peppered with complaints.

"She was venting about the teacher and why she should have her job," Desiree said, "and she was venting about Kaine — everything."

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/08/terri_horman.html

"And the teacher said, 'I thought he left with his mom,' because they thought they had a doctor appointment," Kim Holm said. "And then at lunchtime - ****** ate lunch with him every day - he wasn't there at lunchtime. And then I got a call at 4:30ish, saying he didn't get off the bus, I guess. And ****** said, 'Oh yeah, I knew he was already gone all day, Mom.'"

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/98987454.html

for the other link about what Miss Porter said according to a 3rd grader, I have a youtube video but it might embed so I'll let you find it

This is just a dumb theory. Motive is to get back at the teacher and maybe to get Kyron in 'trouble' for leaving the school. JMO

Wow, Matou, good thinking. The pain caused to the teacher was a side benefit at the least. I hadn't thought about people at the school reading her snarky comments about the science fair the day Kyron disappeared. Guess she figured she didn't need a job any more for some reason on that day.

 

[froginTtown]

....WOW... lots of info out there....(skeletons and such) :lipssealed: :lipssealed:

Crazy how my theory changes daily... or hourly for that matter.. I think they need to take a closer look at DeDe's ex-boyfriend and people he is aquainted with, just a thought...:waitasec:

 

[SacreBleu]

Something I'm pondering:

Per my question in the "What would you like to ask Ms. Porter" thread - I wonder if Kyron usually brought lunch to school, and, if so, if there was a lunch in his backpack that day. If he did typically bring lunch, and if there was not one in his backpack, why? Did Terri know he would not be eating it? Was forgetting his lunch a way to get Kyron back out of the school (Ky, I forgot your lunch - we have time to run home and get it before school starts; or, I'm going to run home and get it, meet me outside in 10 minutes and I'll give it to you.)

Also, if TMH is responsible for Kyron's disappearance, it is my opinion that it was planned well in advance. I also think it was part of the reason J was sent away, assuming that it was TMH who made that happen. It had to happen before school was out. J was scheduled to visit the next week. I know there were 2 more days of classes after a one-week visit would have ended (June 15th was the last day of classes at Skyline), I just feel that June 4th was the "now or never" day.

I also think that there was only one place that TMH would have known that she would not be either bothered or noticed doing anything "unusual". That was at home. If she is solely responsible for his disappearance, it is moo that Kyron is somewhere on their property. I am sure it was searched. It's just the only thing that makes sense to me. It could be why she didn't want to go back to the house with a sick baby K until she absolutely had to, so she just drove around. Any other answer, other than she passed him off, just gets too complicated.

On a side note, it would surprise me that Terri would have made an appointment for Kyron when J was there visiting. It just seems waiting a few more days, until the visit was over and school was out, might have made more sense. But, that's just me.

Okay, I'm ready for everyone to tell me I watch too much tv. Funny thing is, I hardly watch any! And I prefer classic English lit to whodunnits. Just my overactive imagination at work.

 

[cluciano63]

Per above theory, she does not seem to have time to even bury Kyron on her own property, unless she carried him around with her until well after 10am. She must have driven straight to the first store, based upon receipts.

I think LE is so focused on an accomplice because Terri's itinerary does not really allow the time to commit the crime, cover it up, and be all of those other places as well. But if there is no accomplice...could she still have done it and how? Not without having his body in the truck, which might be the case. Otherwise, only between 10:15-11:30 or so. Still, that is a lot of ground to cover as far as possibilities.

There more we hear, the less chance of a hand-off type thing, to me. If Terri did this, Kyron is deceased. And she did not have help. I think it is just luck, for her, that he has not been found.

 

[SusieMom]

I came back over here to repost my theory b/c it seems board-wide there is a lot of assumption that the only other possible alternative theory to Terri being the abductor is that it was the act of a sexual predator/complete stranger. And that's how I looked at it too for a long time. But then I started pondering and came up with a theory that I was only starting to consider thoroughly when the presser about the second adult in or near the truck that morning seemed to fit well my new idea.

I think there was a person, known to Terri, waiting for them in the school parking lot. I think this is because that person had a relationship with Terri that was being kept secret from KH. I think this person's vehicle was in some way distinctive but not in a way that allowed LE to identify its owner (IOW one or more witnesses mentioned it to LE but nobody had the plate and whatever they said about was something distinctive but generic.. for instance a truck with a bunch of ladders on it, or with a trailer of equipment, etc) LE hasn't found the driver of that vehicle yet to be able to say that person had a reason to be there. In addition I think LE has witness reports of seeing an unidentified individual speaking with Terri Horman in the parking lot, either while standing outside her truck or sitting inside it, or possibly both.

I think this person was having a disagreement with TH, I think that is why he was there in the parking lot.. he can't call her at home, and his frustration with her and the issue they were arguing about led him to go there to speak with her face to face. I imagine he was as a polite acquaintance to the children. I think Terri wasn't happy he was there and didn't want to give him any time that morning to discuss it. She was busy getting Kyron to school. I think that angered him and added to feelings of resentment that he already had specifically towards Kyron.

I think the mystery person could have gone into the school shortly after Terri did and basically hid himself on the fringe of the crowds. I think he watched her leave Kyron in the hallway and then lured him outside and took him.

I think Terri left just as she said did and went about her day, assuming mystery person had done the same. But I do think at some point in her morning, she was notified by the mystery person (likely on a secret phone) that he had Kyron. After all this was for her benefit... to hurt her. I think that's when she called Dede,which, if true, I think would indicate that Dede knew of the relationship and was possibly the link between the two, meaning she had introduced them or otherwise knew him. I think the driving around bit was them looking for mystery man and Kyron, assuming this was all some kind of attention stunt and that he was nearby someplace, hoping they could talk him down, get Kyron back and somehow cover it all up. But they couldn't find him or they had proof from mystery person that it was no use looking anymore. Dede had to get back to her job getting ready for the garden tour thing while Terri went back home.

I think they had decided between the two of them that keeping silent about it was the best plan, otherwise they could be called accomplices... and KH would know about the secret relationship. Also its possible that for some reason specific to the mystery person, they might not have much truthful identifying information to give LE anyway. Maybe they were afraid that LE would consider this person to be like "zanny the nanny" and discount it out of hand.

Maybe they figured it would be better for them to let LE figure it all out (inc their own involvement) .... and maybe they are right about that. I mean, maybe it is better for an innocent person to let the police walk all around the issue and come to their own conclusion about your involvement than trying from the beginning to prove your innocence.

Although, if this is true, I don't think either one of them could claim innocence. Keeping silent if you know what happened makes you just as bad morally speaking as the abductor, IMO.

 

[Aedrys]

I'm starting to wonder if this was more than wanting to hurt Kaine. With Kyron possibly having seizures, I wonder if the thought of Terri having to take care of a special needs child (which is what he would become if the seizures were real - he'd definitely would have special medical needs that would require extra attention) overwhelmed her. I mean, she wasn't able to handle a normal (and I mean no special needs and healthy) teenage son in the house and sent him away. I don't think she was looking forward to having to take care of Kyron if he had some special needs, like special medicine or other special things she'd have to do just for him. And think about the attention Kyron would get if he was having seizures. Certainly more would go towards him than Terri and baby K if it turned out that he was having seizures and if those seizures could be from a serious medical condition.

I wonder, with the depression, not loving Kaine anymore, not being able to do anything about Kaine, having to take care of Kyron and baby K everyday, her son being gone for a few months, her life basically not being at all what she wanted, if the thought of Kyron having special medical needs threw her over the edge here and was too much for her to consider or want to deal with. It's odd that she didn't find out for sure first, but I'm thinking she couldn't handle the thought that the seizures were real and that would mean that Kyron would take more of her time and energy, and more attention from her and baby K.

Now, I don't know how mini seizures (absense seizures?) are handled and how difficult that is, but it seems to me that Kyron was having more and more problems at school, and Terri was fast getting at the end of her rope with it before a medical condition could even be diagnosed. It would be extra sad if it turned out there were no seizures, just attention problems or something else entirely that could be easily medically treated.

Anyway, it's something I've been thinking about lately because of that doctor's appointment. And this only works if she wasn't lying about thinking Kyron was having seizures. Now it could be that she was the only one who thought that. Maybe she built up in her mind that something was really wrong with Kyron since he wasn't getting much better with his attention and following directions problems at school. My stepdaughter's aunt blows everything out of proportion - the girl would have stomach aches from anxiety and the aunt would think she had a tumor or something. She takes her to the doctor for every little thing, which is aggravating. Anyway, maybe Terri was blowing Kyron's situation way out of proportion and theorized that he was only going to get worse and she was going to be the one having to keep dealing with him everyday.

ETA: I did want to add that I believe she was killing two birds with one stone - she was getting rid of a burden, and also getting rid of a teacher she didn't like by doing this at the school. So she would completely get the life she wants, free from Kyron and his special needs and with the job she's always wanted if this had turned out the way she planned it.