Sentencing and beyond- JA General Discussion #7

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One last try at uploading more TA house and neighborhood photos, one last fail. Guess I'll have to post them when I return home, end of first week in August, I think.
 
Hope4More said:
Fwiw, TA still had temporary tags on his Prius, hadn't traded them in yet for regular tags.

About time possibly spent at Last Stop or someplace else civilized. She couldn't have been covered in blood, had to have left the house reasonably clean to not have left blood traces downstairs and in the garage or outside. Further washing up of herself could have been done anywhere along the way at a rest stop. I don't see her wandering off into the desert and mesquite bushes to do anything either, especially since she didn't have to.

What she did have to do is to make sure nothing in the car looked suspicious going through the checkpoint, so I'm thinking she got rid of the car mats and bloody clothes before she reached the dam. That too could have been anywhere along the way, after dark perhaps. The weapons- who knows. It would have been risky to have them at the checkpoint, but not overly so, since she wouldn't have matched any profile warranting more than a cursory check of her car, IMO.

And that's that for now. Meeting my boys in a few hours, and onto the cooler temps and awesome scenery of Yellowstone and the Tetons! :)
Click to expand...

Didn't Flores or Martinez speculate that she showered either with Travis's remains or before she put him in the shower? That would have left her clean for the most part. Dumping her clothing and murder weapon would take long enough to pull off the road and throw them in a dumpster.

At the Dam all she had to do was show her ID and be waved through. A woman traveling alone wouldn't have raised any red flags for her car to be searched more thoroughly IMO
 
TexMex said:
Didn't Flores or Martinez speculate that she showered either with Travis's remains or before she put him in the shower? That would have left her clean for the most part. Dumping her clothing and murder weapon would take long enough to pull off the road and throw them in a dumpster.

At the Dam all she had to do was show her ID and be waved through. A woman traveling alone wouldn't have raised any red flags for her car to be searched more thoroughly IMO
Click to expand...

I saw it postulated elsewhere that the water around the sink was from brushing her wet hair in front of the mirror after showering and that rings pretty true, she would have had to walk some distance in the neighborhood to get to her car, and looking freshly showered wouldn't draw as much attention as just wet and haphazard - not to mention her obvious vanity (billion-selfie-girl that she was).

We know she had blood at least on her hands when she dumped everything into the washer as she left blood on the faucet of the downstairs bathroom and a smudge or two on the washer - but she may have already showered and only needed to wash her hands from whatever she picked up from the clothes/towel. Being on her way to Ryan's and not have her hair look a-fright makes think she blow-dried it somewhere, if she did it at T's then the time stamps can't be right, that much hair would take a decent amount of time to dry and even more of her hair would have been left in front of/on the sink area.

I think she got rid of everything except the weapons before the Dam checkpoint (and like Val I think Lake Havasu is most likely, she was familiar with the area and it accounts for the extra time she had), I just have this feeling those were important to her and she put them somewhere she'd remember how to find. Of course it's possible that's why she replaced the gun, having had to dump the one she stole and having liked how it felt to be in possession of one. Self preservation was mighty important to her and she might have felt it was safer to dumpsterize but I'm betwixt and between on that.
 
Hope4More said:
TA's house on left, the park across his street on the right. (Driveway with white vehicles).
Click to expand...

Could she have parked here in front of the park during the murder?
attachment.php
 
Hope4More said:
One last try at uploading more TA house and neighborhood photos, one last fail. Guess I'll have to post them when I return home, end of first week in August, I think.
Click to expand...

Have a great time with the guys, and thanks for all you've done. :)
 
geevee said:
I saw it postulated elsewhere that the water around the sink was from brushing her wet hair in front of the mirror after showering and that rings pretty true, she would have had to walk some distance in the neighborhood to get to her car, and looking freshly showered wouldn't draw as much attention as just wet and haphazard - not to mention her obvious vanity (billion-selfie-girl that she was).

We know she had blood at least on her hands when she dumped everything into the washer as she left blood on the faucet of the downstairs bathroom and a smudge or two on the washer - but she may have already showered and only needed to wash her hands from whatever she picked up from the clothes/towel. Being on her way to Ryan's and not have her hair look a-fright makes think she blow-dried it somewhere, if she did it at T's then the time stamps can't be right, that much hair would take a decent amount of time to dry and even more of her hair would have been left in front of/on the sink area.

I think she got rid of everything except the weapons before the Dam checkpoint (and like Val I think Lake Havasu is most likely, she was familiar with the area and it accounts for the extra time she had), I just have this feeling those were important to her and she put them somewhere she'd remember how to find. Of course it's possible that's why she replaced the gun, having had to dump the one she stole and having liked how it felt to be in possession of one. Self preservation was mighty important to her and she might have felt it was safer to dumpsterize but I'm betwixt and between on that.
Click to expand...

I came across a hitch with the Arizona Last Stop theory ... apparently it didn't open until 2010(I'm still trying to find out what if anything may have been there before, though pretty much anywhere she could have pulled over in White Hills could be a contender, since that seems to fit the cell tower location). :gaah:

As for getting rid of stuff before the checkpoint... She still had the gas cans(Were the same limits in place in 2008? She could only have a max of 15 gallons in the 3 gas cans, unless she had even more that we don't know about.) after Utah and those are a definite no-no at the checkpoint. She would have to have been confident enough to not have to open her trunk.:thinking:

http://www.usbr.gov/lc/hooverdam/crossingguide.pdf
------------------------------------------
"The Mike O'Callaghan – Pat Tillman Memorial Bridge downstream of Hoover Dam officially opened to traffic in October 2010. Vehicles travelling on U.S. Highway 93 no longer cross the
dam. Visitors to the dam must now exit U.S. 93 at Nevada State Route 172 to reach the site.
The dam is not open to through-traffic. The roadway on the Arizona side of the site has been
closed. Vehicles can still cross the dam to visit the Arizona viewpoints and concessions, but all
are required to turn around and re-enter Nevada to access Highway 93."
----
"Vehicles carrying hazardous, combustible or flammable materials (other than the
vehicle’s fuel), munitions, explosives, fertilizer in excess of 40 pounds, fuel in
authorized containers (gas cans, fuel drums, etc.) in excess of 25 gallons, or any
material perceived to be a security risk

Please remember, these are only guidelines – inspecting officers at Hoover Dam may use their
professional discretion in permitting a vehicle to cross or not."
---------------------------------------------
 
geevee said:
I think she got rid of everything except the weapons before the Dam checkpoint (and like Val I think Lake Havasu is most likely, she was familiar with the area and it accounts for the extra time she had), I just have this feeling those were important to her and she put them somewhere she'd remember how to find. Of course it's possible that's why she replaced the gun, having had to dump the one she stole and having liked how it felt to be in possession of one. Self preservation was mighty important to her and she might have felt it was safer to dumpsterize but I'm betwixt and between on that.
Click to expand...

The problem is, there was no extra time. It was an extremely tight fit to get from Mesa to the area north of Kingman where she pinged. I believe H4M just demonstrated this yet again. Also, time was not the only element that was tight: gas was too. She had previously decided that her safety counted on not buying gas in Arizona. A side trip to Havasu is a bunch of those gallons, maybe even 3?
 
Val1 said:
I came across a hitch with the Arizona Last Stop theory ... apparently it didn't open until 2010(I'm still trying to find out what if anything may have been there before, though pretty much anywhere she could have pulled over in White Hills could be a contender, since that seems to fit the cell tower location). :gaah:
-
Click to expand...

There's also Rosie's Den. Last Stop, if not open in 2008, may have had a different owner.

This photo of the Last Stop was taken in 2009: https://www.flickr.com/photos/capturedtime/4268319575/

It looked vacant like this in 2010, so it must simply have changed owners after that: https://www.flickr.com/photos/breezy421/4940443449/
 
Val1 said:
I came across a hitch with the Arizona Last Stop theory ... apparently it didn't open until 2010(I'm still trying to find out what if anything may have been there before, though pretty much anywhere she could have pulled over in White Hills could be a contender, since that seems to fit the cell tower location). :gaah:

As for getting rid of stuff before the checkpoint... She still had the gas cans(Were the same limits in place in 2008? She could only have a max of 15 gallons in the 3 gas cans, unless she had even more that we don't know about.) after Utah and those are a definite no-no at the checkpoint. She would have to have been confident enough to not have to open her trunk.:thinking:

http://www.usbr.gov/lc/hooverdam/crossingguide.pdf
------------------------------------------
"The Mike O'Callaghan – Pat Tillman Memorial Bridge downstream of Hoover Dam officially opened to traffic in October 2010. Vehicles travelling on U.S. Highway 93 no longer cross the
dam. Visitors to the dam must now exit U.S. 93 at Nevada State Route 172 to reach the site.
The dam is not open to through-traffic. The roadway on the Arizona side of the site has been
closed. Vehicles can still cross the dam to visit the Arizona viewpoints and concessions, but all
are required to turn around and re-enter Nevada to access Highway 93."
----
"Vehicles carrying hazardous, combustible or flammable materials (other than the
vehicle’s fuel), munitions, explosives, fertilizer in excess of 40 pounds, fuel in
authorized containers (gas cans, fuel drums, etc.) in excess of 25 gallons, or any
material perceived to be a security risk

Please remember, these are only guidelines – inspecting officers at Hoover Dam may use their
professional discretion in permitting a vehicle to cross or not."
---------------------------------------------
Click to expand...
The 3 gas cans would have been empty by the time she got to Hoover Dam, no?
 
RickshawFan said:
The 3 gas cans would have been empty by the time she got to Hoover Dam, no?
Click to expand...

I think they were empty before she got to the checkpoint. She would have wanted a full tank when she arrived in Mesa. Then she'd have filled it again between Mesa and Hoover Dam
 
RickshawFan said:
The 3 gas cans would have been empty by the time she got to Hoover Dam, no?
Click to expand...

According to mileage driven and gas receipts, she never refilled the gas cans until SLC, and never used them (all gas fills after that were adding to her tank what she'd driven). I have a question I know was answered long back but I'm forgetting - was her full tank enough to get her from Pasadena to Mesa without using the canned gas?
 
Pasadena to Mesa is 388 miles. IIRC her car held 12 gallons and averaged 30mpg
 
geevee said:
According to mileage driven and gas receipts, she never refilled the gas cans until SLC, and never used them (all gas fills after that were adding to her tank what she'd driven). I have a question I know was answered long back but I'm forgetting - was her full tank enough to get her from Pasadena to Mesa without using the canned gas?
Click to expand...

Right, that's my understanding: the cans weren't filled again until SLC. So, heading into NV, she will have had no gas left in the cans and very little left in the tank. She filled up in Mesquite.

I would surmise JA poured the gas can gas into her tank before she pulled into TA's drive way, so she could make an uncomplicated getaway.


LOL, too, on that "Focus" in the Last Stop photo.
 
TexMex said:
Pasadena to Mesa is 388 miles. IIRC her car held 12 gallons and averaged 30mpg
Click to expand...

Thanks Tex, so she would have used some of the canned gas to get all the way to Mesa (where might she have pulled over to do such - Buckeye Lake as she testified?) and the rest to get from Mesa to Mesquite where she gassed up again. Maybe she had enough to get to Lake Havasu, might hop over to google maps and run some numbers in a bit.
 
Hmmm...don't think this route works...

mesatomesquitemap.jpg

Mesa to Lake Havasu - 3 hours 26 minutes - 209 miles

Lake Havasu to Kingman 1 hour - 60 miles

Kingman to Mesquite 2 hours 45 minutes - 184 miles

7 hours 13 minutes - 453 miles

Add Pasadena miles to Mesa (366 miles) and total is 819.

The 15 gallons in the cans would give her 450 miles, her car's 12 gallons would get her 360 miles - total miles 810. If she traveled Mesa to Mesquite by way of Kingman we have a trip of 396 miles, adding Pasadena to that is a total of 762...yeah, even going to Lake Havasu before Kingman she still doesn't have enough gas.
 
geevee said:
Hmmm...don't think this route works...

View attachment 98802

Mesa to Lake Havasu - 3 hours 26 minutes - 209 miles

Lake Havasu to Kingman 1 hour - 60 miles

Kingman to Mesquite 2 hours 45 minutes - 184 miles

7 hours 13 minutes - 453 miles

Add Pasadena miles to Mesa (366 miles) and total is 819.

The 15 gallons in the cans would give her 450 miles, her car's 12 gallons would get her 360 miles - total miles 810. If she traveled Mesa to Mesquite by way of Kingman we have a trip of 396 miles, adding Pasadena to that is a total of 762...yeah, even going to Lake Havasu before Kingman she still doesn't have enough gas.
Click to expand...

Unless she topped up in Buckeye with cash and didn't save her receipts? There is the possibility that she did run out of gas somewhere in the desert and was "rescued" by someone with an extra can of gas... maybe she traded that case of water for it.;)
 
geevee said:
Thanks Tex, so she would have used some of the canned gas to get all the way to Mesa (where might she have pulled over to do such - Buckeye Lake as she testified?) and the rest to get from Mesa to Mesquite where she gassed up again. Maybe she had enough to get to Lake Havasu, might hop over to google maps and run some numbers in a bit.
Click to expand...

Yes. GV. Roughly she left Pasadena with 12 gallons in the car plus 15 in the cans. So 27 gallons x 30mpg = 810 miles she could go.

Pasadena to Mesa is 388
Mesa to Mesquite is 395. Total miles to not buy gas in AZ is 783

IMO she wanted to wait until she was somewhere on I-15 to buy gas so it would work with her route from Pasadena to Ryan's story
 
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