Remains in Trunk and the A's

[JBean]

In the first 400 page document dump there is a report written on 7/17/08 @ 16:42 regarding K9 "Gerus" giving a positive alert on the trunk of the Pontiac for human decomposition. Certainly the dog has no hidden agenda.

I agree,
But it will certainly be challenged. During the Laci case, the defense produced a cadaver dog training tape and in it was the cadaver dog that hit at the dock I believe, making mistakes! It was terrible.
IIRC, I think that is how it went down. I think it was Trimble?

It is all about doubt.
>>During cross-examination Wednesday, Geragos produced a video from a failed October 2002 training exercise that Anderson had kept from her training records prosecutors used to trumpet Trimble's skills.
"The reason you specifically didn't put the failure in the training records is specifically because you knew your dog had failed at that trial, correct?" Geragos said in an accusing tone. "Incorrect," Anderson replied tersely.
Geragos showed the video to jurors in which Trimble seems unable to find a scent trail and at one point "alerts" on the person shooting the video. In the tape, Anderson scolds Trimble, yelling: "Wrong!" <<

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4176/is_20040902/ai_n14582310/

 

[LambChop]

Because they are dogs they can ignore what they have been taught for a variety of reasons. But the dog did alert and that along with the other witnesses who claimed the trunk smelled like death, the fact that Caylee's body was found and testing shows signs in the trunk consistent with decomp. would lead you to believe the child was indeed in the trunk of the car after her death.

Sounds like Anderson's "false statement" on the stand may be why she has trouble with her dog. JMO

 

[hroark2112]

I think KC's "Just one more day" statement to her mom was to take care of these 'loose ends' that were out there. Clean the car, move the body to somewhere more difficult to find, and cover her tracks. She didn't get that opportunity.

I've read a ton of times how intelligent people think KC is, but I disagree. The fact that she didn't take the time to clean the trunk out well, left the paper towels in the trunk, and tossed the body away like trash tell me she's not really all that intelligent and never thought things through. She apparently had almost 3 days to figure out where to dispose of the remains, and couldn't come up with a better spot than that?

I don't think CA or GA had anything to do with the disposal of the body, but I do think they know a lot more than they're letting on.

 

[RR0004]

I agree,
But it will certainly be challenged. During the Laci case, the defense produced a cadaver dog training tape and in it was the cadaver dog that hit at the dock I believe, making mistakes! It was terrible.
IIRC, I think that is how it went down. I think it was Trimble?

It is all about doubt.
>>During cross-examination Wednesday, Geragos produced a video from a failed October 2002 training exercise that Anderson had kept from her training records prosecutors used to trumpet Trimble's skills.
"The reason you specifically didn't put the failure in the training records is specifically because you knew your dog had failed at that trial, correct?" Geragos said in an accusing tone. "Incorrect," Anderson replied tersely.
Geragos showed the video to jurors in which Trimble seems unable to find a scent trail and at one point "alerts" on the person shooting the video. In the tape, Anderson scolds Trimble, yelling: "Wrong!" <<

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4176/is_20040902/ai_n14582310/

So dogs have a training period, huh...that makes sense. I imagine they're not allowed to work a case until they've proven themselves reliable, correct? Oh, it definitely will be challenged. CA challenged it from Day 32....or was it 33?

 

[JBean]

Because they are dogs they can ignore what they have been taught for a variety of reasons. But the dog did alert and that along with the other witnesses who claimed the trunk smelled like death, the fact that Caylee's body was found and testing shows signs in the trunk consistent with decomp. would lead you to believe the child was indeed in the trunk of the car after her death.

Sounds like Anderson's "false statement" on the stand may be why she has trouble with her dog. JMO

Yes she said her dogs never failed or something like that.
I agree with you, I am only saying that it will most likely be challenged. Maybe jurors will agree with your statement, which would cause doubt?:
>>Because they are dogs they can ignore what they have been taught for a variety of reasons<<

 

[BeanE]

Yes I thought we were talking about the same thing. But was it butyric acid or the odor signature of butric acid? It is my understanding that these cheeses that were in the bag can produce butric acid?

I guess I am guilty of thinking that when anyone says the word "if" they are following up hypothetically. I do believe that the 2.6 days is based on a great big "if" . I will go back and read it again to be sure, but the last 8 times I read it, he did not conclude that it was human decomp.

I'm trying to reconcile believing in imaginary cheese, but not the 2.6 days.

 

[TorisMom003]

Brittany Schieber's interview with LE from July30.

http://cayleeanthony.files.wordpress.com/2008/09/brittany-schieber-7-24.pdf

Wrong thread, sorry

 

[LambChop]

Yes she said her dogs never failed or something like that.
I agree with you, I am only saying that it will most likely be challenged. Maybe jurors will agree with your statement, which would cause doubt?:
>>Because they are dogs they can ignore what they have been taught for a variety of reasons<<

LOL. Anyone who has a dog can relate. My dog listens to my daughter....ignores me.

 

[coco puff]

Yes I thought we were talking about the same thing. But was it butyric acid or the odor signature of butric acid? It is my understanding that these cheeses that were in the bag can produce butric acid?

I guess I am guilty of thinking that when anyone says the word "if" they are following up hypothetically. I do believe that the 2.6 days is based on a great big "if" . I will go back and read it again to be sure, but the last 8 times I read it, he did not conclude that it was human decomp.

I think the "IF" would mean a lot more if the driver of the car didn't have a two-year-old daughter who's death she cannot explain.

 

[notthatsmart]

There is no "IF" in the wording (look below at attachment). There was also NO cheese in the vehicle. The wrappings were empty. AZ is correct the butyric acid was acquired through scrapings of the liner. Volatile Fatty Acids are the best means of determining the post mortem interval. The odor signature is not important to me, in the grand scheme of things, it just bolsters the case for decomposition being present in the trunk.


You did not respond to my question earlier on another thread: No one saw Caylee after June 16th- Where do you think she was?

Just a quick preliminary and I will try to get to more of this later. Just doing a quick search, I am finding numberous things that are sources to Vfa and and butyric acid. Broiler chickens, tea, perfume, acetone, vitamins, rancid butter just to name a few.

http://aem.asm.org/cgi/content/abstract/66/6/2536

[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butyric_acid[/ame]

TL did say that Casey brought over chicken often from her Moms. I wonder if febreeze or even freezer pops have butric acid. Anyway, I will research more later. thanks

 

[RR0004]

NTS- respectfully, you do know the topic of the thread is about the "remains" in the trunk. Aren't we supposed to assume that any discussion will be about the "remains". I understand that you may not believe there were any there, but I'm not sure where discussion could lead then...except in circles.
Sorry, I don't mean to imply anything...I'm just a bit confused since we were discussing admissibility of evidence on the last thread.

ETA: mea culpa...was referring to the wrong thread. But just curious, is this thread about the presence or absence of remains?

 

[RR0004]

Just a quick preliminary and I will try to get to more of this later. Just doing a quick search, I am finding numberous things that are sources to Vfa and and butyric acid. Broiler chickens, tea, perfume, acetone, vitamins, rancid butter just to name a few.

http://aem.asm.org/cgi/content/abstract/66/6/2536

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butyric_acid

TL did say that Casey brought over chicken often from her Moms. I wonder if febreeze or even freezer pops have butric acid. Anyway, I will research more later. thanks

I must say, I find it insulting to poor Caylee's memory to equate her remains to frozen chicken.

 

[Harmony 2]

I must say, I find it insulting to poor Caylee's memory to equate her remains to frozen chicken.

OMG... really <<shaking head>>
(sigh)

 

[Gma Kat]

In Tony L's deposition he stated that he had asked KC about the car when he was in NY and KC said her father had taken care of the car and brought it to the mechanics or dealership (he wasn't quite sure which one). We know that GA did not pick up the car it was towed. KC had no plans to go back and get that car and shemay have thought it had been stolen. When you think about it that would have been to her advantage now wouldn't it.

bbm: I have always thought KC intended to have the car stolen by placing it at Amscot - that way she could blame whatever forensics were found in the car on the person who stole it and possibly claim it was stolen with Caylee in her carseat.

 

[TorisMom003]

bbm: I have always thought KC intended to have the car stolen by placing it at Amscot - that way she could blame whatever forensics were found in the car on the person who stole it and possibly claim it was stolen with Caylee in her carseat.

Especially when she left her keys in the car and her bag/purse. Anyone ever watching Bait Car would know that leaving the keys in a car unattended is just asking for someone to steal the car.

 

[Pondering Mind]

I think the "IF" would mean a lot more if the driver of the car didn't have a two-year-old daughter who's death she cannot explain.

Yep coco...That 'teensy weensy' little fact throws a monkey wrench in...well, pretty much everything and anything that defense may come up with to be honest...:angel:

 

[notthatsmart]

Especially when she left her keys in the car and her bag/purse. Anyone ever watching Bait Car would know that leaving the keys in a car unattended is just asking for someone to steal the car.

She left the keys in the car? this is news to me. Can you post a link to this info? I thought the tow truck driver said it was locked. And I thought the tow yard guy Simon Birch confirmed that it was out of gas.

 

[mitzi]

She left the keys in the car? this is news to me. Can you post a link to this info? I thought the tow truck driver said it was locked. And I thought the tow yard guy Simon Birch confirmed that it was out of gas.

Bold mine.

Would you please post a link that shows that cheese was in the car? TYIA.

 

[notthatsmart]

NTS- respectfully, you do know the topic of the thread is about the "remains" in the trunk. Aren't we supposed to assume that any discussion will be about the "remains". I understand that you may not believe there were any there, but I'm not sure where discussion could lead then...except in circles.
Sorry, I don't mean to imply anything...I'm just a bit confused since we were discussing admissibility of evidence on the last thread.

ETA: mea culpa...was referring to the wrong thread. But just curious, is this thread about the presence or absence of remains?

Thank you for pointing this out. I don't want to go off topic. I guess the name of this thread assumes that there were remains in the trunk. I will go find another thread where we can discuss what was really in the trunk. Thanks

 

[cyberborg]

What are you talking about? The quote was blank.
Respect for Caylee is getting to the whole truth and nothing but the truth, good bad or ugly. My opinon only. This is my way of giving Caylee justice.

Hopefully that whole truth is the real truth and not the wildly creative Hollywood scripted Anthony abridged version designed solely to save KC.

It is highly unlikely that we will ever know the whole truth unless KC has an epiphany and tells us .... and even then it will be the KC 'mistruth' version and not the real truth.