PTL (Peach Tree Landing)

[PPKik]

BBM: But suppose Heather thought SM did care for her? I believe she would think that SM would protect her from TM and she would have no reason to be afraid at PTL. If Heather made SM feel like a hero (so mature and in control while at work, you know), then he might act like one around her, and she might have a different perspective of him than those of us on the outside would have.

I agree the prosecution did a spin to make sure the Ms didn't get released. But I don't discount that SM might have cared for Heather, in whatever way he was capable.

I do, however, disagree that murder/kidnapping charges completely negates any feelings SM might have had for Heather. You can care about someone and still care more about yourself.(If SM got caught up in something that just went out of control before he knew what happened and is now protecting his own behind)

<Very respectfully snipped for space>


I honestly have no feelings or insight into what Heather thought that SM thought. Whether he cared for her, or she for him.

I am just going by what the prosecution has charged: That Sidney with premeditation murdered Heather. Wimp or not (probably is), there is no way at all I can see any man or woman caring about another and murdering them out of wimpiness.

There's a limit to being a wimp, in my book, anyway. You can be whipped by an overbearing person, but murder is so extreme, so far beyond any "normal" behaviour and activity where wimpiness would be exhibited, that unless Sidney Moorer can show he was extremely mentally and physically abused to the point of mental illness (which I don't believe to be the case at all), if he did participate in the murder, he did it under his free will. And doing it completely negates any feelings for her.

 

[PPKik]

Haha! Jinx!

Great minds! Jinx is lucky, right?

 

[Makaroni]

I personally don't care how many calls Heather made. At the end of the day, she is presumed dead, not them. The initial call to lure was made by Sidney. She didn't drive to PTL on a whim, bump into the Moorers while there and they kill her in self defense. Sorry, but I believe this was planned WELL in advance. Tammy couldn't get over the affair and I believe stalked Heather, based on "journals" found in Moorers residence. I know I don't have all the evidence, but so far, there are plenty of pieces pointing to their guilt. And I'm sure the grand jury indicted based on far more evidence. Just my opinion though ...

 

[magnolia]

I personally don't care how many calls Heather made. At the end of the day, she is presumed dead, not them. The initial call to lure was made by Sidney. She didn't drive to PTL on a whim, bump into the Moorers while there and they kill her in self defense. Sorry, but I believe this was planned WELL in advance. Tammy couldn't get over the affair and I believe stalked Heather, based on "journals" found in Moorers residence. I know I don't have all the evidence, but so far, there are plenty of pieces pointing to their guilt. And I'm sure the grand jury indicted based on far more evidence. Just my opinion though ...

Heather's calls are part of the evidence. I think a Jury will probably care about those phone calls and why so many went unanswered.

Heather didn't leave for PTL until approximately 2-1/2 hrs. after the intitial pay phone call from Sidney. One would think she would have left sooner if he attempted to lure her out at that time. All the unanswered calls go against the "lured to PTL" theory.

IMO

 

[Makaroni]

Heather's calls are part of the evidence. I think a Jury will probably care about those phone calls and why so many went unanswered.

Heather didn't leave for PTL until approximately 2-1/2 hrs. after the intitial pay phone call from Sidney. One would think she would have left sooner if he attempted to lure her out at that time. All the unanswered calls go against the "lured to PTL" theory.

IMO

People see things differently and I respect that. I believe she struggled back and forth on whether to meet him because according to LE, they had NO contact in quite some time. Of course, the payphone calls are unanswered because they've gone home, in my mind, to further plan her demise. Probably, her heart told her to meet him, whereas her mind said no, because she had moved on and at one time, feared Tammy. She probably struggled with whether or not to call his cell, for fear of Tammy. I think she sadly trusted him after talking to him on his cell. I think the few unanswered cell calls were either just missed or planned by Tammy as "hey, she wouldn't quit calling". I don't think they realized Sidney was caught on camera at gas station. My point is, even if she called 100 times to the payphone, Sidney initiated the first contact in weeks .... Why?!? Coincidentally, she ends up presumably deceased. She did not initiate contact, he did, and if I were a betting woman, I'd say at Tammy's command (with her in car at payphone I'd guess). I don't think he called to just say hey, how's it going ... But rather meet me, Tammy kicked me out. Of course, just my thoughts and opinions.

 

[Madeleine74]

I agree, it wasn't just a "how ya doing" call. There was a purpose to SM calling HE and whatever he said, it pulled Heather back in quickly. It allowed the setup for Heather to be murdered. I don't know what SM's intent was, but he didn't protect Heather and he didn't do anything to warn her, so unless his wife was holding a gun to his head or otherwise threatening his life, he was a willing participant in whatever went down that night/morning.

IF his wife was threatening his life and he was coerced into complying with TM or he would die, then he would not be guilty of either kidnapping or murder. But he'd have to prove that assertion. So far...nada.

 

[magnolia]

People see things differently and I respect that. I believe she struggled back and forth on whether to meet him because according to LE, they had NO contact in quite some time. Of course, the payphone calls are unanswered because they've gone home, in my mind, to further plan her demise. Probably, her heart told her to meet him, whereas her mind said no, because she had moved on and at one time, feared Tammy. She probably struggled with whether or not to call his cell, for fear of Tammy. I think she sadly trusted him after talking to him on his cell. I think the few unanswered cell calls were either just missed or planned by Tammy as "hey, she wouldn't quit calling". I don't think they realized Sidney was caught on camera at gas station. My point is, even if she called 100 times to the payphone, Sidney initiated the first contact in weeks .... Why?!? Coincidentally, she ends up presumably deceased. She did not initiate contact, he did, and if I were a betting woman, I'd say at Tammy's command (with her in car at payphone I'd guess). I don't think he called to just say hey, how's it going ... But rather meet me, Tammy kicked me out. Of course, just my thoughts and opinions.

BBM-

A total of six calls were made to his cell phone. She obviously didn't struggle with it very long.

I know we are not in court. We are not Jurors. However, your theory will have to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. The Jurors will not be allowed to speculate on what Heather's heart vs. her mind was telling her or whether or not she regained trust in Sidney after the phone call, etc. Based on the evidence, they will have to decide if they believe the prosecution's theory. Based on the evidence we have to date, their theory does not make any sense to me. I think this is true for many people.

IMO

 

[Dixie E]

BBM-

A total of six calls were made to his cell phone. She obviously didn't struggle with it very long.

I know we are not in court. We are not Jurors. However, your theory will have to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. The Jurors will not be allowed to speculate on what Heather's heart vs. her mind was telling her or whether or not she regained trust in Sidney after the phone call, etc. Based on the evidence, they will have to decide if they believe the prosecution's theory. Based on the evidence we have to date, their theory does not make any sense to me.

IMO

One thing is for sure-S placed the first call that evening. Whatever the conversation was, it must have been powerful enough for H to keep calling, first to the pay phone and then his cell numerous times. To me, it was almost like desperation from whatever he said. H hadn`t contacted any of the Ms after the break up and then all of a sudden SM calls her. I do believe that the prosecution has plenty of evidence. Not only physical evidence , but, other evidence as well. We will not learn more about the most incriminating evidence until the trial. Why would they say that HM was kidnapped and murdered at PTL if they didn`t have crucial evidence that they are not sharing with the media and public.

 

[magnolia]

One thing is for sure-S placed the first call that evening. Whatever the conversation was, it must have been powerful enough for H to keep calling, first to the pay phone and then his cell numerous times. To me, it was almost like desperation from whatever he said. H hadn`t contacted any of the Ms after the break up and then all of a sudden SM calls her. I do believe that the prosecution has plenty of evidence. Not only physical evidence , but, other evidence as well. We will not learn more about the most incriminating evidence until the trial. Why would they say that HM was kidnapped and murdered at PTL if they didn`t have crucial evidence that they are not sharing with the media and public.

BBM

I think their case is based on circumstantial evidence and a theory.

 

[Dixie E]

BBM

I think their case is based on circumstantial evidence and a theory.

Whether it is or not remains to be seen. We will all find out during the trial. They do have DNA, so that is some physical evidence. If the DNA belongs to H and it was in that truck or anywhere on their property, that will be the incriminating factor. It will all come out at the trial.

 

[Miss Priss]

Whether it is or not remains to be seen. We will all find out during the trial. They do have DNA, so that is some physical evidence. If the DNA belongs to H and it was in that truck or anywhere on their property, that will be the incriminating factor. It will all come out at the trial.

I don't believe that they had confirmed DNA, belonging to Heather at the time the statement was made.

DNA results take longer than that. Seems like it was about a week after the execution of the search warrant when that article was written referencing DNA.

 

[Makaroni]

BBM-

A total of six calls were made to his cell phone. She obviously didn't struggle with it very long.

I know we are not in court. We are not Jurors. However, your theory will have to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. The Jurors will not be allowed to speculate on what Heather's heart vs. her mind was telling her or whether or not she regained trust in Sidney after the phone call, etc. Based on the evidence, they will have to decide if they believe the prosecution's theory. Based on the evidence we have to date, their theory does not make any sense to me. I think this is true for many people.

IMO

Again, I'm only speculating like you are. My theory is based on evidence shown thus far. I wasn't there and I don't know what happened. We are all entitled to our opinions and that was all just mine.

 

[magnolia]

People see things differently and I respect that. I believe she struggled back and forth on whether to meet him because according to LE, they had NO contact in quite some time. Of course, the payphone calls are unanswered because they've gone home, in my mind, to further plan her demise. Probably, her heart told her to meet him, whereas her mind said no, because she had moved on and at one time, feared Tammy. She probably struggled with whether or not to call his cell, for fear of Tammy. I think she sadly trusted him after talking to him on his cell. I think the few unanswered cell calls were either just missed or planned by Tammy as "hey, she wouldn't quit calling". I don't think they realized Sidney was caught on camera at gas station. My point is, even if she called 100 times to the payphone, Sidney initiated the first contact in weeks .... Why?!? Coincidentally, she ends up presumably deceased. She did not initiate contact, he did, and if I were a betting woman, I'd say at Tammy's command (with her in car at payphone I'd guess). I don't think he called to just say hey, how's it going ... But rather meet me, Tammy kicked me out. Of course, just my thoughts and opinions.

Again, I'm only speculating like you are. My theory is based on evidence shown thus far. I wasn't there and I don't know what happened. We are all entitled to our opinions and that was all just mine.

BBM

I am in total agreement. We are all entitled to our opinions.

You said your theory is based on the evidence. Respectfully, where is the evidence supporting the BBM in your post.

 

[Makaroni]

BBM

Respectfully, where is the evidence supporting the BBM in your post.

I've explained my opinions and theories. I don't have time to pull links and "plead my case". You don't have to " thank" or even read my posts. I'm sure some agree with you, some with me, and some have ideas of their own. I respect everyone's opinion even if I disagree. I believe this is a forum where we all form ideas based on how we perceive the evidence presented. No need for hard feelings ...

 

[jeandrews]

I want to mention that each side has Evidence that we don't know about yet. I expect that a lot more Evidence will come out during discovery - that we will won't know about until trial. So I think it's healthy to have discussions based on the evidence we have right now and for each of us to form opinions based on that evidence, please remember that this circus has yet to come to town.

 

[PPKik]

I don't believe that they had confirmed DNA, belonging to Heather at the time the statement was made.

DNA results take longer than that. Seems like it was about a week after the execution of the search warrant when that article was written referencing DNA.

Yes. It did seem a little too quick for confirmation of Heather's DNA. If it is, the evidentiary value will depend on what DNA and how much, in my opinion.

Based on the prosecutor's narrative, Heather and SM had been in a relationship or affair for five months. Heather could have shed lots of DNA in that truck and SM could have transferred her DNA onto objects, clothing or anything that he touched.

 

[SStarr33]

Yes. It did seem a little too quick for confirmation of Heather's DNA. If it is, the evidentiary value will depend on what DNA and how much, in my opinion.

Based on the prosecutor's narrative, Heather and SM had been in a relationship or affair for five months. Heather could have shed lots of DNA in that truck and SM could have transferred her DNA onto objects, clothing or anything that he touched.

Except, according to one of our verified insiders, that truck was purchased after the affair was over. Of course, the defense will say SM was lying about the affair being over which is why I hope the DNA is blood.

I hate having that hope

 

[PPKik]

Except, according to one of our verified insiders, that truck was purchased after the affair was over. Of course, the defense will say SM was lying about the affair being over which is why I hope the DNA is blood.

I hate having that hope

I know what you mean.

Your post brings up some questions for me. I thought TM got a truck, supposedly to help make up for the affair. Didn't LE take all the trucks during the search on the day of the arrests, but kept SM's, the black one? Everyone has been referring to the black one with the silver toolbox as his. Is that wrong?

Re: the affair being over. I don't have a theory one way or the other, but how would Donna Elder know? The whole MO of affairs is stealth. How would anyone know except the two of them? Heather is missing, presumed dead, and Sidney is in the slammer, not considered a model or truthful citizen.

If there is blood, there would have to a lot, imo, to show that it is unlikely she could be alive, or a spatter pattern consistent with a gunshot or heavy blow. It's nearly impossible for me to believe that they would do something so heinous, and then keep the truck as if nothing happened in it.

That circles back to the question of PTL and what really happened there? As far as I remember there was no crime scene cordoned off at PTL, at least not for days. Was it ever considered a crime scene until the murder charges?

 

[Mahouston69]

Police said evidence was found in the home and ON the property. I think that means on the truck (DNA such as long brown hair?) or maybe her foot prints in the mud on their property with her exact size foot and shoe she was wearing?

I think she was seized, kidnapped, etc at PTL but not killed there, unless she was hit and killed by truck and they found strands of hair on or under the bumper....:/

http://www.wistv.com/story/24804641/hcpd-couple-to-be-charged-with-murder-of-heather-elvis

 

[PPKik]

Police said evidence was found in the home and ON the property. I think that means on the truck (DNA such as long brown hair?) or maybe her foot prints in the mud on their property with her exact size foot and shoe she was wearing?

I think she was seized, kidnapped, etc at PTL but not killed there, unless she was hit and killed by truck and they found strands of hair on or under the bumper....:/

http://www.wistv.com/story/24804641/hcpd-couple-to-be-charged-with-murder-of-heather-elvis

According to newly-obtained arrest warrants for Tammy and Sidney Moorer, the HCPD states there is probable cause to believe that they kidnapped Heather Elvis and murdered her at Peachtree Boat Landing on December 18, 2013.


From your link and why many of us are confused by what that state has said so far. It doesn't seem likely to me that she was murdered at PTL, but is their theory. At least it is stated in the warrants, below.

http://www.wistv.com/link/683926/ho...dney-moorer?clienttype=generic&mobilecgbypass

The DNA found in the truck was discussed in a tweet by a reporter,IIRC, and then reported by WMBF.The best I could find was a reference on WS.

SC - Heather Elvis, 20, Myrtle Beach, 18 Dec 2013 #26***ARREST** - Page 25 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community