Poll: was Patsy involved?

[OliviaG1996]

I'm not sure what my President has to do with this conversation but let me assure you....this college educated American woman voted for Donald Trump, as did my entire family of over a hundred in the key state of Ohio, most of whom are lifelong democrats.

Again you seam to be really fond of making accusations without a shred of evidence.

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We may disagree on some things, Pinkland, but politics isn't one of them. eace:

 

[UKGuy]

Pinkland,

The Donald is all over twitter regarding fake news. I knew the Donald long before his Apprentice days, and took a keen interest in his real estate moves.

He will be visiting the UK shortly , which I'm looking forward to. What is the Donald's relevance to the thread: MONEY, lots of it, mountains high.

The Ramsey's also had money, but they were not quite in the Donald's league, who is a real estate billionaire two or three times over.

and as I've come to notice money can purchase advertising during a presidential race and it can buy attorney's in a homicide case.

.

 

[UKGuy]

A transfer via any source other than the one of origin (primary) is, at the minimum, secondary.

icedtea4me,
Sure, but what is the primary source? AR is not telling us is it? Steve Thomas, in his book, describes it as a splinter. Do you disagree with that?



So how does a splinter or to be technical birefringent material end up inside JonBenet, i.e. not outside, as in accidentally arrived via other artifact.

The birefringent material was examined and said to be from the broken paintbrush.

I note you always have a special case for anything that conflicts with your theory.

.

 

[singularity]

singularity,
There is nothing in Colorado Statute or Federal Law that requires perpetrators to be charged conjointly.

Separate charges is the norm and the usual rout to putting people in the dock..
.

That's the point! Separate charges which makes it a second party, not third.

 

[Pinkland]

Pinkland,

The Donald is all over twitter regarding fake news. I knew the Donald long before his Apprentice days, and took a keen interest in his real estate moves.

He will be visiting the UK shortly , which I'm looking forward to. What is the Donald's relevance to the thread: MONEY, lots of it, mountains high.

The Ramsey's also had money, but they were not quite in the Donald's league, who is a real estate billionaire two or three times over.

and as I've come to notice money can purchase advertising during a presidential race and it can buy attorney's in a homicide case.

.

Yea....because the news is so reliable that we have to check facts and sources in a murder investigation that is over 20 years old. Nevermind the bias of particular channels and news sources in regard to reported information....

And by the way money did not buy the presidency if it did Clinton would have won as she outspent Trump....

And the Ramseys had every legal and *constitutional* right to have lawyers. I don't hold it against anyone for being successful.

Even without the funds I am quite sure the Ramseys would have had great legal counsel as some hotshot lawyer would have taken the case probono for publicity.

What I do have a problem with is shoddy investigations and corrupt politicians.

Alex Hunter must have been a Democrat..




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[icedtea4me]

icedtea4me,
Sure, but what is the primary source?

I'd say the most logical primary source is the broken paintbrush.

AR is not telling us is it?

No. How would the coroner know from where the splinter came?

Steve Thomas, in his book, describes it as a splinter. Do you disagree with that?

No.

So how does a splinter or to be technical birefringent material end up inside JonBenet, i.e. not outside, as in accidentally arrived via other artifact.

It ends up inside via any kind of movement that pushes it in that location.

The birefringent material was examined and said to be from the broken paintbrush.

Yes, I agree.

I note you always have a special case for anything that conflicts with your theory.

I do trust you have the capability to state how I made this into a special case because it conflicted with my theory.

 

[Tadpole12]

The wording of the indictments points to an unknown third person ...... /

No it doesn't....that's your interpretation of it. No offense. - sing

hmmm, yet more than one lawyer's interpretation has indicated a third party involvement.

 

[Tadpole12]

I'm not sure where to post this...is anybody watching "How It Really Happened" right now on HLN?

ty.

LW retweeted
[video=twitter;838153839366848512]https://twitter.com/WeHaveYourDtr/status/838153839366848512[/video]

 

[Tadpole12]

The Ramseys did a good job of getting rid of potential evidence linking Burke to the crime. Ie: the wipe down of her groin area, wiping the flashlight of all prints ect. Plus we don't know if LE found any evidence linking Burke. We will never know everything about this case. Ever thought why that is?

JB would have been brain dead. Have you looked at the autopsy report/seen photos of the crack of her skull? She (most likely) never would have recovered from that.

http://jonbenetramsey.pbworks.com/w/page/11682463/DNA Evidence

No Semen on Thighs. "Since the autopsy, the police had thought there was semen on JonBenet's upper thighs. Then, on January 15, the CBI came back with the analysis. The substance thought to be semen was in fact smeared blood. There was no semen. JonBenet's body had been wiped clean, leaving a residue that was visible under the fluorescent light at the autopsy" (Schiller 1999:132,

EMR,

How can it be discerned that the body was wiped?
With no semen present, could the blood have been smeared from contact with someone wearing blue cloth?

 

[EtherealMoonRose]

http://jonbenetramsey.pbworks.com/w/page/11682463/DNA Evidence

No Semen on Thighs. "Since the autopsy, the police had thought there was semen on JonBenet's upper thighs. Then, on January 15, the CBI came back with the analysis. The substance thought to be semen was in fact smeared blood. There was no semen. JonBenet's body had been wiped clean, leaving a residue that was visible under the fluorescent light at the autopsy" (Schiller 1999:132,

EMR,

How can it be discerned that the body was wiped?
With no semen present, could the blood have been smeared from contact with someone wearing blue cloth?

That could be possible, ofcourse.

The wipe down is of the opinion of many. I found this snippet on this forum.

“Det. Arndt stated to Your Affiant that she was present and observed a visual examination by Dr. Meyer of the shirt worn by the child. She observed and Dr. Meyer preserved dark fibers and dark hair on the outside of the shirt Det. Arndt told Your Affiant that she personally observed Dr. John Meyer examine the vaginal and pubic areas of the deceased, Dr. Meyer stated that he observed numerous traces of a dark fiber.
In the presence of Det. Arndt, Det. Tom Trujillo of the Boulder Police Department, used a black florescent light to view the body including the pubic area of the victim in an attempt to observe the possible presence of semen or seminal fluid. (Your Affiant knows from previous experience and training that substances such as semen or seminal fluid, not visible to the unaided eye, may become visible when viewed under a black florescent light). Det. Arndt stated that she observed florescent areas of the upper inner and outer left thigh, as well as the upper and inner right thigh. Det. Arndt stated that her observations of the result of the black florescent light observation is consistent with the presence of semen or seminal fluid.
Det. Arndt informed Your Affiant that she observed Dr. Meyer swab these florescent areas. Dr. Meyer was also observed by Det. Arndt to obtain vaginal, oral and anal swabs form the child's body.
Det. Arndt informed Your Affiant that Dr. Meyer stated to her that he observed red stains in the crotch area of the panties that the child was wearing at the time that the child's body was subjected to the external visual examination. Dr. Meyer stated to Det. Arndt that the red stain appeared to be consistent with blood. Det. Arndt further informed the Affiant that Dr. Meyer stated to her that after examining the panties (as described above), he observed the exterior pubic area of the child's body located next to the areas of the panties containing the red stains and found no visible reddish stains in that area. Dr. Meyer stated to Det. Arndt that his opinion is that the evidence observed is consistent with the child's pubic area having been wiped by a cloth."
http://www.acandyrose.com/s-Flight755-baggagecheck12291996.htm

 

[UKGuy]

http://jonbenetramsey.pbworks.com/w/page/11682463/DNA Evidence

No Semen on Thighs. "Since the autopsy, the police had thought there was semen on JonBenet's upper thighs. Then, on January 15, the CBI came back with the analysis. The substance thought to be semen was in fact smeared blood. There was no semen. JonBenet's body had been wiped clean, leaving a residue that was visible under the fluorescent light at the autopsy" (Schiller 1999:132,

EMR,

How can it be discerned that the body was wiped?
With no semen present, could the blood have been smeared from contact with someone wearing blue cloth?

Tadpole12, Yup, Yup Yipee. It was he that caries bags in his part time role, when not adjudicating as a CEO.

He allegedly left fibers from his foreign cotton shirt, get that bit, on JonBenet's thighs.

Later he would remark on this as disrespecting JonBenet's memory.


.

 

[MURDERER_SERVANT]

We all have to be openminded cause we weren't there.

I wonder what you PDI people think how and why P bashed JB's head so hard to break it? Really wonder that...And why do you think they lied saying B slept whole night until he talked to the GJ that he was awake ? Was it two years later can't remember right now..

 

[UKGuy]

We all have to be openminded cause we weren't there.

I wonder what you PDI people think how and why P bashed JB's head so hard to break it? Really wonder that...And why do you think they lied saying B slept whole night until he talked to the GJ that he was awake ? Was it two years later can't remember right now..

MURDERER_SERVANT,
Yikes, do not mention that. BR was sound sleep, except he wasn't, we checked our records and well ...

Coroner Meyer and his professor buddy say sexual assault, AR says head bash along with asphyxiation.

Any child can work out what happened here: e.g. sexual assault followed by death.

Poor girl denied a life by someone who thought her pageant activities meant she was flaunting herself in public.

.

 

[BoldBear]

We all have to be openminded cause we weren't there.

I wonder what you PDI people think how and why P bashed JB's head so hard to break it? Really wonder that...And why do you think they lied saying B slept whole night until he talked to the GJ that he was awake ? Was it two years later can't remember right now..

Well gosh Wally, it's not like Burke, John and Lin wouldn't have an agenda. Deny the flashlight and then put it into John's hands years later. Put Burke into the living room around the same time the murder was taking place. No one's lying here. There's no attempt at deception. Nope. Trust me.

Do you think it's in Burke's best interest to get to the bottom of this murder? If he did it? If John did it? If Patsy did it?

"I waited until I was an adult and then I turned my parents in."
"I turned them in when I was a child so I could be moved into my grandparents home."
"I admitted to striking her over the head, but the strangulation, the murder, belonged to mom or dad."
"I struck her over the head, strangled her and then admitted to it because I want everyone to know that I kill without remorse."
AND
"I never want this to be solved so my friends and my girlfriends will look at me weird for the rest of my life. I like people treating me like I can't be trusted."

Burke doesn't win. There is no good solution.

I'm not PDI, but I will say that people have been known to go into a rage and lose control. Patsy was getting into fights with JB. They argued what she would wear on the party on the 23rd. Patsy got her to wear a dress. They argued about what she would wear to the Whites. JB could get completely bratty. She's been described as being Patsy's project, but at 6 she was a handful. I love to imagine what she would have been when she was older--talent, intelligence, beauty. I imagine her selecting what college she would go to and her life being without turmoil with the right man, the right education and the right career. At 6 and hard to control. There's the other side. She could have been an out of control teenager and put Patsy through hell. That's all much better than what happened. That's my favorite fantasy.

It's an easy answer. JB was getting more and more bratty. Patsy was worried about how she would behave at the lake house and on the Disney cruise. JB got up to find something to eat. Patsy found her on the 1st floor and they got into a fight. John's asleep and Patsy wants to regain control so she takes JB into the basement to punish her. She gets JB into the most isolated location of the house so she can control the noise. JB's terrified of the basement. Instead of control, Patsy gets a panicking child. If Patsy can't gain control, she'll have to answer to John and there will be a huge fight. Escalation and that's a really easy story to tell.

 

[BBB167893]

I wonder what you PDI people think how and why P bashed JB's head so hard to break it? Really wonder that...

Speaking for myself, I think JB said something P REALLY didn't like and Patsy grabbed her by the collar and waistband and went to throw her onto the bed, only she mistimed it and JB hit her head at high speed.

And why do you think they lied saying B slept whole night until he talked to the GJ that he was awake? Was it two years later can't remember right now..

They didn't want him as a witness.

 

[Pinkland]

Speaking for myself, I think JB said something P REALLY didn't like and Patsy grabbed her by the collar and waistband and went to throw her onto the bed, only she mistimed it and JB hit her head at high speed.



They didn't want him as a witness.

This is pretty close to what I think...though I do think she hit her with the flashlight.

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[UKGuy]

Speaking for myself, I think JB said something P REALLY didn't like and Patsy grabbed her by the collar and waistband and went to throw her onto the bed, only she mistimed it and JB hit her head at high speed.



They didn't want him as a witness.

How can you be a witness to something you know nothing about? special case for BR.

.

 

[UKGuy]

nicee ....

 

[icedtea4me]

Speaking for myself, I think JB said something P REALLY didn't like and Patsy grabbed her by the collar and waistband and went to throw her onto the bed, only she mistimed it and JB hit her head at high speed.*snip*

I agree. I think JonBenet said and/or did something that provoked Patsy.

 

[MURDERER_SERVANT]

One wonders why one piece of the paintbrush was missing cause it could well
be cleaned off just like some other items . Could it be that the missing piece was whittled? Just a thought.