Right, shut your face and do as I tell you

[pingpong]

Cathy,I'm sure,but in this case,Patsy,in DOI,(and John,too,for that matter) were making up one excuse after the next in that book.
IMO,they were making excuses for the clothes in bags they had packed in a hurry to high-tail it out of town.John had even said he had previously packed the plane the day before.He had also said Patsy had the suitcases on the bed laid out for the clothes they were taking and packing the day before.
Combine that with the fact they had PP raid the house of things like keepsakes and passports,and I think you have a recipe for someone or someones planning on high-tailing it out of town ASAP.
This is JMO and no one need agree.

It looks like when J + P packed the plane the day before, JonBenet was still alive.

 

[joeskidbeck]

I've been thinking a lot about the way they called their friends over that morning. Could it be that all of these friends were called that night and came over to help? Sort of, here's what's happened, what do we do, type scenario. In this theory, they had to call them all over the next morning to explain any evidence or dna thay may have been left behind in the night. I believe Fernie already knew what the note said and he accidentally let it slip in front of someone he shouldn't have and that's why he had to come up with that ridiculus story about reading it through the door. The Stines were not called that morning, right? Maybe they were the only ones who were actually there that night and that's why everyone else was called in the morning. I have always had this nagging doubt about their son being in the home that night anyway. He and Burke could have gotten into trouble with JB and hit her in the head with the flashlight (I firmly believe the fl is the weapon, no other reason for totally wiping it down). Then John or Patsy (maybe both) called the Stines and said you better get over here, we have big problems. The staging and ransom note would have been the result of four adults on a serious mission. This could also explain the ransom note novella. Just spitballing here, but I do believe the friends are way more involved than we were ever told. They're too afraid of obstrucion charges to come out now with any of this. Heck, it could even be more than obstruction charges they are afraid of. No way to know.

 

[madeleine]

I've been thinking a lot about the way they called their friends over that morning. Could it be that all of these friends were called that night and came over to help? Sort of, here's what's happened, what do we do, type scenario. In this theory, they had to call them all over the next morning to explain any evidence or dna thay may have been left behind in the night. I believe Fernie already knew what the note said and he accidentally let it slip in front of someone he shouldn't have and that's why he had to come up with that ridiculus story about reading it through the door. The Stines were not called that morning, right? Maybe they were the only ones who were actually there that night and that's why everyone else was called in the morning. I have always had this nagging doubt about their son being in the home that night anyway. He and Burke could have gotten into trouble with JB and hit her in the head with the flashlight (I firmly believe the fl is the weapon, no other reason for totally wiping it down). Then John or Patsy (maybe both) called the Stines and said you better get over here, we have big problems. The staging and ransom note would have been the result of four adults on a serious mission. This could also explain the ransom note novella. Just spitballing here, but I do believe the friends are way more involved than we were ever told. They're too afraid of obstrucion charges to come out now with any of this. Heck, it could even be more than obstruction charges they are afraid of. No way to know.

One of my theories as well.But in this case I think they offered to cover and help because it was about BR,why cover for a molesting dad or a psycho mom,doesn't make sense,but for a little boy in serious trouble and with some serious behavioural problems,yes.

And yes,the staging is just too much,and some things totally contradict other things,like there were more people involved and some had no clue what the others did (they were in a hurry?).
Dunno where I read that FW was shaved....when did he have time to get up,shave and drive to the R house in 10 min or so?Maybe the friends were woken up much earlier.

 

[UKGuy]

I've been thinking a lot about the way they called their friends over that morning. Could it be that all of these friends were called that night and came over to help? Sort of, here's what's happened, what do we do, type scenario. In this theory, they had to call them all over the next morning to explain any evidence or dna thay may have been left behind in the night. I believe Fernie already knew what the note said and he accidentally let it slip in front of someone he shouldn't have and that's why he had to come up with that ridiculus story about reading it through the door. The Stines were not called that morning, right? Maybe they were the only ones who were actually there that night and that's why everyone else was called in the morning. I have always had this nagging doubt about their son being in the home that night anyway. He and Burke could have gotten into trouble with JB and hit her in the head with the flashlight (I firmly believe the fl is the weapon, no other reason for totally wiping it down). Then John or Patsy (maybe both) called the Stines and said you better get over here, we have big problems. The staging and ransom note would have been the result of four adults on a serious mission. This could also explain the ransom note novella. Just spitballing here, but I do believe the friends are way more involved than we were ever told. They're too afraid of obstrucion charges to come out now with any of this. Heck, it could even be more than obstruction charges they are afraid of. No way to know.

joeskidbeck,

At a minimum they made phone calls prior to dialling 911. Either John or Patsy realised that their current staging was incriminating or they recieved advice to restage. I tend to agree with you on the flashlight. Otherwise it means the intruder removed his gloves to use the flashlight and touch JonBenet's longjohns and underwear. Then promptly put them back on to fashion the garrote etc?

One other explanation for the flashlight being wiped down is that there was a third party involved a non-ramsey, who used the flashlight to view the crime-scene?

If the doll is not staging then it appears that JonBenet was initially assaulted in her bed, previously I tended to favor the bedwetting theory e.g. PDI. But Coroner Meyer's remarks regarding sexual contact seem to contradict this. Unless you assume JonBenet wet the bed after being molested? Then again how are her chronic internal injuries to be explained away?

If you assume a BDI then why would Burke need to whack JonBenet with a flashlight, when his hand over her mouth might be as effective?


.

.

 

[CathyR]

My digital camera is a PIECE OF CR$#.

I did the cantaloupe experiment and took pictures that ......... never showed up on memory card or camera memory.

Took camera in for repair and was told to replace battery. It shows to be charged fully but turning in on totally drains the battery. ^&%$#&*.

How the tests came out-

Flashlight looked very similar and I had to whack a few cantaloupes before I figured out not much force needed. I knew I would not be able to duplicate the long fracture as a melon is much softer than a human skull. The square hole was most similar if I was to the side of the melon. A strike with melon facing or turned away made the shape different. The one where the head was sideways (an ear facing the person hitting her) was the most like the photos. I drew happy faces on melons to show angles of head position. I stuck melon on an old fashioned paper "organizer". When you just pierce the paper on the spindle and keep adding to the pile.


I was surprised but a baseball bat HANDLE END also made a similar impression. Once again the angle had to be from the side not from front to back.

My fireplace tongs have a curved piece at the end and they punctured the melon deeply at the curved end.

Golf clubs- I used a wood-- no similarity- huge deep hole round in shape. Used a nine iron- once again shape was similar but not as close as flashlight.

Used an open ended wrench and from front to back it was deeper but my wrench was big and a smaller one would have also made a similar mark. I used both sides big and small, and the smaller side made a very close mark but also too deep.

My dogs loved the crime scene cleanup but left lots of incriminating evidence all over my yard.

 

[otg]

I did the cantaloupe experiment and took pictures that ......... never showed up on memory card or camera memory.

So, CathyR, what time is the melon party? Are we all invited? Sounds like you'll have plenty for everyone.

:dance:​

.

 

[CathyR]

So, CathyR, what time is the melon party? Are we all invited? Sounds like you'll have plenty for everyone.

:dance:​

.

My own family did not want to eat the melons. My hubby said he couldn't take a bite thinking this was someone's head. I didn't sterilize the paper spindle before sticking the melons on it and that isn't too sanitary. I saved two melons for family and even then I was questioned about their use as one had a face drawn on it. I never even took that one or the other one outside. One had a defect like a person with a flat head in back. It was never rolled over during its time on the vine and one side was flattened. I rejected it for the experiment and had to hear jokes about being a "zombie" eating brains.

If you want to fight a Great Dane and a Tennessee Walker for the rest you are welcome to come on down to Texas. My Jack Russell doesn't like the melons and will help you distract the bigger ones from their stash.

 

[joeskidbeck]

Thanks for the results, Cathy. I read somewhere that the skull of a six year old would not be as hard as that of an adult, so the results may be closer than we think.
I wish I could get past that flashlight as the weapon so that I would not feel so closed minded about it, but I can't. The wiping down of the batteries cinched it for me. Had they left the batteries alone, I would probably think the bat was the weapon, but it just ain't happening for me.
Here's something else I've been thinking about. We all know that John had requested Patsy pack in plastic bags to conserve the weight on the plane. What if he did that because there was going to be an extra passenger? One that may have weighed around the same or a little more than Burke? I don't remember the Stine's son's name but I wonder if he may have been going to Charlevoix with the family. I know I am trying to make the evidence fit my theory, but as far as I can see, in this case, it's the only way we may ever figure out what may have happened. I know in my heart the Stines were way more involved than they ever let on and, if you think about it, that was quite a bit. I have lots of friends, but I don't have the kind of money the Ramseys had. I don't understand why they moved in with the Stines when they could have easily made other plans. Most friendships would have fallen apart after that extended stay. Heck, most families would have fallen apart after that kind of stay. I hate to quote Ronald Cummings and I wouldn't if it weren't already something I have said often: "keep your friends close and your enemies closer!". I just can't imagine two forces of nature like Patsy Ramsey and Susan Stine being under the same roof for months. I bet the two men stayed at work (or wherever) as long as possible every day. Human nature says this arrangement was made in he!! and the only way it could last is if they all knew something really bad about each other!
Ok, rant over. Show me all the reasons why my reasoning is off.

 

[CathyR]

I don't know anything about the R's and Stine's friendship so you will have to enlighten me with some links. You also have to realize their friendship would become strained as no house is big enough for 2 families. I have tried to avoid any psychology yet, I want to find the solid forensic evidence first and gleaning that TRUE information is very difficult. I personally think that everyone had their own agenda in regards to JBR' case. Every witness, every friend, the lawyers the cops the DA. the DA feeding false facts, 2 experienced cops just quitting after years of frustration and I respect both Lou and Steve. I don't care who is right as long as strong conflicting forensic evidence doesn't exist. Strong enough to blow their theory out of the water.

Instead of being adversarial to each other, two teams needed to investigate separately and then meet up and debate it with a couple of DA's present, one for each team looking everything over, and if enough evidence to exonerate the R's existed....... then both teams would have merged and went for a single investigation. The new investigation is being conducted very high security with little to no new information being released. I hope it will eventually tell us who killed JBR.

I think the touch DNA is promising because of an article I read.
Here is link. It is a side link on a previous link I posted. Notice at end of article what it says about gloves being used at a crime scene.
http://www.suite101.com/content/forensic-investigation-and-dna-profiling-a250516

 

[tragco]

There were two pages missing and not accounted for from Patsy's notepad. I thought there was also bled through from where the other notes had been started and discarded.

What if Fernie saw one of the "practice" pages, that later got 'cleaned up'?

Also who knows how many times Patsy and or John slipped up? Their friends are certainly not outing them what so ever. The BPD wasn't around enough to hear anything unfortunately.

As for Johns disappearance, what do you all think he was up to for one and a half hours? That's a he'll of a long time!

Also what were the men doing during this time as the women 'comforted ' Patsy? Strange and getting stranger!

According to IRMI, 8 pages were missing. Just a small point, but still.

In response to people thinking the friends were involved (not picking on you, SunnieRN, just responding in general ), I am just not so sure. If so, maybe one. I just don't see even best friends, several of them, covering it up for this long and not telling anyone. People talk.

I do think their friends were concerned with their status and aware of John's power in the community; so although some had suspicions they kept it to themselves. The pageant dress maker.. can't remember her name... or the source.... but apparently she has stated that Patsy took her hand and said "Can't you just fix this?" and "I didn't mean for this to happen". I believe she became suspicious after that and lost quite a few clients.

Now she may have lost clients simply because of less pageant turnout or people just knowing she made poor murdered JonBenet's dresses. But I do think that some of the friends were concerned about John's influence and political power.

The only way I can see friends involved and keeping their collective mouths shut is if there was some kind of sexual game they were all involved in. I just don't see that happening.

IMO and as always, love to hear different takes on the situation.

 

[SunnieRN]

One of my theories as well.But in this case I think they offered to cover and help because it was about BR,why cover for a molesting dad or a psycho mom,doesn't make sense,but for a little boy in serious trouble and with some serious behavioural problems,yes.

And yes,the staging is just too much,and some things totally contradict other things,like there were more people involved and some had no clue what the others did (they were in a hurry?).
Dunno where I read that FW was shaved....when did he have time to get up,shave and drive to the R house in 10 min or so?Maybe the friends were woken up much earlier.

Thank you Madeline! I have said for some time that this is the scenario that would keep an adult quiet. This is what would make them feel sorry for the Ramsey's and possibly encourage them to lie.

There is also the possibility that Burke had nothing to do with this, but JR used BR as a cover up story. This would help me understand the Stein's loyalty and eventual financial gain from Jon Benets death.

The thing that truly makes me question this however, is the fact that FW had to either have known, or suspected the truth. I wonder why, after their battles and mud slinging, back and forth, why he didn't say anything? Was all he had was his suspicion?

Did JR have some type of evidence on FW, not concerning the murder, but something else?

Or did BR say something to FW or his son, which can't be proven, but caused FW to try and reason with JR, trying to get him to help solve the murder.

One thing is certain, he definitely believes a RDI.

Tragco, no offense taken and maybe this post better explains my reasoning.

 

[JMO8778]

IMO the Stines were called during the night and they came over.why? for one reason,they were the last to see JB alive,and were some of the R's closest friends,yet they weren't included in the calls to come over that morning.So despite being able to confirm when JB was last seen alive by others outside the family,they were conspiciously absent that morning.
Their behavior afterwards is suspect as well..esp the pic of them all on the deck in Mi,smiling and enjoying themselves..like they were all relieved they got away with it.Patsy's faux explanation for that in DOI seems to substantiate that for me.
also recall that just 3 days prior,it was Susan Stine who answered the mystery 911 call at the party,without ever opening the door.She KNEW what was going on,and was helping the R's cover for it.The R's knew they could trust the Stines...JMO.

If there are others that came that night,I would place my bets on it being Dr Beuf and possibly the Fernies,(or just Mr Fernie,for them).

 

[DeeDee249]

IMO the Stines were called during the night and they came over.why? for one reason,they were the last to see JB alive,and were some of the R's closest friends,yet they weren't included in the calls to come over that morning.So despite being able to confirm when JB was last seen alive by others outside the family,they were conspiciously absent that morning.
Their behavior afterwards is suspect as well..esp the pic of them all on the deck in Mi,smiling and enjoying themselves..like they were all relieved they got away with it.Patsy's faux explanation for that in DOI seems to substantiate that for me.
also recall that just 3 days prior,it was Susan Stine who answered the mystery 911 call at the party,without ever opening the door.She KNEW what was going on,and was helping the R's cover for it.The R's knew they could trust the Stines...JMO.

If there are others that came that night,I would place my bets on it being Dr Beuf and possibly the Fernies,(or just Mr Fernie,for them).

Dr. Beuf is a good theory. Boy, what could have been learned from those phone records.
I can also make a guess that the S's son (a good friend of BR) was possibly there as an overnight guest of BR, possibly going along on the trip. That would be one reason for the virulent behavior of SS. Let's not forget she impersonated a police officer in e-mails (and why she was not prosecuted for that is something I just don't understand) I suppose if the R's political clout can keep them from being prosecuted for the death of their daughter, they can keep their friend from being prosecuted for impersonating a police officer.
Yes, the Rs knew they could trust the Ss. I wonder what eventually fractured the friendship?
And I also believe FW knows or suspects the truth, and he keeps his mouth shut because he knows JR and his lawyers can point the finger at him anytime they want. He touched the tape and the body, and that can be used against him. Of course, that alone is not enough to make a murder rap stick to him (just like it wasn't enough to do it to the Rs). But he'd spend a fortune to defend himself. I think he knows the Rs will never be held accountable, so he wants to just stay out of it.

 

[joeskidbeck]

I don't know anything about the R's and Stine's friendship so you will have to enlighten me with some links. You also have to realize their friendship would become strained as no house is big enough for 2 families. I have tried to avoid any psychology yet, I want to find the solid forensic evidence first and gleaning that TRUE information is very difficult. I personally think that everyone had their own agenda in regards to JBR' case. Every witness, every friend, the lawyers the cops the DA. the DA feeding false facts, 2 experienced cops just quitting after years of frustration and I respect both Lou and Steve. I don't care who is right as long as strong conflicting forensic evidence doesn't exist. Strong enough to blow their theory out of the water.

Instead of being adversarial to each other, two teams needed to investigate separately and then meet up and debate it with a couple of DA's present, one for each team looking everything over, and if enough evidence to exonerate the R's existed....... then both teams would have merged and went for a single investigation. The new investigation is being conducted very high security with little to no new information being released. I hope it will eventually tell us who killed JBR.

I think the touch DNA is promising because of an article I read.
Here is link. It is a side link on a previous link I posted. Notice at end of article what it says about gloves being used at a crime scene.
http://www.suite101.com/content/forensic-investigation-and-dna-profiling-a250516

Cathy, the story of the friendship between the Ramseys and the Stines are so entwined that you can't tell the story of JB without talking of the Stines as well. The Ramseys lived with them for months after JB's death and the Stines actually followed the Ramseys when they moved back to Atlanta, with Mr. Stine going to work for John Ramsey's company. All of this is documented on all of the accounts of the murder. You can read them at A Candy Rose, Forums for Justice, or even right here in earlier threads. There is certainly enough evidence for anyone to come to the conclusion that the Stines were either involved or know exactly what happened.
I agree with JMO8778 in that the Stines were not invited over that morning because they had been there probably most of the night. Dr Beuf as well. It's my opinion that this doctor knew JB was being molested and decided to just talk it over with Patsy instead of going to the authorities, which is what he legally had to do. I also believe that ultimately that is what got her killed. People who think that because they have money and status they are above the laws that govern the rest of us. That's exactly why JonBenet has never received justice to this day and she never will.
The best way to get an educated opinion on this case is to start at the begining and read all the way through. You don't have to do it here or at Forums for Justice, A Candy Rose is one of the most thorough sites on the whole web. There are good reasons why there are a ton of RDIs in the world. Most IDIs would have you believe that Mary Lacy's exoneration of the Ramseys ended RDI, well that's not true. To throw out all of the evidence in this case because of a tiny bit of dna found in 2 or 3 places is preposterous to say the least.
Sometimes when I read some of the posts here I get the feeling that the poster thinks we have not studied ALL the evidence in this case and that we are overlooking important Intruder evidence. That's not so either. The RDI posters here have looked at this case from every angle for 14 years, we have very valid reasons for believing the way we do.
I'm sorry, I certainly did not intend to go off on a rant, but it seems as though we have to keep repeating the same evidence day after day after day and then we have to dispel all the rumors that have gone on for so long.
Maybe I need a break from this case for a while. That just might be the answer I need.

 

[JMO8778]

Dr. Beuf is a good theory. Boy, what could have been learned from those phone records.
I can also make a guess that the S's son (a good friend of BR) was possibly there as an overnight guest of BR, possibly going along on the trip. That would be one reason for the virulent behavior of SS. Let's not forget she impersonated a police officer in e-mails (and why she was not prosecuted for that is something I just don't understand) I suppose if the R's political clout can keep them from being prosecuted for the death of their daughter, they can keep their friend from being prosecuted for impersonating a police officer.

Indeed,and that's a good thought about DS going on the trip.So they would have had no choice but to call and say 'come and get your son'. I suspect they would have called them for support and advice,(and help?) anyway,but it makes much more sense that he was already there.
I've always thought that like BR,DS too,knows much more than he is saying.

Yes, the Rs knew they could trust the Ss. I wonder what eventually fractured the friendship?

I don't know,are they just keeping a low profile now,or did they have a falling out with the R's? I don't recall reading anywhere that they were at Patsy's funeral.
I've always suspected that SS was around to make sure Patsy didn't lose it and talk too much,seeing as she was so medicated (by Dr Beuf,who wanted to keep her quiet too,it seems).

And I also believe FW knows or suspects the truth, and he keeps his mouth shut because he knows JR and his lawyers can point the finger at him anytime they want. He touched the tape and the body, and that can be used against him. Of course, that alone is not enough to make a murder rap stick to him (just like it wasn't enough to do it to the Rs). But he'd spend a fortune to defend himself. I think he knows the Rs will never be held accountable, so he wants to just stay out of it.

that and I think I recall reading he wants to save what he knows for court,IF and when justice should ever prevail (doubtful in this case though).

 

[GingBreade]

Cathy, the story of the friendship between the Ramseys and the Stines are so entwined that you can't tell the story of JB without talking of the Stines as well. The Ramseys lived with them for months after JB's death and the Stines actually followed the Ramseys when they moved back to Atlanta, with Mr. Stine going to work for John Ramsey's company. All of this is documented on all of the accounts of the murder. You can read them at A Candy Rose, Forums for Justice, or even right here in earlier threads. There is certainly enough evidence for anyone to come to the conclusion that the Stines were either involved or know exactly what happened.
I agree with JMO8778 in that the Stines were not invited over that morning because they had been there probably most of the night. Dr Beuf as well. It's my opinion that this doctor knew JB was being molested and decided to just talk it over with Patsy instead of going to the authorities, which is what he legally had to do. I also believe that ultimately that is what got her killed. People who think that because they have money and status they are above the laws that govern the rest of us. That's exactly why JonBenet has never received justice to this day and she never will.
The best way to get an educated opinion on this case is to start at the begining and read all the way through. You don't have to do it here or at Forums for Justice, A Candy Rose is one of the most thorough sites on the whole web. There are good reasons why there are a ton of RDIs in the world. Most IDIs would have you believe that Mary Lacy's exoneration of the Ramseys ended RDI, well that's not true. To throw out all of the evidence in this case because of a tiny bit of dna found in 2 or 3 places is preposterous to say the least.
Sometimes when I read some of the posts here I get the feeling that the poster thinks we have not studied ALL the evidence in this case and that we are overlooking important Intruder evidence. That's not so either. The RDI posters here have looked at this case from every angle for 14 years, we have very valid reasons for believing the way we do.
I'm sorry, I certainly did not intend to go off on a rant, but it seems as though we have to keep repeating the same evidence day after day after day and then we have to dispel all the rumors that have gone on for so long.
Maybe I need a break from this case for a while. That just might be the answer I need.

I so agree with you on so may points but really let's look at the numbers here. First off (and my theory right now) there is just 3 ppl in the house that would know what happened. PR, JR, BR. Add the Stines and the Dr. and it brings the total to 7, then add the lawyer who may have came and the pilot for the plane (he must have known ahead of time how many he was flying...DS would have been included in the count if he was indeed going to travel with them) anyways the total is now 9. One thing I have learned is that people can't keep their mouths shut so really we should have heard something by now by a friend, foe, drunk relative or whatever. So either Stine and Dr. and lawyer had something to hide too or they are afraid?

 

[joeskidbeck]

I so agree with you on so may points but really let's look at the numbers here. First off (and my theory right now) there is just 3 ppl in the house that would know what happened. PR, JR, BR. Add the Stines and the Dr. and it brings the total to 7, then add the lawyer who may have came and the pilot for the plane (he must have known ahead of time how many he was flying...DS would have been included in the count if he was indeed going to travel with them) anyways the total is now 9. One thing I have learned is that people can't keep their mouths shut so really we should have heard something by now by a friend, foe, drunk relative or whatever. So either Stine and Dr. and lawyer had something to hide too or they are afraid?

I also agree with the points you made, GingBreade; however, I'm pretty sure that any of these people would be very afraid to open their mouths. With the exception of the pilot, they would all face charges if their involvement were exposed. Also, for money, lots of people can keep their mouths shut forever. The pilots wife talked about some things for awhile and then abruptly shut up, wonder why? You are right but I believe the pilot may not have known about the extra person. John and Patsy were pretty adamant about packing in plastic bags, maybe that's why, the pilot didn't know about the extra kid, plus he wouldn't have weighed that much so he may not have been told at that point. I'm not locked in to any one theory, but I am starting to lock in on the fact that the Stines were very involved!

 

[feddup]

I've been thinking a lot about the way they called their friends over that morning. Could it be that all of these friends were called that night and came over to help? Sort of, here's what's happened, what do we do, type scenario. In this theory, they had to call them all over the next morning to explain any evidence or dna thay may have been left behind in the night. I believe Fernie already knew what the note said and he accidentally let it slip in front of someone he shouldn't have and that's why he had to come up with that ridiculus story about reading it through the door. The Stines were not called that morning, right? Maybe they were the only ones who were actually there that night and that's why everyone else was called in the morning. I have always had this nagging doubt about their son being in the home that night anyway. He and Burke could have gotten into trouble with JB and hit her in the head with the flashlight (I firmly believe the fl is the weapon, no other reason for totally wiping it down). Then John or Patsy (maybe both) called the Stines and said you better get over here, we have big problems. The staging and ransom note would have been the result of four adults on a serious mission. This could also explain the ransom note novella. Just spitballing here, but I do believe the friends are way more involved than we were ever told. They're too afraid of obstrucion charges to come out now with any of this. Heck, it could even be more than obstruction charges they are afraid of. No way to know.

Friends do NOT cover up for these types of things unless IMO they are evil social paths.
Now there are 4 adults involved in writing the note and staging JBR body after the "accident" ? lol
Normal people just dont do this. Among this group, i do believe they all had chilldren....they probably had grown fond of jbr and hard to believe they would stage everything and lie. JMO

 

[feddup]

I so agree with you on so may points but really let's look at the numbers here. First off (and my theory right now) there is just 3 ppl in the house that would know what happened. PR, JR, BR. Add the Stines and the Dr. and it brings the total to 7, then add the lawyer who may have came and the pilot for the plane (he must have known ahead of time how many he was flying...DS would have been included in the count if he was indeed going to travel with them) anyways the total is now 9. One thing I have learned is that people can't keep their mouths shut so really we should have heard something by now by a friend, foe, drunk relative or whatever. So either Stine and Dr. and lawyer had something to hide too or they are afraid?

People do NOT keep their mouths shut. someone would've said something by now. Either anonomously or just right out. As in: I cant take it anymore and Im telling.
It seems F White was mad because he told JR not to get a lawyer.
He wasnt afraid of the R;s....what were the others afraid of?

 

[SunnieRN]

I have never believed the Steins were scared, they are greedy! The only scenario that makes sense is that Burke did it, or JR made ANYONE else involved, including Patsy, believe that fact.

The most telling clue in solving this section of the puzzle, is FW. I truly believe he promised Patsy he wouldn't tell LE that Burke was involved, but was insistent that P & J needed to.

John however imho, knows some kind of dirt on FW, which is what kept him quiet.