Reasonable Doubt

[Chillout1989]

http://www.wftv.com/news/17684992/detail.html#

here is another one. they are on the bottom right.

 

[leophoenix]

http://www.wesh.com/caseyanthony/index.html

here ya go...towards bottom of page.

Thanks, that's for the 2nd and 3rd calls. Anyone have a link for the 1st call?

 

[Chillout1989]

will go look sorry......

 

[Chillout1989]

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/p...ale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=1.1.1&sflg=1


hope that helps....

 

[TURBOTHINK]

I don't think there's enough evidence leaning towards premeditation- yet. And I don't think Casey would tell the truth even though the whole thing was an accident- she will never make herself look bad, even if it means taking the heat off of a more serious conviction.

I believe they have the premeditation motive. Not sure what it is yet, but on NG it was said there was compelling evidence of PM....and that none of the really condemning evidence has even been released yet. That tells me they have a LOT coming and KC knows it. She can cry foul all she wants, but many have been convicted with a lot less circumstantial evidence than what we have seen.

 

[Chillout1989]

I believe they have the premeditation motive. Not sure what it is yet, but on NG it was said there was compelling evidence of PM....and that none of the really condemning evidence has even been released yet. That tells me they have a LOT coming and KC knows it. She can cry foul all she wants, but many have been convicted with a lot less circumstantial evidence than what we have seen.

in today's hearing, i understood that too. i think they said that they had a ton more evidence regarding this case; thus no problem to release some of this other stuff to defense.....i just pray that they have their case together!

 

[leophoenix]

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/p...ale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=1.1.1&sflg=1


hope that helps....

Thanks, that's the Flash FLV type video I ran into. Can't do anything with that because it isn't downloadable. I'll work on those two and try to find the 1st audio later.

 

[TURBOTHINK]

I was a juror on a double murder trial and let me tell you, we went over and over what constitutes "reasonable doubt". In our case, a tiny drop of one of the victims blood was enough for us to deliver a guilty verdict, though the defense tried to get us to believe that there was another person involved that committed the actual murder and his client was just in the vehicle (that person could never be produced). I think that a hair with evidence of decomposition would not be enough as it has been stated that a hair yanked from someones head that is alive with skin attached to it would show the same signs of decomposition as a hair from a deceased person, the defense will bring up all of the cases where the "air" tests have been inaccurate which in my mind, these two things would constitute reasonable doubt. Other than those two things, they have no real evidence.

1.Hair yanked from someone's head with skin attached WILL NOT show the same signs of decomposition. The body has to be in a state of decomposition with the scalp and hair "let loose" before there are "death rings" on the follicles.

2. Could you provide a link to where the decomposition air tests were proved inaccurate? I have not found one instance where they have not proved accurate in court. Keep in mind they not only have those tests but TWO cadaver dogs hitting on the same areas.

3. Interesting you say "other than those two things" they have no real evidence. Those two things are non reputable evidence. Go to U.T. Body Farm website and forensic anthropology sites to understand why I say that.

3. Those two things are just the "tip of the iceberg" of their evidence.

 

[Chillout1989]

http://www.foxnews.com/ontherecord/caylee/index.html

last one i have found for you,......system very slow

 

[KAITLAND]

Just popped in for a few seconds - my $0.02 worth: if they are looking to get reasonable doubt, they had better find 12 childless-jurors. The scientific evidence, phone/text/video evidence + the total lack of evidence of fear/remorse/sorrow from Casey = guilt. I think every mother alive has had at least one experience of that feeling of panic when they can't locate their child in the grocery store for one minute....so, 31 DAYS?? This will create absolutely NO DOUBT WHATSOEVER in any parent's mind. But, what do I know, I am just a normal "mom".

 

[TheLoneRanger]

I was watching NG the other night and the woman who was filling in for her quoted Casey as saying she did not report Caylee missing because "theyre going to try to pin this on me". The substitute for NG said something to the effect of that proves her guilt. My question is: What is the "This" they are trying to pin on you? I don't get why that question wasn't addressed.
Did anybody else notice this ?

Hi Hisimage! I don't know if this helps any - I didn't see the NG show or hear that part, but the "pin it on me" part is actually from that phone call home when kc kept asking for TL's ph#.... IIRC she was speaking to KC & it was like kc said "They already said they're gonna pin this on me if they don't find her"....

which I actually took to make NO SENSE whatsoever at that time.... I was thinking "pin WHAT if they don't find her"?!!

Then later, TL claimed he got a text mssg from kc's phone [I think AH stated this to LE during her interview & asked them ask TL about it] but anyways the gist was TL allegedly got a text mssg the same day kc was 1st arrested that said something along the lines of "guess who's going to jail for a long time if they don't ever find her [Caylee]...

which was even MORE disturbing.... imo

 

[Brini]

oops...i forgot that one. good catch....but other than that....NADA!!!! As a mother, i would be psychotic. when i asked my husband, he said the same thing!!!!!!

Yes. Any real mother would.

And, a real parent would be beating done LE's doors for help, and ten dragging the FBI in.

 

[Zoe Bogart]

At first glance, the pictures APPEAR to show a loving mother, I agree.

When we stop & think about Casey & her 'history' we realize...

How long does it take to snap a photo.... it's easy to look happy for a split second.

I agree with you! I've said this time and time again. People CAN look happy and loving in pictures taken during fun events (parties, holidays, a fun day at the beach) but are those pictures giving the full picture of the lives of the people in them? Of course not.

How many happy couples have we seen in pictures, lovely wedding pics, happy honeymoon shots, first holidays with the new babies, lovely family portrait? Then we hear the couple has divorced because they couldn't get along, or one has killed the other, or one has left because there was another man/woman.

Really, just HOW LONG does it take to snap a happy picture or a happy family video?

If I were on the jury, I'd be on the "guilty" side after hearing the child was missing for 31 days before the GRANDMOTHER reported it, Cindy's 911 call about the dead body smell in the damn car, and Casey's first call home when she's more worried about Tony's phone number than she ever was about her daughter, and the fact that she herself says everyone is more worried about Caylee!!!! The after all that, the LIES she told, the forensic evidence in the car..............

I believe, and even as a juror I'd believe, she was guilty of murder because if it was an accident, she would have called 911, but instead, she hid Caylee. How could I believe this was an accident?

For me, the proof is in Casey's actions.

 

[TheLoneRanger]

At first glance, the pictures APPEAR to show a loving mother, I agree.

When we stop & think about Casey & her 'history' we realize...

How long does it take to snap a photo.... it's easy to look happy for a split second.

What would the pictures show IF Casey was a REAL full time mother & not just a fill in when she wasn't off having fun with her friends?

Having a cute kid is a real attention getter.... it's a positive as long as your friends are still cooing over the kid.... what happens when having a toddler around starts to make your friends feel self-conscious about their own behavior... they're young & single & want to have fun.

Are they going to be relieved when they hear your daughter is with her grandmother or off with some 'babysitter?'

Is it important to you that you still fit in with the gang... even though you have grown up responsibilities that cut into your fun time?? What do you do?

I just wanted to comment on the part you said I bolded above - I suddenly had the thought that aside from the latest couple pics from a distance of Caylee & kc walking at the oviedo property, most all of the other pics of kc & Caylee TOGETHER actually look more like web-cam type pics, or rather, self-held-pics, like the kind that you take of yourself to post online or send to someone else in email or IM.... like the kissing ones for example.... [I think Caylee has on a blue-ish nightgown & hair in pony tail] anyways, I thought those were so cute of her... now looking at it, it really seems like kc was taking most of them herself... maybe like to send to someone else [like a guy or something?]... I dunno... just imo....

 

[Zoe Bogart]

Originally Posted by Chillout1989 View Post
the only emotion i have ever heard from kc is when she called 911 regarding the protesters and her dad getting into the fight!!!!!!! pathetic!!!

She cried at the first bond hearing when she heard that she was going to jail -

Let's not forget her anger during her first call home. She was angry they wanted only to talk about Caylee but she only wanted Tony's phone number.

Anger is an emotion, too, don't forget.

I believe there is lots of evidence for premeditated murder. There are the chloroform and missing children's websites searches. I wouldn't doubt for one minute if Casey searched for ZG's info AFTER she killed Caylee because she had just found someone to pin it on - after she saw ZG at Sawgrass and somehow found her information. For me, searching for ZG after the murder would be the only slightly questionable part for premeditated, but somehow, I don't even think that slight bit of wonder would have me declaring her "not guilty" because there is so many overwhelming facts to the contrary, especially, not notifying anyone for a month the child was missing, making up all those lies to her mother where Caylee was during that month (Zanny in an accident story.....etc), all the lies she told to her friends, the evidence of the car, the stories she made up to account for the smell in the car, Cindy's 911 'dead body smell' call, and whatever forensics LE has.

Yes, I had one incident where my young son disappeared from my young daughter and myself in a K-Mart. I was frantic! He had somehow wandered through the clothing racks and must have looked terribly lost. A lady brought him to the front of the store and had them page the parent of "a little lost boy in red T-shirt who says he name is _______". It couldn't have been but a few minutes. To me, it seemed like ages! I ran to the front of the store, hugged my son, thanked everyone, then gave him the lecture of his life for wandering off and leaving the area with a STRANGER!!!! It never happened again.

So after that experience, I can't understand how Casey could be so casual about the disappearance of Caylee.

 

[leophoenix]

Audio Background Snippets So far: Most are hard because of the poor audio quaility of the samples.
There is lots of background talk but most is hard to distinguish.

911 Call 2: KC Crying In Background On Mom's Call Wanting Her Arrested.

911 Call 3: After CA Tells Caylee's birthday KC says "You didn't have the right to go through it" http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/9/4/1407059/you%20didn%27t%20have%20the%20right.mp3

911 Call 3: When CA tries to hand over the phone she says, "You'll Never Get Me To Talk To Them". http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/9/4/1407059/Never%20Going%20To%20Talk%20To%20Em.mp3

911 Call 3: After "My Daughter has been missing for 31 days." CA says, "Whatever." http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/9/4/1407059/Whatever.mp3

911 Call 3: Operator: "Did you guys call to report a vehicle stolen"-CA says, "I called" http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/9/4/1407059/I%20called.mp3

911 Call 3: What vehicle was stolen? no. this is my vehicle.: CA The ? was stolen. http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/9/4/1407059/stolen.mp3

911 Call 3: When Operator is reading description of daughter back she says, "Duh" http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/9/4/1407059/duh.mp3


911 Call 3: The Police Arrive: CA calmly says," Ok here comes the Sheriff are you ready for him?" http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/9/4/1407059/Sheriff.mp3


Will see what other background conversation I can get out.

 

[magic-cat]

Audio Background Snippets So far: Most are hard because of the poor audio quaility of the samples.
There is lots of background talk but most is hard to distinguish.

911 Call 2: KC Crying In Background On Mom's Call Wanting Her Arrested.

911 Call 3: After CA Tells Caylee's birthday KC says "You didn't have the right to go through it"

911 Call 3: When CA tries to hand over the phone she says, "You'll Never Get Me To Talk To Them".

911 Call 3: After "My Daughter has been missing for 31 days." CA says, "Whatever."

911 Call 3: Operator: "Did you guys call to report a vehicle stolen"-CA says, "I called"

911 Call 3: What vehicle was stolen? no. this is my vehicle.: CA The ? was stolen.

911 Call 3: When Operator is reading description of daughter back she says, "Duh"


911 Call 3: The Police Arrive: CA calmy says," Ok here comes the Sheriff are you ready for him?"


Will see what other background conversation I can get out.

How are you making those out? Just listening closely or do you have some sort of program that you can turn up the background somehow?

 

[leophoenix]

How are you making those out? Just listening closely or do you have some sort of program that you can turn up the background somehow?

Using an audio filter program to lessen the background static. Sniping sections between the forefront conversation and increasing the volume and doing some eq. I use Goldwave sort of an audio studio type program. Sometimes slowing the voices down from 1.00-.92 to hear better amongst the leftover static. I've been using it to clean up live concert material for 15 years. If LE has the orignal files they can get better samples than me because the News audio is very low quality.

 

[RR0004]

Well, I definitely remember Casey not wanting to take the phone.
Very interesting stuff...thanks for sharing.

 

[Zoe Bogart]

Thanks, leophoenix. This makes it all the more interesting. I need to go back to those calls and listen again, with script in hand, of course. :book: