ACTIVE SEARCH SD - Serenity Dennard, 9, Children’s Home Society, Pennington County, 3 Feb 2019

[human]

Your post is Factual. A Neighbor has these video/alarm systems installed at their two properties. They can watch anything going on around both properties, from anywhere they connect to the 'net'. Easily installed, not super expensive. Just install and watch All MHO

That would never fly.

When I taught in a regular school, we had all kinds of documents parents signed.

Could we take pictures of the children for the books we made for each child? Could parents come and take pictures of their child and have another child in the picture?

We had parents that had orders for protection against others. We had parents that had new identities. ( not witness protection) We had mothers who were victims of domestic violence and victims of stalkers.

There is no way people would be able to watch kids in a classroom. Can you imagine a perv getting to watch your child?

 

[ilovechili]

Some of the facilities that house dementia and Alzheimer patients have the locked alarm doors also. When my Great Grandpa had to be placed in one due to Alzheimer's, I understood their reasoning due to patients walking away. I admit at first I thought it was wrong to lock them in but I am all for if they save one life.

I have seen it too and I go both ways about it. It is a very difficult thing to see and go through. I do not know your experience but would guess I can probably identify with much of it. A parent in my case. And did not have Alzheimer's or dementia imo but was in that area... Inside the locked area though patients wandered and walked into others' rooms, etc. and no one was taking care of that but they are often understaffed and overworked and I also understand that.

Children and the elderly or vulnerable get to me. I think they should be one of the foremost concerns and our facilities and laws should reflect it and often I feel it is just the opposite...

 

[human]

I worked at the ymca and after the sandy hook tragedy....we kept our classroom doors lock from the outside and a buzzer was installed outside the door to get in....but it was after something terrible happened...we can learn from tragedies....right now I'm hoping for a miracle

We were required in Minnesota to keep our doors locked since Columbine. We had six lockdown practices a year. Now it is a new protocol. Active shooter.

The doors opened just fine from the inside. Any child could open it. But not from the outside.

If sometimes I had a child that may escape, I had some kind of alarm. I forget as it was only a couple of times over the years thar I had a child that may escape. It was not permanent so I am not sure what it was.

 

[human]

I too am hoping for a miracle, I think that is the one thing we all have in common.

I go a bit both ways about it, I mean we also should be able to pop into say our day care or a nursing home unannounced and see that nothing is wrong (a buzzer would not allow that), maybe the answer is having the parent able to access with a key card or something but no one else able to just walk in and the child not able to run out?

I so agree with you about learning from tragedies. I hope here they look at this--I hope it is not too late for her--but at minimum I feel daylight hours were lost and hope they take a look at whatever their protocol is to avoid such an event in the future...

Maybe in some places, but I think since all of the school shootings and the missing Kyron Horman, the day anyone can walk into a achool are long gone.

Over the years, I had many orders for protection.

And in MN, child sex offenders can raise their own children if they have served their sentence, They are allowed to come to school and pick up their own child.

 

[stargazer17]

I too am hoping for a miracle, I think that is the one thing we all have in common.

Amen!

Could we take pictures of the children for the books we made for each child? Could parents come and take pictures of their child and have another child in the picture?

When my son was in day care we had to sign a document that we would not share any photos on social media, which was perfectly fine with me.

 

[ilovechili]

That would never fly.

When I taught in a regular school, we had all kinds of documents parents signed.

Could we take pictures of the children for the books we made for each child? Could parents come and take pictures of their child and have another child in the picture?

We had parents that had orders for protection against others. We had parents that had new identities. ( not witness protection) We had mothers who were victims of domestic violence and victims of stalkers.

There is no way people would be able to watch kids in a classroom. Can you imagine a perv getting to watch your child?

Makes a whole lot of sense doesn't it? Yet a school can have a website and put your child's picture up in a group photo or sports photo or online video or whatever. I think this came from one of my remarks--it is a fine line. A parent should be able to see their child sleeping in a crib at a day care, etc., seeing the child held and rocked, etc. I feel with how economically feasible it is nowadays. Should anyone else have access to that? Of course not.

The Chrome Books schools are issuing go home and have cameras activated as well as other garbage installed. Interestingly enough Silicon Valley and some big people send their children to school and do not want them near these things, they want them learning critical thinking skills and pencil driven tasks--but they put them in every other child's world and parent's world and the school world where we cannot even keep up with what our children are exposed to.

I am getting dangerously close to politics and off topic but to go back to topic, I will say that anyone vulnerable should be protected in every way. A child, the elderly, etc. I know that is living in a dream world to think it can happen. Whether a nanny cam, a security system, etc.

Abuse (and theft) has been caught in nursing homes from the adult child of a resident installing a nanny cam in the room.

It is a discussion that definitely has pros and cons. Privacy is something I value and most do. Yet I also want to know anyone vulnerable is protected and that family members can make sure of that.

I do not know what the answer is.

In my lifetime I have known both evil and good teachers, both with myself and others and other generations; good and bad cops, judges, LE; good and bad doctors; good and crooked car salesmen; good and bad servers and I could go on.

We agree ya know

Edited to change wrong word

 

[human]

In CA, they aren't even allowed to have locked facilities.

“What’s happening in California is dishonest,” said Ken Berrick, the founder of Seneca Family of Agencies, a major child services agency based in Oakland. “We’re saying we don’t want locked facilities here and we don’t want group homes, so instead we’re sending kids to Utah where we can’t monitor them. What’s that about? It’s just wrong.”

Out of Options, California Ships Hundreds of Troubled Children Out of State — ProPublica

Wow. Great article which really tells so many of the issues with children.

Who could have the patience to do this day after day, year after year.

 

[human]

Makes a whole lot of sense doesn't it? Yet a school can have a website and put your child's picture up in a group photo or sports photo or online video or whatever. I think this came from one of my remarks--it is a fine line. A parent should be able to see their child sleeping in a crib at a day care, etc., seeing the child held and rocked, etc. I feel with how economically feasible it is nowadays. Should anyone else have access to that? Of course not.

The Chrome Books schools are issuing go home and have cameras activated as well as other garbage installed. Interestingly enough Silicon Valley and some big people send their children to school and do not want them near these things, they want them learning critical thinking skills and pencil driven tasks--but they put them in every other child's world and parent's world and the school world where we cannot even keep up with what our children are exposed to.

I am getting dangerously close to politics and off topic but to go back to topic, I will say that anyone vulnerable should be protected in every way. A child, the elderly, etc. I know that is living in a dream world to think it can happen. Whether a nanny cam, a security system, etc.

Abuse (and theft) has been caught in nursing homes from the adult child of a resident installing a nanny cam in the room.

It is a discussion that definitely has pros and cons. Privacy is something I value and most do. Yet I also want to know anyone vulnerable is protected and that family members can make sure of that.

I do not know what the answer is.

In my lifetime I have known both evil and good teachers, both with myself and others and other generations; good and bad cops, judges, LE; good and bad doctors; good and crooked car salesmen; good and bad servers and I could go on.

We agree ya know

Edited to change wrong word

I think a school that puts up a picture must have permission from parents for each child. At least, my school district demanded that.

How could a camera watch only your child at a school?

 

[Jim_M]

That would never fly.

When I taught in a regular school, we had all kinds of documents parents signed.

Could we take pictures of the children for the books we made for each child? Could parents come and take pictures of their child and have another child in the picture?

We had parents that had orders for protection against others. We had parents that had new identities. ( not witness protection) We had mothers who were victims of domestic violence and victims of stalkers.

There is no way people would be able to watch kids in a classroom. Can you imagine a perv getting to watch your child?

My apologies if I wasn't clear. I was talking about the property. Being able to see the comings & goings onto the property. Classrooms would be another can of craziness.

Heck, we're all on videos as we drive down the road, shop at our neighborhood stores, and pay at the registers.

 

[ilovechili]

I think a school that puts up a picture must have permission from parents for each child. At least, my school district demanded that.

How could a camera watch only your child at a school?

Not sure what you mean about the camera. If you are talking about the school issued computers that go home, the camera should be off in my opinion because many apps access them and why ever should it be on? If the student is using it in class, the teacher is present. Taking it home every day why should it be activated or on? Ever actually...

If you mean as far as watching at day care or in a nursing home, that is done already in some facilities I believe but it is far from the norm and perhaps it should be. I am not the most technologically savvy person but the parent has access to view the child for instance from work at any time. Maybe someone else can weigh in to give more detail? Kind of like viewing your home from work with a security system.

A school may be more difficult and I never mentioned schools, I was more in range of day cares and nursing homes.

I do not know the answer. I also do know school sites do post pictures as do like dance studios, etc. Hell, bars post pics of their patrons drinking on SM, anyone ever sign a permission slip there? Seriously.

Maybe school districts differ or states do but to my knowledge no permission is needed, I have seen children I know on different school websites and I seriously doubt any explicit permission was granted but I could be wrong. Shots of sports, field trips, a day in class, etc.

I have relatives that say they would never do or be on FB. I tell them they have been on it whether they realize it or not. I say I saw you in a photo the other day and I get a What??? That is the response I first get. Well all anyone has to do is post a group photo at a friend's house. Just because the people in the photo are not on FB does not mean their photo is not.

What I am getting at is that if we have an elderly relative in a nursing home or a child in a day care or residential home like in this case, we should at any time as they say be able to pop in if we are the parent and nowadays one can actually maybe monitor and check live.

Again, I do not know the answer and privacy of others comes into play as well.

Longwinded and a bit sideways. My apologies.

 

[ilovechili]

My apologies if I wasn't clear. I was talking about the property. Being able to see the comings & goings onto the property. Classrooms would be another can of craziness.

Heck, we're all on videos as we drive down the road, shop at our neighborhood stores, and pay at the registers.

So true.

 

[human]

Not sure what you mean about the camera. If you are talking about the school issued computers that go home, the camera should be off in my opinion because many apps access them and why ever should it be on? If the student is using it in class, the teacher is present. Taking it home every day why should it be activated or on? Ever actually...

If you mean as far as watching at day care or in a nursing home, that is done already in some facilities I believe but it is far from the norm and perhaps it should be. I am not the most technologically savvy person but the parent has access to view the child for instance from work at any time. Maybe someone else can weigh in to give more detail? Kind of like viewing your home from work with a security system.

A school may be more difficult and I never mentioned schools, I was more in range of day cares and nursing homes.

I do not know the answer. I also do know school sites do post pictures as do like dance studios, etc. Hell, bars post pics of their patrons drinking on SM, anyone ever sign a permission slip there? Seriously.

Maybe school districts differ or states do but to my knowledge no permission is needed, I have seen children I know on different school websites and I seriously doubt any explicit permission was granted but I could be wrong. Shots of sports, field trips, a day in class, etc.

I have relatives that say they would never do or be on FB. I tell them they have been on it whether they realize it or not. I say I saw you in a photo the other day and I get a What??? That is the response I first get. Well all anyone has to do is post a group photo at a friend's house. Just because the people in the photo are not on FB does not mean their photo is not.

What I am getting at is that if we have an elderly relative in a nursing home or a child in a day care or residential home like in this case, we should at any time as they say be able to pop in if we are the parent and nowadays one can actually maybe monitor and check live.

Again, I do not know the answer and privacy of others comes into play as well.

Longwinded and a bit sideways. My apologies.

I think asking at a school in your district will give the answer.Schools are different than a bar or a home. Schools have to have privacy for children. The scenarios go on and on. BF’s and ex bf’s and ex grandparents and on and on and on.

I would be surprised if a daycare allowed a camera to take pictures inside of the daycare unless it is for children of one family.

Does anyone want some other person to watch their child via a camera? Some perv bf of a parent could be watching like the minister father Randy Pruitt.

A room for the elderly is their room, not other people.

My mother was in a assisted living where one of the men had dementia, He was married and would hit on women. I doubt if anyone would want that broadcast.

 

[Jim_M]

RSBM

My mother was in a assisted living where one of the men had dementia, He was married and would hit on women. I doubt if anyone would want that broadcast.

Well, now that you mention it, BR in the SLP case may want that video...sorry, I could not resist a slight outburst of levity while I'm hoping SD is still with us

 

[MsFacetious]

In the case of a residential home like center, I do think outside cameras would be totally acceptable. It would have been enormously helpful in this case to see where Serenity went. Just as outside cameras would have been in Kyron's disappearance from school.

I know that my SIL was able to check the camera live while her daughter was in daycare. However, it may have been a small home daycare. I do know I've heard about that being a feature of daycares.

I also know some schools have cameras in the hallways. I don't know if any actually allow you to look at it live, but I'm glad they have it for if someone vanished or something occurs that needs to be reviewed.

 

[Jim_M]

Not sure what you mean about the camera. If you are talking about the school issued computers that go home, the camera should be off in my opinion because many apps access them and why ever should it be on? If the student is using it in class, the teacher is present. Taking it home every day why should it be activated or on? Ever actually...

If you mean as far as watching at day care or in a nursing home, that is done already in some facilities I believe but it is far from the norm and perhaps it should be. I am not the most technologically savvy person but the parent has access to view the child for instance from work at any time. Maybe someone else can weigh in to give more detail? Kind of like viewing your home from work with a security system.

A school may be more difficult and I never mentioned schools, I was more in range of day cares and nursing homes.

I do not know the answer. I also do know school sites do post pictures as do like dance studios, etc. Hell, bars post pics of their patrons drinking on SM, anyone ever sign a permission slip there? Seriously.

Maybe school districts differ or states do but to my knowledge no permission is needed, I have seen children I know on different school websites and I seriously doubt any explicit permission was granted but I could be wrong. Shots of sports, field trips, a day in class, etc.

I have relatives that say they would never do or be on FB. I tell them they have been on it whether they realize it or not. I say I saw you in a photo the other day and I get a What??? That is the response I first get. Well all anyone has to do is post a group photo at a friend's house. Just because the people in the photo are not on FB does not mean their photo is not.

What I am getting at is that if we have an elderly relative in a nursing home or a child in a day care or residential home like in this case, we should at any time as they say be able to pop in if we are the parent and nowadays one can actually maybe monitor and check live.

Again, I do not know the answer and privacy of others comes into play as well.

Longwinded and a bit sideways. My apologies.

I believe that privacy is our biggest issue. And yes, I recall our children would be photographed for school events, yearbooks and the like, and those were expected to remain in that community, so to speak.

I believe schools & administrations have begun making permission slips part of the process. Especially with video/photo of students. I don't have a link, but I recall my son's school requiring us to allow any video/photo captures, to be on display on the web page.

And they pretty much toughened up who could register, and log onto, their school district pages. It was another layer of privacy/safety IMO.

Now I'm going to go sideways. A little. Cameras at the inside doors. Cameras at the corners of the building. Cameras at the outside doors also. Nothing intrusive on the inside, but a detailed coverage on that exterior. Something like that in place, and you will see exactly where someone gets to.

Serenity Cameras, if only they had been in place that first time! Prayers for you little one

 

[ilovechili]

I think asking at a school in your district will give the answer.Schools are different than a bar or a home. Schools have to have privacy for children. The scenarios go on and on. BF’s and ex bf’s and ex grandparents and on and on and on.

I would be surprised if a daycare allowed a camera to take pictures inside of the daycare unless it is for children of one family.

Does anyone want some other person to watch their child via a camera? Some perv bf of a parent could be watching like the minister father Randy Pruitt.

A room for the elderly is their room, not other people.

My mother was in a assisted living where one of the men had dementia, He was married and would hit on women. I doubt if anyone would want that broadcast.

Great points.

I do not mean just anyone watching, just the guardian/parent being able to log in and check. I guess I will have to look into it, I am sure some have done it but I heard it some years back. And again I mean day cares and nursing homes. Maybe there is a limit to what areas, where and how and possibly even when, I guess there would have to be.

I know of cases where nanny cams were installed but that was by the guardian/parent.

I get your point about school and agree that would be harder if not impossible. Yet if one thinks of the cell phones and recording capabilities all over school each and every day, I would never think anyone should ever feel they may not be recorded just about anywhere they are nowadays Add in computers with cameras...

Did you know that in some states now you can record a conversation and it is admissible in court? It used to be the other person had to know they were being recorded, or it could only be LE or by having a warrant where it would be admissible. Not any longer. So long as you are one of the people in the conversation, it is allowed. An entirely different thing but one that many have not heard. I wonder if that plays into SP with her video because the stepdad is on it SA her and it looks like it would be admissible as it is referred to in the complaint and I believe the crux of the basis for his arrest.

In relating this to this case, courthouses, airports and body scanners, etc. have their security for safety and protection. I think children deserve protection too. As I said, I do not know what the answer is and I see your points and they are great points. And privacy is a huge concern. There, however, should be some way these children like SD and others can be monitored without too much invasion of their privacy, or a balance. Is it true someone is with these children 24/7? Door alarms I do not think is going too far. Security footage at least in some areas. Parking lot and exterior cameras facing all directions in the event a child runs.

The responses here have been vague about cameras. The sheriff seemed to indicate there is no footage from cameras. I can't recall his exact words but it was a response by LE on media.

 

[ilovechili]

I believe that privacy is our biggest issue. And yes, I recall our children would be photographed for school events, yearbooks and the like, and those were expected to remain in that community, so to speak.

I believe schools & administrations have begun making permission slips part of the process. Especially with video/photo of students. I don't have a link, but I recall my son's school requiring us to allow any video/photo captures, to be on display on the web page.

And they pretty much toughened up who could register, and log onto, their school district pages. It was another layer of privacy/safety IMO.

Now I'm going to go sideways. A little. Cameras at the inside doors. Cameras at the corners of the building. Cameras at the outside doors also. Nothing intrusive on the inside, but a detailed coverage on that exterior. Something like that in place, and you will see exactly where someone gets to.

Serenity Cameras, if only they had been in place that first time! Prayers for you little one

Lol I just posted a similar post to Human. Must be thinking alike.

First with schools, I can believe it has tightened up recently. And will likely continue to be tightened even more so in this day and age. Quite recently there was much that could still be seen on school websites, at least some. I am talking about sites where the children are my relation and in checking the school calendar, events, etc. In the JC case, these thoughts crossed my mind all of the time. I decided during that case to no longer ever post a picture even if my settings are pretty private. I remember thinking about the dance photos and wondering if the perp found her that way, either in person or online. I thought about newspapers where maybe a pic of a sporting event at school or a dance recital, often with names. It has sad it has come to that, but I think it has. Now if we could stop the apps/games that are always faster and beyond what parents know as are the children...

To tie this back to the topic, I posted to Human pretty much what you said above about cameras. At least put them outside. I also think door alarms and perhaps video of public areas like hallways or entryways and so forth. Not video all are watching necessarily but reviewable video if needed. I see no reason that cannot be done and quite honestly I fail to see why such facilities would not necessarily have them as it has been said repeatedly these children are sometimes "runners".

It is such a gray area but full of privacy issues no doubt. You could camera your own property and still possibly catch the neighbor inside of their home at their window in their robe. I guess that is on them for not closing the curtain but just saying...

I would imagine the parents would have to be told there are cameras and sign off to it? At least if any were on the inside in public areas? I have no idea...

Bottom line though is it has been repeatedly stated children like this (some) are known to run. If that is the case, I think there needs to be security and a system to address it for their safety.

I realize though it is easy to be an armchair quarterback...

 

[FruitSnack]

as to having cameras run 24/7 live feed for the parents to watch, I could see why they dont. my sisters day care has the live stream, she can check on her daughter anytime by accessing a private site.
now my school doesn't have it which I am glad. i don't know how many times my 9 year old has stripped off his clothes. I would not want other parents to see that, even special needs parents that are with my son. these kids do strange things and cameras would not be in their best interest

 

[ilovechili]

as to having cameras run 24/7 live feed for the parents to watch, I could see why they dont. my sisters day care has the live stream, she can check on her daughter anytime by accessing a private site.
now my school doesn't have it which I am glad. i don't know how many times my 9 year old has stripped off his clothes. I would not want other parents to see that, even special needs parents that are with my son. these kids do strange things and cameras would not be in their best interest

That is what I thought. So your sister has it? I thought maybe I was wrong after all of this discussion, yet I was positive I have heard of it. What I recall is that at least for an infant who cannot talk there are day cares with live video feed all day. Not live to everyone, live to access by the parents only. And maybe not of every child but that infant in the crib, room, etc. I think state laws often have to have a 1 to 1 ratio in a day care with infants? Not sure.

Does your sister's day care have live access of all children, meaning can she see the other children as well? Or just her child?

It is my guess the parents are informed and make the choice. If they choose a facility that has live feed, they know other parents may see their child as well...? I have no idea but it is worthy of discussion I think.

I certainly can understand both sides of this issue. Privacy is paramount but so is safety and security.

Everyone says the facilities like in this case have "runners". To me, logically, there should be things that prevent that or help with finding them as quickly as possible...

But logic does not always prevail these days Sadly

 

[Yellow Rose]

I find it so hard to even contemplate that this beautiful child has yet to be found! Please Lord, let this be the day!