Sentencing and beyond- JA General Discussion #6

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I agree that she knew about Lisa. She met Lisa in May 2007, but she didn't know that Lisa was any different from any of the other women, like Chiatanya, etc.

The one thing that JA kept repeating and kept going back to in her explanations was how she found about how he'd been seeing Lisa "all along" after he and Lisa had broken up. She wears that statement like an excuse or pity badge. I don't know about the listening in the house thing, but if it happened, maybe Travis got her to believe something different about what she'd heard.

But I believe it explains my theory about Jodi until she got the journals and saw the email.




I am starting to believe that Jodi might have thought Lisa was just a "side chick," and not a woman that Travis was actually in love with and wanted to marry. I don't think she knew the seriousness of his feelings for Lisa until she stole the journals and read the May email he'd composed for Lisa.

AND

I agree that she knew about Lisa. She met Lisa in May 2007, but she didn't know that Lisa was any different from any of the other women, like Chiatanya, etc.





IMO the only way the could possibly have thought Lisa was no different is if she didn't snoop his texts and emails and journals all along, and I'm quite sure she did.

Even Travis the trusting acknowledged, in April 2008, that the had been invading his privacy in those specific ways for a whole year. And even the lying liar wrote in her own journal in fall 2007 that she kept on “finding” info about Travis, “horrible” stuff, that justified her suspicions about him, and her “insecurity” about how he actually felt about her.

Travis joked with other women about making babies and the like, but he didn't talk with them about marrying. He didn't routinely say I love you to them. The knew the difference. That's why she slashed his tires, and then Lisa's too. And why she sent Lisa that vile email and stalked them on dates.

And IMO, knowing that Travis loved Lisa was one of her motivations for throwing herself full force at him sexually, especially in January and early February, when marriage to Lisa was very much on the table. I think she did so to show him what he wouldn’t get with the inexperienced and good Mormon Lisa, and because IMO she knowingly used sex as a weapon against Travis, to make him feel self-doubt, guilt, self-loathing, and overall--weakened by his lack of resolve, and unworthy.

I agree she probably felt victorious when Travis broke it off with Lisa in February for the final time. But....she also knew, if she was snooping, that Travis was already pursuing Mimi BEFORE he broke off with Lisa, and that Sky and Chris were thrilled with his choice of Mimi.

The closely monitored the Mimi situation to see how much a threat she posed, including lying in wait for Travis after his rock climbing date, and keeping track of how many dates Travis had taken Mimi on. Whatever Travis may have written about Lisa or Mimi in his first stolen journal, the almost certainly read every last word, since she definitely had his journal in her possession mid-March, at the OKC convention, the same journal she stole altogether on March 18.

I concluded a while ago that the likely wrote most of her March journal entries after the fact. What she wrote so understates and ignores the emotional reality of what was going on as to be unbelievable, or, downright scary, because of the rage her bland entries completely concealed.

Everything she had done and said and sacrificed and plotted since the fall of 2006 had failed. The has a definite aptitude for creating her own reality, but even with her gift for delusion she’d have to spin hard to make Travis asking her to leave Mesa and no longer being willing to help her financially as anything other than what it was---a rejection. Travis not only wasn’t going to marry her, he was perfectly fine—happy, even, that she’d be living 1,000 away.

By the last week in March she'd concluded, rightly so, that Mimi wasn't going to be "the One." I think it's likely she thought Travis had already given up on Mimi by then (she quotes TA's journal, basically, saying just that). Much of what she wrote (and said) about Mimi before and after killing Travis mocks Travis for his ever calling her the One. In any case, I don’t think the ever felt threatened by Mimi, because I don’t think she believed Travis ever had any chance of marrying her.
.

I think Travis wrote at the end of March about Lisa and about needing the out of town knowing the would read it, and that she wrote a goodbye in his journal as a way of saying she had done so. I think the fight they had on her way out of town when Michelle the Spy came up was about Travis telling her thanks for the memories, but I need to get married now, you do too, it'll be better for both of us when you're gone, and I still think Mimi is the One.


The one thing that JA kept repeating and kept going back to in her explanations was how she found about how he'd been seeing Lisa "all along" after he and Lisa had broken up. She wears that statement like an excuse or pity badge. I don't know about the listening in the house thing, but if it happened, maybe Travis got her to believe something different about what she'd heard.


IMO, Travis had no motivation or interest in lying about or downplaying his interest in Lisa to the . Why would he? He had told the he wasn’t interested in a relationship. He had made it exceptionally clear to her that he did not want her to move to Mesa. He was dating Lisa openly, talking openly to his friends about Lisa, even talking to his bishop about Lisa, openly. Everyone around him seems to have known that Travis was dating with marriage in mind. He was dating Lisa. He was not dating the .

I think the reality is closer to what the wrote in her journal in the fall of 2007 (whatever else she was trying to imply): that Travis didn’t want to talk with her directly about Lisa or anyone else he might date, because she had “become like Deanna,” getting extremely upset when she knew Travis was interested in someone else. (The must have snooped Travis telling someone something like that, probably not mentioning Deanna at all, because she also writes that it’s a good thing Travis didn’t tell her that directly, because it would have pissed her off).

Her walking in on Travis and Lisa embracing and sharing I love you’s comes directly from Travis, texting with Michelle in the beginning of April. Travis also tells Michelle that what bothered him most about the walking in on him (and her other Lisa-related intrusions) was that the was causing HERSELF pain and hurt feelings.

The did carry on and on in every medium available to her before and after murdering Travis that she did NOT know about Lisa until the very eve of leaving Mesa. Utter BS, for the reasons above and more. Why was she so prolific with this particular lie, and so insistent that her lie was true?

Two reasons. IMO---if she didn’t even know about Lisa, she couldn’t be responsible for tire slashings, stalkings, mean texts, and that vile email, etc.

And, secondly, because her lie targeted Lisa in the same lying breath of feigning empathy with her. The was saying—Travis didn’t feel anything special for you, Lisa, because he cheated on you with me the entire time the two of you were together. And I’m just as much a victim as you in that, because just as you didn’t know about ME, I didn’t know about YOU either. We were both victims of Travis, who didn’t love either one of us.


But then the May 2008 email to Lisa lets JA know that she hadn't outlasted Lisa at all, and Travis was really and actually in love with Lisa. Wow. That had to be some pain to read and realize.



The May letter to Lisa. Travis used the past tense... that the had taken/deleted a letter (email) he had SENT to Lisa. Who knows what was actually in the letter. What he did NOT write was a declaration of love for Lisa. He was being respectful of her decision to date someone else, didn't want to spook her, and most importantly, IMO, had indicated he was ready to move on too, after he cleared the air with her. He even joked about wanting to become rich and famous just so his ex-GF's, including Lisa, would regret their bad decision not to stay with him.


No wonder she wasn't journaling in April. She was too busy obsessing over his words in his journal, probably checking the facts against texts and emails. All the while, she was getting more and more angry. Travis probably thought maybe she didn't have the journal because she was still acting all peachy keen.


Who knows if she was keeping a journal in April. She kept and/or manufactured only what she wanted LE to read.

Personally, I think she was already borderline homicidal when she left Mesa, and was pretty occupied most of April and the first 2 weeks of May manufacturing a written, online, and on-tape bogus record of Travis relentlessly in sexual pursuit of her, and so besotten with her that the mere mention of another man’s name by her drove him into a jealous frenzy.
 
I don't think the shaving pic was from June 4th... it was the same day/time period as the office pics imo(see pic and my note about the mirror image one taken in the bathroom, as opposed to a direct image in the office) and re the foot print by the bed, I seem to recall seeing that somewhere, I'll keep an eye open for it.

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I have that pic lol:
 

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Hope,
Yes towards the end of about a 20-25 minute interview I think she was asking about the shower photos on that day and he jokingly said that he had heard that some people thought she had a gun on him in some of photos and he thought ... Paraphrasing here .....that that just didn't happen.

He said he didn't think Travis knew she was coming and somehow conned her way in. He also believes that they had sex and photo session that day and that he absolutely did not see it (her murdering him) coming...☹️

Jenny McCarthy watched the trial like us and was into it, thought jodi was crazy psyco but fascinating, she loved Juan as prosecutor, so she had a lot of good questions ... She also asked him about her suitcases and when she put her stuff in the car that day..... But I got a phone call and didn't here that answer!

She probably got her questions from Websleuths discussions. It sure sounds like it, and these were things we recently discussed. In fact, we even discussed them right around the same time (very recently), so she probably didn't read very many posts. Maybe she even took them from the thread Tricia set up where we could put our questions for JM. Some people depend on others so they don't look stupid. No credit given to online communities, I suppose?
 
Toothbrushes but no toothpaste. Maybe she's using them to apply makeup...or as paintbrushes. Whatever. I'm with JM. WTH cares what or how the is doing now?

I think she needs to be watched 24/7. If she can find a way to manipulate others with toothbrushes, paper or Beano she'll do it. She thinks she's smarter than her fellow convicts and the correction officers.
 
(...)

Note: What was important to me was I did not know that Mr Martinez didn't think Travis expected Jodi that day, and Jenny asked if he thought she had a gun on him in the shower and he also said no...

Thanks for posting. I'll listen to that interview. The chance of Arias telling Travis she would be arriving was extremely low, in my opinion. To risk him telling anyone would have ruined her plans. That was simply too great a risk to take. She spied on him enough to know that he spoke to other people about her, even if he didn't reveal all. On text from Travis would have been all it would take the night before and her location would be known to all.

Also, in the interview with Detective Flores, she stumbled, hesitated and evaded around the time of her arrival.

[video=youtube;7XN5fpDH2p4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XN5fpDH2p4&index=5&list=PLrAJFqIjBGeBWQ8jumn4nJ92njqRQwm0k[/video]

Above, her arrival time is discussed at 8 minutes in:

Detective Flores: "Do you remember what time you rolled in?"

Arias: "Um... three o'clock".

She admits to asking him what roommates were there the night before, during a brief call. In court, her arrival time becomes after 4.00 am - ish:

Nurmi: "Do you remember about what time you arrived in Mesa?"

Arias: "It was still dark, but it was early morning... maybe... around 4 'ish".


Given that his roommate didn't leave for several hours, maybe she rested for a while then waited for him to leave before entering the house? Alternatively, maybe she crept in and hid for a few hours. I don't believe the story about her watching him and Naps not barking when she entered.
 

I am starting to believe that Jodi might have thought Lisa was just a "side chick," and not a woman that Travis was actually in love with and wanted to marry. I don't think she knew the seriousness of his feelings for Lisa until she stole the journals and read the May email he'd composed for Lisa.

AND

I agree that she knew about Lisa. She met Lisa in May 2007, but she didn't know that Lisa was any different from any of the other women, like Chiatanya, etc.





IMO the only way the could possibly have thought Lisa was no different is if she didn't snoop his texts and emails and journals all along, and I'm quite sure she did.

Even Travis the trusting acknowledged, in April 2008, that the had been invading his privacy in those specific ways for a whole year. And even the lying liar wrote in her own journal in fall 2007 that she kept on “finding” info about Travis, “horrible” stuff, that justified her suspicions about him, and her “insecurity” about how he actually felt about her.

Travis joked with other women about making babies and the like, but he didn't talk with them about marrying. He didn't routinely say I love you to them. The knew the difference. That's why she slashed his tires, and then Lisa's too. And why she sent Lisa that vile email and stalked them on dates.

And IMO, knowing that Travis loved Lisa was one of her motivations for throwing herself full force at him sexually, especially in January and early February, when marriage to Lisa was very much on the table. I think she did so to show him what he wouldn’t get with the inexperienced and good Mormon Lisa, and because IMO she knowingly used sex as a weapon against Travis, to make him feel self-doubt, guilt, self-loathing, and overall--weakened by his lack of resolve, and unworthy.

I agree she probably felt victorious when Travis broke it off with Lisa in February for the final time. But....she also knew, if she was snooping, that Travis was already pursuing Mimi BEFORE he broke off with Lisa, and that Sky and Chris were thrilled with his choice of Mimi.

The closely monitored the Mimi situation to see how much a threat she posed, including lying in wait for Travis after his rock climbing date, and keeping track of how many dates Travis had taken Mimi on. Whatever Travis may have written about Lisa or Mimi in his first stolen journal, the almost certainly read every last word, since she definitely had his journal in her possession mid-March, at the OKC convention, the same journal she stole altogether on March 18.

I concluded a while ago that the likely wrote most of her March journal entries after the fact. What she wrote so understates and ignores the emotional reality of what was going on as to be unbelievable, or, downright scary, because of the rage her bland entries completely concealed.

Everything she had done and said and sacrificed and plotted since the fall of 2006 had failed. The has a definite aptitude for creating her own reality, but even with her gift for delusion she’d have to spin hard to make Travis asking her to leave Mesa and no longer being willing to help her financially as anything other than what it was---a rejection. Travis not only wasn’t going to marry her, he was perfectly fine—happy, even, that she’d be living 1,000 away.

By the last week in March she'd concluded, rightly so, that Mimi wasn't going to be "the One." I think it's likely she thought Travis had already given up on Mimi by then (she quotes TA's journal, basically, saying just that). Much of what she wrote (and said) about Mimi before and after killing Travis mocks Travis for his ever calling her the One. In any case, I don’t think the ever felt threatened by Mimi, because I don’t think she believed Travis ever had any chance of marrying her.
.

I think Travis wrote at the end of March about Lisa and about needing the out of town knowing the would read it, and that she wrote a goodbye in his journal as a way of saying she had done so. I think the fight they had on her way out of town when Michelle the Spy came up was about Travis telling her thanks for the memories, but I need to get married now, you do too, it'll be better for both of us when you're gone, and I still think Mimi is the One.


The one thing that JA kept repeating and kept going back to in her explanations was how she found about how he'd been seeing Lisa "all along" after he and Lisa had broken up. She wears that statement like an excuse or pity badge. I don't know about the listening in the house thing, but if it happened, maybe Travis got her to believe something different about what she'd heard.


IMO, Travis had no motivation or interest in lying about or downplaying his interest in Lisa to the . Why would he? He had told the he wasn’t interested in a relationship. He had made it exceptionally clear to her that he did not want her to move to Mesa. He was dating Lisa openly, talking openly to his friends about Lisa, even talking to his bishop about Lisa, openly. Everyone around him seems to have known that Travis was dating with marriage in mind. He was dating Lisa. He was not dating the .

I think the reality is closer to what the wrote in her journal in the fall of 2007 (whatever else she was trying to imply): that Travis didn’t want to talk with her directly about Lisa or anyone else he might date, because she had “become like Deanna,” getting extremely upset when she knew Travis was interested in someone else. (The must have snooped Travis telling someone something like that, probably not mentioning Deanna at all, because she also writes that it’s a good thing Travis didn’t tell her that directly, because it would have pissed her off).

Her walking in on Travis and Lisa embracing and sharing I love you’s comes directly from Travis, texting with Michelle in the beginning of April. Travis also tells Michelle that what bothered him most about the walking in on him (and her other Lisa-related intrusions) was that the was causing HERSELF pain and hurt feelings.

The did carry on and on in every medium available to her before and after murdering Travis that she did NOT know about Lisa until the very eve of leaving Mesa. Utter BS, for the reasons above and more. Why was she so prolific with this particular lie, and so insistent that her lie was true?

Two reasons. IMO---if she didn’t even know about Lisa, she couldn’t be responsible for tire slashings, stalkings, mean texts, and that vile email, etc.

And, secondly, because her lie targeted Lisa in the same lying breath of feigning empathy with her. The was saying—Travis didn’t feel anything special for you, Lisa, because he cheated on you with me the entire time the two of you were together. And I’m just as much a victim as you in that, because just as you didn’t know about ME, I didn’t know about YOU either. We were both victims of Travis, who didn’t love either one of us.


But then the May 2008 email to Lisa lets JA know that she hadn't outlasted Lisa at all, and Travis was really and actually in love with Lisa. Wow. That had to be some pain to read and realize.



The May letter to Lisa. Travis used the past tense... that the had taken/deleted a letter (email) he had SENT to Lisa. Who knows what was actually in the letter. What he did NOT write was a declaration of love for Lisa. He was being respectful of her decision to date someone else, didn't want to spook her, and most importantly, IMO, had indicated he was ready to move on too, after he cleared the air with her. He even joked about wanting to become rich and famous just so his ex-GF's, including Lisa, would regret their bad decision not to stay with him.


No wonder she wasn't journaling in April. She was too busy obsessing over his words in his journal, probably checking the facts against texts and emails. All the while, she was getting more and more angry. Travis probably thought maybe she didn't have the journal because she was still acting all peachy keen.


Who knows if she was keeping a journal in April. She kept and/or manufactured only what she wanted LE to read.

Personally, I think she was already borderline homicidal when she left Mesa, and was pretty occupied most of April and the first 2 weeks of May manufacturing a written, online, and on-tape bogus record of Travis relentlessly in sexual pursuit of her, and so besotten with her that the mere mention of another man’s name by her drove him into a jealous frenzy.

Yet she had said that the reason why she had to be in a different ward while in Mesa was because Lisa and Elena(iirc) was in the other one and that was apparently a concern for her at that time.
 
Shank-proof toothbrushes= sex toys, ummm okay. :laugh: Remember she needs both hands too. Maybe she saved up and used all ten of them at once. :shame:




GreenToothbrush.gif
 
Sounds likes she's becoming a hoarder.. Probably afraid they'll withhold commissary funds with her next infraction.

http://radaronline.com/celebrity-ne...purchases-perryville-travis-alexander-killer/

She eats more than a can of clams every day? Fish flakes like a guppy? Beans and Beano?
She buys XMAS cards after Xmas?
As many anti-shank toothbrushes as toilet rolls? Sumpin' wrong here, folks.....
How many TV's?
How many bottles of shampoo is that? Lotion? Dandruff stuff? Soap? Crazy!

Some of her commissary access got taken away, IIRC, and that's why the frequency of orders dropped.

But I don't think prisoners can hoard very much. I think there are limits on how much stock they can have.
 
Idk...those don't even look like footprints or even blood IMO. More like spills...
Jmo

I don't doubt that it's dried blood, my main question is, what's it doing next to his bed, and also without any more of them (if foot prints) leading to it? Maybe after she cleaned up she went over there to get something (purse?) and dropped something that was 'wet'?
 
I don't doubt that it's dried blood, my main question is, what's it doing next to his bed, and also without any more of them (if foot prints) leading to it? Maybe after she cleaned up she went over there to get something (purse?) and dropped something that was 'wet'?

Or left the book on the nightstand?
 
Yet she had said that the reason why she had to be in a different ward while in Mesa was because Lisa and Elena(iirc) was in the other one and that was apparently a concern for her at that time.

To clarify, from her interrogation:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-the-Interrogation-Videos-of-Jodi-Arias/page3

"June 25, 2008 – Phone Call – States Exhibit #308 Clip 10 – Day 4 Trial Testimony _ Detective Flores

42:11
DF: What did you do then the whole time you were down here then? You just kind of tried to work?
JA: Um…I…Yeah! I guess I figured, you know, like maybe this is the Mormon land of opportunity. Honestly? That’s kind of the way I looked at it? (laughs)

June 25, 2008 – Phone Interview. States Exhibit #306 Clip 12 – Day 4 Trial Testimony – Detective Flores

42:28
DF: So you just kind of hung around town doing your thing until April or so, whenever you left?
JA: Yeah, I hung around. I was in the University 6 Ward—went there. He was in his Desert Ridge Ward and we…We didn’t live that far apart. So, I mean, I was over there a lot—um…not a lot lot because he had his own social circle friends from church that I didn’t really want to interact with (Jodi laughs) because I…I sensed that maybe there was a little bit of awkwardness there because of Lisa and because of Elena (sp?) and I didn’t…"
 
The toothbrush version of a golf pencil?


I would be so embarrassed, but she probably loves the attention. Lots of beano, and "take-my-funk-away" items on there. Zit- B- Gone (magician heal thyself must not be working), and cure my nasty butt pads (Tucks). What, no Hershey bars?
 
I don't think the shaving pic was from June 4th... it was the same day/time period as the office pics imo(see pic and my note about the mirror image one taken in the bathroom, as opposed to a direct image in the office) and re the foot print by the bed, I seem to recall seeing that somewhere, I'll keep an eye open for it.

View attachment 91523

Just to follow up on the shaving pic, this is the pics reversed, take a good look at his hair and compare whether you think they were taken in the same time frame.

TAshaving2.jpg
 
I don't doubt that it's dried blood, my main question is, what's it doing next to his bed, and also without any more of them (if foot prints) leading to it? Maybe after she cleaned up she went over there to get something (purse?) and dropped something that was 'wet'?

But if it was blood we would have heard testimony about it. Martinez said many times there was no blood beyond the throat slash zone...
 
Latest tweets from the killer

Both from 2 days ago

Hot water was restored to her yard after 3 days

#JodiArias is currently reading "From the Barrio to the Board Room," by Robert Renteria.
 
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