Richard Allen Welch, Sr.- A Person of Interest

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Let me just lay it all out here for everybody who reads this thread...I am related to the Welches...I for one am getting really tired of reading and seeing horrible things written about the "Welch Family". I am not defending Lloyd Jr. or anyone else who has abused or molested a child. I have 3 grandsons, two of which are the same ages as the Lyon sisters were when they disappeared. There are hundreds of people all related to Welches in one way or another and they are not to blame for any of this. If you want to call Lloyd Jr. a piece of s**t for what he's already been convicted of doing, then by all means have at it. But please stop making it sound like all the Welches are "f'ed" up. I used to really like coming to WS to discuss things and possibly learn things but if being called names and having an entire family be convicted of a possible crime just because of their last name is what I have to look forward to every time I come to these threads, then I'll just stick with my TMD FB page where the name calling and accusations are not tolerated.

I am sorry that this has affected you so much, But I have one question..

BBM and underlined part.. Does that mean you don't think he is responsible for any of this or involved at all in the Lyons sisters case?

I am pretty sure that when people talk about the Welches they are talking specifically about the ones who are involved in this case, Not the far our reaching happened to be related to them crowd.

 

[Richard]

Well then they would subpoena the companys records. Look, the police and FBI have tons of power of investigation and they know a lot more than any of us know. They don't know everything so they try to obtain additional info outside their normal powers. Trust me, they know everything about RAW and he wasn't named as a person of interest solely based on something LLW said in prison. They have a lot more.

One would certainly expect MCP to have more information on Richard Welch than what Lloyd provided them. After all, they searched his house and property quite thoroughly, tapped his phone, questioned his relatives and neighbors, have probably requested numerous employment and public records, etc.

But, have no doubt about it, the origional source of information linking Richard Welch to the Lyon Case was Lloyd Welch. It was his statements, given to investigators in 2013 - before Lloyd or Richard were identified as Persons of Interest - that were specifically cited in written requests for the search Warrants.

 

[steveP120]

But, have no doubt about it, the origional source of information linking Richard Welch to the Lyon Case was Lloyd Welch. It was his statements, given to investigators in 2013 - before Lloyd or Richard were identified as Persons of Interest - that were specifically cited in written requests for the search Warrants.

We do know that Lloyd linked Richard to the crime, but we don't know if Lloyd was the original source of the information.

The search warrant attachment
http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/wset/SKMBT_60115022314160.pdf
makes it clear that
1.) Cold case investigators rediscovered Lloyd's 1975 police report in May of 2013
2.) Lloyd talked to the police on several occasions since May of 2013
3.) On one of the occasions Lloyd accused his uncle of the crime

We don't know if Lloyd brought up his uncle early in 2013 or late in 2013 after the uncle was linked to Lloyd, from just being his uncle and working in Wheaton. Legal documents, such as search warrants, are often vague - On or about May 15, John did something - so that the case would not get dismissed if it turned out that John did something on May 13, but this entire search warrant seems very vague. For all we know, Lloyd could have mention his uncle in 1975, and the story was just unbelievable.

 

[siriunsun]

We do know that Lloyd linked Richard to the crime, but we don't know if Lloyd was the original source of the information.

The search warrant attachment
http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/wset/SKMBT_60115022314160.pdf
makes it clear that
1.) Cold case investigators rediscovered Lloyd's 1975 police report in May of 2013
2.) Lloyd talked to the police on several occasions since May of 2013
3.) On one of the occasions Lloyd accused his uncle of the crime

We don't know if Lloyd brought up his uncle early in 2013 or late in 2013 after the uncle was linked to Lloyd, from just being his uncle and working in Wheaton. Legal documents, such as search warrants, are often vague - On or about May 15, John did something - so that the case would not get dismissed if it turned out that John did something on May 13, but this entire search warrant seems very vague. For all we know, Lloyd could have mention his uncle in 1975, and the story was just unbelievable.

It may have been something as simple as "where'd you get the car from?", or "who provided transportation?", and the whole possible involvement of RAW became a focal point from there. That published document cannot be, and most certainly is not, the whole story.

 

[danmanhatter]

I like the idea posted earlier that some clues may have come out of the Kraisel trial. Either he himself or even perhaps TTW2 could have revealed details about past events that may have sparked something. What was the relationship back then, or now, amongst the brothers and nephew?

 

[steveP120]

I like the idea posted earlier that some clues may have come out of the Kraisel trial. Either he himself or even perhaps TTW2 could have revealed details about past events that may have sparked something. What was the relationship back then, or now, amongst the brothers and nephew?

I myself have not looked into the Kraisel case because it looks like just a coincidence (bad luck of knowing a child abuser) to me (and I personally should try to cut down on time spent on forums and watching bad TV shows).

But a police officer looking at all options should have typed the name Welch (of which there are many) into a legal database (as someone here did or googled) and looked for connections.

But I think the two simpler explanations, either Lloyd brought it up (perhaps innocently at first) or police found out who Lloyd knew around the mall are more likely.

 

[danmanhatter]

I myself have not looked into the Kraisel case because it looks like just a coincidence (bad luck of knowing a child abuser) to me (and I personally should try to cut down on time spent on forums and watching bad TV shows).

But a police officer looking at all options should have typed the name Welch (of which there are many) into a legal database (as someone here did or googled) and looked for connections.

But I think the two simpler explanations, either Lloyd brought it up (perhaps innocently at first) or police found out who Lloyd knew around the mall are more likely.

Kraisel appears to have been a long-time friend of the Welchs'. It may not be as much of a coincidence as you think. A police officer would have to do more than just search a legal database. Some of the clues about Kraisel's relationships with the Welchs' can only be gathered by reading original paper documents and putting the 'pieces' together. Maybe that's what happened?

 

[siriunsun]

Kraisel has been the focus of more than one investigation in the recent past. His connection to the Welches appears to have roots in Florida, via a female relative.

 

[beachlvr0810]

I am sorry that this has affected you so much, But I have one question..

BBM and underlined part.. Does that mean you don't think he is responsible for any of this or involved at all in the Lyons sisters case?

I am pretty sure that when people talk about the Welches they are talking specifically about the ones who are involved in this case, Not the far our reaching happened to be related to them crowd.

Thank you...I think it's very possible he's responsible for this or involved. Look at what he's sitting in prison for now.

 

[danmanhatter]

Kraisel has been the focus of more than one investigation in the recent past.

I'd like to see a picture of him. Perhaps a well orchestrated event at the mall involving multiple people. One wonders if Kraisel could have been TRM?

 

[simplifymylife2014]

Does anyone know if RAW1 was born in Florida or what led him to go to high school in DeFuniak Springs, Florida?

 

[siriunsun]

I'd like to see a picture of him. Perhaps a well orchestrated event at the mall involving multiple people. One wonders if Kraisel could have been TRM?

From the early 60's, when he graduated from college.

 

[richneil18]

Richard
Where did you find this alias name?

 

[danmanhatter]

Richard
Where did you find this alias name?

I'm pretty sure he got it off the MD case search website.

Use caution though, that database is full of contextual transcription problems. The alias is not correct. You'll need to research RichardLewis' link to the obit to put the correct pieces together.

I don't want to use any names here. But, I think you will find it pretty straightforward to figure out.

 

[simplifymylife2014]

Richard
Where did you find this alias name?

What are you all referring to?

 

[siriunsun]

What are you all referring to?

I don't think it means anything to the case.

 

[danmanhatter]

I don't think it means anything to the case.

Early there was a posting by Richard (not to be confused w/ RichardLewis) regarding the 'alias' of TTW2. It's much further upstream near the beginning. The alias is incorrect, and may instead be that a child. It should probably be flagged for removal.

The incorrect information came from the Maryland case search website. Click here.

As I mentioned above, that website has many transcription problems and errors. I've noticed many times DOB's, relationships, addresses, etc have misinformation associated with them. At a minimum, the information there needs to be put into context before making a statement of fact.

When doing my research, I always seek at least one other alternate source of information before drawing a conclusion. In the case of TTW2, we should all do the same. You'll find RichardLewis' (not to be confused w/ Richard's) obituary post a good place to start. It contains additional information regarding the alias that is very helpful.

 

[Richard]

I tried to find the post where I may have listed an alias for someone, but could not find it. I am sure that if I did post an alias for someone, I also would have included some sort of link or reference as to where I found it. If you can indicate which of my posts you are referring to, I might be able to comment more specifically on it.

Generally speaking, however, I would like to mention that many times a website or public record will list "alternate names", "also known as" (AKA), or "aliases" in their data bases. These could be as simple as initials used or not used, misspellings by anybody, inclusion of a "junior", or "senior", or associated names living at an address. Very often the names listed are obvious variations encountered in anybody's mail box.

Sometimes, a different name is actually used by a person. This could be a "pen name", a "stage name", an online name, or other perfectly legal and legitimate thing. Many actors and musicians use a name other than they were given at birth. These are usually not referred to as "aliases", but some legal or police type data bases might list them as such. Their use of the term "alias" is often somewhat loose, and should not be interpretted to mean something illegal or wrong.

Sometimes people DO give false names for the purpose of evading the law. This sometimes causes a person to be charged or prosecuted for a crime under that false name. When that false name becomes associated with the real name, it is often listed as an "alias" in all subsequent LE data bases - along with other alternate spellings, nicknames, etc like mentioned above. When you go to some on-line databases, you can search them using an "alias" or alternate spellings. Inmate Locators are a good example, as are various Judiciary data bases, of this sort of thing.

It is a good observation of how there are many innaccuracies encountered in various on-line records. Some will integrate all known names, while others simply list things separately under each variation of a name. In the case of the Maryland Judiciary Search website, linked above, looking up Lloyd Welch's various entries will produce three different dates of birth.

 

[siriunsun]

Both my birth name and maiden name have double letters, and have been misspelled on official documents, more than once, to only include one letter instead of the double letter. Each rogue spelling, along with name of a former spouse, is considered an "alias". It really means nothing.

 

[danmanhatter]

Regarding aliases...

The alias in question is not an alias. It is an error. Under normal conditions an alias is an alternate name someone uses for themselves. In this case, the alias is actually someone else - possibly a child. It is not the same person the alias is connected to.

.
This alias is incorrect and possibly that of a child.

.
Curious, how do we know for certain he lost custody of his children?

.
Thinking outside the box, if the Lyon sisters were kept alive for some time, then that amount of time would be legally germane to the case. For example, let's say they had been kept alive for days, weeks, months, or even years. Then any crimes committed beyond the date of the original abduction would be relevant.

Thinking outside the box one more time, there is always a remote possibility (not probability), the Lyon sisters left on their own accord. There may not be an abduction crime at all, but instead perhaps false imprisonment, assault, etc. We should keep an open mind about all possibilities. This case is obviously not going to be what we typically think.