Retrial for Sentencing of Jodi Arias - 1/29 thru 2/2 - Break

[MeeBee]

Agreed, it would be silly and counterproductive for defense to argue that she intentionally inflicted those stab wounds on a gunshot-wounded man, but my point was this in the minute entry:

"The State presented evidence that the victim was first shot in the right side of his head near his eye with a .25 caliber handgun and that the bullet lodged in his left cheek. This wound was not fatal and may or may not have rendered the victim unconcious."

So what evidence did the prosecution present to show the gunshot came first, and why did they change their opinion not long before trial? It seems an even stronger argument for cruelty if she disabled him first and stabbed him countless times afterwards, so why change the order? I just find it confusing, that's all.

The only reason the state changed it was because Juan asked Dr. Horn his medical opinion on the order of the wounds and Dr. Horn studied the autopsy and gave his opinion. So the state changed its opinion. The only reason sequencing even became important is because the defense tried to argue that because the shot came first then it was less cruel.

Juan's evidence is Horn's professional, medical opinion.

 

[Wing Ding]

11. “You told us you weren’t able to make out the license plate leaning up against the curb because you are nearsighted. What is your prescription in each eye?”

JA saying the front license plate of her car was leaning against the cement parking curb was such a ridiculous thing to say. IF some skate punks had removed the front license plate, the plate would have fallen straight down to the ground. It would not have fallen against the parking curb as the curb itself would have been a few feet under the front end of her car by her front tires.

And if she were backing her car out of the parking space, why would she have been looking out the front windshield of the car? And even if she would have looked out her front windshield, if only for a second, the front license plate would have been flat on the ground in front of the parking curb, not laying at an angle against the "inside" of the parking curb.

But considering how JA said a picture of a little boy flew off TA's bed and sailed out several feet and landed at her feet (as opposed to falling straight down to the floor), I know gravity is different in JA's world, and a car license plate would in fact begin to fall straight down to the ground and then -- in mid air, I might add -- magically make a turn and travel underneath the front end of the car and then hop over the parking curb and come to rest at an angle so it's now visible as you're looking out your front windshield as you're backing out of your parking space. Yep, she really did think of everything.

Those were a lot of words just to explain the action of gravity on an object such as a car license plate. Please don't ask me to explain how to make a peanut butter and jelly sandwich.

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

I now believe it was first too. I can understand why Dr. Horn believes it was last, but I think this is one of those weird instances where something unusual happened. Jodi used an old gun that was already a low caliber. It his brain but it grazed it. The disorientation and confusion placed Travis at a severe disadvantage while trying to defend himself from the knife attack. The gun probably jammed or the gun hurt her hand. And imo, it doesn't change the cruelty of it. It actually makes it worse. Travis may have been able to fight her off if he hadn't been shot first.

The gun was first. Jodi has been telling us all along.

In the ninja story it starts with a loud bang and her ears ringing. I also go back and forth. Stranger things have happened. I bet she never thought how loud a gun is going off in tile bathroom.

 

[Ransom]

IMO, because bringing this up could then call into question the accidental pictures taken of JA dragging Travis back to the shower.

That was brought up

 

[MeeBee]

Oh and the ballistics person who said the casing was on top of the blood.

I mean, even if you don't buy it, they have more evidence for their version than the defense does for theirs.

 

[Steely Dan]

Good points.

I agree she wanted to make it look like 2 killers. I also wonder if she maybe shot last because she didnt want the sound of the gun to alert neighbors or anyone else. I kind of wonder if maybe that was like the last thing she did right before leaving. She may have even cleaned up already, showered, changed clothes, and been ready to walk out the door and did the shot right before she left because she knew the sound would be loud.
I have always wondered if she left wearing dark ninja type clothes. It is too bad someone in the neighborhood did not notice the person leaving Travis house that day.

For my personal opinion on it, I think I have resigned myself to always stay on the fence about it. I flip-flop too much about it.

If that's true she'd already concocted the ninja story it would seem.

I think the Hugeses did what they could to warn Travis about Jodi, and protect him from her.

TA may have felt betrayed at first when Sky told JA she wasn't welcome at their house, but I think when TA realized JA wasn't marriage material for him, he was probably thankful Chris and Sky intervened. TA was probably more mad at himself for being too nice to JA. Once she got a taste of the good life, his good life, she just wouldn't leave him alone.

I think she wanted/wants to be somebody. She saw Travis as a bigwig with prepaid legal and she thought she could gain status in prepaid legal if she was his wife. She had their whole lives planned out in her deranged noggin, and she did everything she could to discourage other women from wanting to be with him.

JA saying the front license plate of her car was leaning against the cement parking curb was such a ridiculous thing to say. IF some skate punks had removed the front license plate, the plate would have fallen straight down to the ground. It would not have fallen against the parking curb as the curb itself would have been a few feet under the front end of her car by her front tires.

And if she were backing her car out of the parking space, why would she have been looking out the front windshield of the car? And even if she would have looked out her front windshield, if only for a second, the front license plate would have been flat on the ground in front of the parking curb, not laying at an angle against the "inside" of the parking curb.

But considering how JA said a picture of a little boy flew off TA's bed and sailed out several feet and landed at her feet (as opposed to falling straight down to the floor), I know gravity is different in JA's world, and a car license plate would in fact begin to fall straight down to the ground and then -- in mid air, I might add -- magically make a turn and travel underneath the front end of the car and then hop over the parking curb and come to rest at an angle so it's now visible as you're looking out your front windshield as you're backing out of your parking space. Yep, she really did think of everything.

BBM

IIRC, it actually fell in that chaotic way that papers do.

 

[Steely Dan]

In the ninja story it starts with a loud bang and her ears ringing. I also go back and forth. Stranger things have happened. I bet she never thought how loud a gun is going off in tile bathroom.

IIRC, it was a .22 and they are very quiet guns. They're so low caliber that I don't think the bullet even breaks the speed of sound. JMO

 

[Janedoe66]

I can't believe I didn't realize she was being retried until I saw it here... I've got to stop playing video games.

 

[ElleElle]

What second shot? Where did that come from? TA had one bullet in his head. ONE casing was on the floor. IF there was a second shot, where is the casing? TIA

BBM~ IDK, Jodi took it while she was cleaning up?

 

[Ransom]

I had brought up an example earlier of how the casing could end up in the blood the way it did and also the shot still coming first.

During the 1st trial, I remember some of us describing another way it could have happened with the shot coming first and the shell casing still ending up that way.
You reminded me about it regarding the old gun with such a small caliber.

A small caliber .25 automatic can sometimes be prone to jam for a couple different reasons.
1-Like you mentioned since the gun was an older gun and if it had not been cleaned and oiled then it may have been prone to jam. OR
2-if JA bought ammo for it that was "regular" grain gunpowder and not like a "high magnum" gunpowder it would be more prone to jam. You can buy ammo with varying amounts of gunpowder and the less gunpowder then the more chance an automatic will be prone to jam. Because an automatic needs the blast of the shell to automatically *advertiser censored* back the action. I have a .22 automatic handgun that jams unless I buy a certain type of ammo for it. Once I get this certain ammo, it works fine. Im not sure if JA found shells when she stole the gun but if JA had to buy shells, then she may have just bought typical regular shells with basic amount of gunpowder and it may have jammed on the 1st shot.

Back to shell casing in blood.
So if JA shot him first, and the gun jammed and she could not fire another round, then TA may have stumbled out of the shower and JA drops the gun to run the other way. She then retrieves another weapon (Knife) and begins to finish him off. Then after all is over, she picks up gun and works the action to free the jammed shell casing which could have still been stuck in gun (Ive had this happen before) and it flies onto the floor in the pool of blood.

IF it was a misfire and JA managed to clear it (LMAO) then where was the bad cartridge? To clear a misfire the cartridge needs to be ejected to continue to fire. Second shot into TA head and the casing is visible in a pool on blood and on TOP of the blood and didn't roll in there, IMO.

So ... to sum it up. Jodi managed to clear a misfire and picked up that misfired cartridge, but forgot to pick up the casing from the bullet in TA head???? Don't agree, but that's okay. I'm in the group that agrees that shot was last. JMO and I respect all the views. Peace

 

[Shadowboy]

I think she wanted/wants to be somebody. She saw Travis as a bigwig with prepaid legal and she thought she could gain status in prepaid legal if she was his wife. She had their whole lives planned out in her deranged noggin, and she did everything she could to discourage other women from wanting to be with him.

Snipped with respect.

Okay. I’m saying this and I don’t expect to be “thanked.”

IMO, JA was a fraud, stalker, and (potential) murderess long before she met TA. HOWEVER … I wonder if the Butcher-ess side of JA would have been activated if she hadn't latched onto the “home/family” nature of the Church of the LDS.

IMO, she felt ostracized because of her “newbie” position in the LDS community after she moved to Mesa; she found herself in a tight-knit group of true believers. Believing herself smarter, sexier than other women in the Ward, she manipulated TA with sex. And the worm turned.

I so wish TA had more “street smarts.” The social and sacred network of the LDS was his safety net, but it was also his death sentence.

TA grew up as an overweight, stinky kid. The kid EVERYONE bullied. He ran away from his meth-fueled, disastrous “home” when he was 10 years of age. His G-ma stepped in. G-ma and the LDS became his anchor. His religion became the family/anchor he never had.

IMO, JA posed the most significant threat to TA’s beliefs/tenants/family he had ever met. He thought he could control the threat pose by JA. His bloodied corpse proved he could not.

 

[Ransom]

BBM~ IDK, Jodi took it while she was cleaning up?

But overlooked/forgot the one found at the scene? Okay.

 

[Hatfield]

I can't believe I didn't realize she was being retried until I saw it here... I've got to stop playing video games.

Its "kind of" being retried. LOL

You may already know this. We are actually in just a repeat of just the "Sentencing Phase" because only the sentencing phase was the part the original jury could not come to a decision on. The original GUILTY verdict still stands and that part is not being done over.

With that said, the defense team is practically re-hashing the whole case over again even though they are supposed to just be telling the jury why they should give JA life sentence versus a death sentence.

 

[Steely Dan]

This is from Yahoo! Answers so take it for what you think it's worth: https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20110513201454AALBBvt

...There are many versions of the 22 caliber round. Ranging from the 22short, 22LR (long rifle) to the 22magnum. The 22short & the 22LR are rather quiet compared to almost anything else. Even a lot of firecrackers seem loud in comparison....

I've heard if you want to keep a gun for protection don't use a .22. Shooting someone with a .22 is more likely to make them mad rather than kill them.

I believe Jodi's was a .22short.

 

[ElleElle]

IF it was a misfire and JA managed to clear it (LMAO) then where was the bad cartridge? To clear a misfire the cartridge needs to be ejected to continue to fire. Second shot into TA head and the casing is visible in a pool on blood and on TOP of the blood and didn't roll in there, IMO.

So ... to sum it up. Jodi managed to clear a misfire and picked up that misfired cartridge, but forgot to pick up the casing from the bullet in TA head???? Don't agree, but that's okay. I'm in the group that agrees that shot was last. JMO and I respect all the views. Peace

It's all good. The gunshot first has always been a great debate.

But, Jodi did leave a camera in a washer, so she managed to do a half-*advertiser censored**ed clean-up job. She thought she took the casing, because she did not want it traced back to her grandparent's gun.

Which reminds me, was the bullet casing compared to the ammo at the grandparents, or was that stolen also?

If you look at this pic, to me it seems like the grey area is tile that has been damaged, and it is right next to casing.

 

[Wing Ding]

IIRC, it actually fell in that chaotic way that papers do.

Right. I think that's the way JA explained it, too. But I still think an object, even an object chaotically swaying back and forth, will fall in a more downward direction than an outward direction. She said she was standing by his dresser and the picture landed at her feet. I just... I just don't buy it. Not that I buy the idea there was a picture to begin with. I just don't buy her version of gravity on a chaotically swaying picture sailing out several feet. Maybe her dad really did knock her head against a door jamb a time or two.

 

[ElleElle]

But overlooked/forgot the one found at the scene? Okay.

Okay. She did overlook the camera in the washer, the long hair she left behind, palm print. I just can't believe she would steal a gun and not use it first. Jodi is not a big girl, stabbing a naked wet man would be extremely difficult, shooting in the head would be cleaner and easier. JMO

 

[Ransom]

IIRC, it was a .22 and they are very quiet guns. They're so low caliber that I don't think the bullet even breaks the speed of sound. JMO

.25 caliber

Just something to ponder: GRAPHIC WARNING

[video=youtube;aXR0itwtm74]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXR0itwtm74[/video]

 

[Hatfield]

IF it was a misfire and JA managed to clear it (LMAO) then where was the bad cartridge? To clear a misfire the cartridge needs to be ejected to continue to fire. Second shot into TA head and the casing is visible in a pool on blood and on TOP of the blood and didn't roll in there, IMO.

So ... to sum it up. Jodi managed to clear a misfire and picked up that misfired cartridge, but forgot to pick up the casing from the bullet in TA head???? Don't agree, but that's okay. I'm in the group that agrees that shot was last. JMO and I respect all the views. Peace

That scenerio was just describing if there was the 1 single shot "first" that ended up shooting him in the head, but gun jammed with casing jamming in the gun near the ejection port (has happened to me), and after she retrieved knife to finish him off, she then picks up the gun and works the action to clear the jam and the casing falls into the pool of blood. Would explain how the casing landed in pool of blood with no blood on top, and the shot still coming first.

Ive had a gun fire once and the casing never came out and jammed in ejection port.

But I agree the thought of Jodi even being able to clear a jammed gun is laughable.

 

[Ransom]

Okay. She did overlook the camera in the washer, the long hair she left behind, palm print. I just can't believe she would steal a gun and not use it first. Jodi is not a big girl, stabbing a naked wet man would be extremely difficult, shooting in the head would be cleaner and easier. JMO

K. Disagree. I'm very familiar with guns. I have many and the sequence by Dr. Horn makes perfect sense to me. Peace.