SC - Heather Elvis, 20, Myrtle Beach, 18 Dec 2013 #26***ARREST**

[nosysw]

what about murdered but not moved?

That's kinda where I started. LE said they believe she was kidnapped and murdered at PTL. That's what didn't (and still doesn't) make sense to me. Anyone who is being murdered, is technically being held against their will, but all murderers aren't charged with kidnapping (are they? :waitasec

 

[CHERIE.T]

[modsnip]. Think of all the trauma for them.


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I'm sorry but Heather's family had no consideration given them.

 

[SharetheLight]

Thank you for answering the part clarifying that a deceased person cannot be kidnapped. I'm still confused about how every single person who is murdered is not kidnapped by definition- as they are being murdered, they are not exercising their free will and are being detained, kwim?



This isn't pointed at you, but the definition, which I have looked up but am still confused about.

I understand what you are getting at and it's making my head hurt
What about if you are running from a gunman and get shot--not detained but dead.
I'm trying to think of other scenerios. A poisoning maybe? If you are killed in your sleep? These just all sound ridiculous but I'm trying to think of murders that wouldn't involve, in the very least sense of the word kidnapping, a confinement or detaining someone/not allowing them to leave. Because if I think someone may cause me harm I am going to want to leave.

 

[Softail]

http://www.wctv.tv/home/headlines/E...SU-Student-Murder-244409071.html?device=phone

if this guy gets death, tm at minimum should. IMO.
(not belittling Vincents death at all.... but his murderer didn't taunt his family!)

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What does this have to do with Heather? You lost me. :waitasec:

 

[eileenhawkeye]

In South Carolina, there are no degrees of murder. There is no specific charge of capital murder. If you are charged with murder, you can be sentenced to anywhere from 30 years to the DP/LWOP. I suppose that the jury must decide whether it was premeditated, and then factor that into their punishment.

Now, how exactly would one of the Moorers' get a deal? Would they drop the murder charge for a kidnapping, manslaughter, or other lesser charge? Can they tell the jury that they aren't allowed to sentence one of them to more than 50 years? Would they seek the DP for one, but not the other?

 

[SStarr33]

Kidnapping charges hinge on preventing a person from exercising their will, be it through confinement, terrorizing, moving, etc. States have varying definitions, but they pertain to live persons. You can move a body, desecrate a body, steal a body or rob a grave, but the deceased have no will to exercise.

Seems everyone who is about to be murdered is prevented from exercising their will.

 

[SharetheLight]

[modsnip]. Think of all the trauma for them.


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If it became a DP case and one or both were convicted and sentenced to death, by the time they would actually be executed, after appeals etc [modsnip].
Not trying to be insensitive because when I read it, it sure sounds that way but the M couple had no regard for Heather's life nor any human decency toward her family.
I'm not opposed to it in this case, all things considered.

 

[nosysw]

I understand what you are getting at and it's making my head hurt
What about if you are running from a gunman and get shot--not detained but dead.
I'm trying to think of other scenerios. A poisoning maybe? If you are killed in your sleep? These just all sound ridiculous but I'm trying to think of murders that wouldn't involve, in the very least sense of the word kidnapping, a confinement or detaining someone/not allowing them to leave. Because if I think someone may cause me harm I am going to want to leave.

Exactly. Not trying to make anyone's head hurt. That's why I suggested the wine (which I still haven't had yet).

:needdrink:

 

[cujenn81]

I seem to recall that LE searched the Moorer residence shortly after HE's disappearance. Did they remove a vehicle at that time? News reports talk about 2 vehicles being removed on the "big day" they served warrants late last month, but one vehicle was SM's and one was TM's dad's, and it seems like no one knows what vehicle is TM's. Was her's removed earlier?



On another note, news reports said the camper was searched on the "big day," but since JusticeForHeather took photos yesterday of it at their property, I guess they didn't find anything to make them haul it away. There goes one of my theories about how the Ms may have moved HE.

I think the silver Jeep Cherokee in the driveway in the news pics from the search warrant is hers.


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[nosysw]

Seems everyone who is about to be murdered is prevented from exercising their will.

Exactly my point.

 

[ATasteOfHoney]

In South Carolina, there are no degrees of murder. There is no specific charge of capital murder. If you are charged with murder, you can be sentenced to anywhere from 30 years to the DP/LWOP. I suppose that the jury must decide whether it was premeditated, and then factor that into their punishment.

Now, how exactly would one of the Moorers' get a deal? Would they drop the murder charge for a kidnapping, manslaughter, or other lesser charge? Can they tell the jury that they aren't allowed to sentence one of them to more than 50 years? Would they seek the DP for one, but not the other?

Yes, it is possible to charge one of them differently from the other because one of them could show premeditation and/or kidnapping. The other one may have been an accessory.

:moo:

 

[cujenn81]

I understand what you are getting at and it's making my head hurt
What about if you are running from a gunman and get shot--not detained but dead.
I'm trying to think of other scenerios. A poisoning maybe? If you are killed in your sleep? These just all sound ridiculous but I'm trying to think of murders that wouldn't involve, in the very least sense of the word kidnapping, a confinement or detaining someone/not allowing them to leave. Because if I think someone may cause me harm I am going to want to leave.

I think it might be the "luring her to PTL" under false pretenses (if that's what happened) that prompted the kidnapping charge.


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[SharetheLight]

In South Carolina, there are no degrees of murder. There is no specific charge of capital murder. If you are charged with murder, you can be sentenced to anywhere from 30 years to the DP/LWOP. I suppose that the jury must decide whether it was premeditated, and then factor that into their punishment.



Now, how exactly would one of the Moorers' get a deal? Would they drop the murder charge for a kidnapping, manslaughter, or other lesser charge? Can they tell the jury that they aren't allowed to sentence one of them to more than 50 years? Would they seek the DP for one, but not the other?

I think if one of them cut a deal the prosecutor could request a cap for the number of years sentenced to jail. So I do think a prosecutor could come in with a sentencing recommendation.

 

[SharetheLight]

I think the silver Jeep Cherokee in the driveway in the news pics from the search warrant is hers.


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Was this ever seized? Does anyone know? I asked yesterday but I don't think anyone had an answer.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I think if one of them cut a deal the prosecutor could request a cap for the number of years sentenced to jail. So I do think a prosecutor could come in with a sentencing recommendation.

Well, the minimum for murder is 30 years, so they would have to be sentenced to at least that long. Then, you add up the kidnapping charge.....It seems like unless they got a major deal, they would be spending the rest of their lives in prison. They might be better trying to go for the acquittal...

 

[hockeymom4]

Can someone help me? My margins are all blown on this thread only. I think since the picture was posted. How do I fix it so I can see everyone's posts because right now everything is super small? Thanks.

 

[nosysw]

Can someone help me? My margins are all blown on this thread only. I think since the picture was posted. How do I fix it so I can see everyone's posts because right now everything is super small? Thanks.

Sorry. I have no idea except alerting a mod about the picture that's blowing the margins. I'm not having that issue, but when I do, that's what I do (or just wait until someone explains to the poster how to resize it, which I don't know how to do, either )

 

[cluciano63]

Well, the minimum for murder is 30 years, so they would have to be sentenced to at least that long. Then, you add up the kidnapping charge.....It seems like unless they got a major deal, they would be spending the rest of their lives in prison. They might be better trying to go for the acquittal...

Yeah, I have been saying, I don't see much room for dealing, with the way the laws in SC read. Murder is murder. If you were there, you are equally guilty. No second-degree to knock it down a bit. IMO, unless they start off with a DP case, they have no room to bargain. Personally I hate the idea of either one getting any kind of a light sentence in exchange for anything. But JMO

 

[ShaShaGa]

i'm sorry but heather's family had no consideration given them.

isn't that the truth ????

 

[Softail]

Can someone help me? My margins are all blown on this thread only. I think since the picture was posted. How do I fix it so I can see everyone's posts because right now everything is super small? Thanks.

Yeah, Holy blown margins batman! Then people quote the blown margin posts! :doh: I alerted them.... the mods can delete or fix them. It isn't you.

If you post pics, preview your post first.... then resize as necessary. :twocents: